I know a lot of people say tanking is not that effective in D3. I have been looking into the idea that having a tank might actually be beneficial if used correctly. IE CC, buffs etc.
Well I have been thinking with this build you can control movement of enemies especially in sticky situtations, on top helping teammates with some nice buffs and being able just overall soak dmg. What do you all think and what might you change.
well considering besides the templars' taunt, there isn't one in the game. The only damage you'll actually soak would be whatever damage the mobs throw at you personally, because they just random target and attack. In reality the only thing you'll be tanking would be your own damage, and while the buffs would better the group, 'tanking' won't.
You could "soak" projectiles to prevent them from getting to your allies, as well as providing model collision obstacles, but tanking in some of the most traditional senses does not exist in D3. Mobs can attack in fairly random patterns, so really getting a solid tank down isn't that big of an option. I've done tanks in hack n' slash rpg's before, like Champions of Norrath, the Baludar's Gate: Dark Alliance games, and the like. Those games had a 'block' button though, where you could prevent or minimize damage done to you, meaning you could actually stop damage from going out without killing yourself in the process. Shadow Knights were my favorite btw, taking a Dark Alliance 2 necro and mixing it with a classic warrior archtype, skeleton pet and ranged disease bolts, while running around with plate <3
I think it's more realistic that "tanking" responsibilities will be divided up between party members. Especially at higher difficulties (I'm assuming/hoping) groups will really need to coordinate their CC in order to manage difficult packs. And even if there was one player/build in a group that focused on CC, I'd imagine the build would be very inefficient DPS-wise. The loss of DPS may not be worth the added CC? Just speculating, of course.
Tanking is a viable strategy in Diablo. I find that people only think of tanking as the MMORPG definition, such as how it works in WoW. This is not how tanking works in a game like Diablo. People who have played League of Legends or a similar MOBA game might know what I mean.
A tank in Diablo is someone who rounds up the monster pack, taking the initial attention and damage, while the rest of the group fires away for a few seconds worry-free. The tank works on preventing the monsters from getting to his teammates as long as he can using slows, stuns, etc., and when he starts to lose them he can use his taunt to get them back to him.
This character would be primarily focused on defense. Selfhealing would be an excellent stat to take. Health, armor, and resistances would take precedence over damage stats, but the nature of Diablo - where almost all abilities do decent damage - allows the tank to still do helpful damage while still keeping the pack under control. Granted, he won't do as much as he would if he were in a damaging role, but it's more than a tank in WoW would do compared to the DPS in his raid.
Don't be so quick to dismiss tanking just because it's not an MMO. I find it to be an interesting change from the MMO tanking I've done so much of.
Tanking is a viable strategy in Diablo. I find that people only think of tanking as the MMORPG definition, such as how it works in WoW. This is not how tanking works in a game like Diablo. People who have played League of Legends or a similar MOBA game might know what I mean.
A tank in Diablo is someone who rounds up the monster pack, taking the initial attention and damage, while the rest of the group fires away for a few seconds worry-free. The tank works on preventing the monsters from getting to his teammates as long as he can using slows, stuns, etc., and when he starts to lose them he can use his taunt to get them back to him.
This character would be primarily focused on defense. Selfhealing would be an excellent stat to take. Health, armor, and resistances would take precedence over damage stats, but the nature of Diablo - where almost all abilities do decent damage - allows the tank to still do helpful damage while still keeping the pack under control. Granted, he won't do as much as he would if he were in a damaging role, but it's more than a tank in WoW would do compared to the DPS in his raid.
Don't be so quick to dismiss tanking just because it's not an MMO. I find it to be an interesting change from the MMO tanking I've done so much of.
Yeah that's why I said tanking in quotes... I def agree it isn't the same as an MMO tank. I just wonder (at hell/inferno) if it will even be possible for a single player to take the focus of all that damage? Especially when there is limited ways to heal yourself or others in D3.
I rolled a tank in WoW, so I'm definitely not hating on the strategy, in fact I love the idea of it. I'm just curious as to whether or not it will actually be viable late game. Do you think that a single taunt on a 15 sec CD is enough? It only buys 3 seconds of focus, so that's 12 seconds where you cannot force enemies to focus on you.
Tanking is a viable strategy in Diablo. I find that people only think of tanking as the MMORPG definition, such as how it works in WoW. This is not how tanking works in a game like Diablo. People who have played League of Legends or a similar MOBA game might know what I mean.
A tank in Diablo is someone who rounds up the monster pack, taking the initial attention and damage, while the rest of the group fires away for a few seconds worry-free. The tank works on preventing the monsters from getting to his teammates as long as he can using slows, stuns, etc., and when he starts to lose them he can use his taunt to get them back to him.
This character would be primarily focused on defense. Selfhealing would be an excellent stat to take. Health, armor, and resistances would take precedence over damage stats, but the nature of Diablo - where almost all abilities do decent damage - allows the tank to still do helpful damage while still keeping the pack under control. Granted, he won't do as much as he would if he were in a damaging role, but it's more than a tank in WoW would do compared to the DPS in his raid.
Don't be so quick to dismiss tanking just because it's not an MMO. I find it to be an interesting change from the MMO tanking I've done so much of.
Yeah that's why I said tanking in quotes... I def agree it isn't the same as an MMO tank. I just wonder (at hell/inferno) if it will even be possible for a single player to take the focus of all that damage? Especially when there is limited ways to heal yourself or others in D3.
I rolled a tank in WoW, so I'm definitely not hating on the strategy, in fact I love the idea of it. I'm just curious as to whether or not it will actually be viable late game. Do you think that a single taunt on a 15 sec CD is enough? It only buys 3 seconds of focus, so that's 12 seconds where you cannot force enemies to focus on you.
In all fairness, your post popped up while I was composing mine, so I didn't read it before I posted.
During the Shout cooldown, you should be using slows, stuns, and other forms of CC to keep the monsters off the squishy party members until you can taunt them back. Depending on how "threat" works in DIII, you may not even need to worry about some monsters since they'll be attacking you anyway. Think of it more as herding than just soaking the damage.
I think it'd be OK for one player to take a tanking role, even in Inferno. The gear check is definitely higher than a normal person, since you'd need much higher defense stats than if you were splitting the damage across four players, but I think it would be worth it for the other three players to be able to focus solely on damage. Three players focusing 100% on damage is better than 4 players focusing 50% on damage and 50% on surviving.
It may take a lot of coordination - and maybe even luck with gear - but the payoff is worth it, I think.
If the targeting AI of the mobs is similar to that of D2 - while you can't effectively control aggro tables (because there's no "threat" mechanic) you can still provide a primary target. D2 mobs typically attacked whatever target they "saw" first for at least a short period of time. If the same holds true a well geared "tank" could potentially soak up a good chunk of damage while allowing teammates to lay the smack down before the baddies wise-up.
There is also somewhat of a taunt mechanic for barbs.. can't think of ones for any other classes atm... but I think that illustrates the point that there can at least be a character that helps focus mob fire to one place (if that's even a good idea).
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Liquid Cooled Intel I7 2700k OC'd to 5.0ghz at a max pull of 1.44v ~ 19-21C Idle ~ 68C max under load.
16GB G Skill Ram ~ 2x Mushkin 120GB SSD's ~ MSI GTX 570 Twin Frozer ~ Asus P8P67 Deluxe
well considering besides the templars' taunt, there isn't one in the game. The only damage you'll actually soak would be whatever damage the mobs throw at you personally, because they just random target and attack. In reality the only thing you'll be tanking would be your own damage, and while the buffs would better the group, 'tanking' won't.
threatening shout, demoralize rune. taunt.
lol, Imagining the Barb shouting, "Nanny nanny boo boo, your mother was a human your father was Nyancat!" whist mooning the mobs.
On the serious side, I think careful mob management(kiting, lining, herding) will be more key for solo play. Fast champion packs probably best kited and handled alone as best as possible.
There is also somewhat of a taunt mechanic for barbs.. can't think of ones for any other classes atm... but I think that illustrates the point that there can at least be a character that helps focus mob fire to one place (if that's even a good idea).
Though it`s not a "taunt", monk`s Inner Sanctuary gets the job done, trapping the monsters with the monk(except for some teleporter monster that REALLy want those dps dead O.o)
Three players focusing 100% on damage is better than 4 players focusing 50% on damage and 50% on surviving.
can't argue with that math!! Yeah I guess we'll see how things play out. I definitely like the idea of having loose 'party roles' for each member of the group. Honestly, one of my favorite things about WoW was knowing that I had a specific role to play in a group. I wouldn't mind seeing some of that bleed into D3.
I agree with many of the statements above. I guess i didnt clarify how the build works. Its all about getting up close and personally initial taking all the incoming dmg from that and getting the mobs into a pack. Then burning earthquake to keep them at that spot. allowing your group to nuke the hell out of them. at that point moving on to the next pack to repeat allowing your team to clean up the first pack and then coming to you again to nuke again. Best i can explain it simplistically is Leap in use CDs for shrugging dmg/CC's move out gather next pack leap in and do it again. Basically "HEY LOOK AT ME" then run to another group "HEY LOOK AT ME"
Personally, I'm stoked to start playing a tank in D3 and I think it will be very viable. Although there isn't a threat table in D3, I think that tank barbs will be able to peel for squishies really well. Here's my build that focuses on that.
Ridiculous amounts of stun and mobility. Rush in with Furious Charge (which seems absolutely ridiculous with Merciless Assault rune), pull mobs in with Ground Stomp, and just keep peeling while spamming Cleave and Revenge whenever possible.
It won't be super TOP dps, but it seems pretty strong while providing a TON of utility.
I don't think you need to go crazy overboard with defensive skills like Ignore Pain or Leap (Iron Impact) because imo to play this build effectively, you'll be using a shield which provides a shit ton of armor.
One thing I'm not particularly sure if I should add or not is Earthquake. It does quite a bit of damage but that 2 min cd is ridiculous when there are so many other spells with amazing utility.
I liked it. mobile, dots, hit em, stun, rend and run... tho lets be honest, in inferno every barb will be using the 15% magic find from demoralizing shout haha...
Well I have been thinking with this build you can control movement of enemies especially in sticky situtations, on top helping teammates with some nice buffs and being able just overall soak dmg. What do you all think and what might you change.
http://us.battle.net/d3/en/calculator/barbarian#akcTRX!cVb!YcZZYa
Tanking is a viable strategy in Diablo. I find that people only think of tanking as the MMORPG definition, such as how it works in WoW. This is not how tanking works in a game like Diablo. People who have played League of Legends or a similar MOBA game might know what I mean.
A tank in Diablo is someone who rounds up the monster pack, taking the initial attention and damage, while the rest of the group fires away for a few seconds worry-free. The tank works on preventing the monsters from getting to his teammates as long as he can using slows, stuns, etc., and when he starts to lose them he can use his taunt to get them back to him.
This character would be primarily focused on defense. Selfhealing would be an excellent stat to take. Health, armor, and resistances would take precedence over damage stats, but the nature of Diablo - where almost all abilities do decent damage - allows the tank to still do helpful damage while still keeping the pack under control. Granted, he won't do as much as he would if he were in a damaging role, but it's more than a tank in WoW would do compared to the DPS in his raid.
Don't be so quick to dismiss tanking just because it's not an MMO. I find it to be an interesting change from the MMO tanking I've done so much of.
Yeah that's why I said tanking in quotes... I def agree it isn't the same as an MMO tank. I just wonder (at hell/inferno) if it will even be possible for a single player to take the focus of all that damage? Especially when there is limited ways to heal yourself or others in D3.
I rolled a tank in WoW, so I'm definitely not hating on the strategy, in fact I love the idea of it. I'm just curious as to whether or not it will actually be viable late game. Do you think that a single taunt on a 15 sec CD is enough? It only buys 3 seconds of focus, so that's 12 seconds where you cannot force enemies to focus on you.
During the Shout cooldown, you should be using slows, stuns, and other forms of CC to keep the monsters off the squishy party members until you can taunt them back. Depending on how "threat" works in DIII, you may not even need to worry about some monsters since they'll be attacking you anyway. Think of it more as herding than just soaking the damage.
I think it'd be OK for one player to take a tanking role, even in Inferno. The gear check is definitely higher than a normal person, since you'd need much higher defense stats than if you were splitting the damage across four players, but I think it would be worth it for the other three players to be able to focus solely on damage. Three players focusing 100% on damage is better than 4 players focusing 50% on damage and 50% on surviving.
It may take a lot of coordination - and maybe even luck with gear - but the payoff is worth it, I think.
There is also somewhat of a taunt mechanic for barbs.. can't think of ones for any other classes atm... but I think that illustrates the point that there can at least be a character that helps focus mob fire to one place (if that's even a good idea).
16GB G Skill Ram ~ 2x Mushkin 120GB SSD's ~ MSI GTX 570 Twin Frozer ~ Asus P8P67 Deluxe
lol, Imagining the Barb shouting, "Nanny nanny boo boo, your mother was a human your father was Nyancat!" whist mooning the mobs.
On the serious side, I think careful mob management(kiting, lining, herding) will be more key for solo play. Fast champion packs probably best kited and handled alone as best as possible.
Though it`s not a "taunt", monk`s Inner Sanctuary gets the job done, trapping the monsters with the monk(except for some teleporter monster that REALLy want those dps dead O.o)
can't argue with that math!! Yeah I guess we'll see how things play out. I definitely like the idea of having loose 'party roles' for each member of the group. Honestly, one of my favorite things about WoW was knowing that I had a specific role to play in a group. I wouldn't mind seeing some of that bleed into D3.
Ridiculous amounts of stun and mobility. Rush in with Furious Charge (which seems absolutely ridiculous with Merciless Assault rune), pull mobs in with Ground Stomp, and just keep peeling while spamming Cleave and Revenge whenever possible.
It won't be super TOP dps, but it seems pretty strong while providing a TON of utility.
I don't think you need to go crazy overboard with defensive skills like Ignore Pain or Leap (Iron Impact) because imo to play this build effectively, you'll be using a shield which provides a shit ton of armor.
One thing I'm not particularly sure if I should add or not is Earthquake. It does quite a bit of damage but that 2 min cd is ridiculous when there are so many other spells with amazing utility.
http://eu.battle.net/d3/en/calculator/barbarian#bcYdgk!bVU!cZZaac
I liked it. mobile, dots, hit em, stun, rend and run... tho lets be honest, in inferno every barb will be using the 15% magic find from demoralizing shout haha...
here's mine. http://eu.battle.net...XSgY!baV!ZYcZbc
edit: here's my dmg build if i dont have to pure tank http://eu.battle.net/d3/en/calculator/barbarian#WeXVij!YWa!cZcaaY