With patch 2.1 around the corner, and the addition of the greater rift gems, there are now 5 solid choices to roll on amulets that can have 4 primaries. Which are you most likely to enchant off? For instance, will you roll off a socket (and only keep it on your rings) to get one of the others above?
Pretty straight forward actually (IMHO) for most "great but not world best" eq loadouts 750 stat is probably somewhere around 6-8% of your total main stat
10% CC is usually around 1/5th (20%)
100% CHD is around 1/4th (25%)
Elemental is probably 20-25% of your Elemental bonus
and the sockets will grant unique abilities which are build changing and can probably never be done without again....
About the only thing mainstat has going for it in the background is the additional defensive capabilities but it represents an even tinier fraction of either Armor or All Resist.
The poll that REALLY needs to be answered is how much would you give up for a new eq slot that could take those sweet sweet legendary gems....
I've heard this several times, that not everyone will use 3 gems. If that's the case, you're going to use your existing ones for quite some time of course (at first, sacrifice the 6% CHC/50% CHD on rings to get the sockets for legendary gems). In the long run, I'm pretty sure everyone will use 3 legendary gems. And I always consider gearing something where you don't think about what you need today, but also what you need tomorrow (and beyond). Otherwise you might throw away "crap" today which becomes "BiS" tomorrow.
I think the poll question should be rephrased - the least important stats on amulet are those that are not even included, like allres and area damage and so on. It's better to ask for most important stats. But then, there are lots of exceptions, so a definite answer is difficult, as you can see from my list below. Here's what I look out for in 2.1:
Critical hit damage. Without a doubt, this stat is a must have on every amulet. At 60-65% CHD this stat surpasses every other stat. An amulet without CHD is unacceptable.
Socket. If Shinna/Jaetch/others are right about the fact that we're not always going to use 3 gems then I'll just use my amulets that I have now... but I believe in the long run, after a few weeks, you will always run 3 gems.
Critical hit chance. I used Diabloprogress for some of my chars to calculate the best DPS stat on amulets and CHC was always second, so I'm gonna say that's mandatory. Exception might be for pet builds - and using the legendary gem this might be an option for almost every class. Does anyone know if CHC on items is still capped at 75%? I know it can go beyond that (up to 100%) with skills, but I believe that from items the cap is 75% (that includes paragon, base CHC, and gems). So there's the option to go for the 40% from pet gem, 10% on gloves, 6% on bracers, 9% on offhand, 5% base and 5% paragon if that cap still exists. If it doesn't: CHC is a must-have.
Elemental damage. DPS-wise this is the fourth best stat, no doubt, in almost all my calculations (unless you have some 120% fire damage on gear already).
Main stat. Well, this is where it gets tricky. In the beginning I definitely want main stat over elemental damage, because of the survivability (it gives an extra 75 AR or 750 armor, depending on class) and other synergies (Gruesome Feast, for example). It also means that an amulet with main stat over element is useful for all builds on two classes (I like to switch elements frequently). In the long run, I'm sure it will be a DPS race as usual, so for the perfect gem this is only priority #5. However, thanks to Flavor of Time we might not have to choose between main stat and elemental damage but can just get both. Also: note it's super difficult to get an amulet with the first four stats as almost every amulet rolls main stat by default.
Cooldown reduction. For some crazy stuff like perma Archon or perma Epiphany you might even consider CDR on an amulet, so I'm not dismissing those either.
I'm keeping every legendary amulet that has three out of those stats.
The other questions is "which amulet is going to be BiS in 2.1"?
Some say Hellfire Amulet. It depends on class, but as a wizard I'm not too interested in those. There are other more interesting ones, see below. maybe for WD or DH this could be close to BiS, we'll see.
Immunity amulets. My clear winner here is lightning. I've got a perfect Star of Azkaranth and couldn't care less about it, it's total "meh". Would switch to any other amulet for 2% more DPS. Fire, cold, arcane are all avoidable. Poison is difficult to dodge but doesn't kill unless you're half asleep. But especially as someone who likes melee builds, Electrified is deadly; plus, most of my deaths on T6 are due to Thunderstorm. This affix is just so painful because it hits you anywhere, without a warning. So... a well-rolled Xephirian Amulet would make me happy!
Flavor of Time. It's not a rare amulet, so you will see this drop from time to time; getting 4 good rolls will be tough, though. Still, a FoT with 4 out of the 6 affixes above would be insane and automatically be in my BiS list.
Set amulets. I've got a decent Tal's that is a strong contender on my wizard; but also the new Blackthorne's amulet is worth considering.
Obviously, getting any of those will be super difficult; most people will just run any amulet with the four best stats.
I vote socket, because as you mentioned this will be in 2.1, you can potentially ADD a socket using Ramalandi's Gift (or whatever the guy's name is.) Rolling onto a socket and then rolling back off is time consuming and a pain in the ass with jewelry requiring flawless imperial gems to reroll.
It will be interesting to see how commonly Gifts drop since i personally will need about 30 of em to gear up my stable of characters.
At the start everyone will focus on 1-2 gems in rings but as you scale them up the relative benefit of continuing to upgrade them will go down compared to adding that 3rd gem no matter what spec you play. ie. you will maintain ele/main/cc/chd for a while and then drop ele or main for the 3rd socket eventually.
I vote socket, because as you mentioned this will be in 2.1, you can potentially ADD a socket using Ramalandi's Gift (or whatever the guy's name is.) Rolling onto a socket and then rolling back off is time consuming and a pain in the ass with jewelry requiring flawless imperial gems to reroll.
It will be interesting to see how commonly Gifts drop since i personally will need about 30 of em to gear up my stable of characters.
Ramalandi's gift works with only weapons for the thousandth time. Please people read.
Quote frommafwiz I suppose that makes more sense than allowing us to roll off sockets on Chest, Legs, neck and rings to add an extra primary to each.
The item description from the captions I've seen does say "Use this item and select an unsocketed item to add the maximum number of sockets."
Well thats the first description they gave, then they fixed it instantly, that description was in datamine + stayed up 2 or 3 days tops.
Kind of unnecessarily aggressive my friend.
I humbly apologize for having missed some news on future updates that may or may not be concretely determined at this point in time, I have no idea how I could have let this crucial information escape me.
The 2nd sentence was fine but I take umbrage to "only weapons for the thousandth time. Please people read."
I'm expected to read all 1000 of his prior comments on the subject? I rarely pop into the forums andapparentlymissed the update regarding the change on the front page, if there was one.
Not to mention I had already conceded that it made more sense for the item to be weapon-only prior to him commenting. His statement was essentially pointless, and came across to me as bashing.
Anyhow, good night to you both, I'm not going to waste any more of anyone's times with this,
Primary stat is the least valuable. There's some math out there proving it, I can try to dig it up. Also, past p800 you can just make up for the loss of primary, not so with the other stats.
Since amulets can roll much higher stats than rings, getting a socket in an amulet is rather dumb, unless you want to use 3 legendary gems for some reason.
Also, past p800 you can just make up for the loss of primary, not so with the other stats.
That's not really true.
If you're p1000, and you have an amulet without primary stat, you're still going to have up to 750 less primary stat than someone else who is p1000 and has primary stat on their amulet. There isn't any "making up" for it. It's just a matter of what's best. 950 is still more than 200. 1150 is still more than 400. Regardless of Paragon level, you're still going to be short by a certain amount, not to mention that those levels require a pretty hefty amount of XP. The only question that needs to be asked is if primary stat is "worth it" for your build on a five-prop amulet.
That being said, this is where five-prop amulets (and rings) come into play. If you don't want to sacrifice stats, that option exists.
I'd say the least appealing is main stat by a huge margin most of the time.......but of course there will always be those fringe exceptions, for example you can always assume that a legendary gem will be worth more than ~700 main stat....but is some cases, on some characters..it wont be.....and you wont be able to just assume...
it may be a long story but im sure it will be justified eventually by certain players why 750 main stat is better than at least one of the others you listed...even a brand new crazy powerful legendary gem.
Also, past p800 you can just make up for the loss of primary, not so with the other stats.
That's not really true.
If you're p1000, and you have an amulet without primary stat, you're still going to have up to 750 less primary stat than someone else who is p1000 and has primary stat on their amulet. There isn't any "making up" for it. It's just a matter of what's best. 950 is still more than 200. 1150 is still more than 400. Regardless of Paragon level, you're still going to be short by a certain amount, not to mention that those levels require a pretty hefty amount of XP. The only question that needs to be asked is if primary stat is "worth it" for your build on a five-prop amulet.
That being said, this is where five-prop amulets (and rings) come into play. If you don't want to sacrifice stats, that option exists.
There are several spreadsheets out there showing mathematically that at some point of main stat (around 10k or so I believe) CC, CD, and AS contribute more to overall damage. I think you'll understand when you start seeing HF amulets with CC, CD, elemental, SOCKET.
There are several spreadsheets out there showing mathematically that at some point of main stat (around 10k or so I believe) CC, CD, and AS contribute more to overall damage. I think you'll understand when you start seeing HF amulets with CC, CD, elemental, SOCKET.
I fully understand that. But at no point does Paragon "make up" for anything.
At any given Paragon level you're looking at X less main stat where X is the roll on the amulet. No matter how many Paragon levels you tack on, you will still be short X.
The question is not whether you can "make up" for a lack of mainstat with Paragon, because you clearly cannot... no matter what you do you'll be missing the roll on an item. The only question that needs to be answered is which is better X main stat or Y <other stat>. That is the only relevant discussion.
Trying to say you can "make up" for it with Paragon is misleading. It just doesn't ever need to be brought up because it's a fallacious line of thinking. What you're saying is that you can take 5% CHC off your gear because Paragon levels will "make up" for it. It just doesn't work that way unless you're hitting a hard cap.
There are several spreadsheets out there showing mathematically that at some point of main stat (around 10k or so I believe) CC, CD, and AS contribute more to overall damage. I think you'll understand when you start seeing HF amulets with CC, CD, elemental, SOCKET.
I fully understand that. But at no point does Paragon "make up" for anything.
At any given Paragon level you're looking at X less main stat where X is the roll on the amulet. No matter how many Paragon levels you tack on, you will still be short X.
The question is not whether you can "make up" for a lack of mainstat with Paragon, because you clearly cannot... no matter what you do you'll be missing the roll on an item. The only question that needs to be answered is which is better X main stat or Y <other stat>. That is the only relevant discussion.
Trying to say you can "make up" for it with Paragon is misleading. It just doesn't ever need to be brought up because it's a fallacious line of thinking. What you're saying is that you can take 5% CHC off your gear because Paragon levels will "make up" for it. It just doesn't work that way unless you're hitting a hard cap.
Technically, no it doesn't, with the exception of movement speed (capped). It 'makes up' in the sense that paragon points allow you to deal with the gear you have by 'making up' the points elsewhere. If you have a GG item but really need 500 vit, and have 500 vit worth of paragon points, you can dump those into vit and still have the toughness breakpoint you need to get by. Similarly, if you're trying to hit an attack speed breakpoint, but are just 1-2% shy of your goal from gear due to RNG, you can 'make up' for it and hit the next BP through paragon points. That's what I'm trying to get at - it gives you flexibility.
As far as relevant discussions go, the only relevant discussion in 2.1 is who will be on top of the leaderboards and why
This all depends on build really. For a pet doc Socket+Crit+CritHitDmg+Int is going to be best and same about some fire builds but for a Jade doc Cold+Crit+Crithitdmg+Socket is always going to be the clear cut winner. 5 stat ammy ftw though, for many classes.
This all depends on build really. For a pet doc Socket+Crit+CritHitDmg+Int is going to be best and same about some fire builds but for a Jade doc Cold+Crit+Crithitdmg+Socket is always going to be the clear cut winner. 5 stat ammy ftw though, for many classes.
5th (which will be 750 main stat) will never be as strong as a universal passive. Hellfire ammy is BiS (unless your build can't benefit much from 5 passives), you will see.
10% CC is usually around 1/5th (20%)
100% CHD is around 1/4th (25%)
Elemental is probably 20-25% of your Elemental bonus
and the sockets will grant unique abilities which are build changing and can probably never be done without again....
About the only thing mainstat has going for it in the background is the additional defensive capabilities but it represents an even tinier fraction of either Armor or All Resist.
The poll that REALLY needs to be answered is how much would you give up for a new eq slot that could take those sweet sweet legendary gems....
I've heard this several times, that not everyone will use 3 gems. If that's the case, you're going to use your existing ones for quite some time of course (at first, sacrifice the 6% CHC/50% CHD on rings to get the sockets for legendary gems). In the long run, I'm pretty sure everyone will use 3 legendary gems. And I always consider gearing something where you don't think about what you need today, but also what you need tomorrow (and beyond). Otherwise you might throw away "crap" today which becomes "BiS" tomorrow.
I think the poll question should be rephrased - the least important stats on amulet are those that are not even included, like allres and area damage and so on. It's better to ask for most important stats. But then, there are lots of exceptions, so a definite answer is difficult, as you can see from my list below. Here's what I look out for in 2.1:
I'm keeping every legendary amulet that has three out of those stats.
The other questions is "which amulet is going to be BiS in 2.1"?
Obviously, getting any of those will be super difficult; most people will just run any amulet with the four best stats.
It will be interesting to see how commonly Gifts drop since i personally will need about 30 of em to gear up my stable of characters.
The item description from the captions I've seen does say "Use this item and select an unsocketed item to add the maximum number of sockets."
I humbly apologize for having missed some news on future updates that may or may not be concretely determined at this point in time, I have no idea how I could have let this crucial information escape me.
Check your attitude at the door please.
I'm expected to read all 1000 of his prior comments on the subject? I rarely pop into the forums andapparentlymissed the update regarding the change on the front page, if there was one.
Not to mention I had already conceded that it made more sense for the item to be weapon-only prior to him commenting. His statement was essentially pointless, and came across to me as bashing.
Anyhow, good night to you both, I'm not going to waste any more of anyone's times with this,
MeatHeadGaming - YouTube - Twitch - Facebook - Web
If you're p1000, and you have an amulet without primary stat, you're still going to have up to 750 less primary stat than someone else who is p1000 and has primary stat on their amulet. There isn't any "making up" for it. It's just a matter of what's best. 950 is still more than 200. 1150 is still more than 400. Regardless of Paragon level, you're still going to be short by a certain amount, not to mention that those levels require a pretty hefty amount of XP. The only question that needs to be asked is if primary stat is "worth it" for your build on a five-prop amulet.
That being said, this is where five-prop amulets (and rings) come into play. If you don't want to sacrifice stats, that option exists.
it may be a long story but im sure it will be justified eventually by certain players why 750 main stat is better than at least one of the others you listed...even a brand new crazy powerful legendary gem.
Nothing is absolute.
MeatHeadGaming - YouTube - Twitch - Facebook - Web
At any given Paragon level you're looking at X less main stat where X is the roll on the amulet. No matter how many Paragon levels you tack on, you will still be short X.
The question is not whether you can "make up" for a lack of mainstat with Paragon, because you clearly cannot... no matter what you do you'll be missing the roll on an item. The only question that needs to be answered is which is better X main stat or Y <other stat>. That is the only relevant discussion.
Trying to say you can "make up" for it with Paragon is misleading. It just doesn't ever need to be brought up because it's a fallacious line of thinking. What you're saying is that you can take 5% CHC off your gear because Paragon levels will "make up" for it. It just doesn't work that way unless you're hitting a hard cap.
As far as relevant discussions go, the only relevant discussion in 2.1 is who will be on top of the leaderboards and why
MeatHeadGaming - YouTube - Twitch - Facebook - Web
MeatHeadGaming - YouTube - Twitch - Facebook - Web