I've actually been curious about this for a while; do you all feel like Diablo 3 has an actual end game right now? Currently I feel like I'm just going to the casino to get loot. When I get enough good loot, I pack up, move to a high rollin' casino (torment II-VI) and try again. Maybe some don't feel the same way as I do, but an end game to me has always been the hardest challenge with precise detail on what you'll be facing.
"That last dungeon of that game, man it was hard. I had to go back and farm to even put up a fight."
"The final boss is just cruel. We party wiped like 5 times before we beat it."
aRPG should not have end-game. This is not mmorpg.
What? Diablo 2 had an end game. It was act 5 on hell difficulty followed by ubers and Diablo clone. You can always seek perfection and keep playing your character, but there was indeed an end game.
go play on hardcore, that feeling of challenge will come back pretty fast
Oh don't get me wrong. This game is challenging, sometimes insanely punishing. The jump from T5 to T6 is frustrating for me at my skill level.
Maybe I'll try to go beat the story mode on T6.
I never liked this endgame discussion, but at this point it's really just ridiculous. I don't fully agree with silvach that ARPGs have no endgame, but it's certainly not an MMORPG-like endgame.
That being said, D3's "endgame", if you want to discuss it that way, is miles ahead of D2. In D2, even what you describe as endgame (Hellfire event) was beaten by a group of NAKED PEOPLE. No gear whatsoever, on HC, Google "D2 Ironman" runs. Not sure if you'd be able to beat even T6 naked, let alone Greater Rift level 50.
ARPGs are about progression - kill monsters, get loot, kill more monsters, get more loot, and so on. And with Greater Rifts as a part of endgame that has no real ceiling, it's like beating the 100m world record - it'll be incredibly hard to beat that and only a "one in a million" chance will get you there, but that's why it's a world record.
To answer your question: absolutely definitely totally "yes". My opinion. Your mileage may vary.
To me, the endgame in D3 starts when you have accumulated all the required items for your target spec. I have reached that status with my Wiz, DH, Monk and WD and my "endgame"-options are now:
1) t6 rifts in order to get better rolled versions of my items and craft mats
2) grifts to upgrade gems
3) bounties for a better RoRG and access to rifts
4) uber event for a decent Hellfire amulet
So, while there are several different activities, there's nothing really special that you can't do from the get-go.
edit: Might sound negative, but it keeps me entertained for now.
Diablo 3 is about killing and looting and looting and killing. A level up to pick a skill or change the skill. Some more killing and looting and then more level ups and skill placements. More killing and looting and level ups until max character level. more killing and looting and then placing points into paragon level ups. Again looting and killing.
The only thing changes is the type of loot you get, the monsters to kill and the area you kill the bad guys.
And for the most part ARPG's follow the motto Killing and looting and loot to kill.
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On Strike and supporting Fallout 4 Mod Makers
Some fallout 4 mod makers have had their mods stolen and uploaded and downloaded on Bethesda's site for the Xbox One.
You are playing the wrong game. You are looking for sensations commonly found in RPGs, which never were served by D3 or any Diablo part for that matter.
You get gear and get to kill stuff for better stuff so you can kill more stuff for even better stuff. And then there's leaderboards and seasons and s***. Torment and Monster Power are only means to an end to provide a challenge for experienced players to improve the relation between "time spent killing monsters" and "legendary drop chance".
The challenge does not lie in killing specific enemies. You kill ridiculous amounts of enemies. It lies in improving your gear to get every percentage out of it and with GRifts you have a dynamic difficulty where you can compete and compare your progress with others.
aRPG should not have end-game. This is not mmorpg.
What? Diablo 2 had an end game. It was act 5 on hell difficulty followed by ubers and Diablo clone. You can always seek perfection and keep playing your character, but there was indeed an end game.
Diablo 3 Act V Torment 6, after that you can do Ubers (one of them is a diablo clone) so I fail to see your logic. D3 has everything you see as "end-game" that D2 had and you still ask for end-game content. Please make up your mind about what you want.
aRPG should not have end-game. This is not mmorpg.
What? Diablo 2 had an end game. It was act 5 on hell difficulty followed by ubers and Diablo clone. You can always seek perfection and keep playing your character, but there was indeed an end game.
Diablo 3 Act V Torment 6, after that you can do Ubers (one of them is a diablo clone) so I fail to see your logic. D3 has everything you see as "end-game" that D2 had and you still ask for end-game content. Please make up your mind about what you want.
You're right. I talked to my friend about it who was a hardcore d2 fan and he said, "what you're missing is a structure to the game." Basically he is saying that d2 had a structure, where if you know what you want, there was a best place to farm said items where as in d3, aside from bounty runs, items have the same drop rate everywhere so you just do things in hopes for the next big drop. You're running around like a chicken with your head cut off.
aRPG should not have end-game. This is not mmorpg.
What? Diablo 2 had an end game. It was act 5 on hell difficulty followed by ubers and Diablo clone. You can always seek perfection and keep playing your character, but there was indeed an end game.
Diablo 3 Act V Torment 6, after that you can do Ubers (one of them is a diablo clone) so I fail to see your logic. D3 has everything you see as "end-game" that D2 had and you still ask for end-game content. Please make up your mind about what you want.
You're right. I talked to my friend about it who was a hardcore d2 fan and he said, "what you're missing is a structure to the game." Basically he is saying that d2 had a structure, where if you know what you want, there was a best place to farm said items where as in d3, aside from bounty runs, items have the same drop rate everywhere so you just do things in hopes for the next big drop. You're running around like a chicken with your head cut off.
Yeah I came to this conclusion myself a few times, but it is a double edged sword:
If you know where to get what you want and you can farm this specific item, You'll spend your days farming exactly that one part until you get what you want. I never really played D2 for longer than nightmare Act..3 I think and when I hear from a friend that he misses the Baal runs, Ugh, sorry but that sounds so borring, I mean, really? How can it be fun killing the same boss countless times in hopes to get the same item over and over again, while hoping that it would be a little bit better than last time?
In D3 you can't farm specific items, with the exception of the Cache bounties, so you can do whatever you think is most fun, because the chances that you get the item you want won't change with the things you do. That gives you a freedom that D2 never had, and I think it's this freedom that many old "hardcore D2" players find so "boring". They are used to get told what they have to do in order to get what they want. But now that they can do whatever they want, they don't know what to do.
aRPG should not have end-game. This is not mmorpg.
What? Diablo 2 had an end game. It was act 5 on hell difficulty followed by ubers and Diablo clone. You can always seek perfection and keep playing your character, but there was indeed an end game.
Diablo 3 Act V Torment 6, after that you can do Ubers (one of them is a diablo clone) so I fail to see your logic. D3 has everything you see as "end-game" that D2 had and you still ask for end-game content. Please make up your mind about what you want.
You're right. I talked to my friend about it who was a hardcore d2 fan and he said, "what you're missing is a structure to the game." Basically he is saying that d2 had a structure, where if you know what you want, there was a best place to farm said items where as in d3, aside from bounty runs, items have the same drop rate everywhere so you just do things in hopes for the next big drop. You're running around like a chicken with your head cut off.
Yeah I came to this conclusion myself a few times, but it is a double edged sword:
If you know where to get what you want and you can farm this specific item, You'll spend your days farming exactly that one part until you get what you want. I never really played D2 for longer than nightmare Act..3 I think and when I hear from a friend that he misses the Baal runs, Ugh, sorry but that sounds so borring, I mean, really? How can it be fun killing the same boss countless times in hopes to get the same item over and over again, while hoping that it would be a little bit better than last time?
In D3 you can't farm specific items, with the exception of the Cache bounties, so you can do whatever you think is most fun, because the chances that you get the item you want won't change with the things you do. That gives you a freedom that D2 never had, and I think it's this freedom that many old "hardcore D2" players find so "boring". They are used to get told what they have to do in order to get what they want. But now that they can do whatever they want, they don't know what to do.
I agree completely. This is actually a tough point to follow so if I can't promise I'll articulate it well (also I've been drinking all night): I feel that having a completely opened ended world is bad for the health of the game because it encourages indifference. Through indifference comes boredom because your decisions, in the long run are less valuable from a gameplay stand point because you will eventually progress (theoretically) provided you just play the game. It feels like there is a minimal separation between casual players and people that try to master the game, because the two beneficiary statistics in favor for any player are luck and time which both accomplish whenever they log on. While this doesn't pull from the idea of a standard RPG, it detracts from people that want to gain something through gameplay outside of "style." I guess that's really it when I say I'm looking for an end game. "Increasing monster statistics" doesn't feel like end game for me; mechanics do. Because I can't find a challenge that can't be solved with "wait for x piece of gear to drop" so you can, I feel unsatisfied.
There is no real solution to this problem aside from finding another game that gives me what I'm craving, but it hurts because Diablo 3 does SO much right that it's hard to put it behind me, mainly because I'm selfish and I want to find ways to play it for the next decade like my friends and I did for D2.
Main diffference endgame wise between D2 and D3 is that D2 was way more openly designed. You didnt have all those limitations that they put in D3. This gave the community the possibility to come up with their own endgame.
Just one example i will list here is you fill a game with naked lvl 1 HC chars, all turn on PVP, and the first guy to beat act 1 (or the last one living ) wins the "race". D2 allowed for such games cause it was not restrictive.
Look at how much fun such an event would be in D3. Act 1 has almost no map randomisation, so the race would be much less open. You can't pvp outside of this boring pvp-arena, so that aspect would not work either. What's left? Leveling against the clock in narrow, static tunnels. That's how blizzard wants you to play the game, and that's the ONLY way you can play this game.
Main diffference endgame wise between D2 and D3 is that D2 was way more openly designed. You didnt have all those limitations that they put in D3. This gave the community the possibility to come up with their own endgame.
Just one example i will list here is you fill a game with naked lvl 1 HC chars, all turn on PVP, and the first guy to beat act 1 (or the last one living ) wins the "race". D2 allowed for such games cause it was not restrictive.
Look at how much fun such an event would be in D3. Act 1 has almost no map randomisation, so the race would be much less open. You can't pvp outside of this boring pvp-arena, so that aspect would not work either. What's left? Leveling against the clock in narrow, static tunnels. That's how blizzard wants you to play the game, and that's the ONLY way you can play this game.
Stuff like that would be great. It's been said thousands of times, but trading was a hook I enjoyed. All the restrictions make you feel like you are supposed to go down a certain path for success but you are left in an open world with no direction. Feels very counter intuitive.
Maybe uber like bosses monthly make a new challege Really hard bosses at the end of dungeon Unique enemies for some special loots And a team deathmatch 4 vs 4
What's left? Leveling against the clock in narrow, static tunnels. That's how blizzard wants you to play the game, and that's the ONLY way you can play this game.
Unfortunately, and somewhat shockingly, 1.x was actually better able to hold my attention than 2.x. This is mostly due to Josh's stance that player choice needs to be removed.
I find it absurd that they removed trading because players could circumvent the natural flow of the game and gain some kind of "advantage" over other players. Yet, when faced with people exploiting a bug with XP gains in rifts, they just fix the bug and move on. If one is a problem then the other is a problem. If one problem requires compete eradication of trading then the other surely requires more than just letting the people who exploited keep their spoils. It's inconsistent stances like this which frustrate me.
They want to open up diversity? So they implement a game mode that actively encourages us to seek out every last little .5% increase in effectiveness of our builds. Greater Rifts are the biggest hit to build diversity (and related item diversity) since the horrible decision to "double it" in regards to Inferno difficulty.
They want to open up diversity? So they make Campaign Mode completely useless and Bounties useless except as a gate to Rifts and as a mechanism to get a select few items. Our choices as to *how* to spend our time are at an all-time low. Want to rank up your legendary gems? There is only one way to do that. If you're not going a Greater Rift of equal, or higher, level than the gem you want to rank up then you probably aren't going to be making much progress on that front.
Instead of allowing legendary gems to rank up independent of where you are playing, they chose to limit it which further shoehorns HOW we play. This is OK when it's used sparingly. I'd argue that the Uber events are basically "enough" of it for the whole game, currently.
And I really think the guy/gal who OKd Trials should be tied to a telephone pole and we should be allowed to punch them in the face until all the bones in our hands are broken. They are truly boring and entirely unnecessary. Since they fixed pet survivability I've been able to enjoy 2.1 much more. It was a major stumbling block for me. But, even still, every single time I realize that I have to do a trial I log off. Trials are not fun. They're horrible. The people who thought they were fun make me so angry that I seriously want to hit someone.
I've never felt that way about anyone at Blizzard, ever. I've never wanted to take a swing at Jay, or Josh, or anyone. But if someone stepped forward and took responsibility for Trials I seriously would take a swing at them if I saw them in the street regardless of the repercussions. How anyone, including the people QAing that shit, could have given it the thumbs-up as something enjoyable that enhances the overall experience of the game is beyond me.
Trials are hands-down the absolute worst thing D3 has ever seen. I'd rather have the shitty itemization and AH back than do trials. The fact that I have to spend 15+ minutes talking myself into doing a single trial is mind-blowing. They really should be ashamed of themselves that this is the best they can do given the rocky history that this game has had.
What's worse is that they keep trying to apply band-aids to a system that many people hate and that really isn't working for the playerbase. I do not know a single person who actually enjoys doing trials. Every single person I know would prefer that they were removed from the game. While that's anecdotal, I think it's pretty obvious WHY people might feel this way and WHY it probably is a majority opinion. It shouldn't be shocking that people dislike a must-perform task that gives no rewards at all other than very poor XP.
But, this wouldn't be a major issue.... IF I COULD RANK UP MY LEGENDARY GEMS OUTSIDE OF GREATER RIFTS.
If Greater Rifts were purely "epeen mode" it would help to mitigate how uninspired and boring the Realm of Trials actually is.
They want to open up diversity? So they implement a game mode that actively encourages us to seek out every last little .5% increase in effectiveness of our builds. Greater Rifts are the biggest hit to build diversity (and related item diversity) since the horrible decision to "double it" in regards to Inferno difficulty.
My endgame did not really change from D2. I want ~3-4 powerful, "efficient" (I hate this word with a passion) heroes to farm shards and items with. All my other character slots are/will be used for creative and exotic builds, just to experiment around with different abilities that I like gameplay-wise or that are visually appealing and take them to atleast T6. So my endgame is something like a character modeling kit I guess. In D2 I had loads of fun like that and I played Sacrifice Paladin, Thornmancer, Daggermancer, Summoner with a Bow, Holy Fire Paladin, Rabies Werewolf, Armageddon Druid, Poison Java and so on.
Well, while the build diversity in D2 was considered better because the low difficulty of the game allowed you to stomp anything anway, I wouldn't want that back. In D3 there are plenty of opportunities to create such exotic characters, you just don't get to excel in grifts with them. Just like you don't bring a stock car to a Formula 1 race. Also, even in D2 you could very well get alienated if you didn't bring your Java/Hammerdin/Smiter. Now the addition of a game mode that enables players who like efficiency to test their limits is a good move. It has some flaws, but it doesn't hinder anyone playing their melee Wizards in t6 and below.
it would be great to have extra hellfire items.
But make it like a monthly uber guardian.
they could even add some tactics to defeat him.
I kinda agree with this. I already thought about amulets with 2 sockets for example. However the current uber system isn't very player friendly. You have to go out of your way for a long, unrewarding time (key farming) to then stomp a trivial encounter and get an abysmal small chance at an upgrade because amulets have the most restrictive stat requirements in the game. Just look at how many people use random amulets that happened to roll double-crit.
Also, I hate that Blizz overlooked the single player disadvantages in this regard when they fixed rift keystones to require one (and only one!) per player. Why do 4 players get 4 amulets for the price of 1? I have stockpiled some machines now and couldn't find the motivation to turn them in yet. I don't hate people, don't get me wrong, the game just feels so trivial in a group. Plus I like the pause function for real life issues
Yes. Not with that much passion, but yes. Those should be a one-time unlock that you can repeat at will to improve your highest entry level (which has to be lower than the highest grift you can beat however, to combat Zombie/Conduit fishing, but that's a different topic).
I think this system is in the game for multiplayer purposes. There are two benefits: a) All 4 players need the same lvl keystone to enter their grift, Many players have no clue, what their freshly formed party is capable of.
However I don't think these benefits outweigh the long and boring procedure. It should be a lot shorter, like jumping from wave 1 to wave 25 depending on the time it took. It could also have a starting wave depending on game difficulty (like normal: wave 1, t6: wave 25)
Honestly while I found gearing up my original character to be very satisfying, if I had to do that again with abysmal set item drop rates I probably wouldn't be playing at all right now since the current viable Barb playstyle is extremely boring.
I agree with your post when it comes to Diablo 3. This game doesn't have an end-game that is even remotely different from the mid-game.
Your attitude, however, is something I have a problem with. I might be wrong, but I got the impression that you don't think this game needs an end-game (and, after seeing your edit, I was correct). Every game needs an end-game. Not having an end-game is the #1 problem I see in Diablo 3. Farming is extremely boring and the endless-farming style of this game is why only the "hardcore" remain outside of major patches.
Endless farming isn't fun. There needs to be an objective outside of "get better gear to do more of the same boring stuff."
"That last dungeon of that game, man it was hard. I had to go back and farm to even put up a fight."
"The final boss is just cruel. We party wiped like 5 times before we beat it."
I miss that feeling. T-T
Maybe I'll try to go beat the story mode on T6.
That being said, D3's "endgame", if you want to discuss it that way, is miles ahead of D2. In D2, even what you describe as endgame (Hellfire event) was beaten by a group of NAKED PEOPLE. No gear whatsoever, on HC, Google "D2 Ironman" runs. Not sure if you'd be able to beat even T6 naked, let alone Greater Rift level 50.
ARPGs are about progression - kill monsters, get loot, kill more monsters, get more loot, and so on. And with Greater Rifts as a part of endgame that has no real ceiling, it's like beating the 100m world record - it'll be incredibly hard to beat that and only a "one in a million" chance will get you there, but that's why it's a world record.
To answer your question: absolutely definitely totally "yes". My opinion. Your mileage may vary.
End game in D3 right now is GR.
1) t6 rifts in order to get better rolled versions of my items and craft mats
2) grifts to upgrade gems
3) bounties for a better RoRG and access to rifts
4) uber event for a decent Hellfire amulet
So, while there are several different activities, there's nothing really special that you can't do from the get-go.
edit: Might sound negative, but it keeps me entertained for now.
http://eu.battle.net/d3/en/profile/Sol77-2972/hero/66110450
Diablo 3 is about killing and looting and looting and killing. A level up to pick a skill or change the skill. Some more killing and looting and then more level ups and skill placements. More killing and looting and level ups until max character level. more killing and looting and then placing points into paragon level ups. Again looting and killing.
The only thing changes is the type of loot you get, the monsters to kill and the area you kill the bad guys.
And for the most part ARPG's follow the motto Killing and looting and loot to kill.
You get gear and get to kill stuff for better stuff so you can kill more stuff for even better stuff. And then there's leaderboards and seasons and s***. Torment and Monster Power are only means to an end to provide a challenge for experienced players to improve the relation between "time spent killing monsters" and "legendary drop chance".
The challenge does not lie in killing specific enemies. You kill ridiculous amounts of enemies. It lies in improving your gear to get every percentage out of it and with GRifts you have a dynamic difficulty where you can compete and compare your progress with others.
If you know where to get what you want and you can farm this specific item, You'll spend your days farming exactly that one part until you get what you want. I never really played D2 for longer than nightmare Act..3 I think and when I hear from a friend that he misses the Baal runs, Ugh, sorry but that sounds so borring, I mean, really? How can it be fun killing the same boss countless times in hopes to get the same item over and over again, while hoping that it would be a little bit better than last time?
In D3 you can't farm specific items, with the exception of the Cache bounties, so you can do whatever you think is most fun, because the chances that you get the item you want won't change with the things you do. That gives you a freedom that D2 never had, and I think it's this freedom that many old "hardcore D2" players find so "boring". They are used to get told what they have to do in order to get what they want. But now that they can do whatever they want, they don't know what to do.
There is no real solution to this problem aside from finding another game that gives me what I'm craving, but it hurts because Diablo 3 does SO much right that it's hard to put it behind me, mainly because I'm selfish and I want to find ways to play it for the next decade like my friends and I did for D2.
Just one example i will list here is you fill a game with naked lvl 1 HC chars, all turn on PVP, and the first guy to beat act 1 (or the last one living ) wins the "race". D2 allowed for such games cause it was not restrictive.
Look at how much fun such an event would be in D3. Act 1 has almost no map randomisation, so the race would be much less open. You can't pvp outside of this boring pvp-arena, so that aspect would not work either. What's left? Leveling against the clock in narrow, static tunnels. That's how blizzard wants you to play the game, and that's the ONLY way you can play this game.
http://eu.battle.net/d3/en/profile/Twoflower-2131/hero/47336841
Maybe uber like bosses monthly make a new challege
Really hard bosses at the end of dungeon
Unique enemies for some special loots
And a team deathmatch 4 vs 4
^ This
Those Who Do Not Know True Pain Cannot Possibly Understand True Peace...
I find it absurd that they removed trading because players could circumvent the natural flow of the game and gain some kind of "advantage" over other players. Yet, when faced with people exploiting a bug with XP gains in rifts, they just fix the bug and move on. If one is a problem then the other is a problem. If one problem requires compete eradication of trading then the other surely requires more than just letting the people who exploited keep their spoils. It's inconsistent stances like this which frustrate me.
They want to open up diversity? So they implement a game mode that actively encourages us to seek out every last little .5% increase in effectiveness of our builds. Greater Rifts are the biggest hit to build diversity (and related item diversity) since the horrible decision to "double it" in regards to Inferno difficulty.
They want to open up diversity? So they make Campaign Mode completely useless and Bounties useless except as a gate to Rifts and as a mechanism to get a select few items. Our choices as to *how* to spend our time are at an all-time low. Want to rank up your legendary gems? There is only one way to do that. If you're not going a Greater Rift of equal, or higher, level than the gem you want to rank up then you probably aren't going to be making much progress on that front.
Instead of allowing legendary gems to rank up independent of where you are playing, they chose to limit it which further shoehorns HOW we play. This is OK when it's used sparingly. I'd argue that the Uber events are basically "enough" of it for the whole game, currently.
And I really think the guy/gal who OKd Trials should be tied to a telephone pole and we should be allowed to punch them in the face until all the bones in our hands are broken. They are truly boring and entirely unnecessary. Since they fixed pet survivability I've been able to enjoy 2.1 much more. It was a major stumbling block for me. But, even still, every single time I realize that I have to do a trial I log off. Trials are not fun. They're horrible. The people who thought they were fun make me so angry that I seriously want to hit someone.
I've never felt that way about anyone at Blizzard, ever. I've never wanted to take a swing at Jay, or Josh, or anyone. But if someone stepped forward and took responsibility for Trials I seriously would take a swing at them if I saw them in the street regardless of the repercussions. How anyone, including the people QAing that shit, could have given it the thumbs-up as something enjoyable that enhances the overall experience of the game is beyond me.
Trials are hands-down the absolute worst thing D3 has ever seen. I'd rather have the shitty itemization and AH back than do trials. The fact that I have to spend 15+ minutes talking myself into doing a single trial is mind-blowing. They really should be ashamed of themselves that this is the best they can do given the rocky history that this game has had.
What's worse is that they keep trying to apply band-aids to a system that many people hate and that really isn't working for the playerbase. I do not know a single person who actually enjoys doing trials. Every single person I know would prefer that they were removed from the game. While that's anecdotal, I think it's pretty obvious WHY people might feel this way and WHY it probably is a majority opinion. It shouldn't be shocking that people dislike a must-perform task that gives no rewards at all other than very poor XP.
But, this wouldn't be a major issue.... IF I COULD RANK UP MY LEGENDARY GEMS OUTSIDE OF GREATER RIFTS.
If Greater Rifts were purely "epeen mode" it would help to mitigate how uninspired and boring the Realm of Trials actually is.
I kinda agree with this. I already thought about amulets with 2 sockets for example. However the current uber system isn't very player friendly. You have to go out of your way for a long, unrewarding time (key farming) to then stomp a trivial encounter and get an abysmal small chance at an upgrade because amulets have the most restrictive stat requirements in the game. Just look at how many people use random amulets that happened to roll double-crit.
Also, I hate that Blizz overlooked the single player disadvantages in this regard when they fixed rift keystones to require one (and only one!) per player. Why do 4 players get 4 amulets for the price of 1? I have stockpiled some machines now and couldn't find the motivation to turn them in yet. I don't hate people, don't get me wrong, the game just feels so trivial in a group. Plus I like the pause function for real life issues
Yes. Not with that much passion, but yes. Those should be a one-time unlock that you can repeat at will to improve your highest entry level (which has to be lower than the highest grift you can beat however, to combat Zombie/Conduit fishing, but that's a different topic).
I think this system is in the game for multiplayer purposes. There are two benefits: a) All 4 players need the same lvl keystone to enter their grift, Many players have no clue, what their freshly formed party is capable of.
However I don't think these benefits outweigh the long and boring procedure. It should be a lot shorter, like jumping from wave 1 to wave 25 depending on the time it took. It could also have a starting wave depending on game difficulty (like normal: wave 1, t6: wave 25)
http://eu.battle.net/d3/en/profile/Sol77-2972/hero/66110450
Your attitude, however, is something I have a problem with. I might be wrong, but I got the impression that you don't think this game needs an end-game (and, after seeing your edit, I was correct). Every game needs an end-game. Not having an end-game is the #1 problem I see in Diablo 3. Farming is extremely boring and the endless-farming style of this game is why only the "hardcore" remain outside of major patches.
Endless farming isn't fun. There needs to be an objective outside of "get better gear to do more of the same boring stuff."