I dont think DH is broken. However, the fact Blizzard makes everything possible to kill glass cannon builds eventhough it was failure on their part because of how they equiped DHs with defensive skills. The fact that there is not a single skill, active or passive, that help you survive a hit is easy give away that Blizzard themselves wanted DHs to be played as hide-a-kill class. When players develop that idea into perfection by creating glass cannon build & gear totaly focused on killing stuff before it kills you, it is suddenly an issue. They nerfed outgoing damage in later acts to help every class in D3 yet they have not done anything to help DH to survive.
This isn't even close to being true anymore. I have 14k hp and only like 200 resist all, and i can tank multiple spearmen/quillbeast hits in act 3 with ease with gloom. I've paid absolutely no attention to defense at all, and yet i can still tank multiple hits from most ranged mobs with just gloom. A demon hunter that puts some emphasis on defense should be able to waltz through the game tanking most of the content with gloom alone.
So lets go through this again.
I said Blizzard did nothing for DH specifically to survive. The overall nerf of outgoing damage is valid for everyone. DH has still 0 skills helping us survive. I can list few skills from alts I play to make sure you get my point: barbarian shouts + runes boosting the effect or increasing resistances, wizards armors, etc.
Shadow power - Gloom is probably the worst thing that ever happened to DH. It goes directly against the spirit of the class, which should be agile damage dealer. With broken 4P Natalyas set bonus, you can just stand there like a turret. All you need is enough dps to kill the stuff in 20-30 seconds of non-stop glooming. Amazing!
It is also funny you mention glass cannon and tanking in the same sentence. Anyone can take a hit or two with 65% damage reduction. My DH has 47k HP, 280allres (390 physical) and 41k DPS without SS. I could probably take 2 hit from tremor or molok's fireball with SP/Gloom up. Anyway, I was not talking about such situation.
If you have a point, you're not communicating it very well. I still don't understand what you're trying to say. You say we have zero skills to help us survive but then in the next sentence you mention gloom, the very skill that does the job that you claim doesn't exist. And fyi, I was using gloom long before i got 4 piece nats just to deal with damage reflect mobs. It doesn't boost your armor, or your resists, but it gives you 65% damage reduction and more than enough life steal to negate damage reflect and recover lost hp. I don't understand how this doesn't count as a skill that helps us to survive. As to gloom going against "the spirit of the class" ... lol i don't know what to say to that.
nether tentacle was a bugfix you know not a nerf =)
Lol that's a bald-face lie and Blizzard knows it. Nether's projectile speed crawls along at a snail's pace for a reason -- it was meant to hit multiple targets multiple times. They should have just reduced the damage but kept the multi-hit mechanic of the skill, or if they're going to remove the multi-hit then at least speed the projectile up to match the other runes. The way the skill works right now is just absolutely retarded.
so you think being able to cast an ability 10x times for 310% weapon damage with your resource pool was working as intended =) , Dh's need to look around at other classes sometimes and compare percentages =)
The mechanic of the skill was working as intended. The DPS of the skill was FUBAR, and that's blizzard's fault. Explain to me why nether moves so slow (just like ball lightning) if it wasn't meant to hit multiple targets multiple times (just like ball lightning). All Blizzard had to do was nerf the damage. Instead, they removed the multi-hit mechanic (the entire reason for the skill moving so slow in the first place) and broke the skill's intended design. I don't see how what I'm saying is at all difficult to comprehend.
variation between skills ...
So nether does the same damage as basic un-runed elemental arrow but moves half as fast just to be different? Glad we cleared that up.
nether tentacle was a bugfix you know not a nerf =)
Lol that's a bald-face lie and Blizzard knows it. Nether's projectile speed crawls along at a snail's pace for a reason -- it was meant to hit multiple targets multiple times. They should have just reduced the damage but kept the multi-hit mechanic of the skill, or if they're going to remove the multi-hit then at least speed the projectile up to match the other runes. The way the skill works right now is just absolutely retarded.
so you think being able to cast an ability 10x times for 310% weapon damage with your resource pool was working as intended =) , Dh's need to look around at other classes sometimes and compare percentages =)
The mechanic of the skill was working as intended. The DPS of the skill was FUBAR, and that's blizzard's fault. Explain to me why nether moves so slow (just like ball lightning) if it wasn't meant to hit multiple targets multiple times (just like ball lightning). All Blizzard had to do was nerf the damage. Instead, they removed the multi-hit mechanic (the entire reason for the skill moving so slow in the first place) and broke the skill's intended design. I don't see how what I'm saying is at all difficult to comprehend.
variation between skills ...
So nether does the same damage as basic un-runed elemental arrow but moves half as fast just to be different? Glad we cleared that up.
variation how the skill works and looks yes , can't understand how this is hard to understand, you also have a life leech
variation how the skill works and looks yes , can't understand how this is hard to understand, you also have a life leech
Because it's a ridiculous suggestion and I'm kind of shocked you're sticking to your guns on this. They can make demon hunters move at half movespeed too to give the classes "variation" but i don't think that idea will go over very well. If you want variety in the skills, keep it to cosmetics -- nether is already a massive dimensional cloud with tentacles squirming from it -- it has enough variety.
Making the projectile move at half speed is a tangible handicap, one that needs to be made up elsewhere in the skill's mechanic. With ball lightning, this is made up by allowing the skill a massive aoe and the ability to hit multiple targets multiple times. By keeping the slow nether projectile speed yet removing the skill's ability to hit multiple times, they've in effect kept the skill's handicap but removed the mechanic that compensated for this handicap. The fact that you would bring in the .0000000002% lifesteal on nether to buttress your argument tells me you don't really have much of an argument in the first place.
The nerfs to nether and IAS was absolutely needed because any DH could take advantage of them and become godly OP. People were breaking 240k dps without sharpshooter before the nerf, and if you didn't think that was too much then I don't know what to tell you. Even Demon Hunters who were moderately geared could reach insane numbers very very quickly. Even now after the nerf, the average DH is still running around with 40-50k dps, well above the same average for equally geared wizards/witch doctors, and about twice as much as equally geared barbs and monks.
While any DH can take advantage of nether and IAS, the same can't be said about the natalyas set. I'll be the first to admit that the 4 piece bonus is totally out of line. But the difference between this and the IAS/nether nerf is that only a small fraction of the DH population actually has access to the set without totally gimping their dps. Every DH could spam nether to victory. How many DHs have a decent set of 4 piece natalyas? Basically, Blizzard had to balance their options and determine if a small fraction of the population being OP was worth nerfing gear that people had spent gold/rmah money on. Ultimately, they decided that they could deal with a little OP. Once the dust from the nerfs settled, we STILL remain the most OP class in the game. Anyone who complains about us being nerfed "to the ground" doesn't have a clue of what the other classes have to deal with.
People still have insanely high DPS now, but are a very small minority. I am having a tough time breaking 80k pre-SS w/o spending 10-20m on single pcs of armor, or another 100m on a new bow. And that is pure glass canon. pre IAS and Nether Tentacle nerf, i would probably be in the 100k ballpark.
The people with these insane 250k dps are still doing very good, if not even better with money you've been able to farm easily to buy 4pc Natalya. It just hurts the other DH. Now, I am not saying we're weak in any regard, we're one of the best solo'n heroes in the game by far. However, after watching 400k geared 1h+1shield barbs taking on content I would get destroyed on, it can get pretty depressing with 20k+ repair bills.
As far as me? I do welcome being able to play many different style of DH. That is the only thing I appreciate from the "nerf", the fact it forced us to branch out from the cookie cutter. I am still refining my toolkit. I've dropped Spike Trap for RV, and dropped RV for Entangling. I just love Evasive Fire too much right now, but I may drop that for Entangling+Spiked Traps.
The people with these insane 250k dps are still doing very good, if not even better with money you've been able to farm easily to buy 4pc Natalya. It just hurts the other DH. Now, I am not saying we're weak in any regard, we're one of the best solo'n heroes in the game by far. However, after watching 400k geared 1h+1shield barbs taking on content I would get destroyed on, it can get pretty depressing with 20k+ repair bills.
That's just part of human psychology -- we want what we can't have/can't do. My friend's monk is running around with 12k dps. Sure, he can tank stuff all day, he just can't kill a damn thing. It takes him an hour and a half to clear 1, maybe 2 dungeons. In the same amount of time, i can clear stonefront > keep levels 1 through 3 > ghom > battlefields > bridge of korsik > underbridge > siegebreaker. I think we ended up with the better deal.
I m farming Act 3 and Act 4 inferno with group of 3 DH's and I sometimes tank on my monk or DPS on my WD.
We are farming for almost a month and pretty much owning everything. They are very happy with their DH's.
Those who complain are just little crying scrubs who expected that they will be making 200x more damage then other classes forever.
DH's are still OP. Good DH's and any player with brain knows that.
Have a nice day.
Same. Farning in groupe of 2 dh, wiz and monk and all happy about everything.
That's just part of human psychology -- we want what we can't have/can't do. My friend's monk is running around with 12k dps. Sure, he can tank stuff all day, he just can't kill a damn thing.
your friend doing smth wrong.
I got 2 lvl60 heroes on my acc, Dh and monk. I use monk for solo farming, becouse its much easier then with dh. my dh have 64k dps without SS, about 30k hp, 350 allres,, 41% dodge. and 3700 armor. I can survive 1 hit(you don't need to tank as dh) from almost every mob in act3 without using sp\gloom. But it take ages to kill some types of champs becouse of long way kiting. While my monk feels like honeybudger with same gear(i undress my dh) and rape everything on his way. i clear act 3 in 2-2.5 hours as monk
Dh now is just fine, not op and not useless. All you need is to find your playstyle.
Whoa, we have a badass over here. Keep badmouthing me over internet tough boy and see how much I care. 155%wd over line of a melassa moving projectile with small hitbox is bad, Overpenetration with Impale does 250% and it's instant. <stopped reading, I was losing braincells too fast to dare read more>
Okay.... So besides being WRONG you're obviously not capable of understanding simple math.
First, elemental arrow, 10 hatred, 155% weapon damage, full pierce without rune.
Second, impale, 25 hatred, 250% weapon damage, needs run for pierce.
Third, simple math, for the same 25 hatred your impale is doing 250% weapon damage for you get 2.5 elemental arrows equalling 387.5 weapon damage. Elemental arrow gives you more damage for your hatred on a point per point comparison. Elemental arrow has a wider hit column on its pierce than Impale. And if you don't care about the 3% lifesteal from nether tentacle you can still use Lightning bolts for the stun on crit and an attack almost as fast (or just as fast) moving as your impale. And, using elemental arrow, if you run up against reflect damage mobs you can do less damage if you want to by shooting one EA at a time for 155% weapon damage where impale is always the 250% each.
Whoa, we have a badass over here. Keep badmouthing me over internet tough boy and see how much I care. 155%wd over line of a melassa moving projectile with small hitbox is bad, Overpenetration with Impale does 250% and it's instant. <stopped reading, I was losing braincells too fast to dare read more>
Okay.... So besides being WRONG you're obviously not capable of understanding simple math.
First, elemental arrow, 10 hatred, 155% weapon damage, full pierce without rune.
Second, impale, 25 hatred, 250% weapon damage, needs run for pierce.
Third, simple math, for the same 25 hatred your impale is doing 250% weapon damage for you get 2.5 elemental arrows equalling 387.5 weapon damage. Elemental arrow gives you more damage for your hatred on a point per point comparison. Elemental arrow has a wider hit column on its pierce than Impale. And if you don't care about the 3% lifesteal from nether tentacle you can still use Lightning bolts for the stun on crit and an attack almost as fast (or just as fast) moving as your impale. And, using elemental arrow, if you run up against reflect damage mobs you can do less damage if you want to by shooting one EA at a time for 155% weapon damage where impale is always the 250% each.
Your math is also flawed, your not factoring in crit dmg.
I'm wondering how DH are getting such huge damage. My damage is only at 56k in Inferno Act 1, and that's with sharpshooter. And I've got a fairly nice weapon too (above 1k damage, no socket sadly)
Because we stack Crit Hit Damage Increased by **%.
To those saying we were nerfed, yes, we are less OP than we were before. We are still retard mode OP. Sorry you can't just stand in place and shoot non stop. Learn to play your class, and kite.
NT is not a skill you need anymore, there are better skills. Start building to have 40%-%50% to crit WITHOUT SS, and run without it, instead using Cull, and Frozen Arrow, or Caltrops, or both, and watch your damage just skyrocket.
It's all about learning how to build your class, for how you play. I personally love kiting, and shooting things that aren't even on my screen.
Yes 4p Nat's is OP, and that's why I love it, but I'm starting to work on a set that doesn't use it, and doesn't use SS, that is going to do god mode damage.
I guess IRL you also shout in between someone's argument to call them stupid? You must make wonderful conversation partner. Start attacking my arguments instead of me, then I may try to refute yours.
Honestly, this forum really went down to battle.net level lately.
Whoa, we have a badass over here. Keep badmouthing me over internet tough boy and see how much I care. 155%wd over line of a melassa moving projectile with small hitbox is bad, Overpenetration with Impale does 250% and it's instant. <stopped reading, I was losing braincells too fast to dare read more>
Okay.... So besides being WRONG you're obviously not capable of understanding simple math.
First, elemental arrow, 10 hatred, 155% weapon damage, full pierce without rune.
Second, impale, 25 hatred, 250% weapon damage, needs run for pierce.
Third, simple math, for the same 25 hatred your impale is doing 250% weapon damage for you get 2.5 elemental arrows equalling 387.5 weapon damage. Elemental arrow gives you more damage for your hatred on a point per point comparison. Elemental arrow has a wider hit column on its pierce than Impale. And if you don't care about the 3% lifesteal from nether tentacle you can still use Lightning bolts for the stun on crit and an attack almost as fast (or just as fast) moving as your impale. And, using elemental arrow, if you run up against reflect damage mobs you can do less damage if you want to by shooting one EA at a time for 155% weapon damage where impale is always the 250% each.
Your math is also flawed, your not factoring in crit dmg.
/facepalm
And how exactly does that make a difference? Crit damage % will increase the damage of impale(w/penetration) and elemental arrow equally. Remember, he is specifically talking about the impale with the penetration rune to pierce through mobs. So..... yeah.
I guess IRL you also shout in between someone's argument to call them stupid? You must make wonderful conversation partner. Start attacking my arguments instead of me, then I may try to refute yours.
Honestly, this forum really went down to battle.net level lately.
Obviously you can't refute mine. When people like you make posts that are obviously wrong and refuse to listen to anyone else the only way to even have a shot at making you read an entire reply is to insult you, make you angry, and make you want to read it for more insults. It is sad but true. You can attack me with your ad-hominem bullshit all you want. It doesn't change the fact that you are wrong and won't even bother to think critically about what you're trying to state as fact.
Yes, these forums have gone downhill, I agree, because morons won't actually think about what they are crying about before posting.
And IRL, I am actually a wonderful conversationalist. Simply because the people I have around me are intelligent enough to think about what is being talked about before forming an opinion on it.
Nether tentacle was a bit OP, granted, but it is still a 100% necessary skill. Sure, could use multishot at its near useless 20 hatred a shot.... noty. Could use another elemental arrow... but... noty. Nether tentacle still pierces all targets, something that is essential against invulnerable mobs. It also has the life steal on it, which makes it nearly a must have against reflect damage mobs unless you have massively stacked other sources of healing via attacking.
I can't stay that I agree. Currently I run without Nether Tentacles, or any kind of Elemental Arrow and I've been farming act 3 and 4 in Inferno for quite some time. Nether Tentacles is not necessary, even against refect damage. Use smoke screen when you burst, keep kiting, and use a health pot amidst the health globes they drop as they lose HP and you're fine. And Multishot hits harder than Nether Tentacles ever did, and it goes through Invulnerable minions just the same. So I wouldn't say that it's 'required' at all. I also don't stack life on hit, or anything else of that nature either.
Edit - Also the life leech when it only hits once per mob is pretty abysmal at 3%. Sure it heals you, but for very little.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"I'm just getting started. I'm gonna pull the whole thing down. I gonna bring the whole fuckin' diseased, corrupt temple down on your heads. It's gonna be Biblical."
But he did gave you his thoughts, and my are similar. First you 'balance' skill, then you add and leave way, way more gamebreaking set (triple of normal regen of hardest resource to gain in game). You either balance all things around, or let people be OP as they want. Unless you want to discuss how near permanent Gloom DHs are fine, all talk about balance in game is null.
Nether tentacle at this moment deal crappy damage over very narrow lane with next to no life regain due to Inferno scaling. Multishot is nice for trash, but it's close range (not being able to even hit whole length of screen) makes it questionable to use against jailer/mortar/waller/teleport/vortex, not to mention it may be next thing on chopping block, the 50% hatred cost reduction rune is pretty much mandatory if you ever want to use it.
Impale is single target, which make runing anything other than Overpenetration iffy. Single target in this game works only if you face act bosses and perhaps if you finished all minions somehow from champ pack leaving golden mob. Unless you have 100k dps+ unbuffed, you will kite mobs for hours trying to get enough Hatred to kill whole elite packs with it.
Comparing other classes is pointless, I don't care for them. I rerolled from WD when I found I am unable to play in a way that suits me (pet or dot spread build, while not dying whole time to unkiteble enemies due to limited kiting arsenal). If other classes are struggling, why nerf DH and not buff those classes instead? It only leads to the point where every single class is struggling, and then you have blanket nerf on Inferno itself.
We're far from broken, in fact, we may have the best working resource system in game, both hatred AND discipline, THE FUN HAS BEEN DOUBLED. WD struggle on mana (static mana regen on growing mana cost of spells, k...), Barbs are not spending fury, Monk have barely any worthwhile spenders beside Mantra Spam, and Wiz... I guess they work too. But that doesn't offset fact that Nether Tentacle nerf hurt, together with not getting any changes to underused skills (non-bat familiar, sentry, strafe).
I currently run Impale with the Greivous Wounds Glyph for burst when I need to take down targets one at a time (Very useful for elite packs. AOEing down elite packs can be a real pain, but isolating one, and picking it off very quickly with huge damage crits is very effective). Then for AOE I have Multishot with the reduced cost, because it sharpshooter + autocritting an entire room to dead makes me giggle. Then I have Hungering Arrow with Spray of Teeth for even more AOE to help deal with large packs. Then of course, Smoke Screen, Prep, and Clatrops with the damage per second, because you can stack caltrops for massive damage in a choke, and the slow is just good any time when you're kiting. So far with all the builds I've played around with, this one is the best by far.
It's all preference, naturally.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"I'm just getting started. I'm gonna pull the whole thing down. I gonna bring the whole fuckin' diseased, corrupt temple down on your heads. It's gonna be Biblical."
nether tentacle was a bugfix you know not a nerf =)
Lol that's a bald-face lie and Blizzard knows it. Nether's projectile speed crawls along at a snail's pace for a reason -- it was meant to hit multiple targets multiple times. They should have just reduced the damage but kept the multi-hit mechanic of the skill, or if they're going to remove the multi-hit then at least speed the projectile up to match the other runes. The way the skill works right now is just absolutely retarded.
In my opinion, they should have made it cost more instead of nerfing the damage. The problem was that DH's could bomb an entire room with layers of them for only ten hatred. If they'd bumped the cost up to 30-50 hatred, I would have had no complaints. Then you would have to think twice about just spamming it endlessly.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"I'm just getting started. I'm gonna pull the whole thing down. I gonna bring the whole fuckin' diseased, corrupt temple down on your heads. It's gonna be Biblical."
Nether tentacle at this moment deal crappy damage over very narrow lane <stopped reading right there>
You're wrong. It deals amazing damage, 155% weapon damage. It hits everything in a narrow lane, which means its doing 155% weapon damage times however many mobs you get in the lane. If you were intelligent enough to know how to actually use the ability hitting EVERY mob you have aggro on is a non issue. If you are too stupid to use the skill properly, that is no ones fault but your own, but since you are complaining about the "very narrow lane" you obviously don't know what you're doing. As such anything further in your post is probably more utter garbage and wasn't worth reading.
While I agree that he is wrong, I disagree with your method for bringing your opinion to the topic. It doesn't mean that he's dumb, and it doesn't mean that you should post without reading his entire argument. That in turn makes -you- uninformed about anything that he might have brought up, and can quite easily make -you- the fool in the discussion. Read first, think second, post third.
Edit for spelling. Lulz.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"I'm just getting started. I'm gonna pull the whole thing down. I gonna bring the whole fuckin' diseased, corrupt temple down on your heads. It's gonna be Biblical."
- Clay Shelton
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If you have a point, you're not communicating it very well. I still don't understand what you're trying to say. You say we have zero skills to help us survive but then in the next sentence you mention gloom, the very skill that does the job that you claim doesn't exist. And fyi, I was using gloom long before i got 4 piece nats just to deal with damage reflect mobs. It doesn't boost your armor, or your resists, but it gives you 65% damage reduction and more than enough life steal to negate damage reflect and recover lost hp. I don't understand how this doesn't count as a skill that helps us to survive. As to gloom going against "the spirit of the class" ... lol i don't know what to say to that.
So nether does the same damage as basic un-runed elemental arrow but moves half as fast just to be different? Glad we cleared that up.
variation how the skill works and looks yes , can't understand how this is hard to understand, you also have a life leech
Because it's a ridiculous suggestion and I'm kind of shocked you're sticking to your guns on this. They can make demon hunters move at half movespeed too to give the classes "variation" but i don't think that idea will go over very well. If you want variety in the skills, keep it to cosmetics -- nether is already a massive dimensional cloud with tentacles squirming from it -- it has enough variety.
Making the projectile move at half speed is a tangible handicap, one that needs to be made up elsewhere in the skill's mechanic. With ball lightning, this is made up by allowing the skill a massive aoe and the ability to hit multiple targets multiple times. By keeping the slow nether projectile speed yet removing the skill's ability to hit multiple times, they've in effect kept the skill's handicap but removed the mechanic that compensated for this handicap. The fact that you would bring in the .0000000002% lifesteal on nether to buttress your argument tells me you don't really have much of an argument in the first place.
People still have insanely high DPS now, but are a very small minority. I am having a tough time breaking 80k pre-SS w/o spending 10-20m on single pcs of armor, or another 100m on a new bow. And that is pure glass canon. pre IAS and Nether Tentacle nerf, i would probably be in the 100k ballpark.
The people with these insane 250k dps are still doing very good, if not even better with money you've been able to farm easily to buy 4pc Natalya. It just hurts the other DH. Now, I am not saying we're weak in any regard, we're one of the best solo'n heroes in the game by far. However, after watching 400k geared 1h+1shield barbs taking on content I would get destroyed on, it can get pretty depressing with 20k+ repair bills.
As far as me? I do welcome being able to play many different style of DH. That is the only thing I appreciate from the "nerf", the fact it forced us to branch out from the cookie cutter. I am still refining my toolkit. I've dropped Spike Trap for RV, and dropped RV for Entangling. I just love Evasive Fire too much right now, but I may drop that for Entangling+Spiked Traps.
profile: http://us.battle.net/d3/en/profile/vanboon-1499/hero/3962228
http://i.imgur.com/8AfIp.jpg 4/4pc natalyza dps: 73k (w/o ss), dex: 1967, health: 22k, resist: ~150, mf: 90%/261%
That's just part of human psychology -- we want what we can't have/can't do. My friend's monk is running around with 12k dps. Sure, he can tank stuff all day, he just can't kill a damn thing. It takes him an hour and a half to clear 1, maybe 2 dungeons. In the same amount of time, i can clear stonefront > keep levels 1 through 3 > ghom > battlefields > bridge of korsik > underbridge > siegebreaker. I think we ended up with the better deal.
We are farming for almost a month and pretty much owning everything. They are very happy with their DH's.
Those who complain are just little crying scrubs who expected that they will be making 200x more damage then other classes forever.
DH's are still OP. Good DH's and any player with brain knows that.
Have a nice day.
your friend doing smth wrong.
I got 2 lvl60 heroes on my acc, Dh and monk. I use monk for solo farming, becouse its much easier then with dh. my dh have 64k dps without SS, about 30k hp, 350 allres,, 41% dodge. and 3700 armor. I can survive 1 hit(you don't need to tank as dh) from almost every mob in act3 without using sp\gloom. But it take ages to kill some types of champs becouse of long way kiting. While my monk feels like honeybudger with same gear(i undress my dh) and rape everything on his way. i clear act 3 in 2-2.5 hours as monk
Dh now is just fine, not op and not useless. All you need is to find your playstyle.
ps: sry for my English
Okay.... So besides being WRONG you're obviously not capable of understanding simple math.
First, elemental arrow, 10 hatred, 155% weapon damage, full pierce without rune.
Second, impale, 25 hatred, 250% weapon damage, needs run for pierce.
Third, simple math, for the same 25 hatred your impale is doing 250% weapon damage for you get 2.5 elemental arrows equalling 387.5 weapon damage. Elemental arrow gives you more damage for your hatred on a point per point comparison. Elemental arrow has a wider hit column on its pierce than Impale. And if you don't care about the 3% lifesteal from nether tentacle you can still use Lightning bolts for the stun on crit and an attack almost as fast (or just as fast) moving as your impale. And, using elemental arrow, if you run up against reflect damage mobs you can do less damage if you want to by shooting one EA at a time for 155% weapon damage where impale is always the 250% each.
I love my new build. Thanks!
Why your in here bitching doesn't make sense though. Your complaining about complaining. Just keep it to yourself.
I will be trying out the "immortal DH" spec soon, even though I refuse to call it that.
Once I can afford it that is
Your math is also flawed, your not factoring in crit dmg.
/facepalm
Because we stack Crit Hit Damage Increased by **%.
To those saying we were nerfed, yes, we are less OP than we were before. We are still retard mode OP. Sorry you can't just stand in place and shoot non stop. Learn to play your class, and kite.
NT is not a skill you need anymore, there are better skills. Start building to have 40%-%50% to crit WITHOUT SS, and run without it, instead using Cull, and Frozen Arrow, or Caltrops, or both, and watch your damage just skyrocket.
It's all about learning how to build your class, for how you play. I personally love kiting, and shooting things that aren't even on my screen.
Yes 4p Nat's is OP, and that's why I love it, but I'm starting to work on a set that doesn't use it, and doesn't use SS, that is going to do god mode damage.
http://tinyurl.com/NTcalcA
I guess IRL you also shout in between someone's argument to call them stupid? You must make wonderful conversation partner. Start attacking my arguments instead of me, then I may try to refute yours.
Honestly, this forum really went down to battle.net level lately.
And how exactly does that make a difference? Crit damage % will increase the damage of impale(w/penetration) and elemental arrow equally. Remember, he is specifically talking about the impale with the penetration rune to pierce through mobs. So..... yeah.
Obviously you can't refute mine. When people like you make posts that are obviously wrong and refuse to listen to anyone else the only way to even have a shot at making you read an entire reply is to insult you, make you angry, and make you want to read it for more insults. It is sad but true. You can attack me with your ad-hominem bullshit all you want. It doesn't change the fact that you are wrong and won't even bother to think critically about what you're trying to state as fact.
Yes, these forums have gone downhill, I agree, because morons won't actually think about what they are crying about before posting.
And IRL, I am actually a wonderful conversationalist. Simply because the people I have around me are intelligent enough to think about what is being talked about before forming an opinion on it.
I can't stay that I agree. Currently I run without Nether Tentacles, or any kind of Elemental Arrow and I've been farming act 3 and 4 in Inferno for quite some time. Nether Tentacles is not necessary, even against refect damage. Use smoke screen when you burst, keep kiting, and use a health pot amidst the health globes they drop as they lose HP and you're fine. And Multishot hits harder than Nether Tentacles ever did, and it goes through Invulnerable minions just the same. So I wouldn't say that it's 'required' at all. I also don't stack life on hit, or anything else of that nature either.
Edit - Also the life leech when it only hits once per mob is pretty abysmal at 3%. Sure it heals you, but for very little.
- Clay Shelton
I currently run Impale with the Greivous Wounds Glyph for burst when I need to take down targets one at a time (Very useful for elite packs. AOEing down elite packs can be a real pain, but isolating one, and picking it off very quickly with huge damage crits is very effective). Then for AOE I have Multishot with the reduced cost, because it sharpshooter + autocritting an entire room to dead makes me giggle. Then I have Hungering Arrow with Spray of Teeth for even more AOE to help deal with large packs. Then of course, Smoke Screen, Prep, and Clatrops with the damage per second, because you can stack caltrops for massive damage in a choke, and the slow is just good any time when you're kiting. So far with all the builds I've played around with, this one is the best by far.
It's all preference, naturally.
- Clay Shelton
In my opinion, they should have made it cost more instead of nerfing the damage. The problem was that DH's could bomb an entire room with layers of them for only ten hatred. If they'd bumped the cost up to 30-50 hatred, I would have had no complaints. Then you would have to think twice about just spamming it endlessly.
- Clay Shelton
While I agree that he is wrong, I disagree with your method for bringing your opinion to the topic. It doesn't mean that he's dumb, and it doesn't mean that you should post without reading his entire argument. That in turn makes -you- uninformed about anything that he might have brought up, and can quite easily make -you- the fool in the discussion. Read first, think second, post third.
Edit for spelling. Lulz.
- Clay Shelton