Don't start a new thread on this, please. Just post a reply on your other thread about the exact same topic.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Bashiok - Blizzard Representative - 08/01/2011 -"So how many skill combinations are there now? Well taking into account 6 active skills, all the rune combinations, and 3 passives we currently expect each class to have roughly 2,285,814,795,264 different build combinations."
"Hey, I thought you'd like the witty irony of grub-on-glowie violence!"
Yeah. People never boasted about cheating before YouTube came along, WoW never had a one-button healbot and they never put cheat codes or ads for ROM hacks in magazines either.
Yeah. People never boasted about cheating before YouTube came along, WoW never had a one-button healbot and they never put cheat codes or ads for ROM hacks in magazines either.
/s
This may come as a shock to you, there was online gaming before WoW.
And that stuff in magazines was for single player games.
This may come as a shock to you, there was online gaming before WoW.
And that stuff in magazines was for single player games.
But the tone of your reply is...enlightening.
People just pull cables when they lose back then. Aside from that, they use stuff like muta stacking, an exploit that appears on TV in Korea. It was widely praised. Who needs the internet when you have national television?
Note: I do not condone the Grift exploit, but to speak as if exploits are new, or that they are all evil, is not to understand the competition community.
Edit: Oh, I forgot about the oldest exploit in existence. Combos. If you ever made a combo in a fighting game, you are condoning the legacy of an exploit.
Do you really want to know what happened? What changed? You're probably not going to like it. Still want to know? Okay, here goes:
Cheating in Diablo 3 doesn't affect you. D3 is a coop game and cheating is only frowned upon in competitive games. Yes, I realize that some elements of Seasons are "competitive," but not in such a way that exploiting some XP gain by sitting in town is going to give you an unfair advantage.
Look at any online competitive game and you'll see that cheating is frowned upon and actioned whenever possible. Look at games like Counter-Strike or CoD and you'll see communities that are completely against cheating because it actually has a negative impact on their personal enjoyment of the game. Now let's compare that to Diablo 3.
In Diablo 3, you wouldn't even know that someone is cheating unless you were watching their stream. Wow, that really screws up the game for YOU, doesn't it? ... No, it doesn't.
That's what happened. I said you wouldn't like it.
TL;DR: Nothing has changed. Cheating is still frowned upon and cheaters still hide in the shadows... except on Diablo 3... because it doesn't affect anyone aside from themselves.
The gaming community has grown exponentially since the "Yanking cables" era of competitive gaming. With that comes with people always looking for an advantage whether exploit/cheat or not. Technology has also increased in a way that allows for complex cheat engines that are harder for anti-cheats to see. Advantageous bugs need to be fixed once the exploit starts. Endless cycle when it comes to any kind of gaming.
The "it doesn't affect you" is the lamest copout ever. It also absolutely does affect everyone when nerf after nerf occurs because the cheaters and exploiters abused the hell out of things until they were removed. Yeah yeah, I know...people will claim that most of these things weren't exploits, but they were exploiting the games mechanics. Exploits aren't just abusing bugs like the recent one. It goes all the way back to removing surface Resplendant Chest spawns right up to nefing static spawns and bounties. Every one of those things things affected all players whether they exploited or not. There are dozens of other examples of things that were nice for "normal" players that were removed or nerfed due to people exploiting them non-stop. So "It doesn't affect you" is pure concentrated BS.
The "it doesn't affect you" is the lamest copout ever. It also absolutely does affect everyone when nerf after nerf occurs because the cheaters and exploiters abused the hell out of things until they were removed. Yeah yeah, I know...people will claim that most of these things weren't exploits, but they were exploiting the games mechanics. Exploits aren't just abusing bugs like the recent one. It goes all the way back to removing surface Resplendant Chest spawns right up to nefing static spawns and bounties. Every one of those things things affected all players whether they exploited or not. There are dozens of other examples of things that were nice for "normal" players that were removed or nerfed due to people exploiting them non-stop. So "It doesn't affect you" is pure concentrated BS.
Let me try...
It's simpler than that. Let me make it plain and simple, small words.
YOU don't get to tell me how I feel.
YOU don't get to decide IF it affects my game.
How PETTY is it for YOU to tell me IF it affects the game I bought, or how I feel about it?
If it's a player base issue, clearly there are many many people upset about this and they all bought their games too I bet.
Yeah. People never boasted about cheating before YouTube came along, WoW never had a one-button healbot and they never put cheat codes or ads for ROM hacks in magazines either.
/s
This may come as a shock to you, there was online gaming before WoW.
And that stuff in magazines was for single player games.
But the tone of your reply is...enlightening.
Sorry, I was responding to the content of your post which implied that people's attitudes towards cheats and exploits have become much more relaxed over time by using a few high profile examples to illustrate how common and conspicuous the use of cheats and exploits has been in the past.
I remember a time in gaming where exploiters and cheaters hid in the shadows.
Now they are proud of what they do and THEY feel insulted and attack those who call them on their actions.
WTF happened?
People started supporting bad behavior. It's part of this new gen apathy.
When I was young and they showed on TV, for example, a person crashing their bike into a tree and obviously getting injured, people said "OHHHH, did he get hurt".
Now...it's "LOL what a fking dumbass OMG FAIL".
This detached behavior translates to online gaming. When a major exploit comes along, people say "OMG FKING BLIZZ SUCKS". Instead of the more reasonable approach of calling out those who are purposely ripping the game.
As well; Back in my day, when you played a game vs someone else, they were sitting right there next to you. If they cheated, shit got real.
Isn't laughing at people getting hurt on TV the fundamental premise of AFV? ... or NFL, if I wanted to get snarkier.
All that's changed is that YouTube and Twitch provide a much bigger platform for douchebags to be the douchebags they've always been. This isn't a fundamental change in human nature, just a fundamental change in the visibility of human nature.
All that really matters (in the modern age of online, server-side gaming) is how the authorities respond. I don't really give a crap how many idiot cheaters streamed the exploit, or how many idiot sycophants applauded them... what I care about is how Blizzard responds. I'd prefer banning, but paragon resets will do.
Do you really want to know what happened? What changed? You're probably not going to like it. Still want to know? Okay, here goes:
Cheating in Diablo 3 doesn't affect you. D3 is a coop game and cheating is only frowned upon in competitive games. Yes, I realize that some elements of Seasons are "competitive," but not in such a way that exploiting some XP gain by sitting in town is going to give you an unfair advantage.
Look at any online competitive game and you'll see that cheating is frowned upon and actioned whenever possible. Look at games like Counter-Strike or CoD and you'll see communities that are completely against cheating because it actually has a negative impact on their personal enjoyment of the game. Now let's compare that to Diablo 3.
In Diablo 3, you wouldn't even know that someone is cheating unless you were watching their stream. Wow, that really screws up the game for YOU, doesn't it? ... No, it doesn't.
That's what happened. I said you wouldn't like it.
TL;DR: Nothing has changed. Cheating is still frowned upon and cheaters still hide in the shadows... except on Diablo 3... because it doesn't affect anyone aside from themselves.
I really like this post and everything in it. Bans or resets in diablo type game are just silly to me. I bought the game, I should be able to play it in any way I want and so should everybody else.
Do you really want to know what happened? What changed? You're probably not going to like it. Still want to know? Okay, here goes:
Cheating in Diablo 3 doesn't affect you. D3 is a coop game and cheating is only frowned upon in competitive games. Yes, I realize that some elements of Seasons are "competitive," but not in such a way that exploiting some XP gain by sitting in town is going to give you an unfair advantage.
Look at any online competitive game and you'll see that cheating is frowned upon and actioned whenever possible. Look at games like Counter-Strike or CoD and you'll see communities that are completely against cheating because it actually has a negative impact on their personal enjoyment of the game. Now let's compare that to Diablo 3.
In Diablo 3, you wouldn't even know that someone is cheating unless you were watching their stream. Wow, that really screws up the game for YOU, doesn't it? ... No, it doesn't.
That's what happened. I said you wouldn't like it.
TL;DR: Nothing has changed. Cheating is still frowned upon and cheaters still hide in the shadows... except on Diablo 3... because it doesn't affect anyone aside from themselves.
I really like this post and everything in it. Bans or resets in diablo type game are just silly to me. I bought the game, I should be able to play it in any way I want and so should everybody else.
As was stated above, since D3 was made by MMO devs with MMO features...what others do absolutely does affect everyone, even if they never join a game with another player.
The "it doesn't affect you" is the lamest copout ever. It also absolutely does affect everyone when nerf after nerf occurs because the cheaters and exploiters abused the hell out of things until they were removed. Yeah yeah, I know...people will claim that most of these things weren't exploits, but they were exploiting the games mechanics. Exploits aren't just abusing bugs like the recent one. It goes all the way back to removing surface Resplendant Chest spawns right up to nefing static spawns and bounties. Every one of those things things affected all players whether they exploited or not. There are dozens of other examples of things that were nice for "normal" players that were removed or nerfed due to people exploiting them non-stop. So "It doesn't affect you" is pure concentrated BS.
Let me try...
It's simpler than that. Let me make it plain and simple, small words.
YOU don't get to tell me how I feel.
YOU don't get to decide IF it affects my game.
How PETTY is it for YOU to tell me IF it affects the game I bought, or how I feel about it?
If it's a player base issue, clearly there are many many people upset about this and they all bought their games too I bet.
I just don't understand the issue here. If some people choose to play XP rich areas to advance faster and they want to elevate themselves in the process posting videos and messages on the internet, that's up to them. Some people will respect them, most people will definitely not. So long as they are not causing monetary loss or hardship to anyone else ( inc Blizzard ), it's harmless. Only issue I can see is they have rendered the Season's leaderboard a joke so in that sense, they have compromised the intention of Seasons. However, this is due to Blizzard's poor testing processes and unresponsiveness to user feedback following the PTR. Blizzard's decision not to address certain issues before going-live imply they were not issues.
Lastly, the public are Blizzard's best QA and therefore, they will NOT want to punish anyone for helping to expose bugs. Reseting and banning would be really stupid.
I mean seriously, it's pointed out repeatedly how these thing affect everyone besides just the leaderboards and people keep saying "it doesn't affect you".
Now they are proud of what they do and THEY feel insulted and attack those who call them on their actions.
WTF happened?
Bashiok - Blizzard Representative - 08/01/2011 -"So how many skill combinations are there now? Well taking into account 6 active skills, all the rune combinations, and 3 passives we currently expect each class to have roughly 2,285,814,795,264 different build combinations."
"Hey, I thought you'd like the witty irony of grub-on-glowie violence!"
Besides, this isn't about the latest exploit specifically or the one before that or the one before that. It's about gamers.
/s
And that stuff in magazines was for single player games.
But the tone of your reply is...enlightening.
People just pull cables when they lose back then. Aside from that, they use stuff like muta stacking, an exploit that appears on TV in Korea. It was widely praised. Who needs the internet when you have national television?
Note: I do not condone the Grift exploit, but to speak as if exploits are new, or that they are all evil, is not to understand the competition community.
Edit: Oh, I forgot about the oldest exploit in existence. Combos. If you ever made a combo in a fighting game, you are condoning the legacy of an exploit.
I never said axploits and cheating are new.
Cheating in Diablo 3 doesn't affect you. D3 is a coop game and cheating is only frowned upon in competitive games. Yes, I realize that some elements of Seasons are "competitive," but not in such a way that exploiting some XP gain by sitting in town is going to give you an unfair advantage.
Look at any online competitive game and you'll see that cheating is frowned upon and actioned whenever possible. Look at games like Counter-Strike or CoD and you'll see communities that are completely against cheating because it actually has a negative impact on their personal enjoyment of the game. Now let's compare that to Diablo 3.
In Diablo 3, you wouldn't even know that someone is cheating unless you were watching their stream. Wow, that really screws up the game for YOU, doesn't it? ... No, it doesn't.
That's what happened. I said you wouldn't like it.
TL;DR: Nothing has changed. Cheating is still frowned upon and cheaters still hide in the shadows... except on Diablo 3... because it doesn't affect anyone aside from themselves.
Let me try...
It's simpler than that. Let me make it plain and simple, small words.
YOU don't get to tell me how I feel.
YOU don't get to decide IF it affects my game.
How PETTY is it for YOU to tell me IF it affects the game I bought, or how I feel about it?
If it's a player base issue, clearly there are many many people upset about this and they all bought their games too I bet.
WD Season 8 https://www.diabloprogress.com/hero/finiar-1655/Kildare/84509816
Monk season 7 http://www.diabloprogress.com/hero/finiar-1655/MojoJoJo/42225505
DH season 6 http://www.diabloprogress.com/hero/finiar-1655/DeadShot/75655606
Angry Chicken http://www.diabloprogress.com/hero/finiar-1655/WhoDoVooDoo/68187610
What? Me worry?
I apologize for the inconvenience.
When I was young and they showed on TV, for example, a person crashing their bike into a tree and obviously getting injured, people said "OHHHH, did he get hurt".
Now...it's "LOL what a fking dumbass OMG FAIL".
This detached behavior translates to online gaming. When a major exploit comes along, people say "OMG FKING BLIZZ SUCKS". Instead of the more reasonable approach of calling out those who are purposely ripping the game.
As well; Back in my day, when you played a game vs someone else, they were sitting right there next to you. If they cheated, shit got real.
BurningRope#1322 (US~HC) Request an invite to the official (NA) <dfans> Clan
All that's changed is that YouTube and Twitch provide a much bigger platform for douchebags to be the douchebags they've always been. This isn't a fundamental change in human nature, just a fundamental change in the visibility of human nature.
All that really matters (in the modern age of online, server-side gaming) is how the authorities respond. I don't really give a crap how many idiot cheaters streamed the exploit, or how many idiot sycophants applauded them... what I care about is how Blizzard responds. I'd prefer banning, but paragon resets will do.
I just don't understand the issue here. If some people choose to play XP rich areas to advance faster and they want to elevate themselves in the process posting videos and messages on the internet, that's up to them. Some people will respect them, most people will definitely not. So long as they are not causing monetary loss or hardship to anyone else ( inc Blizzard ), it's harmless. Only issue I can see is they have rendered the Season's leaderboard a joke so in that sense, they have compromised the intention of Seasons. However, this is due to Blizzard's poor testing processes and unresponsiveness to user feedback following the PTR. Blizzard's decision not to address certain issues before going-live imply they were not issues.
Lastly, the public are Blizzard's best QA and therefore, they will NOT want to punish anyone for helping to expose bugs. Reseting and banning would be really stupid.
I mean seriously, it's pointed out repeatedly how these thing affect everyone besides just the leaderboards and people keep saying "it doesn't affect you".