Did we fight Lilith in the pandemonium event or was that purely a game event and didn't really happen lore wise?
Gibson is correct, but it has little to do with the Book of Cain. The Pandemonium Event, or Uber Diablo for that matter, were never canonical events. Even during the days of D2, before the Sin War books etc., it made absolutely no logical, metaphysical or narrative sense within the Diablo Universe. They were two fun events designed to deal with design flaws within D2, nothing more.
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This speech however implies that there was never any tensions within the ranks of Hell, and that it has all been a ploy to fool both Sanctuary and Heaven. This would, by extension, also mean that the civil war that is said to be raging between Azmodan and Belial has been nothing but a ruse."
Not necessarily. While that has certainly been the prevailing theory on this matter over the years, I think the Black Soulstone cinematic, plus what we know of events within D3 disprove this line of thought. Azmodan and Belial both appear to be at real odds with the Prime Evils.
What's important to note here is that even if the Three did mastermind their own exile, it does not necessitate that the Lesser Evils knew about this. The Lesser Evils could have been duped by the Three, and likely were.
PlugY for Diablo II allows you to reset skills and stats, transfer items between characters in singleplayer, obtain all ladder runewords and do all Uberquests while offline. It is the only way to do all of the above. Please use it.
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I'm not sure I understand the exact question, are you wondering how Azmodan figured out the Black Soulstone existed, or how Diablo figured it out? At this point both questions are impossible to answer, and I bet they rely on story development within D3 which we have yet to hear of.
PlugY for Diablo II allows you to reset skills and stats, transfer items between characters in singleplayer, obtain all ladder runewords and do all Uberquests while offline. It is the only way to do all of the above. Please use it.
Supporting big shoulderpads and flashy armor since 2004.
Why didn't they just "walk over" to sanctuary?
I guess neither the lesser evils nor the high heavens should become suspicious. "We are not on sanctuary by choice."
That's a theory I subscribed to in the past, but it doesn't seem to be what actually happened. From what we can tell from the Book of Cain, Heaven didn't know the Three were exiled to Sanctuary. Tyrael only found out by happenstance some decades after it happened, and then he did everything he could to keep that knowledge from the rest of the Council. Thus he created the Horadrim to hunt them down.
In light of this, it would seem that the Three never intended for the soulstones to be used to begin with, since they ravaged Sanctuary just fine without them for forty years. What seems mor elikely is that, once Tyrael decided to use the soulstones, then Izual informed the Three about them and their weakness.
Now Diablo somehow got the knowledge of the black soulstone and he adapted his plan, or someone else plays a role later on (Adria's betrayal stuff) which somehow has to lead to the merging theory.
The Black Soulstone was only created by Zoltun Kulle after the Three were all imprisoned, so like I said, it's really hard to say anything definitive about it at this point.
PlugY for Diablo II allows you to reset skills and stats, transfer items between characters in singleplayer, obtain all ladder runewords and do all Uberquests while offline. It is the only way to do all of the above. Please use it.
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Since the worldstone is gone, shouldn't nephalem powers break free ?
Yes. But not immediately like a crowd at the Mall on a Black Friday sale.
Yea, since it's been said the worldstone took the powers away from the nephalem over generations, I would think to reverse it would take the same amount of time. IE, why D3 is 20 years later, a generation or two away
The thing is the Worldstone is not destroyed. I mean not the whole of it. At Blizzcon they mentioned that only a part of the worldstone is destroyed
Yes, the worldstone did exist in another plane, and thus when its OTHER side was destroyed, it remained. The fraction in the Pandemonium was removed to Earth, and there destroyed. However, there was the other fraction of the worldstone that yet remained, in another plane. And now, that section of the Worldstone has been hinted by both blizzard and the book to play a very important role in "future events" [D3 obviously].
Maybe something to do between the Black Soulstone, a manifestation of power to harness the power of both angels and demons, and also this Fraction of the Worldstone, that has the very power to make the nephalems some of the strongest beings in the universe[ or in otherwords make now more-nephalem-like humans become all powerful such as Uldyssian], as well as the odd fact that Azmodan's forces are spawning from the "shattered mountain" [Past- Arreat Mountain, where Worldstone was and had to be destroyed to stop all hell being released into Earth] . However, I'm sure that all of this will be obvious to us within the first 10-15 hours the game is out [3 to get/install, 12 or more to play!]
PlugY for Diablo II allows you to reset skills and stats, transfer items between characters in singleplayer, obtain all ladder runewords and do all Uberquests while offline. It is the only way to do all of the above. Please use it.
Supporting big shoulderpads and flashy armor since 2004.
1) The seven great evils came from each of the heads of the 7-headed dragon Tathamet. In the beginning only a single pearl existed (named Anu). Inside the pearl was everything and every emotion. The forces within the pearl polarized into good/evil and the pearl split apart. The evil was cast out and formed into Tathamet while the good formed into a diamond warrior (also named Anu). These two primordial beings of good and evil warred forever until one day the destroyed each other in a catastrophic explosion. This is how the universe that sancuary exists in was created. The seven heads of Tathamet became the seven great evils with the three primary heads becoming the three prime evils. So to answer your question, no, the great evils did not start out as regular demons and worked their way to the top, they have always existed in thier current roles.
2) I do not believe there is a way for a non-great evil demon to ascend to the seat of a great evil. But I would like to point out that you have a misconception about the role of heaven in the diablo universe. Heaven rules with strict and severe justice emotion as we know it is not a virtue respected by militarist angels (other than hope i guess). You envision heaven as being a place of everything good but in this universe heaven believes that their is no room for compasion and love and that these are viewed as weaknesses and a human would not enjoy such an environment let alone be allowed to exist there. Also humans are abominations in the eyes of the angles because we are the spawn of angles and demons, something that never should have existed.
I could have gone further into detail but if you are looking for more I HIGHLY encourage you to read "the book of cain" It will fill you in on just about all the key pieces of lore that is applicable at the time of Diablo III. If you want even more lore I would recommend reading the lore pieces from Diablo I instruction manuel http://www.diablowik...drim_-_Book_One as well as the Sin War series as those books are considered to be applicable pieces of lore whereas the other Diablo books are more like side stories (so I hear, as I have not read the other books). Additionally there are several youtube compilation videos of all the important events that happened in diablo I and II those are good for a few more lore pieces http://www.youtube.c...er/zealousdemon. Other than that the next book "the order" will be available on may 15th. Oh yeah, and you should also watch the Blizzcon '11 Diablo III lore panel videos on youtube, I think it is an hour long and has some good info as well .Well, hope this has provided some useful information. <7 days =)
Most of your questions do not have answers at this point other than speculation. I would like to point out that although Sanctuary, heaven, and hell are in the same universe it is said that Sanctuary was created with the Worldstone in an alternate diminsion to keep it hiden from heaven and hell. Hell discovered its existance dring the mage clan wars and heaven discovered it during the Sin War. So heaven and hell are physical locations but mortals can not simply travel to them unless by some unique means such as summoned by the Angiris Council or the portal open by the prime evils. In Diablo I you go deeper and deeper underground and fight in an area that resembles hell but according to the book of cain (i believe) that area just resembles hell because Diablo had been summoning his demons from deep within the catacombs for so long. I'm sure it will be made clear as you play through Diablo III how your hero is able to travel to these places (that is if we do visit both of these sites).
I've been watching some videos, trying to piece the entirety of Diablo 3 together. I've watched the cinematics, and am trying to get the whole thing revolving around the Black Soulstone.
So the heroes journey to Caldeum and defeat Kulle, taking the Black Soulstone. However, as he charges it, it seems to draw into itself the souls of the dead lords of Hell spontaneously. It's later "revealed" that Adria "marked" the demons' souls, allowing them to be drawn in. Is this ever elaborated upon? How did she "mark" them? And how does the Black Soulstone destroy them with Diablo's "final defeat"? It seems like they'd simply be banished back into it, their essence waiting within.
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Be it through hallowed grounds or lands of sorrow
All in the Forger's wake is left bereft and fallow
Is the residuum worth the cost of destruction and maiming;
Or is the shaping a culling and exercise in taming?
The road's goal is the dark Origin of Being
But be wary through what thickets it winds.
-Excerpt from the Litany of Residuum;
As Translated by He Who Brings Order
1) Tyreal is "sacrifice" his position in Heavens to become a mortal humam. Err... I thought nephalem > angels and nephalem = human (from the Sin War trilogy), then logically humans > angels. How transform into a potential stronger being is a setency/sacrifice ?
The only explation is that human =/= nephalem. Nephalem are the demon-angel hybrids (actualy the closest thing to Anu) and humans are degenerated nephalem. So not all people in sanctuary have the untaped power, only a few (the "not so degenrated ones"). It seens men are the degenerated forms of high celestial beigns (nephalem, angels and demons), not only nephalem. It just happens that the first race to turn into mortal was the nephalem.
My question is if the way i see the story is right or if theres another explanation for how Tyreal becaming human makes any sense.
2) I think i just missed something but how the soul of the prime evils were sucked inside the Blacksoul Stone ? Was Diablo truelly inside Leah this whole time or it was inside the Black Soulstone (or both) ? Seriously wtf going on ?
Diablo story is seriously confusng. I'm still struggling to understand wtf the soul stones really do...
In the wizard short an assassin is sent after the wizard, and the one who sent the assassin Valthek is very sure that the assassin will reach the wizard and kill her before she can save the would. But when I played the story of D3 with my wizard I didn't find anything even referring to the assassin.
Is there some piece of lore that I missed?
In the wizard short an assassin is sent after the wizard, and the one who sent the assassin Valthek is very sure that the assassin will reach the wizard and kill her before she can save the would. But when I played the story of D3 with my wizard I didn't find anything even referring to the assassin.
Is there some piece of lore that I missed?
I don't think the Assassins work like what you may think of when you hear 'assassin.' As far as I know, altered dialogues and maybe cutscenes are the only class-specific things in-game. (The Witch Doctor's dialogue is pretty cool with his spirits guiding him) Perhaps class-specific content will be something they do for an expansion.
Wizard short story spoilers I suppose:
Like in the story, an Assassin had been sent to watch Isendra, the Sorceress. They didn't kill her immediately, only when she started casting that powerful weather-altering spell that failed. (Bear in mind this is meant to be the sorceress from Diablo 2, so she would have already proven she had immense power) The same will apply to the Wizard, as long as they aren't corrupted or trying to cast an extremely dangerous spell, they should be fine, for now.
From the Assasin lore:
The small surviving group of sorcerers, the remnants of the once-great Vizjerei clan, resolved forevermore to spurn Demonic Magics and set about renewing their studies in the Elemental Magics. To further ensure that a similar tragedy could never happen again, they formed a secret order whose sole purpose was to police the mage clans, destroying corruption wherever they found it. This was the birth of the Viz-Jaq'taar, the Order of the Mage Slayers — otherwise known as the Assassins.
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Non nobis, Domine, non nobis sed nomini tuo da gloriam.
Questions rise: 1. What are the equivalents of the old Diablo 2 heroes in Diablo 3? Or did Blizzard decided to skip that 'tradition' ?
2. What is the timeline regarding the events in Diablo 1 and the period when Lachdanan, Leoric and others were alive? I know Lachdanan killed Leoric and went alone in the lower-levels of the Cathedral to die, for he was cursed.
As far as we know, none of the D2 heroes were corrupted, but 'not all of them are alive'. There are references in game and out of game to some of them though.
Necromancer - Act II random event hints he had trained apprentice(s)
Sorceress - Wizard's short story
Assassin - Wizard short story (maybe)
Barbarian - Was originally going to be the Barbarian you play as, was later changed to not be the same to downplay his importance or something like that.
The others, as far as I know, have unknown fates.
http://www.diablofan...logy-of-events/
This lore in this topic makes it sound like Leoric ruled for months trying to fight off Diablo. Considering all the torture chambers and prisons you go to in D3, he may have ruled for several months after he went mad.
Perhaps there's a precise timeline out there somewhere, but several months, maybe around a year, is probably accurate for his time ruling as the 'Black King.'
I suppose it depends on how quickly the Khanduras army lost to Westmarch. He was killed shortly after Lachdanan and the survivors of the failed Westmarch invasion returned.
Going by the D1 lore, the Warrior/D1 heroes would have arrived in Tristram not long after Leoric's death, as word of the weird events spread across the lands.
Going by the retconned Warrior = Price Aidan, he probably would have been with Lachdanan and the other survivors.
Not long after Leoric took possession of Khanduras, a power long asleep awakened within the dark recesses beneath the Monastery.
... For many months King Leoric secretly fought the evil presence that twisted his thoughts and emotions.
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Non nobis, Domine, non nobis sed nomini tuo da gloriam.
1) Tyreal is "sacrifice" his position in Heavens to become a mortal humam. Err... I thought nephalem > angels and nephalem = human (from the Sin War trilogy), then logically humans > angels. How transform into a potential stronger being is a setency/sacrifice ?
The only explation is that human =/= nephalem. Nephalem are the demon-angel hybrids (actualy the closest thing to Anu) and humans are degenerated nephalem. So not all people in sanctuary have the untaped power, only a few (the "not so degenrated ones"). It seens men are the degenerated forms of high celestial beigns (nephalem, angels and demons), not only nephalem. It just happens that the first race to turn into mortal was the nephalem.
My question is if the way i see the story is right or if theres another explanation for how Tyreal becaming human makes any sense.
2) I think i just missed something but how the soul of the prime evils were sucked inside the Blacksoul Stone ? Was Diablo truelly inside Leah this whole time or it was inside the Black Soulstone (or both) ? Seriously wtf going on ?
Diablo story is seriously confusng. I'm still struggling to understand wtf the soul stones really do...
In the Diablo games lore (especially 3), some humans have discovered their powers, but are not close to being at a Nephalem level. They don't live as long as them, nor have their features. Hence they are "just" humans. So Tyrael is just being "downgraded" to a human, not a Nephalem since no such exist.
Since the Worldstone is gone, Nephalem power will surely wake. And Nephalem do exist: the 5 D3 heroes are cleary nephalem (at least the greater evils call you that way); it seens Magda is a nephalem too once she entered the suken temple, a place were only nephalem can open.
Imo turning into potential nephalem doesn't sound like a punishment. Also, if nephalem mortals are hybrid demon-angels, in my understanding angels shiuldnt be able to become humam since they lack the demon herintage.
TLDNR; Humans are NOT Nephalem, they are lesser versions of them. Adria made the Evils go into the black soulstone.
But the Evil's spirits shouldn't be on Sanctuary, they should be at the Abyss !
What's the point of lighting them? I don't get it. Why is it important enough to risk my life for?
Lightning up the fires will show the soldiers fighting on the battlefield and on the wall that they had not lost yet (they show that part of the keep has be "retaken" proving that demons can be defeated).
When people are in an situation they're sure they'll be dead by the end of the day the basic reaction is to let thenself be killed as soon as possible. Specially if they think they will be tortured or something.
Showing an way out of sure death situations surely boost the spirirt to take up arms and try to win.
What happened to Adria after she released Diablo from Leah ? Is she still alive ?
She's possibly on standby in case D3 will get an expansion or something. Considering that Adria has been quite a valuable servant of Diablo, my guess is that she is very capable of bringing him back to the world of the living again.
What happened to the world without Tyreal? For 20 years he had to 'find his ethereal form' after destroying the world stone. When Auriel is captured the Angels, Tyreal, as well as many Humans in the keep lose their hope for a victory over Diablo and evil. If Tyreal is missing, what kind of things went wrong without Justice being in the world?
Is this wrong? Do the Angelic aspects not affect people with their absence? Without Malthael do we lose wisdom until Tyreal takes over at the end of D3? I know its not all explained but I really thought there could be some cool stories created with this in mind.
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What's important to note here is that even if the Three did mastermind their own exile, it does not necessitate that the Lesser Evils knew about this. The Lesser Evils could have been duped by the Three, and likely were.
In light of this, it would seem that the Three never intended for the soulstones to be used to begin with, since they ravaged Sanctuary just fine without them for forty years. What seems mor elikely is that, once Tyrael decided to use the soulstones, then Izual informed the Three about them and their weakness.
The Black Soulstone was only created by Zoltun Kulle after the Three were all imprisoned, so like I said, it's really hard to say anything definitive about it at this point.
Yes, the worldstone did exist in another plane, and thus when its OTHER side was destroyed, it remained. The fraction in the Pandemonium was removed to Earth, and there destroyed. However, there was the other fraction of the worldstone that yet remained, in another plane. And now, that section of the Worldstone has been hinted by both blizzard and the book to play a very important role in "future events" [D3 obviously].
Maybe something to do between the Black Soulstone, a manifestation of power to harness the power of both angels and demons, and also this Fraction of the Worldstone, that has the very power to make the nephalems some of the strongest beings in the universe[ or in otherwords make now more-nephalem-like humans become all powerful such as Uldyssian], as well as the odd fact that Azmodan's forces are spawning from the "shattered mountain" [Past- Arreat Mountain, where Worldstone was and had to be destroyed to stop all hell being released into Earth] . However, I'm sure that all of this will be obvious to us within the first 10-15 hours the game is out [3 to get/install, 12 or more to play!]
2) I do not believe there is a way for a non-great evil demon to ascend to the seat of a great evil. But I would like to point out that you have a misconception about the role of heaven in the diablo universe. Heaven rules with strict and severe justice emotion as we know it is not a virtue respected by militarist angels (other than hope i guess). You envision heaven as being a place of everything good but in this universe heaven believes that their is no room for compasion and love and that these are viewed as weaknesses and a human would not enjoy such an environment let alone be allowed to exist there. Also humans are abominations in the eyes of the angles because we are the spawn of angles and demons, something that never should have existed.
I could have gone further into detail but if you are looking for more I HIGHLY encourage you to read "the book of cain" It will fill you in on just about all the key pieces of lore that is applicable at the time of Diablo III. If you want even more lore I would recommend reading the lore pieces from Diablo I instruction manuel http://www.diablowik...drim_-_Book_One as well as the Sin War series as those books are considered to be applicable pieces of lore whereas the other Diablo books are more like side stories (so I hear, as I have not read the other books). Additionally there are several youtube compilation videos of all the important events that happened in diablo I and II those are good for a few more lore pieces http://www.youtube.c...er/zealousdemon. Other than that the next book "the order" will be available on may 15th. Oh yeah, and you should also watch the Blizzcon '11 Diablo III lore panel videos on youtube, I think it is an hour long and has some good info as well .Well, hope this has provided some useful information. <7 days =)
All in the Forger's wake is left bereft and fallow-Excerpt from the Litany of Residuum;
As Translated by He Who Brings Order
1) Tyreal is "sacrifice" his position in Heavens to become a mortal humam. Err... I thought nephalem > angels and nephalem = human (from the Sin War trilogy), then logically humans > angels. How transform into a potential stronger being is a setency/sacrifice ?
The only explation is that human =/= nephalem. Nephalem are the demon-angel hybrids (actualy the closest thing to Anu) and humans are degenerated nephalem. So not all people in sanctuary have the untaped power, only a few (the "not so degenrated ones"). It seens men are the degenerated forms of high celestial beigns (nephalem, angels and demons), not only nephalem. It just happens that the first race to turn into mortal was the nephalem.
My question is if the way i see the story is right or if theres another explanation for how Tyreal becaming human makes any sense.
2) I think i just missed something but how the soul of the prime evils were sucked inside the Blacksoul Stone ? Was Diablo truelly inside Leah this whole time or it was inside the Black Soulstone (or both) ? Seriously wtf going on ?
Diablo story is seriously confusng. I'm still struggling to understand wtf the soul stones really do...
In the wizard short an assassin is sent after the wizard, and the one who sent the assassin Valthek is very sure that the assassin will reach the wizard and kill her before she can save the would. But when I played the story of D3 with my wizard I didn't find anything even referring to the assassin.
Is there some piece of lore that I missed?
I don't think the Assassins work like what you may think of when you hear 'assassin.' As far as I know, altered dialogues and maybe cutscenes are the only class-specific things in-game. (The Witch Doctor's dialogue is pretty cool with his spirits guiding him) Perhaps class-specific content will be something they do for an expansion.
Wizard short story spoilers I suppose:
From the Assasin lore:
The small surviving group of sorcerers, the remnants of the once-great Vizjerei clan, resolved forevermore to spurn Demonic Magics and set about renewing their studies in the Elemental Magics. To further ensure that a similar tragedy could never happen again, they formed a secret order whose sole purpose was to police the mage clans, destroying corruption wherever they found it. This was the birth of the Viz-Jaq'taar, the Order of the Mage Slayers — otherwise known as the Assassins.
As far as we know, none of the D2 heroes were corrupted, but 'not all of them are alive'. There are references in game and out of game to some of them though.
Necromancer - Act II random event hints he had trained apprentice(s)
Sorceress - Wizard's short story
Assassin - Wizard short story (maybe)
Barbarian - Was originally going to be the Barbarian you play as, was later changed to not be the same to downplay his importance or something like that.
The others, as far as I know, have unknown fates.
http://www.diablofan...logy-of-events/
This lore in this topic makes it sound like Leoric ruled for months trying to fight off Diablo. Considering all the torture chambers and prisons you go to in D3, he may have ruled for several months after he went mad.
Perhaps there's a precise timeline out there somewhere, but several months, maybe around a year, is probably accurate for his time ruling as the 'Black King.'
I suppose it depends on how quickly the Khanduras army lost to Westmarch. He was killed shortly after Lachdanan and the survivors of the failed Westmarch invasion returned.
Going by the D1 lore, the Warrior/D1 heroes would have arrived in Tristram not long after Leoric's death, as word of the weird events spread across the lands.
Going by the retconned Warrior = Price Aidan, he probably would have been with Lachdanan and the other survivors.
Since the Worldstone is gone, Nephalem power will surely wake. And Nephalem do exist: the 5 D3 heroes are cleary nephalem (at least the greater evils call you that way); it seens Magda is a nephalem too once she entered the suken temple, a place were only nephalem can open.
Imo turning into potential nephalem doesn't sound like a punishment. Also, if nephalem mortals are hybrid demon-angels, in my understanding angels shiuldnt be able to become humam since they lack the demon herintage.
But the Evil's spirits shouldn't be on Sanctuary, they should be at the Abyss !
Lightning up the fires will show the soldiers fighting on the battlefield and on the wall that they had not lost yet (they show that part of the keep has be "retaken" proving that demons can be defeated).
When people are in an situation they're sure they'll be dead by the end of the day the basic reaction is to let thenself be killed as soon as possible. Specially if they think they will be tortured or something.
Showing an way out of sure death situations surely boost the spirirt to take up arms and try to win.
What happened to Adria after she released Diablo from Leah ? Is she still alive ?
She's possibly on standby in case D3 will get an expansion or something. Considering that Adria has been quite a valuable servant of Diablo, my guess is that she is very capable of bringing him back to the world of the living again.
What happened to the world without Tyreal? For 20 years he had to 'find his ethereal form' after destroying the world stone. When Auriel is captured the Angels, Tyreal, as well as many Humans in the keep lose their hope for a victory over Diablo and evil. If Tyreal is missing, what kind of things went wrong without Justice being in the world?
Is this wrong? Do the Angelic aspects not affect people with their absence? Without Malthael do we lose wisdom until Tyreal takes over at the end of D3? I know its not all explained but I really thought there could be some cool stories created with this in mind.