Look, the bottom line is that every class should have at least 3 different sets that are efficient. I say 3 because I'm guessing you can make 3 types of sub characters per character class (i.e Bowazon, Javazon/Amazon...etc). Make them more possible to find as well. I've finished the game over 10 times, and cumulatively, I've found around 15 set items. Maybe I'm just not lucky? I'm not entirely sure.
Lol! Having a mandated assortment of items as the undisputed best for your build would suck ass. Mixing and matching uniques, runewords, and select set items was so much better.
If by 'matching' you mean everyone should wear the exact same items like it was in D2 then okay.
If by 'matching' you mean everyone should wear the exact same items like it was in D2 then okay.
.
No, in D2 not every build in the same class gets the same item build... Ex: some builds needs more FC (like Bone/Poison necros) some don't (summon necros).
Of course, theres some items that are overused like Enigma, SoJ, Mara's, Shako...
But the problem lies in the broken game mechanic - everyone use only vit, ppl really don'r care about have giant mana pools, just a ok mana pool, +1 All Skills is a too comun and generic bonus.
The problem is some bonus is much more better then others. Ex: Nobody give a damn to have a super giant DEF, put the STR you would use to wear plates in VIT and get a super high HP bonus and use a Dusk Shroud is allways the smartest option. It's a math problem, not a SET ITEMS Vs. Runeword problem.
Sets should make stable characters with stable stats, they shouldn't be capable of the highest damage output, or the most defence but they should be capable of completing most of the greatest difficulty mode with a high quality set if they play it smart. I like sets because they kinda fill a niche. They aren't quite as impossible to find as uniques or runes/runewords but they always give stats that you have a general idea about and can become pretty powerful when complete. Also, I think they should introduce more sets which alter character appearances, becoming a ghould lord with full Trang' Oul was just awesome. I think it would have been great to become a purple cow with full Cow King's hides or grow a pair of angelic wings with the full Angelic set.
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Set items should not be the best items imo. If sets would be the strogest, it would take out player's item building. The best item must be Unic/Crafted in my opnion.
How exactly is there item building in D2? You get Enigma, Shako, Hoto, torch, etc, and your set. No offense but that doesn't seem like item building...
Quote from "italofoca" »
Of course Enigma, Shako, Mara's and other was imbalanced items. But it was not for the fact that it was Unic/RW, but because they status was totally overpowered. If there was a Set item in the game the same thing would hapen, except it was restricted to a class.
And they already said that they don't wanna focus Class Specific items, once it kills the trading economy.
Thus we get to the point, sets would be just as bad if they had the same stats.
Quote from "italofoca" »
Also the problem with set it was too hard to complete it compered with the bonus. I don't think the set should be strongest, but it shoudl be easier to get.
I would like to see all the items be easier to get, but...
Quote from "italofoca" »
And don't take WoW as a model. Theres no equipament trading in wow and trading are not a considerable part of the game. Nobody in wow becomes strong because he know how to trade. In diablo, have a good notion of trading can make you get a Enigma out of nowhere and then your character becomes pretty strong.
And in Diablo you have to play every day and trade every day, and if you take even a week or two off, you won't know how much X item is worth. People like me, with a job and a life and everything, can't play 10 and 12 and 14 hours a day...
In WoW though, you stick it in an Auction House and the game does the dirty work.
Oh, and have you played WoW? Contrary to popular belief, there is item trading. Not on the same scale as Diablo 2, but there is item trading. Check Orgrimmar's trading channel from 5am to 11pm. Yea...
Quote from "angelmaz" »
Lol! Having a mandated assortment of items as the undisputed best for your build would suck ass. Mixing and matching uniques, runewords, and select set items was so much better.
There were already sets in Diablo 2 that were the best. They just wern't called sets. (Sets refering to Enigma, shako, maras, etc being a set.)
Quote from "italofoca" »
No, in D2 not every build in the same class gets the same item build... Ex: some builds needs more FC (like Bone/Poison necros) some don't (summon necros).
Of course, theres some items that are overused like Enigma, SoJ, Mara's, Shako...
But the problem lies in the broken game mechanic - everyone use only vit, ppl really don'r care about have giant mana pools, just a ok mana pool, +1 All Skills is a too comun and generic bonus.
The problem is some bonus is much more better then others. Ex: Nobody give a damn to have a super giant DEF, put the STR you would use to wear plates in VIT and get a super high HP bonus and use a Dusk Shroud is allways the smartest option. It's a math problem, not a SET ITEMS Vs. Runeword problem.
And in Diablo you have to play every day and trade every day, and if you take even a week or two off, you won't know how much X item is worth. People like me, with a job and a life and everything, can't play 10 and 12 and 14 hours a day...
In WoW though, you stick it in an Auction House and the game does the dirty work.
Oh, and have you played WoW? Contrary to popular belief, there is item trading. Not on the same scale as Diablo 2, but there is item trading. Check Orgrimmar's trading channel from 5am to 11pm. Yea...
Thankyou.
I agree. Diablo's trading is very hard for casual players. I've no job, but i'm a studant and I play around 1 hour day, 5 days/week.. Yes i'm a very casual player, for that reason i've stoped to play wow ('ve no time for raiding).
But when i said ''Don't take wow as a model'', I was talking about the set items been the best, not the AH. The AH is a brilhant idea and must be implement, it helps alot. What i really don't like is overpowered set items. It just kill the players option to creat they own set. I know diablo 've this problem, because some items are too strong compered to other.
Imo, the perfect balance would be Unics and Runeword be equally the best, and most of those items should 've equivalent bonus (but different bonus), not one stronger then the other, but two diferent items.
There will be no unewords in D3 anyway so thats out of the question. I hope there make sets more balanced so its worth it wearing a set.
Rares/crafted (if in game) should be the strongest as the mods on either of those are totally random (crafted have some that isnt, i know) whereas the mods on unique/set items are given before hand and only certain things can vary.
The sets in WoW are so much better at the time of their release (as said before) because they're of the highest accessible item level (Its also important that there are content patches and expansions to increase both level cap and introduce new dungeons with better sets that's kinda doubtfull for Diablo III to happen.). There are items (mostly weapons, though) that would make people swap every set item for them. The next tier... Legendaries (that are extremely rare) and Artifacts (in the years that WoW is out, none has dropped yet - hopefully Frostmourne will be the first) make everything else look pale.
Thats how sets in Diablo III should be. Great at each given time, (but also possible to be obtained) but pale compared to the high level uniques.
I think every set should have their own unique "effect". I like how Trang's set turned you into a vampire. Hope they put in some more stuff like that. Wouldn't it be awesome if on holidays like x-mas they have the monsters drop holiday set items that turn you into a demon santa?
I think sets should make you a solid character, but I dont think the best characters in the game should be running around in sets. They should make a solid character that can complete the game, but they certainly shouldn't have the highest damage output. There is a less thinking involved in wearing a set. "Set it and forget it" for most of your item slots, there isn't much "I need more resistance so I'll wear those boots..."
Yeah, there needs to be a stragedy to customizing your equipment to fit what you want your charector to do.
And in Diablo you have to play every day and trade every day, and if you take even a week or two off, you won't know how much X item is worth. People like me, with a job and a life and everything, can't play 10 and 12 and 14 hours a day...
In WoW though, you stick it in an Auction House and the game does the dirty work.
Oh, and have you played WoW? Contrary to popular belief, there is item trading. Not on the same scale as Diablo 2, but there is item trading. Check Orgrimmar's trading channel from 5am to 11pm. Yea...
Ooh that really pisses me off to see WoW trading so misrepresented. Maybe you can stand wallowing in mediocrity in a game, but I can't. And mediocre is exactly what you'll be if you use only items you can trade for, because those items suck ass. The only real items in WoW are items you raid for, and anyone who says differently just plain blows at the game.
Not all casual players are satisfied with mediocrity. At my peak, I probably played around 3 hours of D2 a day. And I fucking kicked ass. The fact of the matter is that with a sharp mind and some experience, a casual player could acquire the items necessary to excel in diablo 2. This is not, was never, and will never be the case in WoW, and that is why I despise that game with every fiber of my being.
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"Because "half-assed" is not a "style"." - DragoonWraith, champion of character customization and legimitate art direction in D3
I'm going to admit, I did not read much of anything but i'll bet i'm right on the money with what's being talked about.
Sets and Trade and rigged sets?
Sets did not encourage trade, uniques and runes encouraged trade. Runes made Sets Useless, and they were mostly useless anyway. Know why? because the game was set up like a really bad boss fight. Diablo 2 became a battle of gods, it was utterly meaningless, it came down to maximizing certain stats was all there was to it; This time around, Diablo 3, it's going to be a bit different, your enemies won't just kill you with a hard hit, you're going to be slowly ate away at, stat maximizing will be virtually meaningless, as skills will take precedence. Thus...? Sets will serve a function. The Mercenaries, Horadric Cube, Boss Fights, Runes, Sets, and uniques... all of these are failed features of diablo 2 and they are not the last.
This debate is nothing when people forget that the way the game works will not be the same, it will just look and be somewhat similar but the moment to moment activity and how things are affected is going to be different.
Sets were a good idea, like almost all of the failed functions (minus the Cube, fucking extra bag, gtfo.)
They were a solid idea that was seemingly ruined, certain sets were even useless before you could use them no matter what you played, and then some sets were so over powered that, and i'll bet i'm right about this, you all tried to put runewords on some of them.
Sets will serve a function. The Mercenaries, Horadric Cube, Boss Fights, Runes, Sets, and uniques... all of these are failed features of diablo 2 and they are not the last.
This debate is nothing when people forget that the way the game works will not be the same, it will just look and be somewhat similar but the moment to moment activity and how things are affected is going to be different.
Sets were a good idea, like almost all of the failed functions (minus the Cube, fucking extra bag, gtfo.)
They were a solid idea that was seemingly ruined, certain sets were even useless before you could use them no matter what you played, and then some sets were so over powered that, and i'll bet i'm right about this, you all tried to put runewords on some of them.
I dont understand what feature didnt fail in D2.
I agree they are trying to make combat a lot less of life yo-yo for melee and less one hit death for casters.
Some sets were overpowered? You could always make a more powerful character that didnt wear set pieces. People tried to put runewords in Griswolds or something?
some of the set items were pretty good, but i didn't like how off balance the levels were. if i remember right, the Paladin set (Gris) was basically a mid-range level set, and was obsolete for higher level paladins, whereas the Barb's set (IK) could last you till 99 without any complaints.
but i'm sure they've already considered these things, or will soon.
if would be nice, however, if sets were a little easier to get. i mean, why bother making set items if their Unique item type equivalents drop just as often? a full set is nothing compared to being decked out in Uniques, right, so the set should be a little easier to get.
the main flaw in set items is how "addictive" they are. once you have the full set, when you start getting better items, you don't want to remove parts of your powerful set to put on pieces that will take away the advantages of wearing that set. no set is fully effective if you are only wearing part of it, so you're sorta stuck with it until you can replace ALL the pieces. so, in a way, sets are counterproductive.
low level sets are more pointless than low level uniques though. you never get them unless you are too high level to use them, and even then, you're not going to find all the other pieces in time to be able to utilize them. it's a cool and fun idea, but it just never works (unless you're finding them on a higher level just to pass them down to a lower one, but i don't think too many items should be made just for passing down)
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No, in D2 not every build in the same class gets the same item build... Ex: some builds needs more FC (like Bone/Poison necros) some don't (summon necros).
Of course, theres some items that are overused like Enigma, SoJ, Mara's, Shako...
But the problem lies in the broken game mechanic - everyone use only vit, ppl really don'r care about have giant mana pools, just a ok mana pool, +1 All Skills is a too comun and generic bonus.
The problem is some bonus is much more better then others. Ex: Nobody give a damn to have a super giant DEF, put the STR you would use to wear plates in VIT and get a super high HP bonus and use a Dusk Shroud is allways the smartest option. It's a math problem, not a SET ITEMS Vs. Runeword problem.
Not particularly. You're pretty amusing. But trying to have a decent argument with you is like repeatedly banging my head against a wall.
"Because "half-assed" is not a "style"." - DragoonWraith, champion of character customization and legimitate art direction in D3
How exactly is there item building in D2? You get Enigma, Shako, Hoto, torch, etc, and your set. No offense but that doesn't seem like item building...
Thus we get to the point, sets would be just as bad if they had the same stats.
I would like to see all the items be easier to get, but...
And in Diablo you have to play every day and trade every day, and if you take even a week or two off, you won't know how much X item is worth. People like me, with a job and a life and everything, can't play 10 and 12 and 14 hours a day...
In WoW though, you stick it in an Auction House and the game does the dirty work.
Oh, and have you played WoW? Contrary to popular belief, there is item trading. Not on the same scale as Diablo 2, but there is item trading. Check Orgrimmar's trading channel from 5am to 11pm. Yea...
There were already sets in Diablo 2 that were the best. They just wern't called sets. (Sets refering to Enigma, shako, maras, etc being a set.)
Thankyou.
I agree. Diablo's trading is very hard for casual players. I've no job, but i'm a studant and I play around 1 hour day, 5 days/week.. Yes i'm a very casual player, for that reason i've stoped to play wow ('ve no time for raiding).
But when i said ''Don't take wow as a model'', I was talking about the set items been the best, not the AH. The AH is a brilhant idea and must be implement, it helps alot. What i really don't like is overpowered set items. It just kill the players option to creat they own set. I know diablo 've this problem, because some items are too strong compered to other.
Imo, the perfect balance would be Unics and Runeword be equally the best, and most of those items should 've equivalent bonus (but different bonus), not one stronger then the other, but two diferent items.
Rares/crafted (if in game) should be the strongest as the mods on either of those are totally random (crafted have some that isnt, i know) whereas the mods on unique/set items are given before hand and only certain things can vary.
"Ahh, fresh meat!"
- The Butcher
Thats how sets in Diablo III should be. Great at each given time, (but also possible to be obtained) but pale compared to the high level uniques.
Yeah, there needs to be a stragedy to customizing your equipment to fit what you want your charector to do.
Ooh that really pisses me off to see WoW trading so misrepresented. Maybe you can stand wallowing in mediocrity in a game, but I can't. And mediocre is exactly what you'll be if you use only items you can trade for, because those items suck ass. The only real items in WoW are items you raid for, and anyone who says differently just plain blows at the game.
Not all casual players are satisfied with mediocrity. At my peak, I probably played around 3 hours of D2 a day. And I fucking kicked ass. The fact of the matter is that with a sharp mind and some experience, a casual player could acquire the items necessary to excel in diablo 2. This is not, was never, and will never be the case in WoW, and that is why I despise that game with every fiber of my being.
"Because "half-assed" is not a "style"." - DragoonWraith, champion of character customization and legimitate art direction in D3
"I tell you the truth, whatever you bind on earth will be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth will be lossed in heaven."
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Sets and Trade and rigged sets?
Sets did not encourage trade, uniques and runes encouraged trade. Runes made Sets Useless, and they were mostly useless anyway. Know why? because the game was set up like a really bad boss fight. Diablo 2 became a battle of gods, it was utterly meaningless, it came down to maximizing certain stats was all there was to it; This time around, Diablo 3, it's going to be a bit different, your enemies won't just kill you with a hard hit, you're going to be slowly ate away at, stat maximizing will be virtually meaningless, as skills will take precedence. Thus...? Sets will serve a function. The Mercenaries, Horadric Cube, Boss Fights, Runes, Sets, and uniques... all of these are failed features of diablo 2 and they are not the last.
This debate is nothing when people forget that the way the game works will not be the same, it will just look and be somewhat similar but the moment to moment activity and how things are affected is going to be different.
Sets were a good idea, like almost all of the failed functions (minus the Cube, fucking extra bag, gtfo.)
They were a solid idea that was seemingly ruined, certain sets were even useless before you could use them no matter what you played, and then some sets were so over powered that, and i'll bet i'm right about this, you all tried to put runewords on some of them.
I dont understand what feature didnt fail in D2.
I agree they are trying to make combat a lot less of life yo-yo for melee and less one hit death for casters.
Some sets were overpowered? You could always make a more powerful character that didnt wear set pieces. People tried to put runewords in Griswolds or something?
but i'm sure they've already considered these things, or will soon.
if would be nice, however, if sets were a little easier to get. i mean, why bother making set items if their Unique item type equivalents drop just as often? a full set is nothing compared to being decked out in Uniques, right, so the set should be a little easier to get.
the main flaw in set items is how "addictive" they are. once you have the full set, when you start getting better items, you don't want to remove parts of your powerful set to put on pieces that will take away the advantages of wearing that set. no set is fully effective if you are only wearing part of it, so you're sorta stuck with it until you can replace ALL the pieces. so, in a way, sets are counterproductive.
low level sets are more pointless than low level uniques though. you never get them unless you are too high level to use them, and even then, you're not going to find all the other pieces in time to be able to utilize them. it's a cool and fun idea, but it just never works (unless you're finding them on a higher level just to pass them down to a lower one, but i don't think too many items should be made just for passing down)
You don't always know where you stand,
'Till you know that you won't run away.
There's something inside me that feels...
Like breathing in sulfur.