it just had better be good, but i think it mf-ing would become awesome and exciting if you could find runes that gave you the abilities you were looking for, and rarer the rune, the more powerful (more beneficial) the skill would be, and if you find more than 1 rune of the same kind, then that skill would 'upgrade' and the max a skill could be upgraded too depended on the rarity of the rune.
I doubt it will be skill books and those require people to grind and search for books which appears to be not Blizzard's idea of fun. They want the game very easy assessable and played to full right out the door it seems so searching for books = no no. It also takes you away from the story cause you will be sitting there farming and hunting for books which they also appear to be against.
Now if there are no pre req to any skill then what is stopping me from doing what they don't want me to do and that is horde my points till I hit X level and then put them all into the skill I want? They remove 1 problem and make 1-2 more.
How is it different from farming experience/skill points?
Because experience is a given on every monster and quest, skill points are a given once you acquire enough experience which is a given. The books are random or at best certain monsters which requires hunting / farming for certain monsters which leads us to Diablo 2 MF really. I just don't see em doing it that way. Most likely be a skill token you get per level and you use it at a merchant and purchase a new skill, only issue is if there are no pre req why shouldn't I just horde up my points and spend em all on Top tier skills? Why even get the lesser skills since obviously they suck compared to top tier skills, this is just a cheap way to get out of saying that they can't balance all skills and most skills are useless. Like I said eliminate getting useless skills, and you acquire a hording problem. No middle ground to be met really, it's one or the other.
What if you get a book each time you do a quest/adventure? Or from killing champions?
Both requires no specific monster and can be made unaffected by MF.
Well the quest/adventure isn't that bad of an idea the champion thing tho would require hunting for champions. Only issue with the quests is do you get 1 every random quest or just every main quest...cause every random quest and you get way to many skills, and every main quest well that's like 1 skill every few hours, that kinda feels like I am level 90 trying to level up when I am really level 3 doing a quest ha.
I got this idea that just came to me as I was reading this discussion on books vs skills that you guys got going on.
Now the idea is very rough, since I haven't given much though to it. Instead I'm just going to write it out as it appears and let you guys sort out the details.
Since the beginning of time, (or RPG games) there have been skills. Skills are leveled up by clicking on them upon the gain of a new skill point.
Click* +1 to skill.....Skill reaches next level and thus goes up in strength with all kinds of predefined levels of usefulness.....
What if , upon reaching a new level, we would be given the choice to level a certain perspective of a skill instead of a skill as a whole. This would mean that instead of....
Click* +1 to Fireball = +damage, +radius, +fire, etc....
We first unlock the spell or skill (maybe with a quest/prerequisites or even class specific books) then every level we gain we are given skill points (not the same as D2 skill points) but simply points that would be used to directly level up certian aspects of skills.
(Reach a level) +20 Points
Click to customize whichever skill you need to customize...
For example, I'm a wizard, I like using a mix of teleport and disintegrate.
I use a tactic that heavily relies on placement and focus fire to eliminate large groups standing in a row with a direct beam.
So I could choose to level my tele speed, or distance and level up the disintegrate range in order to maximize the ammount of monsters I hit per cast.
I use this tactic for a few levels since I notice it's doing good, but then when I enter a new dungeon I notice that my spell power is lacking. So I then decide to spend the next point on damage instead of range.
All boosts could also be complemented with drawbacks. More range could mean less width of the beam. More damage could mean more mana usage per second. More width could mean a slower cast speed. etc etc. This way, it could prevent users from becoming too uber in a short span of time by simply leveling one skill. And it would make sure that we wouldn't end up maxing out a skill by level 10.
I wanna write some more but my wife says we gotta head out, so I'll let you guys talk some more about it.
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[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]Diablo 3, Hottest shit to happen to 21st Century Entertainment since Georges "Rush" St-Pierre.______________ --------~~Mattheo's Quote of the day~~---------
----------Brought to you by Diablofans.com Forums -------- Originally Posted by mattheo_majik
I LOVE being a SEX TON!!!
I got this idea that just came to me as I was reading this discussion on books vs skills that you guys got going on.
Now the idea is very rough, since I haven't given much though to it. Instead I'm just going to write it out as it appears and let you guys sort out the details.
Since the beginning of time, (or RPG games) there have been skills. Skills are leveled up by clicking on them upon the gain of a new skill point.
Click* +1 to skill.....Skill reaches next level and thus goes up in strength with all kinds of predefined levels of usefulness.....
What if , upon reaching a new level, we would be given the choice to level a certain perspective of a skill instead of a skill as a whole. This would mean that instead of....
Click* +1 to Fireball = +damage, +radius, +fire, etc....
We first unlock the spell or skill (maybe with a quest/prerequisites or even class specific books) then every level we gain we are given skill points (not the same as D2 skill points) but simply points that would be used to directly level up certian aspects of skills.
(Reach a level) +20 Points
Click to customize whichever skill you need to customize...
For example, I'm a wizard, I like using a mix of teleport and disintegrate.
I use a tactic that heavily relies on placement and focus fire to eliminate large groups standing in a row with a direct beam.
So I could choose to level my tele speed, or distance and level up the disintegrate range in order to maximize the ammount of monsters I hit per cast.
I use this tactic for a few levels since I notice it's doing good, but then when I enter a new dungeon I notice that my spell power is lacking. So I then decide to spend the next point on damage instead of range.
All boosts could also be complemented with drawbacks. More range could mean less width of the beam. More damage could mean more mana usage per second. More width could mean a slower cast speed. etc etc. This way, it could prevent users from becoming too uber in a short span of time by simply leveling one skill. And it would make sure that we wouldn't end up maxing out a skill by level 10.
I wanna write some more but my wife says we gotta head out, so I'll let you guys talk some more about it.
Just a few things I see possibly wrong with this is:
- This gives players a HUGE number of ways to level up their character but that limits the skills useable alot. People will be to concentrated on leveling up say FB to top range, top width, top damage, instead of going dmg here, width on this skill, ect.
- What about Barbarian battle order type skills? Do we cut them up and have 1 skill point as life and 1 as mana?
The idea is good but flawed in the fact that it just rips skills apart and substitutes points that would be used on useless skills to just complete what is now just 1 skill.
I can't wait to see what Blizzard has under their sleeves cause they have some serious issues here with their skill systems and skills, and have said numerous times they want all the skills to be useful and better off then they were in D2...but maybe they bit off a little more then they can chew cause obviously they are having some issues.
I do like that idea of leveling up certain aspects of skills. I'll continue to use the Fireball example to keep things simple as to why it's good.
Let's say we still have 20 skill levels of fireball, and you can choose to upgrade cast rate, damage, range, and area of effect. Once you reach the 20th level of fireball, you have effectively maxed the skill, but not all portions of the skill.
Eg. If you have maxed Fireball, you can either have maximum range and maximum damage, which would benefit long range shooting (Like a sniper rifle). Or, you could have maximum cast rate and the biggest area of effect (Like an Uzi with huge bullets). Or, you could have max cast rate and range, meaning you deal lots of low-powered fireballs.
You add these combinations on top of the runes to create even more variety in how people can use the one skill.
The problem is though, whilst I can see this working for some active skills like fireball, how would you go about doing something like whirlwind? Spinning rate (higher = damage), speed (higher = quicker, but less damage), range (higher = further at same speed) and perhaps Damage bonus (higher = more damage)
I was thinking of another idea that just came up. It was really based off sinergies. i was thinking how great of a concept it was when kept as such. When applied didn't turn out as good as it was made out to be.
How about if we took that concept a little further by directly linking skills together. So basically this would mean that a player would choose his main skills and have them linked together to create new skill effects.
This would make nearly every skill usefull in the way that they would complement each other as well as create a way for the player to get more for his buck. It would only be done with none passive skills.
For example, if you mixed whirlwind with that smash skill it would create a new version which would spin the character and as soon as you released the button, your character would simultaneously perform a big finish to his WW by smashing the ground in front of him.
Kinda like the combo from God of War. Basically chaining different skills together for various effects. A zombie dog linked with wall of zombies would create a pet that attacked targets and upon a successful hit, zombies would come up and hold him in place to further enable the player to deal ranged damage to it.
Fire Bomb with Terror would create a bomb that replaced it's fire damage with a terror effect. Notably usefull for clearing out some potentially deadly monsters from a room without having to go in and suicide.
Those were just a few examples so to try to get the idea out there.
What u guys think?
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----------Brought to you by Diablofans.com Forums -------- Originally Posted by mattheo_majik
I LOVE being a SEX TON!!!
Do you realise how much time it would take to create a useful/unique effect for EVERY skill combination?
U realize how much time they been, and still have to work on it....
Though, It doesn't necessarily mean that I am really thinking it could be done or not on Diablo3. It's Not like most of the stuff people talk about out here is taken seriously anyways.
Guess it's just to share what we believe might be cool ideas.
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[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]Diablo 3, Hottest shit to happen to 21st Century Entertainment since Georges "Rush" St-Pierre.______________ --------~~Mattheo's Quote of the day~~---------
----------Brought to you by Diablofans.com Forums -------- Originally Posted by mattheo_majik
I LOVE being a SEX TON!!!
U realize how much time they been, and still have to work on it....
Though, It doesn't necessarily mean that I am really thinking it could be done or not on Diablo3. It's Not like most of the stuff people talk about out here is taken seriously anyways.
Guess it's just to share what we believe might be cool ideas.
I like the idea, it wouldn't take that long to do either. It would take just as long to do as it would to redo their whole skill system which they are obviously doing now.
[/quote]You don't hunt for champions, they are randomized and appears as you play the game. You don't get more champion kills by going to a certain area or doing a certain thing.[/quote]
They are randomized and thus I have to search and hunt through the game to find them, that's not very fast or convenient and takes you out of the action cause you are spending time looking for these champions just so you can unlock a skill.
You should really read my previous posts because I am starting to repeat myself now The total level of your skills must not be higher than your skill points. Skill books unlocks the skills while skill points levels them. Read my previous posts for the reason for this system.
So these skill books then just unlock skills, what if I get a skill book I don't want? Do they work for any skill? I search and find a champion after 20 mins and bam, he drops me a bash skill book when I wanted a leap attack skill book...time to search again.
Skill books must come in great numbers because only 20% of them will be useable by your class, and probably only 4% for your build. It is important that you get them in about the same rate as you level up.
If 20% are for my class why would only 4% be for my build? Also they would have to implement a system where monsters only drop your character class skill books which would turn into a hassle with multiplayer and if they didn't people would just trade em off.
I still think they need a way to limit every character having every skill available to them. Drops do not do this. With enough play time, one character could have every skill. The quest idea could work but they would have to give you a set of skills to choose from like you can get +1 to fireball or +1 to cone of fire. The problem with either of these ideas is respec. I know it hasn't been officially confirmed but it has been all but. I guess technically a tier set up without any pre-req's and seperate tress would be different from a tree mechanic but still allows limits to skills and possible respecs. I would like something more different but I could see this happening.
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I'm glad they've decided to abolish the skill tree system. I personally think the idea makes no logical sense. Think realistically about how one would earn a skill. It's done through experience, learned from a book, or taught by a teacher. My guess is we will have to learn skills taught by teachers in a quest format; in such a way that we must to earn our skills and abilities. Once we have learned the basic skills, then we can upgrade them with experience as we progress through the game or simply with skill points earned from leveling. I don't like the skill book idea because it's been done several times before, includig Diablo 1, and it can ruin the economy from what I've seen.
The real problem with a drop idea is that it limits players to what they have gotten rather then what they want to play. If I play a WD and want to focus on summoning, I might not get the chance if I never get the right skills to drop. There is no reason to limit characters builds based off of drops they receive. I would be very upset if I didn't get free choice of my character's build.
Also, if you still limit peoples skill points with drops, then people will just horde their points until the finally get a skill that they wanted. Hording skill points is something they wanted to change from D2.
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I just don't think they'll return to item based skills. They would have to drop often enough to ensure that you get them and they could not be randomized events.
Why not have each skill have its own experience? The more you use a skill the more powerful it becomes. I don't know how this would work with passives... maybe if it boosts life, the more damage you take the stronger it becomes. You could also have new skills tiers unlocked at certain levels. That way you still get better skills at higher levels. I think to work, if a skill is idle (you stop using it in favor of a different skill) it begins to wane.
The problem with the use it to level it system is how do you limit characters from having every skill. I don't think they want every character to be able to cast every spell.
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The whole book thing seems too unnecessarily complicated in my opinion. And I like mattheo_majik idea of increasing certain aspects of a skill. Maybe instead of 20 points to invest in any skill, you can only improve 1 skill, but as you wish.
Like, instead of doubling fireball damage, I'd like to x1.5 it, but also increase it's area of effect. Each aspect would have a limit, so you don't have a massive fireball that does virtually no damage.
The book can be a skill point that you can put as your wish ?! But the only thing is how balancing that to always keep equality between same level characters ? So I don't think it will work like that.
Before d2 release, I hoped the return of books. When I knew that each character will have there own unique skill, I continue to hoped that the books bring standard spell that any character be able to use (like healing, resurect, teleport...) But I be disapointed...
Maybe they will do that with the books but now I hope each own characters skills will not work with books.
For who my english quality hurt you, I'm sorry !
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Now if there are no pre req to any skill then what is stopping me from doing what they don't want me to do and that is horde my points till I hit X level and then put them all into the skill I want? They remove 1 problem and make 1-2 more.
Now the idea is very rough, since I haven't given much though to it. Instead I'm just going to write it out as it appears and let you guys sort out the details.
Since the beginning of time, (or RPG games) there have been skills. Skills are leveled up by clicking on them upon the gain of a new skill point.
Click* +1 to skill.....Skill reaches next level and thus goes up in strength with all kinds of predefined levels of usefulness.....
What if , upon reaching a new level, we would be given the choice to level a certain perspective of a skill instead of a skill as a whole. This would mean that instead of....
Click* +1 to Fireball = +damage, +radius, +fire, etc....
We first unlock the spell or skill (maybe with a quest/prerequisites or even class specific books) then every level we gain we are given skill points (not the same as D2 skill points) but simply points that would be used to directly level up certian aspects of skills.
(Reach a level) +20 Points
Click to customize whichever skill you need to customize...
For example, I'm a wizard, I like using a mix of teleport and disintegrate.
I use a tactic that heavily relies on placement and focus fire to eliminate large groups standing in a row with a direct beam.
So I could choose to level my tele speed, or distance and level up the disintegrate range in order to maximize the ammount of monsters I hit per cast.
I use this tactic for a few levels since I notice it's doing good, but then when I enter a new dungeon I notice that my spell power is lacking. So I then decide to spend the next point on damage instead of range.
All boosts could also be complemented with drawbacks. More range could mean less width of the beam. More damage could mean more mana usage per second. More width could mean a slower cast speed. etc etc. This way, it could prevent users from becoming too uber in a short span of time by simply leveling one skill. And it would make sure that we wouldn't end up maxing out a skill by level 10.
I wanna write some more but my wife says we gotta head out, so I'll let you guys talk some more about it.
--------~~Mattheo's Quote of the day~~---------
----------Brought to you by Diablofans.com Forums --------
Originally Posted by mattheo_majik
I LOVE being a SEX TON!!!
- This gives players a HUGE number of ways to level up their character but that limits the skills useable alot. People will be to concentrated on leveling up say FB to top range, top width, top damage, instead of going dmg here, width on this skill, ect.
- What about Barbarian battle order type skills? Do we cut them up and have 1 skill point as life and 1 as mana?
The idea is good but flawed in the fact that it just rips skills apart and substitutes points that would be used on useless skills to just complete what is now just 1 skill.
I can't wait to see what Blizzard has under their sleeves cause they have some serious issues here with their skill systems and skills, and have said numerous times they want all the skills to be useful and better off then they were in D2...but maybe they bit off a little more then they can chew cause obviously they are having some issues.
2013 anyone?
Let's say we still have 20 skill levels of fireball, and you can choose to upgrade cast rate, damage, range, and area of effect. Once you reach the 20th level of fireball, you have effectively maxed the skill, but not all portions of the skill.
Eg. If you have maxed Fireball, you can either have maximum range and maximum damage, which would benefit long range shooting (Like a sniper rifle). Or, you could have maximum cast rate and the biggest area of effect (Like an Uzi with huge bullets). Or, you could have max cast rate and range, meaning you deal lots of low-powered fireballs.
You add these combinations on top of the runes to create even more variety in how people can use the one skill.
The problem is though, whilst I can see this working for some active skills like fireball, how would you go about doing something like whirlwind? Spinning rate (higher = damage), speed (higher = quicker, but less damage), range (higher = further at same speed) and perhaps Damage bonus (higher = more damage)
How about if we took that concept a little further by directly linking skills together. So basically this would mean that a player would choose his main skills and have them linked together to create new skill effects.
This would make nearly every skill usefull in the way that they would complement each other as well as create a way for the player to get more for his buck. It would only be done with none passive skills.
For example, if you mixed whirlwind with that smash skill it would create a new version which would spin the character and as soon as you released the button, your character would simultaneously perform a big finish to his WW by smashing the ground in front of him.
Kinda like the combo from God of War. Basically chaining different skills together for various effects. A zombie dog linked with wall of zombies would create a pet that attacked targets and upon a successful hit, zombies would come up and hold him in place to further enable the player to deal ranged damage to it.
Fire Bomb with Terror would create a bomb that replaced it's fire damage with a terror effect. Notably usefull for clearing out some potentially deadly monsters from a room without having to go in and suicide.
Those were just a few examples so to try to get the idea out there.
What u guys think?
--------~~Mattheo's Quote of the day~~---------
----------Brought to you by Diablofans.com Forums --------
Originally Posted by mattheo_majik
I LOVE being a SEX TON!!!
U realize how much time they been, and still have to work on it....
Though, It doesn't necessarily mean that I am really thinking it could be done or not on Diablo3. It's Not like most of the stuff people talk about out here is taken seriously anyways.
Guess it's just to share what we believe might be cool ideas.
--------~~Mattheo's Quote of the day~~---------
----------Brought to you by Diablofans.com Forums --------
Originally Posted by mattheo_majik
I LOVE being a SEX TON!!!
[/quote]You don't hunt for champions, they are randomized and appears as you play the game. You don't get more champion kills by going to a certain area or doing a certain thing.[/quote] They are randomized and thus I have to search and hunt through the game to find them, that's not very fast or convenient and takes you out of the action cause you are spending time looking for these champions just so you can unlock a skill.
So these skill books then just unlock skills, what if I get a skill book I don't want? Do they work for any skill? I search and find a champion after 20 mins and bam, he drops me a bash skill book when I wanted a leap attack skill book...time to search again.
If 20% are for my class why would only 4% be for my build? Also they would have to implement a system where monsters only drop your character class skill books which would turn into a hassle with multiplayer and if they didn't people would just trade em off.
Find any Diablo news? Contact me or anyone else on the News team
Also, if you still limit peoples skill points with drops, then people will just horde their points until the finally get a skill that they wanted. Hording skill points is something they wanted to change from D2.
Find any Diablo news? Contact me or anyone else on the News team
Why not have each skill have its own experience? The more you use a skill the more powerful it becomes. I don't know how this would work with passives... maybe if it boosts life, the more damage you take the stronger it becomes. You could also have new skills tiers unlocked at certain levels. That way you still get better skills at higher levels. I think to work, if a skill is idle (you stop using it in favor of a different skill) it begins to wane.
Find any Diablo news? Contact me or anyone else on the News team
The whole book thing seems too unnecessarily complicated in my opinion. And I like mattheo_majik idea of increasing certain aspects of a skill. Maybe instead of 20 points to invest in any skill, you can only improve 1 skill, but as you wish.
Like, instead of doubling fireball damage, I'd like to x1.5 it, but also increase it's area of effect. Each aspect would have a limit, so you don't have a massive fireball that does virtually no damage.
Find any Diablo news? Contact me or anyone else on the News team
Find any Diablo news? Contact me or anyone else on the News team
Before d2 release, I hoped the return of books. When I knew that each character will have there own unique skill, I continue to hoped that the books bring standard spell that any character be able to use (like healing, resurect, teleport...) But I be disapointed...
Maybe they will do that with the books but now I hope each own characters skills will not work with books.
For who my english quality hurt you, I'm sorry !