How about at a level and gear that is relevant to the beta...If you run around one shotting everything then of course every class would seem OP. Thats hardly a good position to look at the games balance. Is that really that complicated for you?
Gear is actually a factor we can even eliminate. Everyone will have similar gear, thus the real factors are the skills themselves and we have all that info already.
There is no level in beta that is relevant to balance. No one is going to be complaining about their lvl 10 anything when the game comes out, because it takes an hour to get there, and another hour to be WELL past that point. The only thing we can speculate about is the farthest we can get into the game, when the classes have the most access to the most things, its meaningless to speculate about balance at a level where noone will be for any length of time, and even less meaningful to discuss levels before that.
Anyway, good troll, and good day sir moving on to constructive comments.
Wow you are dense....try level 7-9 for SK. That is the relevant lever, and whatever gear you find on the way is the relevant gear level.
At level 13 with 70 dps you can't really make any useful conclusions at all, as you are way too powerful for that content.
Here let me whip out the crayons for you. If I can one shot all the mobs with 50 dps, and you have 1000 dps. Then there is no advantage to having that extra 950 dps... it does nothing.For all intents and purposes in that scenario the 50 dps is equal in killing power to the 1000 dps.This is why you can't judge the content of the beta based on level 13's with the best gear in beta.
k champ, now its time to go beddy bye.
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"Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?"
How about at a level and gear that is relevant to the beta...If you run around one shotting everything then of course every class would seem OP. Thats hardly a good position to look at the games balance. Is that really that complicated for you?
Gear is actually a factor we can even eliminate. Everyone will have similar gear, thus the real factors are the skills themselves and we have all that info already.
There is no level in beta that is relevant to balance. No one is going to be complaining about their lvl 10 anything when the game comes out, because it takes an hour to get there, and another hour to be WELL past that point. The only thing we can speculate about is the farthest we can get into the game, when the classes have the most access to the most things, its meaningless to speculate about balance at a level where noone will be for any length of time, and even less meaningful to discuss levels before that.
Anyway, good troll, and good day sir moving on to constructive comments.
Wow you are dense....try level 7-9 for SK. That is the relevant lever, and whatever gear you find on the way is the relevant gear level.
At level 13 with 70 dps you can't really make any useful conclusions at all, as you are way too powerful for that content.
Here let me whip out the crayons for you. If I can one shot all the mobs with 50 dps, and you have 1000 dps. Then there is no advantage to having that extra 950 dps... it does nothing.For all intents and purposes in that scenario the 50 dps is equal in killing power to the 1000 dps.This is why you can't judge the content of the beta based on level 13's with the best gear in beta.
k champ, now its time to go beddy bye.
By your reasoning in D2 we should conclude that the Sorceress SUCKED by the time you get to Blood Raven, it has no mana regen and no survivability, therefore it is terribly weak and unbalanced.... Meanwhile the Necro is the strongest most awesome character ever and should be nerfed right?
45 minutes of any RPG doesn't give you the slightest bit of information about class balance...
I agree with OP to an extent. The first few levels of playing as a Wiz were just super boring to me. Not that it was underpowered per se, just not at all interesting or exciting. Then I got around level 11-13 area and it started to get a lot cooler and I felt like I was doing some damage. I definitely attribute it to gear/available abilities at low level. Based on what I've seen (was able to get all to 13 before open beta closed) I think each character is going to be really awesome to play at high levels.
How about at a level and gear that is relevant to the beta...If you run around one shotting everything then of course every class would seem OP. Thats hardly a good position to look at the games balance. Is that really that complicated for you?
Gear is actually a factor we can even eliminate. Everyone will have similar gear, thus the real factors are the skills themselves and we have all that info already.
There is no level in beta that is relevant to balance. No one is going to be complaining about their lvl 10 anything when the game comes out, because it takes an hour to get there, and another hour to be WELL past that point. The only thing we can speculate about is the farthest we can get into the game, when the classes have the most access to the most things, its meaningless to speculate about balance at a level where noone will be for any length of time, and even less meaningful to discuss levels before that.
Anyway, good troll, and good day sir moving on to constructive comments.
Wow you are dense....try level 7-9 for SK. That is the relevant lever, and whatever gear you find on the way is the relevant gear level.
At level 13 with 70 dps you can't really make any useful conclusions at all, as you are way too powerful for that content.
Here let me whip out the crayons for you. If I can one shot all the mobs with 50 dps, and you have 1000 dps. Then there is no advantage to having that extra 950 dps... it does nothing.For all intents and purposes in that scenario the 50 dps is equal in killing power to the 1000 dps.This is why you can't judge the content of the beta based on level 13's with the best gear in beta.
k champ, now its time to go beddy bye.
By your reasoning in D2 we should conclude that the Sorceress SUCKED by the time you get to Blood Raven, it has no mana regen and no survivability, therefore it is terribly weak and unbalanced.... Meanwhile the Necro is the strongest most awesome character ever and should be nerfed right?
45 minutes of any RPG doesn't give you the slightest bit of information about class balance...
Two completely different games mechanic wise....so your analogy falls flat on its face.
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"Just google "diablo 3 gold guide" and magical rainbow covered demons will assault your eyes."
Two completely different games mechanic wise....so your analogy falls flat on its face.
It really doesn't... If you don't have the all the intended class mechanics available to a class, you can't complain about its balance. Wizard doesn't have regen available in the beta, only Power Hungry at lvl 10, which is beyond the scope he wants to compare even. But as Wizard is a class that they've specifically talked about regen and regen speed being HUGE for, its rediculous to compare it to other classes that ARE doing their main class mechanics. The point being that because Wizard OBVIOUSLY scales to be better a littler later than the first 20-30 minutes of the game, its rediculous to compare it to other classes that are better set up to scale during that minute portion of play.
Two completely different games mechanic wise....so your analogy falls flat on its face.
It really doesn't... If you don't have the all the intended class mechanics available to a class, you can't complain about its balance. Wizard doesn't have regen available in the beta, only Power Hungry at lvl 10, which is beyond the scope he wants to compare even. But as Wizard is a class that they've specifically talked about regen and regen speed being HUGE for, its rediculous to compare it to other classes that ARE doing their main class mechanics. The point being that because Wizard OBVIOUSLY scales to be better a littler later than the first 20-30 minutes of the game, its rediculous to compare it to other classes that are better set up to scale during that minute portion of play.
We do have all the information regarding mechanics. The beta gameplay is just another part of the puzzle we can use to piece together a constructive viewpoint of actual gameplay later on. You will do the exact same thing later while playing the game to determine which skills and combos work the best.
Experimentation is important, but we have a good deal of it via the beta and even gameplay in D2.
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Do you want to get scammed? Perhaps a nice keylogger?
"Just google "diablo 3 gold guide" and magical rainbow covered demons will assault your eyes."
[
We do have all the information regarding mechanics. The beta gameplay is just another part of the puzzle we can use to piece together a constructive viewpoint of actual gameplay later on. You will do the exact same thing later while playing the game to determine which skills and combos work the best.
Experimentation is important, but we have a good deal of it via the beta and even gameplay in D2.
Gameplay at lvl 7-9 will not be rebalanced is the point. Hell class balance at 20-30 isn't really the point either, these skills are balanced for lvl 60 generally as they're expected to be able to be used the entire way. If you look at any RPG generally you can compare classes ever 5 levels and see that the best class at that level will change. Why? Because this character gets a good synergy at 12 that this other one that was stronger at 10 didn't, and then the other class gets some huge bonus at the next level range.
The beta wizard gameplay at LVL 13 feels balanced fine with other classes at LVL 13, at lvl 8? Maybe not, who cares once you get to 13?
Who cares about 13? As was said earlier, if you can one shot everything then every class seems equal regardless of the actual numbers.
As I said it is balanced at the END point of the beta, the highest we can get to, meaning if beta was the actual game, regardless of the middle portion the characters end up balanced, in terms of damage, regardless of 1 shot or not. Hell I'm pretty sure my wizard was vastly out DPSing most monks I played with, maybe they should complain about their balance.
If the game kept going and monsters had more hp and my wizard was still doing its lvl 13 damage it WOULD be balanced with the damage of the other classes at lvl 13. THAT is the point not wether or not my wizard got the skills to put it at the exact same dps as the other classes at the same time, just that it does get there. Its especially not the point it isn't on part for a tiny section of the beginning act.
Who cares about 13? As was said earlier, if you can one shot everything then every class seems equal regardless of the actual numbers.
As I said it is balanced at the END point of the beta, the highest we can get to, meaning if beta was the actual game, regardless of the middle portion the characters end up balanced, in terms of damage, regardless of 1 shot or not. Hell I'm pretty sure my wizard was vastly out DPSing most monks I played with, maybe they should complain about their balance.
If the game kept going and monsters had more hp and my wizard was still doing its lvl 13 damage it WOULD be balanced with the damage of the other classes at lvl 13. THAT is the point not wether or not my wizard got the skills to put it at the exact same dps as the other classes at the same time, just that it does get there. Its especially not the point it isn't on part for a tiny section of the beginning act.
So the game is completely balanced at 13, but not 8?!?
Again, you can't make any judgements about balance at 13 when every class one shots everything, thats not logical at all. The game is completely unbalanced, because you shouldn't be that well geared in that area. So to claim there exist class balance in that completely unbalanced situation is just stupid.
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Do you want to get scammed? Perhaps a nice keylogger?
"Just google "diablo 3 gold guide" and magical rainbow covered demons will assault your eyes."
So the game is completely balanced at 13, but not 8?!?
Again, you can't make any judgements about balance at 13 when every class one shots everything, thats not logical at all. The game is completely unbalanced, because you shouldn't be that well geared in that area. So to claim there exist class balance in that completely unbalanced situation is just stupid.
So are you just choosing to ignore the point where I said regardless of the area or how much hp enemies have?... NONE of the characters should be that well geared at that level, and yet all gear being the same, even though wizard will likely be more gear dependent, hell even naked the Wizard's damage, thanks to the runes and which not compared to others is FINE. Is everyone on a 100% equal footing? No, because once again the game is balanced to lvl 60, at that point, the characters should all be equally strong with different gear requirements.
This thread is about wether the wizard is underpowered. Its not, regardless of whatever limitations you want to put on it to make it less true, at LVL 13 which THE FARTHEST WE CAN TEST, the damage numbers are NOT underpowered, nor is the range of skills that it has, slows, large aoe and damage absorbing armor.
It doesn't matter wether you are hitting a lvl 1 monster or a lvl 20 monster, at lvl 13 my wizard will probably take it down just as fast as your monk.
But you apparently aren't allowing anyone to think about anything but the journey to 13, an that is not the point.
Is it just me or does the wizard seem pretty underpowered? granted its beta, 1/4th of act 1 and you didnt get any good gear, but compared to the other characters the wizard felt..... lacking. 3 arcane orbs and youre out of arcane power and forced to use signature spells which really dont do that much damage, and also dont work well in large packs. Say when youre against a tomb guardian and hes summoning more skeles. If youre initial spells dont clear a straight path to the tomb guardian, you might be in a longer fight than you bargained for. Hell, in a full game a full Ray of Frost wasnt enough to kill a single normal harvester.
i know the resource is suppost to be small and regen fast but it just didnt play well for the beta. maybe itwas my setup, i dont know. just really felt like most of the time i was spamming magic missile
The Wizard is underpowered until you unlock more spells. You just have to be diligent until then.
Also, Blizz has been dialing in the balance quite a bit over the last few patches. I've noticed all characters have to work a bit harder now.
Is it just me or does the wizard seem pretty underpowered? granted its beta, 1/4th of act 1 and you didnt get any good gear, but compared to the other characters the wizard felt..... lacking. 3 arcane orbs and youre out of arcane power and forced to use signature spells which really dont do that much damage, and also dont work well in large packs. Say when youre against a tomb guardian and hes summoning more skeles. If youre initial spells dont clear a straight path to the tomb guardian, you might be in a longer fight than you bargained for. Hell, in a full game a full Ray of Frost wasnt enough to kill a single normal harvester.
i know the resource is suppost to be small and regen fast but it just didnt play well for the beta. maybe itwas my setup, i dont know. just really felt like most of the time i was spamming magic missile
The Wizard is underpowered until you unlock more spells. You just have to be diligent until then.
Also, Blizz has been dialing in the balance quite a bit over the last few patches. I've noticed all characters have to work a bit harder now.
What spells? Most people claim that Arcane Orb is one of the best, if not the best.
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"Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?"
In my playthroughs during the open beta, the wizard dealt the highest DPS out of all the characters. Averaging 40 AOE damage with spectral blade, 32 damage with charged bolt, and 50 damage with arcane orb. The only class to come close was the barb, max damage was around 30.
Is it just me or does the wizard seem pretty underpowered? granted its beta, 1/4th of act 1 and you didnt get any good gear, but compared to the other characters the wizard felt..... lacking. 3 arcane orbs and youre out of arcane power and forced to use signature spells which really dont do that much damage, and also dont work well in large packs. Say when youre against a tomb guardian and hes summoning more skeles. If youre initial spells dont clear a straight path to the tomb guardian, you might be in a longer fight than you bargained for. Hell, in a full game a full Ray of Frost wasnt enough to kill a single normal harvester.
i know the resource is suppost to be small and regen fast but it just didnt play well for the beta. maybe itwas my setup, i dont know. just really felt like most of the time i was spamming magic missile
The Wizard is underpowered until you unlock more spells. You just have to be diligent until then.
Also, Blizz has been dialing in the balance quite a bit over the last few patches. I've noticed all characters have to work a bit harder now.
What spells? Most people claim that Arcane Orb is one of the best, if not the best.
Spectral blade = awesome AoE
Wave of Force = Awesome radius... and Awesome AoE
Frost Nova = Decent CC (same as monk, and barb... just frozen rather than stun or blind).
Ray of Frost - 215% single target dps as a constant stream
Arcane Orb = 228% AoE orbs.. 3 can be cast per AP pool. Thats 684% weapon damage per volley. It takes less than 10 seconds to throw another volley.
Magic Missile - While i know you like to whine about this compared to other classes... its FREE. Absolutely 100% free and it does 143% WD ... at a FAR range.
etc....
wizard was the best class power wise for me when playing the beta, one full thorough playthrough and by the time i get to the skeleton king being lvl 10, i had around 32dps and all of there spells felt powerful and had there own niche, i enjoyed some more than others, but i personally enjoyed shockpulse, rune or not runed the entire way through, i love how it instantly deals its damage without much travel time as apposed to the arcane spells, and the fact that it has multiple arcs, i felt i didnt ever have to worry about single target, even in the skeleton kings case, as long as i can quickly dispatch of all aoe packs, my diamond skin / frost nova giving me insane survivablity if used properly have basically 0 time to even damage me outside of just those 2 cds, yea Wizard felt awesome with just your standard no twinking use what you kill playthrough
Is it just me or does the wizard seem pretty underpowered? granted its beta, 1/4th of act 1 and you didnt get any good gear, but compared to the other characters the wizard felt..... lacking. 3 arcane orbs and youre out of arcane power and forced to use signature spells which really dont do that much damage, and also dont work well in large packs. Say when youre against a tomb guardian and hes summoning more skeles. If youre initial spells dont clear a straight path to the tomb guardian, you might be in a longer fight than you bargained for. Hell, in a full game a full Ray of Frost wasnt enough to kill a single normal harvester.
i know the resource is suppost to be small and regen fast but it just didnt play well for the beta. maybe itwas my setup, i dont know. just really felt like most of the time i was spamming magic missile
The Wizard is underpowered until you unlock more spells. You just have to be diligent until then.
Also, Blizz has been dialing in the balance quite a bit over the last few patches. I've noticed all characters have to work a bit harder now.
What spells? Most people claim that Arcane Orb is one of the best, if not the best.
Spectral blade = awesome AoE
Wave of Force = Awesome radius... and Awesome AoE
Frost Nova = Decent CC (same as monk, and barb... just frozen rather than stun or blind).
Ray of Frost - 215% single target dps as a constant stream
Arcane Orb = 228% AoE orbs.. 3 can be cast per AP pool. Thats 684% weapon damage per volley. It takes less than 10 seconds to throw another volley.
Magic Missile - While i know you like to whine about this compared to other classes... its FREE. Absolutely 100% free and it does 143% WD ... at a FAR range.
etc....
just stop whining and grow a pair.
Those are the spells often in the beta....He said there were amazing ones just waiting for the wizard that would rebalance things. Of course to suggest that is an admission that the wizard is gimp, but I will ignore that.
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"Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?"
Epicurus
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At level 13 with 70 dps you can't really make any useful conclusions at all, as you are way too powerful for that content.
Here let me whip out the crayons for you.
If I can one shot all the mobs with 50 dps, and you have 1000 dps. Then there is no advantage to having that extra 950 dps... it does nothing. For all intents and purposes in that scenario the 50 dps is equal in killing power to the 1000 dps. This is why you can't judge the content of the beta based on level 13's with the best gear in beta.
k champ, now its time to go beddy bye.
Epicurus
By your reasoning in D2 we should conclude that the Sorceress SUCKED by the time you get to Blood Raven, it has no mana regen and no survivability, therefore it is terribly weak and unbalanced.... Meanwhile the Necro is the strongest most awesome character ever and should be nerfed right?
45 minutes of any RPG doesn't give you the slightest bit of information about class balance...
"Just google "diablo 3 gold guide" and magical rainbow covered demons will assault your eyes."
It really doesn't... If you don't have the all the intended class mechanics available to a class, you can't complain about its balance. Wizard doesn't have regen available in the beta, only Power Hungry at lvl 10, which is beyond the scope he wants to compare even. But as Wizard is a class that they've specifically talked about regen and regen speed being HUGE for, its rediculous to compare it to other classes that ARE doing their main class mechanics. The point being that because Wizard OBVIOUSLY scales to be better a littler later than the first 20-30 minutes of the game, its rediculous to compare it to other classes that are better set up to scale during that minute portion of play.
We do have all the information regarding mechanics. The beta gameplay is just another part of the puzzle we can use to piece together a constructive viewpoint of actual gameplay later on. You will do the exact same thing later while playing the game to determine which skills and combos work the best.
Experimentation is important, but we have a good deal of it via the beta and even gameplay in D2.
"Just google "diablo 3 gold guide" and magical rainbow covered demons will assault your eyes."
Gameplay at lvl 7-9 will not be rebalanced is the point. Hell class balance at 20-30 isn't really the point either, these skills are balanced for lvl 60 generally as they're expected to be able to be used the entire way. If you look at any RPG generally you can compare classes ever 5 levels and see that the best class at that level will change. Why? Because this character gets a good synergy at 12 that this other one that was stronger at 10 didn't, and then the other class gets some huge bonus at the next level range.
The beta wizard gameplay at LVL 13 feels balanced fine with other classes at LVL 13, at lvl 8? Maybe not, who cares once you get to 13?
"Just google "diablo 3 gold guide" and magical rainbow covered demons will assault your eyes."
As I said it is balanced at the END point of the beta, the highest we can get to, meaning if beta was the actual game, regardless of the middle portion the characters end up balanced, in terms of damage, regardless of 1 shot or not. Hell I'm pretty sure my wizard was vastly out DPSing most monks I played with, maybe they should complain about their balance.
If the game kept going and monsters had more hp and my wizard was still doing its lvl 13 damage it WOULD be balanced with the damage of the other classes at lvl 13. THAT is the point not wether or not my wizard got the skills to put it at the exact same dps as the other classes at the same time, just that it does get there. Its especially not the point it isn't on part for a tiny section of the beginning act.
So the game is completely balanced at 13, but not 8?!?
Again, you can't make any judgements about balance at 13 when every class one shots everything, thats not logical at all. The game is completely unbalanced, because you shouldn't be that well geared in that area. So to claim there exist class balance in that completely unbalanced situation is just stupid.
"Just google "diablo 3 gold guide" and magical rainbow covered demons will assault your eyes."
So are you just choosing to ignore the point where I said regardless of the area or how much hp enemies have?... NONE of the characters should be that well geared at that level, and yet all gear being the same, even though wizard will likely be more gear dependent, hell even naked the Wizard's damage, thanks to the runes and which not compared to others is FINE. Is everyone on a 100% equal footing? No, because once again the game is balanced to lvl 60, at that point, the characters should all be equally strong with different gear requirements.
This thread is about wether the wizard is underpowered. Its not, regardless of whatever limitations you want to put on it to make it less true, at LVL 13 which THE FARTHEST WE CAN TEST, the damage numbers are NOT underpowered, nor is the range of skills that it has, slows, large aoe and damage absorbing armor.
It doesn't matter wether you are hitting a lvl 1 monster or a lvl 20 monster, at lvl 13 my wizard will probably take it down just as fast as your monk.
But you apparently aren't allowing anyone to think about anything but the journey to 13, an that is not the point.
The Wizard is underpowered until you unlock more spells. You just have to be diligent until then.
Also, Blizz has been dialing in the balance quite a bit over the last few patches. I've noticed all characters have to work a bit harder now.
Signature by Aranoch
What spells? Most people claim that Arcane Orb is one of the best, if not the best.
Epicurus
The wizard is in no means underpowered. Her nukes deals super high damage and she has some nice cc.
Man you sound like VladDracul calling anyone you disagree with a kid.
Why do you take such pleasure in life out of being a troll? Every single post you make is angry and trollish.
Spectral blade = awesome AoE
Wave of Force = Awesome radius... and Awesome AoE
Frost Nova = Decent CC (same as monk, and barb... just frozen rather than stun or blind).
Ray of Frost - 215% single target dps as a constant stream
Arcane Orb = 228% AoE orbs.. 3 can be cast per AP pool. Thats 684% weapon damage per volley. It takes less than 10 seconds to throw another volley.
Magic Missile - While i know you like to whine about this compared to other classes... its FREE. Absolutely 100% free and it does 143% WD ... at a FAR range.
etc....
just stop whining and grow a pair.
Those are the spells often in the beta....He said there were amazing ones just waiting for the wizard that would rebalance things. Of course to suggest that is an admission that the wizard is gimp, but I will ignore that.
Epicurus