The latest is announcing you can't enchant pre-2.0.1 legendaries because some of them can become overpowered and are actually better than level 70 items. Many of the wallet warriors over there had been hoarding these legendaries for their own use and IMHO a little closer to launch were going to try to sell some of them.
As for the official forums specifically, they are always a cesspool since Blizzard seems to have no interest in getting rid of the malcontents and shit stirrers. Best to just let them all stew in their own bile. Most of them are going to buy RoS anyway.
The latest is announcing you can't enchant pre-2.0.1 legendaries because some of them can become overpowered and are actually better than level 70 items. Many of the wallet warriors over there had been hoarding these legendaries for their own use and IMHO a little closer to launch were going to try to sell some of them.
As for the official forums specifically, they are always a cesspool since Blizzard seems to have no interest in getting rid of the malcontents and shit stirrers. Best to just let them all stew in their own bile. Most of them are going to buy RoS anyway.
i noticed something odd any items obtained before the latest patch day cannot be enchanted, be it a lvl 1 rare or a lvl 70 legendary nothing. wonder if this will apply for the 2.0 live patch also. that any items obtained before it cannot be enchanted at all. its a bit frustrating in the beta right now. as i hoarded a few of the new legendarys, but never enchanted em as i diden't know at that time what i wanted em to be. and now i cant even touch em. i guess its for the better good.
I say a better option is to just have all sub 61 items go up to lvl 60 affixes only, And bring back the cost of forgotten souls for all lvl 55+ legendaries.
but my biggest hope with the change is hopefully to balance CHD. it ain't even a fun stat but its extremly mandotory.
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Thats why you come here and avoid the official forums like the plague
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That's funny you started this thread OP, because just yesterday I was over there seeing if anything cool is going on (first mistake by me), and I defiantly noticed all the 'that's it I'm quitting / how do I get my money back / I want to cancel my pre-order' threads. At first I was really curious, then I remembered it was the battle.net forums.
There are always reasons behind all hate or rage, it's never one sided. It is a process, it doesn't spontaneously appears.
Yes. The reason is that people did not read the disclaimer of the beta. Here it is, copied from the invitation email:
"While we’re inviting you to experience an early look at the development ofReaper of Souls, please keep in mind that the game is still changing and not everything you experience is guaranteed to make it to the final game. We’re still working on the game so you will see some bugs and unfinished bits."
Instead, people just went on to assume that what they had experienced on the PTR would be the final state of RoS and wasted billions on gear on live to be enchanted once RoS hits. And then they rage. There's the reason. It's a mistake based on misunderstanding the word "beta". It appeared spontaneously because it was a pretty unexpected change for some people (I think everyone who thought that Blizzard would allow 2500 DPS Chantodo's and 400 int WHs in RoS was always out of their mind).
Not sure what you mean by "one sided", however, it's a pretty ridiculous discussion anyways because no one's gonna talk about this anymore in 2 months when all 60 gear is replaced. I guess many of these people just want to blow off some steam, but eventually many of them will come back. Just let them rage...
The funny thing is, the professional haters on the official forums have complained so long and so loud about every single detail that they've completely undermined themselves and lost the ability to be taken seriously on anything. Tell me I'm not the only one who reads their posts (when extremely bored) and just sees:
To be fair, a lot of the vitriol comes from the fact that a lot of testers have been saying since the day they stepped into the Beta that enchanting was bugged in this way. They were told, eventually, that it would be fixed and that it was not intended to be that way. Then, a few days ago, blues came back with the information that, no, turns out that was not the case because some level 60 items could be re-rolled much better than the 70 items that are supposed to replace them.
The main points of contention then became:
That's not what you told us
How are we supposed to test things when you don't even know what we're testing?
There are maybe a handful of lvl 60 items that a lvl 70 might try to enchant to use as BiS item, and most of the time people still don't
Why would you make a decision like this based on so little information that isn't even completely accurate?
Okay, but you still have itemization issues to address?
So yeah, a lot of people got really mad and weren't exactly sunshine and daisies about it all, but there's more than one side to every argument, you know? The elitism I've seen from all sides about this is pretty headache inducing, to be honest. Just because you weren't upset by something does not automatically mean you are in the right or that their emotional reaction negates their reason for being upset in the first place.
Full Disclosure: I am not in the beta. I do not post on the official forums outside of bug reports. I do not really subscribe to any one side of this argument, I just read and listened a lot after the explosion happened.
The funny thing is, the professional haters on the official forums have complained so long and so loud about every single detail that they've completely undermined themselves and lost the ability to be taken seriously on anything. Tell me I'm not the only one who reads their posts (when extremely bored) and just sees:
"rabble, rabble, rabble"
lol love that episode...
Sometimes the community managers make comments or posts based on what they currently know about the game. If the decision to change that feature in the game (enchanting lvl 60s) had been recently made by the devs, in a meeting the CMs didn't participate, they probably didn't have updated info to provide. That's usually why they give wrong answers like that.
On argument (3), I saw a crapton of people on the Diablo clan using re-enchanted lvl 60s. Enchanting lvl 60s didn't only provide BiS, it made a lot of lvl 60s, when enchanted, better than 99% of ALL lvl 70 items, because of the changes to how items roll. I was still using my Witching Hour 20-30 hours into the expansion, and saw no reason to switch it, even with massively inflated offensive and defensive stats.
I don't understand number (2) as well.
We know we're testing things like enchanting, Smart Drops, Bounties, Rifts, Crafting, and a lot of people pointed out (I'm pretty sure I wrote that in my own feedback thread there right before taking a break) that hunting lvl 70 items was pointless when you could enchant a mediocre 60 that could carry you all the way to Torment 2-3 (Again, I'm not even talking about BiS necessarily).
I sincerely doubt these people were worried with the ramifications of buying gear on the AH to prepare to RoS, they just want the item hunt to have meaning and be fun.
@w3djyt (apparently the forum software doesn't let me quote numbered lists, so manual c/p):
1) You're probably referring to to this thread here. However, the same restriction applies as to every other bit of information in the RoS beta: it's not final. Everything is subject to change. Just because a blue post said something at some point doesn't mean it can never be changed. If you don't understand this, please never touch any beta anywhere.
2) Everything's up for testing in a beta. Blizzard doesn't need to tell you which parts you should test and which you don't. Of course, there were some things they wanted more feedback on ("focused feedback" threads) and some things that are known as bugs and therefore testing can stop with regard to this. In terms of enchanting level 60 items, Blizzard has more data than any individual of us. They see how many people are still using level 60 items in RoS endgame and made their decision based on this data. Almost every wizard I know was using Witching Hour and a Chantodo's, just FYI. The people who were not using level 60 items were mostly barbarians. It might be a class thingy...
3) Even if it's just one item, it's bad enough. Because that's exactly the point why D3V itemization failed: One item completely dominating and ridiculing "choice" for this item slot. It really doesn't matter how many - actually, if it was 10 items per slot that could've been made viable it wouldn't be as much of a problem, but as a matter of fact there was often only one level 60 item that could be enchanted to negate loot 2.0.
5) Exactly, now Blizzard can use the remaining few weeks to address RoS itemization instead of having to worry about D3V items jeopardizing all they've worked for.
4) I've only seen this point being posted by Mannercookie, and it makes me really upset. Why would anyone even say something like this? This is not an argument at all. What's this inaccurate feedback supposed to look like? Player sends an email to Blizzard: "Hey, I can't find any level 70 items to replace my level 60 gear, please stop legacy enchanting." Blizzard: "There's an email from this guy, let's stop legacy enchanting." Is that what people think? Think again. Blizzard does not blindly follow feedback, no software developer in beta would ever blindly implement a beta tester's request. They have all the data about how many level 60 item were being used, they know which potential undiscovered legendaries could've been superior to these legacy items, and they know if for ALL level 60 items there is always at least ONE level 70 item. Why they know? Not because of inaccurate player feedback, but because they designed the game themselves.
The only elitism in this case is when players quit the discussion by saying that they know more than Blizzard.
Frankly I suspect a lot of it comes down to people having no idea what a beta actually is, and I partly lay the blame for this at the feet of developers as typically these days beta actually means "pretty much the version of the game that is going to ship, we're just using you to stress test so aren't even going to wipe the game" rather than an in development build where literally everything is subject to evaluation and change.
I also saw quite a bit of QQ from the changes to rift keys, which was quite funny.
Coming from whats left of Lotro Ive seen the opposite. The boards there are overrun by fanbois, their CM infracts and bans at the slightest mention of Lotro not being teddy bears and unicorns. I dont really post on the official forums for D3 either although I do browse for info.
I will agree that many over there in fact do not know what the meaning of a BETA is, and the f*ck them I want a refund, Im quitting crowd is over the top.
I saw one poster in the WD forums state hes quitting because 0dog is no longer viable, he went on to say hes 45 years old and makes 10K a week but sounds like hes 10 years old.
Im sure somewhere, someplace there are forums with a nice middle ground.
If you are infact are quitting can I have your stuff??
I think it's about the pot finally boiling over, and it's been a long time coming. I'm afraid many people are just hugely let down by RoS as a whole, especially the (arguably) failed itemization reiteration, and its now starting to show more and more. Lots of little disappointments that are finally blowing over.
From what I can see, even the most hardcore fanboys seem very let down, even the green posters and the like. People are finally figuring out that release is too close for them to fix the glaring flaws still in the game, and that their "it's just beta, it will be fine on release" argument is less and less relevant. I really doubt anyone would really rage so hard and not buy the game because they cant enchant their ring. But then again, there are all kinds of people
Can I ask you why you get that impression? Some green posters (Jaetch, Droth) recently started "feel good" campaigns to change the tone. Just because bugs have been reported it doesn't mean RoS is a failure. In fact, only very few of those I see posting stuff like "loot 2.0 has failed" seem to have played the beta extensively.
The last patch got a lot of things quite right actually and since Friday I feel that we're close to getting RoS in a near-release state. Drop rates are right, balance of skills is right, Torment difficulties are right (I can get by with several wizard builds with my rares-only wizard now), the changes to bounties and rifts make sense, crafting and gambling is kinda where it's supposed to be.
I fail to see any convincing argument by anyone who has reached T6 as to why loot 2.0 itemization has failed.
I only heard about the no more mystic for level 60 items.. is that all?.
As for the official forums specifically, they are always a cesspool since Blizzard seems to have no interest in getting rid of the malcontents and shit stirrers. Best to just let them all stew in their own bile. Most of them are going to buy RoS anyway.
I say a better option is to just have all sub 61 items go up to lvl 60 affixes only, And bring back the cost of forgotten souls for all lvl 55+ legendaries.
but my biggest hope with the change is hopefully to balance CHD. it ain't even a fun stat but its extremly mandotory.
EU Season Achievement Ladder: Season 1 : #773, 7150/7880 | S2 : #742, 5970/8280 | S3 : #1000+, 810/980 | S4 #? 0/? |
Thats why you come here and avoid the official forums like the plague
If you want to arrange it
This world you can change it
If we could somehow make this
Christmas thing last
By helping a neighbor
Or even a stranger
And to know who needs help
You need only just ask
"While we’re inviting you to experience an early look at the development ofReaper of Souls, please keep in mind that the game is still changing and not everything you experience is guaranteed to make it to the final game. We’re still working on the game so you will see some bugs and unfinished bits."
Instead, people just went on to assume that what they had experienced on the PTR would be the final state of RoS and wasted billions on gear on live to be enchanted once RoS hits. And then they rage. There's the reason. It's a mistake based on misunderstanding the word "beta". It appeared spontaneously because it was a pretty unexpected change for some people (I think everyone who thought that Blizzard would allow 2500 DPS Chantodo's and 400 int WHs in RoS was always out of their mind).
Not sure what you mean by "one sided", however, it's a pretty ridiculous discussion anyways because no one's gonna talk about this anymore in 2 months when all 60 gear is replaced. I guess many of these people just want to blow off some steam, but eventually many of them will come back. Just let them rage...
"rabble, rabble, rabble"
To be fair, a lot of the vitriol comes from the fact that a lot of testers have been saying since the day they stepped into the Beta that enchanting was bugged in this way. They were told, eventually, that it would be fixed and that it was not intended to be that way. Then, a few days ago, blues came back with the information that, no, turns out that was not the case because some level 60 items could be re-rolled much better than the 70 items that are supposed to replace them.
The main points of contention then became:
So yeah, a lot of people got really mad and weren't exactly sunshine and daisies about it all, but there's more than one side to every argument, you know? The elitism I've seen from all sides about this is pretty headache inducing, to be honest. Just because you weren't upset by something does not automatically mean you are in the right or that their emotional reaction negates their reason for being upset in the first place.
Full Disclosure: I am not in the beta. I do not post on the official forums outside of bug reports. I do not really subscribe to any one side of this argument, I just read and listened a lot after the explosion happened.
Sometimes the community managers make comments or posts based on what they currently know about the game. If the decision to change that feature in the game (enchanting lvl 60s) had been recently made by the devs, in a meeting the CMs didn't participate, they probably didn't have updated info to provide. That's usually why they give wrong answers like that.
On argument (3), I saw a crapton of people on the Diablo clan using re-enchanted lvl 60s. Enchanting lvl 60s didn't only provide BiS, it made a lot of lvl 60s, when enchanted, better than 99% of ALL lvl 70 items, because of the changes to how items roll. I was still using my Witching Hour 20-30 hours into the expansion, and saw no reason to switch it, even with massively inflated offensive and defensive stats.
I don't understand number (2) as well.
We know we're testing things like enchanting, Smart Drops, Bounties, Rifts, Crafting, and a lot of people pointed out (I'm pretty sure I wrote that in my own feedback thread there right before taking a break) that hunting lvl 70 items was pointless when you could enchant a mediocre 60 that could carry you all the way to Torment 2-3 (Again, I'm not even talking about BiS necessarily).
I sincerely doubt these people were worried with the ramifications of buying gear on the AH to prepare to RoS, they just want the item hunt to have meaning and be fun.
1) You're probably referring to to this thread here. However, the same restriction applies as to every other bit of information in the RoS beta: it's not final. Everything is subject to change. Just because a blue post said something at some point doesn't mean it can never be changed. If you don't understand this, please never touch any beta anywhere.
2) Everything's up for testing in a beta. Blizzard doesn't need to tell you which parts you should test and which you don't. Of course, there were some things they wanted more feedback on ("focused feedback" threads) and some things that are known as bugs and therefore testing can stop with regard to this. In terms of enchanting level 60 items, Blizzard has more data than any individual of us. They see how many people are still using level 60 items in RoS endgame and made their decision based on this data. Almost every wizard I know was using Witching Hour and a Chantodo's, just FYI. The people who were not using level 60 items were mostly barbarians. It might be a class thingy...
3) Even if it's just one item, it's bad enough. Because that's exactly the point why D3V itemization failed: One item completely dominating and ridiculing "choice" for this item slot. It really doesn't matter how many - actually, if it was 10 items per slot that could've been made viable it wouldn't be as much of a problem, but as a matter of fact there was often only one level 60 item that could be enchanted to negate loot 2.0.
5) Exactly, now Blizzard can use the remaining few weeks to address RoS itemization instead of having to worry about D3V items jeopardizing all they've worked for.
4) I've only seen this point being posted by Mannercookie, and it makes me really upset. Why would anyone even say something like this? This is not an argument at all. What's this inaccurate feedback supposed to look like? Player sends an email to Blizzard: "Hey, I can't find any level 70 items to replace my level 60 gear, please stop legacy enchanting." Blizzard: "There's an email from this guy, let's stop legacy enchanting." Is that what people think? Think again. Blizzard does not blindly follow feedback, no software developer in beta would ever blindly implement a beta tester's request. They have all the data about how many level 60 item were being used, they know which potential undiscovered legendaries could've been superior to these legacy items, and they know if for ALL level 60 items there is always at least ONE level 70 item. Why they know? Not because of inaccurate player feedback, but because they designed the game themselves.
The only elitism in this case is when players quit the discussion by saying that they know more than Blizzard.
I also saw quite a bit of QQ from the changes to rift keys, which was quite funny.
I will agree that many over there in fact do not know what the meaning of a BETA is, and the f*ck them I want a refund, Im quitting crowd is over the top.
I saw one poster in the WD forums state hes quitting because 0dog is no longer viable, he went on to say hes 45 years old and makes 10K a week but sounds like hes 10 years old.
Im sure somewhere, someplace there are forums with a nice middle ground.
If you are infact are quitting can I have your stuff??
The last patch got a lot of things quite right actually and since Friday I feel that we're close to getting RoS in a near-release state. Drop rates are right, balance of skills is right, Torment difficulties are right (I can get by with several wizard builds with my rares-only wizard now), the changes to bounties and rifts make sense, crafting and gambling is kinda where it's supposed to be.
I fail to see any convincing argument by anyone who has reached T6 as to why loot 2.0 itemization has failed.