Safe to say, the expansion pack is garbage. A5 (mobs/tile sets) is a total shit pile and the xpansion class is awful.
3 mandatory items and still the worst in the game. Nice job blizzard
Comparison is the thief of joy.
Absolutely, based on the solo leaderboards you have every right to complain about balance and in that vacuum they are the 'worst'. But unless you're trying to get in that top 10, I suggest stop comparing your class to everyone else's if it's the class you find fun to play.
Would love to see crusaders get some sets with belt / amulet / /shield (tal rasha, inna's, IK, etc) pieces to mix and match like all other classes at the moment. Right now all the crusadergear take the same 6 slots. Would also like to see a set weapon set (green sword / shield like shenlongs, BK swords, chantodo, manajuma). These are all the things other classes have. Sounds so fun to have these kind of things for crusader
im honestly not excited for their revamped invoker set for sader..but i hope they prove me wrong. the idea of a thorns set doesnt sound appealing to me at all
Crusaders are, indeed, the most underdeveloped class.
They do not have a 2 piece weapon set (Which generally only buffs another set, but still, extra power)
They do not have a 7 piece set, or a set that has off pieces (non-standard 6).
Two of their sets are relatively lacking. Akhans is weak as shit for damage and toughness (Its the oldest Crusader set and was made when 6 piece sets were weak as fuck in general, before the 2.1 buffs to many of the 6 pieces). Rolands needs a number of specific legendaries to be able to avoid the no-damage resource phase, and its damage reduction is rolled into skills that you have to be very active about using.
Seeker of the Light is actually decent, having both good damage and damage reduction potential. It does, however, require a huge number of supporting legendaries, and you have to make a choice between 2 of 3 supporting legendaries, specifically 3 weapon slots that all affect Blessed Hammer. Finally, for max benefit you need specific rune choices (Cold on Blessed Hammer to ensure you hit as few enemies as possible, and Lightning on Falling Sword to reduce the CD down to 10 seconds as much as possible)
So yea. Crusaders are underdeveloped compared to all other classes. WD (5 total sets. 3 standard 6-piece sets. 1 7-piece set with 2 off pieces. 1 2 piece weapon set that is greatly synergetic with another 6 piece set. Spirit of Arachyr is essentially a huge amount of passive damage that ALSO is synergistic with Manajuma's Way (Resulting in a huge amount of Hex damage). Of those sets, only two of them do not recieve any benefit to a primary skill (And both of those can have specific legendaries and have certain abilities to where they will never NEED a primary skill). All of the sets have the ability to increase toughness by an average of 50%.
Wizard, 5 sets. 2 standard 6 piece sets. 2 7 piece sets, 1 with 2 off pieces. A 2 piece weapon set that synergizes with one of the 6 piece sets. Of the 4 6/7 piece sets, NONE of them result in significantly lowered damage when using Primary Skills, with Firebirds having the lowest damage output of the 4. The damage reduction of the sets, however, is fairly low, with Vyr's set having the highest amount of toughness available (Firebirds gives no toughness, but does have a death-avoidance mechanism. Tel'rasha only provides damage reduction against 4 damage types, Fire, Cold, Lightning, and Arcane. Delseres is dependent on Slow Time, providing around 40% damage reduction when fully equipped.
Demon Hunter, 5 sets. 2 standard 6 piece sets. 1 7 piece set with 2 off-pieces. 1 4 piece set. 1 2 piece weapon set that has a very weak synergistic bonus with Natalya's, but is decent for speed runs. The 4 piece set is more or less useless, and is slated for a dagger-based build in 2.4. Maurader's has the weakest toughness of the 3 viable set, at 20% damage reduction. UE has 20% baseline, but also has access to a huge Disc pool, allowing them to use more Disc for damage reduction then the other 2 sets. Nat's has 50% damage reduction. Finally, of the 3 viable sets, only Marauders has low-damage primaries.
Barb, 5 sets. 1 7 piece, 2 off pieces. 2 standard 6 piece sets. 1 2 piece weapon set that synergizes with one of the 6 piece sets. a 4 piece set that was viable in the past, and will likely become a 6 piece set in 2.4. For toughness, only 1 of the 3 viable sets has no damage reduction, Raekors. WW has 40% damage reduction, and IKs has a huge amount of damage reduction, with 50% potential from Ancients, and 50% potential from Wrath. There is no need for primary skills with all 3 sets.
Monk, 5 sets. 1 7 piece with 2 off pieces. 2 standard 6 piece sets. 1 2 piece weapon set that has decent synergistic effects with all but Inna's and Monkey's King. The 4 piece set synergizes with the 7 piece set greatly. With that being said, only Inna's has defensive benefits.
So yes. The Crusader has recieved very little attention. 2 of its 3 obtainable sets are greatly lacking in both the damage and toughness department. It has no synergist 2 piece set, nor does it have a 7 piece set, which greatly hurts its maximum potential. As it stands, the ONLY other class that lacks the synergistic ability you can find with the sets is Demon Hunter, and their damage is high enough for that to not matter.
Safe to say, the expansion pack is garbage. A5 (mobs/tile sets) is a total shit pile and the xpansion class is awful.
Kind of a déjà vù right there. Like it's predecessor the D3 expansion featured the least popular class(es) and the least popular environment (perceived as that because of the increased difficulty), yet both LoD and RoS made their respective games so much better (excluding pvp).
Would love to see crusaders get some sets with belt / amulet / /shield (tal rasha, inna's, IK, etc) pieces to mix and match like all other classes at the moment. Right now all the crusadergear take the same 6 slots. Would also like to see a set weapon set (green sword / shield like shenlongs, BK swords, chantodo, manajuma). These are all the things other classes have. Sounds so fun to have these kind of things for crusader
This is done by adding another piece to the sets, however you have to be careful when turning set items into something else than armor pieces, because this may cause serious problems when mixed with other sets. As for adding more items in general, it's a good idea to think about increasing the stash size before you continue to add more and more items. I presume they still can save their face at this year's Blizzcon, after that, if they don't increase the stash size, I'm pretty much done with this game, and I'm sure more and more players will give up as well. This idea that the the game can be fixed by adding more and more "interesting" items and sets, while we barely have storage space for one class (other character slots included), is by far the worst problem this game has right now, one can can be so easily solved.
It baffles me that some ppl seriously think the biggest problem the game has atm is stash space? it's not balance or lack of endgame options or class disparity in multiplayer comps or the paragon benefits... it's stash space... lol.
OT: crusaders are not the worst class, they are actually alot better designed than wizards or even barbs, but they are simply not balanced enough with the obvious ones this patch.
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Those Who Do Not Know True Pain Cannot Possibly Understand True Peace...
Correct me if I'm wrong but didn't the devs already say that Akkhan's is getting a rework in the next major patch? They're also making invokers a sader set so I imagine that will get a pretty big rework as well. If i had to guess I'd say they'll make one of those a 7-pc set post rework.
I must admit that the trolling name of the thread drew my attention but since I bought ros for the crusader primarily I can safely say that from all the classes with the exception of wizard that I have 0 experience (sorry its not sorceress) Crusader has the most awkward and dysfunctional builds.
3 Sets (4 with Invoker lol)
1. Akkhan was good for t6 no bonus to any skills besides the perma akarat /fire starter /prophet.
Fate of the Fell build produced high damage (for t6) but with severe amount of stutter (if you break the animation) and minimal aoe.
Darklight was good , simple. tons of aoe (and lag) but inefficient when mobs hps and dmg got up.
Ponnies was something in between.
Condemn (only holy runes) did very good aoe (low single dmg) but required you to constantly spam a button with an icd often leading to watch the button in order to not miss a cast and not the gameplay.
All of the skill variations required perma akarat = emphasis on 56% cdr.
2. Roland's. New set, but not much changed. Numbers got up but both of 2 the build variations are problematic.
Bash do incredibly high amount of damage but is very single target restricted by aoe and resource (see the new barbarian hota build this is what bash should have been).
Ironically, bash got nerfed when blizzard fixed the rift density.
Sweep is the opposite. Does medium to high amount of damage but its only useful for large packs and or when CoE procs. The single target dmg its the one of worse of any class /build I have played.
3. Light. Only for blessed hammer. Falling sword still sucks as a skill.Too slow mechanic/landing, no damage.
Tons of aoe (and lag) but at a cost (as always). Too low dmg . Its only useful with cube -furnace and CoE proc when you are followed by a train of mobs.If you go stutterstep the Hexing Pants path and you don't use a macro or infinite scroll wheel say bye bye to your fingers.
All of the above creates a further dilemma to the players if they want to utilize the best dmg rings in the game : F&R + CoE. Half of the builds are not working with a generator and for solo almost none w/o unity.
Its like blizzard put a candy in display that everybody desires but hey its not for your class sorry.
Correct me if I'm wrong but didn't the devs already say that Akkhan's is getting a rework in the next major patch? They're also making invokers a sader set so I imagine that will get a pretty big rework as well. If i had to guess I'd say they'll make one of those a 7-pc set post rework.
i believe only the original 6 piece sets are 7 piece sets because they each got an item added. all other sets will be 6 max. i think a blue said this but im not sure
All of the builds you have to be close to monsters and crusaders have like no toughness comapred to other classes. For a big char yeilding a shield they should be a lot tougher. I had to use unity to clear a 52.
I don't think they're bad (farthest I leveled one was to 40ish), but having to juggle all the ranges they have can be a pain in the butt. I still think monks make better tanks (maybe barbarians, the jury is still out on them) though. If Blizzard ever gave them a Cyclone Strike-type ability (Provoke sucks) I'd play them more, but until then they're on my backburner.
One season Crusader being on bottom and you all lost your mind.
Last Season you got shield bash and sweep Roland Sader which was the thing with Talrasha and Maticulous DH.
On season 2 you had AFK mara DH and condamn sader that was really fun.
On season 1 we had Jade WD one of my favorite specs in game oh and Stampede saders.
I really don't see why Sader are sux while other classes like the rollercoaster WD or the hard to win wiz had really bad times. Not to mention monks if you remembered use to be at the bottom of the barel once.
They can hit high 60 Grifts so they are not a bad class IMO. there are thousands of people playing Crusader that are not into trying to climb leaderboards and just want to have fun. It's a fun class to play. I agree the class needs more balance, but a game like this will have a hard time finding balance. Most people go with flavor of the month classes (season 4 = barb/monk) but that shouldn't deter you from playing what you like. Just have fun playing that game. You can still climb leaderboards and you can still accomplish things with the classes you love.
All of the builds you have to be close to monsters and crusaders have like no toughness comapred to other classes. For a big char yeilding a shield they should be a lot tougher. I had to use unity to clear a 52.
Gonna have to change this. Put fallen sword (flurry with sacred harness belt) on bar and toughness is no longer an issue. Dps is a bit low, im having to kite multiple elite packs together, but dying is usually my fault.
Gotta play the hammerdin like a melee vs ghom, short kites. Its really fun but the damage could be improved. Especially on fallen sword since its a cooldown.
All of the builds you have to be close to monsters and crusaders have like no toughness comapred to other classes. For a big char yeilding a shield they should be a lot tougher. I had to use unity to clear a 52.
Gonna have to change this. Put fallen sword (flurry with sacred harness belt) on bar and toughness is no longer an issue. Dps is a bit low, im having to kite multiple elite packs together, but dying is usually my fault.
Gotta play the hammerdin like a melee vs ghom, short kites. Its really fun but the damage could be improved. Especially on fallen sword since its a cooldown.
Is the belt really worth it? Isn't String of Ears better, because of the kite mechanic of this build?
It casts instantly, not when you land from fallen sword, The enemies you targeted dont move for 6secs and deal 40% less damage. Its nice if they are standing in crap. 50% on unity, 50% on 4pc and whatever flurry does, your really tough.
Just cant kill anything fast at 55+.
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Safe to say, the expansion pack is garbage. A5 (mobs/tile sets) is a total shit pile and the xpansion class is awful.
3 mandatory items and still the worst in the game. Nice job blizzard
This is a good expansion, crusader is the worst class but "fun" to play agreed.
You enjoy fighting a5 mobs on a5 maps in grifts?
Why does reflect damage hurt so much? Makes no sense.
Shields are also useless since they dont block anything that hurts. Why cant you block elite affix's?
Absolutely, based on the solo leaderboards you have every right to complain about balance and in that vacuum they are the 'worst'. But unless you're trying to get in that top 10, I suggest stop comparing your class to everyone else's if it's the class you find fun to play.
crusaders are definitely the worst class THIS PATCH. but this is the first time theyve been the worst class imo
Crusaders are, indeed, the most underdeveloped class.
They do not have a 2 piece weapon set (Which generally only buffs another set, but still, extra power)
They do not have a 7 piece set, or a set that has off pieces (non-standard 6).
Two of their sets are relatively lacking. Akhans is weak as shit for damage and toughness (Its the oldest Crusader set and was made when 6 piece sets were weak as fuck in general, before the 2.1 buffs to many of the 6 pieces). Rolands needs a number of specific legendaries to be able to avoid the no-damage resource phase, and its damage reduction is rolled into skills that you have to be very active about using.
Seeker of the Light is actually decent, having both good damage and damage reduction potential. It does, however, require a huge number of supporting legendaries, and you have to make a choice between 2 of 3 supporting legendaries, specifically 3 weapon slots that all affect Blessed Hammer. Finally, for max benefit you need specific rune choices (Cold on Blessed Hammer to ensure you hit as few enemies as possible, and Lightning on Falling Sword to reduce the CD down to 10 seconds as much as possible)
So yea. Crusaders are underdeveloped compared to all other classes. WD (5 total sets. 3 standard 6-piece sets. 1 7-piece set with 2 off pieces. 1 2 piece weapon set that is greatly synergetic with another 6 piece set. Spirit of Arachyr is essentially a huge amount of passive damage that ALSO is synergistic with Manajuma's Way (Resulting in a huge amount of Hex damage). Of those sets, only two of them do not recieve any benefit to a primary skill (And both of those can have specific legendaries and have certain abilities to where they will never NEED a primary skill). All of the sets have the ability to increase toughness by an average of 50%.
Wizard, 5 sets. 2 standard 6 piece sets. 2 7 piece sets, 1 with 2 off pieces. A 2 piece weapon set that synergizes with one of the 6 piece sets. Of the 4 6/7 piece sets, NONE of them result in significantly lowered damage when using Primary Skills, with Firebirds having the lowest damage output of the 4. The damage reduction of the sets, however, is fairly low, with Vyr's set having the highest amount of toughness available (Firebirds gives no toughness, but does have a death-avoidance mechanism. Tel'rasha only provides damage reduction against 4 damage types, Fire, Cold, Lightning, and Arcane. Delseres is dependent on Slow Time, providing around 40% damage reduction when fully equipped.
Demon Hunter, 5 sets. 2 standard 6 piece sets. 1 7 piece set with 2 off-pieces. 1 4 piece set. 1 2 piece weapon set that has a very weak synergistic bonus with Natalya's, but is decent for speed runs. The 4 piece set is more or less useless, and is slated for a dagger-based build in 2.4. Maurader's has the weakest toughness of the 3 viable set, at 20% damage reduction. UE has 20% baseline, but also has access to a huge Disc pool, allowing them to use more Disc for damage reduction then the other 2 sets. Nat's has 50% damage reduction. Finally, of the 3 viable sets, only Marauders has low-damage primaries.
Barb, 5 sets. 1 7 piece, 2 off pieces. 2 standard 6 piece sets. 1 2 piece weapon set that synergizes with one of the 6 piece sets. a 4 piece set that was viable in the past, and will likely become a 6 piece set in 2.4. For toughness, only 1 of the 3 viable sets has no damage reduction, Raekors. WW has 40% damage reduction, and IKs has a huge amount of damage reduction, with 50% potential from Ancients, and 50% potential from Wrath. There is no need for primary skills with all 3 sets.
Monk, 5 sets. 1 7 piece with 2 off pieces. 2 standard 6 piece sets. 1 2 piece weapon set that has decent synergistic effects with all but Inna's and Monkey's King. The 4 piece set synergizes with the 7 piece set greatly. With that being said, only Inna's has defensive benefits.
So yes. The Crusader has recieved very little attention. 2 of its 3 obtainable sets are greatly lacking in both the damage and toughness department. It has no synergist 2 piece set, nor does it have a 7 piece set, which greatly hurts its maximum potential. As it stands, the ONLY other class that lacks the synergistic ability you can find with the sets is Demon Hunter, and their damage is high enough for that to not matter.
Kind of a déjà vù right there. Like it's predecessor the D3 expansion featured the least popular class(es) and the least popular environment (perceived as that because of the increased difficulty), yet both LoD and RoS made their respective games so much better (excluding pvp).
http://eu.battle.net/d3/en/profile/Sol77-2972/hero/66110450
OT: crusaders are not the worst class, they are actually alot better designed than wizards or even barbs, but they are simply not balanced enough with the obvious ones this patch.
Those Who Do Not Know True Pain Cannot Possibly Understand True Peace...
Correct me if I'm wrong but didn't the devs already say that Akkhan's is getting a rework in the next major patch? They're also making invokers a sader set so I imagine that will get a pretty big rework as well. If i had to guess I'd say they'll make one of those a 7-pc set post rework.
I must admit that the trolling name of the thread drew my attention but since I bought ros for the crusader primarily I can safely say that from all the classes with the exception of wizard that I have 0 experience (sorry its not sorceress) Crusader has the most awkward and dysfunctional builds.
3 Sets (4 with Invoker lol)
1. Akkhan was good for t6 no bonus to any skills besides the perma akarat /fire starter /prophet.
Fate of the Fell build produced high damage (for t6) but with severe amount of stutter (if you break the animation) and minimal aoe.
Darklight was good , simple. tons of aoe (and lag) but inefficient when mobs hps and dmg got up.
Ponnies was something in between.
Condemn (only holy runes) did very good aoe (low single dmg) but required you to constantly spam a button with an icd often leading to watch the button in order to not miss a cast and not the gameplay.
All of the skill variations required perma akarat = emphasis on 56% cdr.
2. Roland's. New set, but not much changed. Numbers got up but both of 2 the build variations are problematic.
Bash do incredibly high amount of damage but is very single target restricted by aoe and resource (see the new barbarian hota build this is what bash should have been).
Ironically, bash got nerfed when blizzard fixed the rift density.
Sweep is the opposite. Does medium to high amount of damage but its only useful for large packs and or when CoE procs. The single target dmg its the one of worse of any class /build I have played.
3. Light. Only for blessed hammer. Falling sword still sucks as a skill.Too slow mechanic/landing, no damage.
Tons of aoe (and lag) but at a cost (as always). Too low dmg . Its only useful with cube -furnace and CoE proc when you are followed by a train of mobs.If you go stutterstep the Hexing Pants path and you don't use a macro or infinite scroll wheel say bye bye to your fingers.
All of the above creates a further dilemma to the players if they want to utilize the best dmg rings in the game : F&R + CoE. Half of the builds are not working with a generator and for solo almost none w/o unity.
Its like blizzard put a candy in display that everybody desires but hey its not for your class sorry.
All of the builds you have to be close to monsters and crusaders have like no toughness comapred to other classes. For a big char yeilding a shield they should be a lot tougher. I had to use unity to clear a 52.
I think shields can only block white attacks. They cannot block any elite affixs like frozen, jailer, light etc.
Sheilds are cosmetic in this game.
I don't think they're bad (farthest I leveled one was to 40ish), but having to juggle all the ranges they have can be a pain in the butt. I still think monks make better tanks (maybe barbarians, the jury is still out on them) though. If Blizzard ever gave them a Cyclone Strike-type ability (Provoke sucks) I'd play them more, but until then they're on my backburner.
One season Crusader being on bottom and you all lost your mind.
Last Season you got shield bash and sweep Roland Sader which was the thing with Talrasha and Maticulous DH.
On season 2 you had AFK mara DH and condamn sader that was really fun.
On season 1 we had Jade WD one of my favorite specs in game oh and Stampede saders.
I really don't see why Sader are sux while other classes like the rollercoaster WD or the hard to win wiz had really bad times. Not to mention monks if you remembered use to be at the bottom of the barel once.
They can hit high 60 Grifts so they are not a bad class IMO. there are thousands of people playing Crusader that are not into trying to climb leaderboards and just want to have fun. It's a fun class to play. I agree the class needs more balance, but a game like this will have a hard time finding balance. Most people go with flavor of the month classes (season 4 = barb/monk) but that shouldn't deter you from playing what you like. Just have fun playing that game. You can still climb leaderboards and you can still accomplish things with the classes you love.
Gotta play the hammerdin like a melee vs ghom, short kites. Its really fun but the damage could be improved. Especially on fallen sword since its a cooldown.
Just cant kill anything fast at 55+.