You could always do the bosses on regular before attempting them on hardcore. Then you would know exactly how difficult they are and avoid this whole situation entirely.
Lets all get this straight: playing Diablo 3 on HC, or any video game for that matter, does not make you "hardcore", bad ass, or a real man by any means, It's a damn game.
You could be playing the hardest game known to man and still only be a little asocial kid living in his parents basement.
Failing to acknowledging certain features of D2 missing in D3 only shows how eager you are to appear like internet toughguys.
In D2 HC, save & exit and instant tp was the name of the game. It's what you did to get out of a tight spot. Becaues guess what, it was either doing that or losing your char.
Choosing not to play the game as it's meant to be played (save & exit and tp being parts of the game) by not escaping a fight you know you'll loose is just dumb. You can either escape or loose your char. Loosing your char on purpose and then posting about it in an internet forum just makes you an idiot for wasting your own time without gaining anything from it - becaues lets face it, you aren't becoming more of a man by completing certain difficult videogame challenges.
I agree with OP. D3 is missing features that made HC what it was in D2. Saying that save & exit and tp in D3 HC makes it too easy, or basically makes it SC, is just dumb as it was what made HC in D2 what it was.
HC is having one life but also having easy exit strategies. That's how HC in D2 was. HC in D3 is a harder version of HC.
Saying that HC has always been like that is simply wrong, as we've always been using save & exit and tp to get out of trouble, to avoid loosing our chars.
It still surprises me to see how eager people are to prove how "hardcore" they are for beating a damn video game in a certain way.
Save and exit and instant TP weren't features jackass, they were faults. Just like there being no actual currency in D2 was a fault, so players had to make up their own (see SOJs). Arguing that this is being changed in D3 is = to burning a cross is ridiculous. Just because it's what we did before doesn't mean it's healthy for the game or the players.
The fact that you want an easy way out if you're in a tough spot just says to me you need to play softcore. You like the danger but 'oohhh *cring*' I don't want to actually lose!
Also, coming onto the forums for the first time using such a heavy stream of nerdrage words to flame people about playing diablo on HC, on a diablo website, is not the best idea.
Now what I said to add is a quicker recall of what's already in game, 3-5 second cast vs 10 would definitly still give you a chance at death, and thinking its not hc enough is a stupid response when a 1 damage arrow from a random skele will cancel the recall.
I like less safety nets for HC. Gives it that much more tension and suspense. I thought town portals were the worst mechanic anyway. Just adds another layer of caution to how people play Hardcore.
This is where you nerdraged by degrading those that want to play hardcore without the "features" you so want.
As you said, it is a damn game. Don't cry if you lose a character. Start a new one.
There is a reason for why they introduced a small window before you actually exit the game also why they gave stone of recall a casting time. They just didn't like how it was abused in D2. They want it to be played in another way.
So now "raging" simply means saying you don't like the same as someone else?
And how did this start anyway? Was I the one saying others shouldn't play the way they wanted? No, I was saying that I would like to play as I did in D2. Fans of a more hardcore HC mode have been saying all along that people who want to play D2 style HC are pussies for wanting that.
Now for saying that I'm fine with them playing however they want, if I can play the way I used to, I'm suddenly, not even raing, but nerdraging. How does that work out?
Also, complaining about losing a character because of a game bug, or unfair (compared to the previous diablo game) game mechanic, isn't crying. It's complaining about it and hoping it will get fixed so that random insta deaths doesn't happen in the same way anymore.
And it wasn't abused in D2. It was used the way it was meant to. Now they just want something else from D3, and a 10s exit time is too long for me in HC. At least it would have been in D2 with so many random insta deaths. Maybe D3 won't be like that, making a 10s casting time less of a worry. However it seems to be down to 4s now, much more to my liking.
What my real problem is situations like this: getting spotted by something like dark souls in worldstone keep from somewhere off screen where I can't see them.
What happens is this, I walk along without seeing any mobs. Suddenly though, I see a ton of lightning coming my way from somewhere off screen, and I die. That's a random insta death. Nothing you can do about it. I don't like that, and I don't want it in D3.
Even with the right gear for the situation, you can happen to get killed in an instant by something you didn't even see.
If D3 doesn't have these kinds of situations, then a 10s exit might be ok, let alone a 4s casting time.
First off you're asking for an instant out, because you took your toon too far and you're going to die. That's not HC, nor the instant save and exit.
Second, SoR is on like a 4 second cast.
Third, you can exit the game while moving and fighting, on a 10 second timer. If you're that big of a puss, just play with your exit game open the whole time.
Fourth, we have no idea how disconnects from our end are handled by D3, for all we know disconnects mean an instant leave-game server side. Just unplug your shit
Maybe those who don't like it should play SC, like most people would. If some are saying that finishing the game in HC isn't worth anything, then why are there complaints? Seems like there is a concern because they themselves want to be able to say "I play D3, on hardcore." I honestly don't care what's there to HC, and I won't be playing on HC, ever.
I find that the cause for the disjoint in opinion is between those who want to say "I play HC" but don't want to live with what makes it hard, and those who want to say "I play HC" and want it to be as hard as possible, to make bragging all the more worth it...
Of course this is an opinion, and this is the internet. I hope to play with you guys once the game comes out
You will all see, wait till nightmare+ is all i can say. I played hc in d2 for years i dont need to go sc, i agree with with how they have setup hc in d3 all the way except for this one major bug which they will change regardless of you "internet toughies" think. All the people in this topic will be the ones begging for it.
As for Duriels room, like i said before, yes you are locked in there, but you have instant TP's and save & exit to get out, in the same situation in D3, you can run around in circles for 5-20 min till you get sick of running, but the fact is all ur gonna think about is your gonna be losing this char with all the gear on him and there isnt shit you can do about it, because normal walk through you are forced to do in SC before HC, prepares you for none of the bosses in nightmare+.
Sorry if I'm running around for 5-20mins as a wizard (or any class) not able to kill a boss in that time then I deserve to die. You say we should have a opt out but that's not the reason most of us play HC, we are masocists and we like to be punished. That brief moment of sorrow and agony when all hope is lost and that sense of rush you get from knowing it's victory or death is why we play HC.
It's true we don't like to lose our characters but that comes with the mode we've chosen, most people did use S&E and TP'd and even chicken botted. Why?
Iron maiden / Dolls / FE's / FELE's / MSLE's / Tomb Vipers and the other completely random, totally unstable gameplay mechanics these brought to the mix. These things could bring the best "internet toughies" to there knees screaming like little girls while their hearts skipped beat after beat, they were not fun things to deal with for even the most skill & geared HC players.
because normal walk through you are forced to do in SC before HC, prepares you for none of the bosses in nightmare+.
That's part of the FUN! That's part of why people enjoy HC and the higher difficulties in it! because you have to learn new things and understand them to suceed! You could pussy out and playthrough all the way in SC before hitting HC so you know what to expect but then for those like me that ruins the surprise and the experience of HC.
What HC players didn't like in D2 was random near instant/instant bullshit deaths. We are fine with deaths that we can acknowledge as our own faults but most deaths in HC in D2 were because of bullshit mob mechanics that just left us with no chance in hell.
5-20 minutes running around is a chance in heaven compared to random instant D2 deaths and if you can't figure things out in that time then I pray you die until you learn
First off you're asking for an instant out, because you took your toon too far and you're going to die. That's not HC, nor the instant save and exit.
Second, SoR is on like a 4 second cast.
Third, you can exit the game while moving and fighting, on a 10 second timer. If you're that big of a puss, just play with your exit game open the whole time.
Fourth, we have no idea how disconnects from our end are handled by D3, for all we know disconnects mean an instant leave-game server side. Just unplug your shit
Right, right. But do you get what I'm saying in the end, with the example of black souls insta killing you from off screen?
That's what my opinions are based on. I can't see why anyone would possibly want the game to keep you from exiting in situations like that, where you loose your char at random.
If things like that doesn't happen in D3, then a casting time to exit is fine with me. I don't mind the game being hard, but I do mind the game randomly killing you for no apparent reason, as D2 would do in certain places.
Ah yes, I do see what you mean, but for me personally that's not an excuse to have an instant out just because there might be some game mechanics that are screwed up at launch. I'm sure the first wave of people to try and go through inferno HC will have stories forever to tell of some glitched mobs that were 1 shotting them =D It's all part of the fun
Well if you think about it, the best way to go about hardcore is going through it in normal first. Max a character out to 60, then go through with a different class on hardcore so you have a feel on what the boss can actually do to you. But I mean, it is hardcore. Playing that mode in itself is a risky way to go about playing. You have to go through normal once anyways, and I don't think all the bosses will be in a closed space like the skeleton king. Think about it, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jPwHNaMBqFE outside battles like this one with the Siegebreaker have an opened path back where you entered, if you fast forward to 4:25. I don't know if it closes off later on or whatever, but you get the point.
I'm going to be honest. I have saved a few hardcore characters in D2 using save and exit (and for the people that are saying they haven't, well, ok..).
The biggest thing I came to realize with it was you never really needed it. If you play hardcore, you would know that you never should have been in the situation where you needed to quickly leave the game. Most of the times I used it was in Normal out of all places.
One example I can think of was leveling up a Sorc in A2 tombs. Just got fireball and was eager to use it. Ran into a room, got surrounded by undead and beatles, they blocked the door, and I couldn't blast my way out because of the beatles. I was trapped, and out of health potions. Stupid of me.
And of course, in later difficulties.. you probably won't even get the chance to use it. Last character to die of mine was a LF zon. Level 76, too low and undergeared for soloing hell, but I was bored. Made it to hell Tristram before I stupidly ran into two groups of special skeleton archers. Insta gibbed.. Should have been more cautious.
TLDR; Save and exit is just a crutch. Shouldnt have put yourself in the position to use it.
This will force you to choose your battles wisely and thoroughly understand the risks before starting a hard fight. I don't think they will be so hard, though. In Diablo 2, bosses were never that hard unless you weren't ready for them. Almost everyone died on champions with crazy random mods. What's the point of hardcore if you can just press a button and escape? Did it honestly feel cool being level 95 in hardcore when you genuinely need to be good at all to get there?
They removed instant life refill potions spam, no more instant portal, no save & exit, i don't mind fewer safety nets but there should be a possibility to run, Duriel is a great example from Diablo 2, you usually used your merc as meat shield, when he died you started eating potions like mad, if you were a caster you would normally port back to town to res your merc and buy more potions, if that was diablo 3 then a character without a huge amount of life leech/mana regain would die almost for certain after mana/life potions ran out or the damage taken was to rapid for the life over time potions to absorb.
This will just force HC characters to grind lower level acts/difficulties with low risk and low XP until they can safely take a boss, which in result creates a boring game in my opinion.
The current gameplay mechanics works great for softcore but i think there will be a change in hardcore down the line.
They removed instant life refill potions, no more instant portal, no save & exit, i don't mind fewer safety nets but there should be a possibility to run, Duriel is a great example from Diablo 2, you usually used your merc as meat shield, when he died you started eating potions like mad, if you were a caster you would normally port back to town to res your merc and buy more potions, if that was diablo 3 then a character without a huge amount of life leech/mana regain would die almost for certain after mana/life potions ran out or the damage taken was to rapid for the life over time potions to absorb.
This will just force HC characters to grind lower level acts/difficulties with low risk and low XP until they can safely take a boss, which in result creates a boring game in my opinion.
The current gameplay mechanics works great for softcore but i think there will be a change in hardcore down the line.
I don't think so. I'm actually glad Hardcore will be more "hardcore". Separate women from the girls and all that.
Im confused... arent there a save and quit button?
So if your on a boss fight u die or kill him? sounds... fishy.
Correct. I suppose you can run away if things go awry. Unless it's Duriel's Lair type of place Then indeed, it's you or the boss. In hardcore at least. In softcore, you simply respawn, or your teammates resurrect you.
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Save and exit and instant TP weren't features jackass, they were faults. Just like there being no actual currency in D2 was a fault, so players had to make up their own (see SOJs). Arguing that this is being changed in D3 is = to burning a cross is ridiculous. Just because it's what we did before doesn't mean it's healthy for the game or the players.
The fact that you want an easy way out if you're in a tough spot just says to me you need to play softcore. You like the danger but 'oohhh *cring*' I don't want to actually lose!
Also, coming onto the forums for the first time using such a heavy stream of nerdrage words to flame people about playing diablo on HC, on a diablo website, is not the best idea.
i think it is 6 not 5??
OMG it keeps getting shorter and shorter, don't worry guys it will be a town portal when the game is released.:P
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First off you're asking for an instant out, because you took your toon too far and you're going to die. That's not HC, nor the instant save and exit.
Second, SoR is on like a 4 second cast.
Third, you can exit the game while moving and fighting, on a 10 second timer. If you're that big of a puss, just play with your exit game open the whole time.
Fourth, we have no idea how disconnects from our end are handled by D3, for all we know disconnects mean an instant leave-game server side. Just unplug your shit
I find that the cause for the disjoint in opinion is between those who want to say "I play HC" but don't want to live with what makes it hard, and those who want to say "I play HC" and want it to be as hard as possible, to make bragging all the more worth it...
Of course this is an opinion, and this is the internet. I hope to play with you guys once the game comes out
hahahahaha it is really becoming a Town Portal !!!!
Sorry if I'm running around for 5-20mins as a wizard (or any class) not able to kill a boss in that time then I deserve to die. You say we should have a opt out but that's not the reason most of us play HC, we are masocists and we like to be punished. That brief moment of sorrow and agony when all hope is lost and that sense of rush you get from knowing it's victory or death is why we play HC.
It's true we don't like to lose our characters but that comes with the mode we've chosen, most people did use S&E and TP'd and even chicken botted. Why?
Iron maiden / Dolls / FE's / FELE's / MSLE's / Tomb Vipers and the other completely random, totally unstable gameplay mechanics these brought to the mix. These things could bring the best "internet toughies" to there knees screaming like little girls while their hearts skipped beat after beat, they were not fun things to deal with for even the most skill & geared HC players.
Heck SC players hated that shit!
That's part of the FUN! That's part of why people enjoy HC and the higher difficulties in it! because you have to learn new things and understand them to suceed! You could pussy out and playthrough all the way in SC before hitting HC so you know what to expect but then for those like me that ruins the surprise and the experience of HC.
What HC players didn't like in D2 was random near instant/instant bullshit deaths. We are fine with deaths that we can acknowledge as our own faults but most deaths in HC in D2 were because of bullshit mob mechanics that just left us with no chance in hell.
5-20 minutes running around is a chance in heaven compared to random instant D2 deaths and if you can't figure things out in that time then I pray you die until you learn
The new town portal? It's still a 4 second cast. I don't think they will be lowering it.
Ah yes, I do see what you mean, but for me personally that's not an excuse to have an instant out just because there might be some game mechanics that are screwed up at launch. I'm sure the first wave of people to try and go through inferno HC will have stories forever to tell of some glitched mobs that were 1 shotting them =D It's all part of the fun
The biggest thing I came to realize with it was you never really needed it. If you play hardcore, you would know that you never should have been in the situation where you needed to quickly leave the game. Most of the times I used it was in Normal out of all places.
One example I can think of was leveling up a Sorc in A2 tombs. Just got fireball and was eager to use it. Ran into a room, got surrounded by undead and beatles, they blocked the door, and I couldn't blast my way out because of the beatles. I was trapped, and out of health potions. Stupid of me.
And of course, in later difficulties.. you probably won't even get the chance to use it. Last character to die of mine was a LF zon. Level 76, too low and undergeared for soloing hell, but I was bored. Made it to hell Tristram before I stupidly ran into two groups of special skeleton archers. Insta gibbed.. Should have been more cautious.
TLDR; Save and exit is just a crutch. Shouldnt have put yourself in the position to use it.
I didn't do much save&exit during D2, most of my deaths which were not so many in fact was because of lag or some instakill sort of thing.
RIP: Demon Hunter: lvl 50 | Barb: lvl 60 (plvl 5) | Monk: lvl12 & lvl70 (plvl 200)
This will just force HC characters to grind lower level acts/difficulties with low risk and low XP until they can safely take a boss, which in result creates a boring game in my opinion.
The current gameplay mechanics works great for softcore but i think there will be a change in hardcore down the line.
I don't think so. I'm actually glad Hardcore will be more "hardcore". Separate women from the girls and all that.
Correct. I suppose you can run away if things go awry. Unless it's Duriel's Lair type of place Then indeed, it's you or the boss. In hardcore at least. In softcore, you simply respawn, or your teammates resurrect you.