I'll keep it short, I've read through the entire thing and I don't think I found a single flaw. I especially LOVED your theory about NV. Great stuff! I really hope Blizzard will elicit what they need from this post and make the game better for everyone!
5,000,000 for the initial upgrade? I played D3 when it came out, and a little bit more recently, In all that time probably 4-5 months. I only ever had about 750,000 in the bank. With lvling gems and crafting gear I never broke 1 mil. I think 5 mil is a bit high for a solo player that doesn't use the AH.
Gold should not be the deciding factor in whether or no someone can get the best gear. That just encourages botting and lets be real, gold is boring. No one wants to grind so they can pick up 4 million gold. People will grind to find enchantment drops though or ingredients to use on enchantments. And most importantly drops are just as viable for solo as they are for MP, where as gold gain varies drastically for solo to MP/AH, non AH. This would be a great time to add items to the game that you can't AH... jeez broke this game so hard.
Also, "Earn Nephalem valor at 2x the rate" would re-break the game, forcing you to only use that character that had that rare.
This game still has the best combat of all the dungeon crawlers, PoE just knocks the socks of D3 in terms of itemization and build diversity (and frankly economy).
I've read your other post in the past and really enjoyed it. Fully read this one and here's my take on it:
Rarity of Legendaries and Legendaries in General:
-> I think its a great idea to have the sparkle effect for a rarer legendary.
-> However, the Legendaries as they stand right now aren't all that legendary. As this game is all about free sockets, weapon damage, main stat, CC, CD, and IAS because the Developers in their wisdom decided to make everything based off weapon damage, it makes a legendary item get regaled to trash status if it doesn't have these stats on them. Doesn't matter if it deals 1200 as a 2hander for DPS, but if it doesn't have a socket and either CD / IAS / Life Steal on it, it is usually not worth it. Which is why you don't see anyone running around with a Maximus. Coolish effect, but is regaled as trash because of lack of stats.
-> So to truly make legendaries, legendary, they need to do something special that offsets not having the critical hit damage/chance or the IAS or the free socket, etc...
-> As far as special runes for skills goes, I think it could work. I think it would be even more interesting IF you could have both runes active at the same time. Like for your Wind Chill Rune. I think that if you could have that active plus say Hurricane (move as your movement speed) it would make these legendary based skill runes even more potent as you could effectively have two runes active for the same skill. You could build a build around two active runes for the same skill, yah? Or even a legendary that allows you to use two runes of your choice for a given skill (ie Blood Funnel and Hurricane at the same time). This would make legendaries, legendary and offset the loss of either CD, IAS or even CC.
Rewards for the Item Hunt for Legendaries
-> Sounds like a great idea.
-> I would prefer it to be more incremental however for the bonuses, so that EVEN if you only find one of the items in the set, you get something for it. Particularly if the item in question is useless to you and may not even sell on the AH.
Magic Find
-> I think that the magic find per stack is too low. Having it too low per stack means that if a player ever wants to reach the 500% maximum they'd have to play the game either on excessive MP levels and/or play for several hours on end. IF the game's item hunt was ABOVE STELLAR then I could see myself playing for 2-3 hours at a time, but without the item hunt this would be torture.
-> Instead I think it should be:
MP1 = 10% MP2 = 20% MP3 = 30% MP4 = 40% MP5 = 50% MP6 = 60% MP7 = 70% MP8 = 80%
MP9 = 90% MP10 = 100%
-> Why so high? Well I have attempted MP 10 on my Barbarian (about 190k buffed DPS) and it took me about 12 minutes to take down a single pack. Since everything has so much more HP and damage on the higher MP levels, it should reward you with requiring FAR fewer stacks to reach the cap. As it takes over 10 times the time to kill a single pack it should reward you for your effort.
Crafting
-> I think that salvaging items should net more rewards. Considering that a higher quality item will produce the same number of materials as a poorer quality item, doesn't make much sense. (ie A grandfather produces the same mats as a pair of Depth Diggers). I think that to improve salvaging that they should make higher tiered items salvage into more materials.
-> I think that the current crafting system should be FIXED before they go on to add new recipes and the like. The majority of recipes available pre-patches do not provide very good items for the materials invested in them. The newer recipes gives a decent risk vs reward system. The old recipes are high risk low return. I think they should buff up all the older recipes so that a player could be self-found for all their lower levels by crafting their own equipment. As someone who has played Vanilla WoW (haven't touched it for years) I was used to being self-found and crafting my own gear. When I got to Diablo 3 and heard you could craft your own gear I was so happy until I say what the system was like. Salvaging produces far too few materials, the gold cost is excessive for a low-level starting out, and the item produced is too heavily random that it is frustrating. Think of this: A barbarian trying to craft a pair of shoulders and instead of getting STR or VIT, they keep getting INT or DEX, with low rolls on that that makes them not worthy of being sold.
-> I think that crafted legendaries should get a major buff in power to make them comparable to other legendaries OR give them something special.
-> As cool as it would be to get a rare crafting material from a purple guy that is bind on account; is a terrible idea. Do you know that for some uniques, it is next to impossible to get them to spawn? Like take Bashiok. I've run through the entire Oasis over 100 times and never had him spawn (I still have the Rakinishu blade that I want to use on him). This would be a good idea IF and only IF one of the rare uniques that would spawn in an area is guaranteed to spawn in that area for every game. Otherwise this would make things onerously annoying. Having more of the purple uniques spawn in general would make getting the achievement less onerous as well.
-> I agree that making all gemstones be able to drop would be muchly appreciated. I've been playing since launch and have never had more than 5 million gold at a time, and haven't been able to get any good items to drop to sell, so having top tiered gems is impossible for me (I'm not referring to the Marquise... I think that should remain as a gold sink). Making only one type of gem drop in the first three difficulties is a great idea... plus I never really stock up on the lower ones anyways. Like when I see a flawless square something drop these days I don't bother picking it up as it doesn't sell well AND it takes 10,000s of gold to make it into something useful. And as for those that say that I should then play more to get more gold, my response is that I have better things to do with my time these days than play a game that doesn't reward we well for my time. EVEN Dark Souls in all its frustrating moments rewards me better for my time than Diablo 3 does.
I hope that blizzard takes some of your things into consideration, but if they are going to remove MF totally and place all the burden on NV, I would like to see the amount per stack increased heavily... as we currently get 15% MF per stack, and if I now have to kill 15 packs to get the same effect on MP1 I'm not going to play Diablo 3 anymore. You also neglected to mention how much MF you get on MP0? Do you get 0% MF for the stacks?
I like everything I read here. Especially the removal of MF from gear. I hate feeling controlled by that stupid stat that makes no sense at all. Some magical stat that makes finding gear easier. WTF?
But why all this talk of reducing drop rates? Why does the item hunt need to be a grind? I agree the best things need to be rare so that not everyone and their dog has them but why does it have to be so rare? Why can't there be a system that doesn't require 1000 hours of farming and still be fun and rewarding?
Every time I hear talk of reducing drop rates and things being based on luck my heart drops. My favorite part of Diablo II was I wanted a certain item for a build I was working on and I could go to the boss in the act and difficulty that it dropped most off of and kill them for awhile and I would get it. In DIII so far I have spent a month trying to get a legendary ring and can't get it to drop for the life of me.
I would like a system in place that I can choose a path to get certain items that I want and after putting in X amount of work I get the results I want. None of this wasting my time day in day out and have nothing to show for it.
I am hoping this attitude changes now that the AH is gone. I didn't want the GAH to go (definitely wanted the RMAH to go) but I hate how the drops and game play were based around the AH. Be nice if they made the game as if the AH didn't exist but then had the GAH for those who wanted to use it.
Thinking back to it an AH in Diablo II would have been awesome. All the hours spent making new characters to try different builds. Could have made good use of the AH then. Instead of the AH being solely for looking at overpriced inferno rares.
What about this for an idea. Take your Legendary Items and make them have life. When you use them in game play they gain experience as well. Just like you level up, so will your Legendary Items. You then will get a free point to spend to upgrade one of the affixes on your Legendary Item. Not every Legendary Item should have this, in fact it could be a special affix roll. This could save gold in terms of gold sinks with the Mystic to upgrade your stats to their perfect scores. You could also scale them. As a current affix gets closer to the max value, it requires 2 points or 3 points... Thoughts?
We obviously all love this thread and Mr. Monstrosity, but there's no need to necro it and have people go through 10 pages of pretty old posts.
I'm thinking it might be best to lock it (and not cause much confusion to those reading) - and if anyone wants to discuss the ideas presented here in light of the current state of RoS, they're free to quote the original post and do it in a new thread
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Gold should not be the deciding factor in whether or no someone can get the best gear. That just encourages botting and lets be real, gold is boring. No one wants to grind so they can pick up 4 million gold. People will grind to find enchantment drops though or ingredients to use on enchantments. And most importantly drops are just as viable for solo as they are for MP, where as gold gain varies drastically for solo to MP/AH, non AH. This would be a great time to add items to the game that you can't AH... jeez broke this game so hard.
Also, "Earn Nephalem valor at 2x the rate" would re-break the game, forcing you to only use that character that had that rare.
This game still has the best combat of all the dungeon crawlers, PoE just knocks the socks of D3 in terms of itemization and build diversity (and frankly economy).
Rarity of Legendaries and Legendaries in General:
-> I think its a great idea to have the sparkle effect for a rarer legendary.
-> However, the Legendaries as they stand right now aren't all that legendary. As this game is all about free sockets, weapon damage, main stat, CC, CD, and IAS because the Developers in their wisdom decided to make everything based off weapon damage, it makes a legendary item get regaled to trash status if it doesn't have these stats on them. Doesn't matter if it deals 1200 as a 2hander for DPS, but if it doesn't have a socket and either CD / IAS / Life Steal on it, it is usually not worth it. Which is why you don't see anyone running around with a Maximus. Coolish effect, but is regaled as trash because of lack of stats.
-> So to truly make legendaries, legendary, they need to do something special that offsets not having the critical hit damage/chance or the IAS or the free socket, etc...
-> As far as special runes for skills goes, I think it could work. I think it would be even more interesting IF you could have both runes active at the same time. Like for your Wind Chill Rune. I think that if you could have that active plus say Hurricane (move as your movement speed) it would make these legendary based skill runes even more potent as you could effectively have two runes active for the same skill. You could build a build around two active runes for the same skill, yah? Or even a legendary that allows you to use two runes of your choice for a given skill (ie Blood Funnel and Hurricane at the same time). This would make legendaries, legendary and offset the loss of either CD, IAS or even CC.
Rewards for the Item Hunt for Legendaries
-> Sounds like a great idea.
-> I would prefer it to be more incremental however for the bonuses, so that EVEN if you only find one of the items in the set, you get something for it. Particularly if the item in question is useless to you and may not even sell on the AH.
Magic Find
-> I think that the magic find per stack is too low. Having it too low per stack means that if a player ever wants to reach the 500% maximum they'd have to play the game either on excessive MP levels and/or play for several hours on end. IF the game's item hunt was ABOVE STELLAR then I could see myself playing for 2-3 hours at a time, but without the item hunt this would be torture.
-> Instead I think it should be:
MP1 = 10% MP2 = 20% MP3 = 30% MP4 = 40% MP5 = 50% MP6 = 60% MP7 = 70% MP8 = 80%
MP9 = 90% MP10 = 100%
-> Why so high? Well I have attempted MP 10 on my Barbarian (about 190k buffed DPS) and it took me about 12 minutes to take down a single pack. Since everything has so much more HP and damage on the higher MP levels, it should reward you with requiring FAR fewer stacks to reach the cap. As it takes over 10 times the time to kill a single pack it should reward you for your effort.
Crafting
-> I think that salvaging items should net more rewards. Considering that a higher quality item will produce the same number of materials as a poorer quality item, doesn't make much sense. (ie A grandfather produces the same mats as a pair of Depth Diggers). I think that to improve salvaging that they should make higher tiered items salvage into more materials.
-> I think that the current crafting system should be FIXED before they go on to add new recipes and the like. The majority of recipes available pre-patches do not provide very good items for the materials invested in them. The newer recipes gives a decent risk vs reward system. The old recipes are high risk low return. I think they should buff up all the older recipes so that a player could be self-found for all their lower levels by crafting their own equipment. As someone who has played Vanilla WoW (haven't touched it for years) I was used to being self-found and crafting my own gear. When I got to Diablo 3 and heard you could craft your own gear I was so happy until I say what the system was like. Salvaging produces far too few materials, the gold cost is excessive for a low-level starting out, and the item produced is too heavily random that it is frustrating. Think of this: A barbarian trying to craft a pair of shoulders and instead of getting STR or VIT, they keep getting INT or DEX, with low rolls on that that makes them not worthy of being sold.
-> I think that crafted legendaries should get a major buff in power to make them comparable to other legendaries OR give them something special.
-> As cool as it would be to get a rare crafting material from a purple guy that is bind on account; is a terrible idea. Do you know that for some uniques, it is next to impossible to get them to spawn? Like take Bashiok. I've run through the entire Oasis over 100 times and never had him spawn (I still have the Rakinishu blade that I want to use on him). This would be a good idea IF and only IF one of the rare uniques that would spawn in an area is guaranteed to spawn in that area for every game. Otherwise this would make things onerously annoying. Having more of the purple uniques spawn in general would make getting the achievement less onerous as well.
-> I agree that making all gemstones be able to drop would be muchly appreciated. I've been playing since launch and have never had more than 5 million gold at a time, and haven't been able to get any good items to drop to sell, so having top tiered gems is impossible for me (I'm not referring to the Marquise... I think that should remain as a gold sink). Making only one type of gem drop in the first three difficulties is a great idea... plus I never really stock up on the lower ones anyways. Like when I see a flawless square something drop these days I don't bother picking it up as it doesn't sell well AND it takes 10,000s of gold to make it into something useful. And as for those that say that I should then play more to get more gold, my response is that I have better things to do with my time these days than play a game that doesn't reward we well for my time. EVEN Dark Souls in all its frustrating moments rewards me better for my time than Diablo 3 does.
I hope that blizzard takes some of your things into consideration, but if they are going to remove MF totally and place all the burden on NV, I would like to see the amount per stack increased heavily... as we currently get 15% MF per stack, and if I now have to kill 15 packs to get the same effect on MP1 I'm not going to play Diablo 3 anymore. You also neglected to mention how much MF you get on MP0? Do you get 0% MF for the stacks?
I really hope D3 developers have the chance to see this
I totally support this!!!
-Whosthat
They already saw this. And mentioned it several times. For example here: http://us.battle.net/d3/en/blog/10509961/community-commentary-the-potential-of-loot-20-7-25-2013
But why all this talk of reducing drop rates? Why does the item hunt need to be a grind? I agree the best things need to be rare so that not everyone and their dog has them but why does it have to be so rare? Why can't there be a system that doesn't require 1000 hours of farming and still be fun and rewarding?
Every time I hear talk of reducing drop rates and things being based on luck my heart drops. My favorite part of Diablo II was I wanted a certain item for a build I was working on and I could go to the boss in the act and difficulty that it dropped most off of and kill them for awhile and I would get it. In DIII so far I have spent a month trying to get a legendary ring and can't get it to drop for the life of me.
I would like a system in place that I can choose a path to get certain items that I want and after putting in X amount of work I get the results I want. None of this wasting my time day in day out and have nothing to show for it.
I am hoping this attitude changes now that the AH is gone. I didn't want the GAH to go (definitely wanted the RMAH to go) but I hate how the drops and game play were based around the AH. Be nice if they made the game as if the AH didn't exist but then had the GAH for those who wanted to use it.
Thinking back to it an AH in Diablo II would have been awesome. All the hours spent making new characters to try different builds. Could have made good use of the AH then. Instead of the AH being solely for looking at overpriced inferno rares.
We obviously all love this thread and Mr. Monstrosity, but there's no need to necro it and have people go through 10 pages of pretty old posts.
I'm thinking it might be best to lock it (and not cause much confusion to those reading) - and if anyone wants to discuss the ideas presented here in light of the current state of RoS, they're free to quote the original post and do it in a new thread