Myr current build is doing quite well in MP8 groups, and very well in MP5 solo farming. Am I the only one who utilizes the lack of AP required for living lightning for a CM build... I feel like theres a reason people don't do it. Lack of damage? Anyway here I am: (also in sig) http://us.battle.net/d3/en/profile/BrakeFailure-1197/hero/2003089
I die about as often as would be expected in MP8, to tough mobs, but it's quite fun and without having to worry about APoC it makes the build much easier. What do you high-end guys think?
Take a look at wizards; basically top 500 rated ones in the world.
There is one signature spell that nearly half of the top wizards use; Shock Pulse. And out of the players that use Shock Pulse, nearly all of them run Living Lightning. The next signature skill, Spectral Blades, comes at a very distant 16% of the players.
Nearly all Hybrid Archon users (half CM build, half Archon build) run Living Lightning. No questions about it.
If you run a variant of SNS or a CM build, you'll do yourself a HUGE favor by getting APoC because Living Lightning works almost like a crappy channeling spell with little range. In addition, it doesn't "tick" more per cast; there are no breakpoints involved, unlike Wicked Wind. If I remember correctly, it only ticks a total of three times per cast, whereas WW can tick upward of 30-40+ per cast depending on the APS.
It's meant as a utility spell to complement builds that don't involve constant spamming. Many people use it as a trigger for Arcane Dynamo in various Blizzard or Arcane Torrent builds, but certainly not spam builds involving Diamond Skin, Frost Nova, Explosive Blast... staples in traditional CM/WW builds.
WW does about 5-10x the damage per cast and procs about 5-10x as much per cast. That's why SNS uses WW over LL.
For reference, LL tics about 4-5x per second and lasts for 2s. For large mobs that ends up being about 5-6 tics per LL. For smaller mobs that's probably more like 3-4 tics per cast. At 2.5 APS WW tics 33 times per cast or 5.5 times per second. Since mobs usually stay frozen in place, you usually get the full benefit of the WW tics as long as mobs are still alive. Also, WW procs SA and CM about 2-2.5x as often as those LoH tics, while LL uses the same damage and SA/CM/LoH tic mechanics.
It's meant as a utility spell to complement builds that don't involve constant spamming. Many people use it as a trigger for Arcane Dynamo in various Blizzard or Arcane Torrent builds, but certainly not spam builds involving Diamond Skin, Frost Nova, Explosive Blast... staples in traditional CM/WW builds.
So then you're saying that I AM one of the few that use it as my main attack to tick CM... Regardless of what it's MEANT for, I seem to have better luck using it that WW.
It's meant as a utility spell to complement builds that don't involve constant spamming. Many people use it as a trigger for Arcane Dynamo in various Blizzard or Arcane Torrent builds, but certainly not spam builds involving Diamond Skin, Frost Nova, Explosive Blast... staples in traditional CM/WW builds.
So then you're saying that I AM one of the few that use it as my main attack to tick CM... Regardless of what it's MEANT for, I seem to have better luck using it that WW.
It means WW ticks more, more LOH returns, more proc of CM, faster generation of APoC....Living Lighting is good for CM archon hybrid build, and WW is good for CM permFreeze wizard, that's it...
Technically speaking, the vast majority of players use LL as a trigger for CM if not via WW. But players use WW for spamming builds, like yours. Even if you just invest in one APoC item, you will see drastic improvements.
Even a 5+ cc Storm Crow will do you wonders. The 8% elemental bonus damage and bonus to elites won't cost you too much DPS compared to your Mempo.
@Jaetch: He doesn't even need to switch to Storm Crow. Just get a wand instead of his axe with similar (or same) stats but APoC. His Triumvirate does already have APoC.
@Brake Failure: If you'd get IAS on rings and that APoC wand (obviously, either the wand or the rings then need to have some LoH) CMWW would increase your kill speed significantly compared to your "CMLL" build.
I'm generally happy to see people who do something "different". But except for WW you're exactly on the typical default CMWW build, and LL simply decreases your "real" DPS significantly. The reason why WW might not work for you is because some of your numbers are a bit off (2.2 APS and 10 APoC are not enough).
I'm sorry Brake Failure, but that is clearly suboptimal. You should get another apoc source, more APS and switch to WW. It'll improve your survivability and killtime significantly. The only reason not to get apoc and aps, is if you dislike the spamming mechanic or if you want higher heroscore on diabloprogress (both are valid reasons btw, imo, but then you should also tweak your build to better suit the high sheet dps archon varieties).
These days, anything works if you want to farm, given the accessability of mid-tier gear. It's great, you can do what you want. But that doesn't mean it's "competitive" if min/maxing the farming is your thing.
I'm sorry Brake Failure, but that is clearly suboptimal. You should get another apoc source, more APS and switch to WW. It'll improve your survivability and killtime significantly. The only reason not to get apoc and aps, is if you dislike the spamming mechanic or if you want higher heroscore on diabloprogress (both are valid reasons btw, imo, but then you should also tweak your build to better suit the high sheet dps archon varieties).
These days, anything works if you want to farm, given the accessability of mid-tier gear. It's great, you can do what you want. But that doesn't mean it's "competitive" if min/maxing the farming is your thing.
I'm not really min/maxing. Im trying to figure out a build that will allow me to solo farm in Archon and group with CM. I should have probably mentioned that.
I'm not really min/maxing. Im trying to figure out a build that will allow me to solo farm in Archon and group with CM. I should have probably mentioned that.
Replace LL with WW. Run generic Archon skills. 10 APoC is more than enough. I used to use WW without any APoC and still had perma-Archon.
You don't have to min/max. You just need the right stats to make a more... usable build. By usable I mean effective.
I'm not really min/maxing. Im trying to figure out a build that will allow me to solo farm in Archon and group with CM. I should have probably mentioned that.
Do you mean a gear set or skill set, or both, when you say build?
It's pretty trivial to switch specs to CMWW for group play and back for solo play, unless you have people jumping in and out of your game mid run. It's more efficient for both to keep a couple items separate for the two builds if that's the case.
For Archon, I just quick swap to a CC SC when my Archon falls off and I need to refresh it. Otherwise I had quite a few different pieces for my SNS build but you can get away with just swapping MH+OH+helm or something like that if you want to reduce the number of gear pieces you swap between each.
For reference it's easier to gear for CMWW and swap to Archon then the other way around. Ultimately it's up to you to decide what you want to do. We're just trying to help you be more efficient with your group build
I stand corrected on the build. I've switched some things around, and can now handle MP7 effectively. I can even handle most elite packs on MP10, albeit not efficiently.
Check out my armory in my signature and let me know what you guys think of the new gear. Idea's for changes are welcome (took most of the given advice already)
*edit* It would be nice to somehow get a little more life, but I think it would come at a DPS loss, which is kinda crappy as mobs stay up for quite a while as it is
I stand corrected on the build. I've switched some things around, and can now handle MP7 effectively. I can even handle most elite packs on MP10, albeit not efficiently.
Check out my armory in my signature and let me know what you guys think of the new gear. Idea's for changes are welcome (took most of the given advice already)
*edit* It would be nice to somehow get a little more life, but I think it would come at a DPS loss, which is kinda crappy as mobs stay up for quite a while as it is
I stand corrected on the build. I've switched some things around, and can now handle MP7 effectively. I can even handle most elite packs on MP10, albeit not efficiently.
Check out my armory in my signature and let me know what you guys think of the new gear. Idea's for changes are welcome (took most of the given advice already)
*edit* It would be nice to somehow get a little more life, but I think it would come at a DPS loss, which is kinda crappy as mobs stay up for quite a while as it is
First I'd drop APoC on the OH and get an OH with extra vit. Extra int is nice too but sometimes you can get one with str/vit and high ave damage for cheaper than high int and lower ave damage but same char sheet dps, if that makes sense.
Second, I highly recommend trying to get IAS on both rings instead of just CC+CD. The problem with the zuni is you'd have to get a trifecta, so that might be out of the question. Otherwise with IAS on one or both rings you could replace your Lacuni and/or Inna's with higher EHP items. If you like the high dps of Inna's at least you could use crafted bracers for higher dps and higher EHP. I happen to prefer BT pants because that+helm takes care of your LoH needs. You're forced to get LoH on the rings which is costing you a lot of extra gold.
You also might be able to swap zuni 2pc for rare ring+IC boots. Since you're using a Chanto MH you're only getting about half the benefit from the poison bonus on zuni boots so high Int IC can beat them out. The hard part is finding a good dps ring to replace the zuni and the 120 int 2pc bonus. You also will lose some AR in the process, but you can make up some of that by getting armor on the IC (something like 250+int, 50+vit, 500+total armor for the ICs).
Regarding your spec, if you're running groups then Bone Chill is great, otherwise I recommend Deep Freeze. With the mob density changes it's very easy to keep up most of the time, even against elites, and is basically BC+Evocation rolled into one. Also, you're losing a TON of effective dps using pinpoint barrier instead of SA, though I'm hoping that's just because you were trying high MP and needed the extra survivability.
Dont understand why you're running Glass Cannon with energy armor. kind of counter productive. Shocking aspect adds about 40-60% true damage. Run SA, drop glass cannon, get more mitigation.
I die about as often as would be expected in MP8, to tough mobs, but it's quite fun and without having to worry about APoC it makes the build much easier. What do you high-end guys think?
That is probably the most unrealistic statement ever.
http://www.diablopro...t_heroscore_500
Take a look at wizards; basically top 500 rated ones in the world.
There is one signature spell that nearly half of the top wizards use; Shock Pulse. And out of the players that use Shock Pulse, nearly all of them run Living Lightning. The next signature skill, Spectral Blades, comes at a very distant 16% of the players.
My profile: note Living Lightning.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hApu2o6uHRM
Note Living Lightning.
Nearly all Hybrid Archon users (half CM build, half Archon build) run Living Lightning. No questions about it.
If you run a variant of SNS or a CM build, you'll do yourself a HUGE favor by getting APoC because Living Lightning works almost like a crappy channeling spell with little range. In addition, it doesn't "tick" more per cast; there are no breakpoints involved, unlike Wicked Wind. If I remember correctly, it only ticks a total of three times per cast, whereas WW can tick upward of 30-40+ per cast depending on the APS.
It's meant as a utility spell to complement builds that don't involve constant spamming. Many people use it as a trigger for Arcane Dynamo in various Blizzard or Arcane Torrent builds, but certainly not spam builds involving Diamond Skin, Frost Nova, Explosive Blast... staples in traditional CM/WW builds.
Edit: corrected some misinformation and typos.
Armory | YouTube | Twitter | Clan Site
For reference, LL tics about 4-5x per second and lasts for 2s. For large mobs that ends up being about 5-6 tics per LL. For smaller mobs that's probably more like 3-4 tics per cast. At 2.5 APS WW tics 33 times per cast or 5.5 times per second. Since mobs usually stay frozen in place, you usually get the full benefit of the WW tics as long as mobs are still alive. Also, WW procs SA and CM about 2-2.5x as often as those LoH tics, while LL uses the same damage and SA/CM/LoH tic mechanics.
Crusader DPS and EHP Spreadsheet, meant for Crusaders
My Wizard
So then you're saying that I AM one of the few that use it as my main attack to tick CM... Regardless of what it's MEANT for, I seem to have better luck using it that WW.
It means WW ticks more, more LOH returns, more proc of CM, faster generation of APoC....Living Lighting is good for CM archon hybrid build, and WW is good for CM permFreeze wizard, that's it...
Even a 5+ cc Storm Crow will do you wonders. The 8% elemental bonus damage and bonus to elites won't cost you too much DPS compared to your Mempo.
Armory | YouTube | Twitter | Clan Site
@Brake Failure: If you'd get IAS on rings and that APoC wand (obviously, either the wand or the rings then need to have some LoH) CMWW would increase your kill speed significantly compared to your "CMLL" build.
I'm generally happy to see people who do something "different". But except for WW you're exactly on the typical default CMWW build, and LL simply decreases your "real" DPS significantly. The reason why WW might not work for you is because some of your numbers are a bit off (2.2 APS and 10 APoC are not enough).
This is just a video of me showing what I can do on MP5 with my current setup.
*edit sorry for the crappy video*
These days, anything works if you want to farm, given the accessability of mid-tier gear. It's great, you can do what you want. But that doesn't mean it's "competitive" if min/maxing the farming is your thing.
http://www.diabloprogress.com/hero/sodomir-2220/
I'm not really min/maxing. Im trying to figure out a build that will allow me to solo farm in Archon and group with CM. I should have probably mentioned that.
Replace LL with WW. Run generic Archon skills. 10 APoC is more than enough. I used to use WW without any APoC and still had perma-Archon.
You don't have to min/max. You just need the right stats to make a more... usable build. By usable I mean effective.
Armory | YouTube | Twitter | Clan Site
Do you mean a gear set or skill set, or both, when you say build?
It's pretty trivial to switch specs to CMWW for group play and back for solo play, unless you have people jumping in and out of your game mid run. It's more efficient for both to keep a couple items separate for the two builds if that's the case.
For Archon, I just quick swap to a CC SC when my Archon falls off and I need to refresh it. Otherwise I had quite a few different pieces for my SNS build but you can get away with just swapping MH+OH+helm or something like that if you want to reduce the number of gear pieces you swap between each.
For reference it's easier to gear for CMWW and swap to Archon then the other way around. Ultimately it's up to you to decide what you want to do. We're just trying to help you be more efficient with your group build
Crusader DPS and EHP Spreadsheet, meant for Crusaders
My Wizard
Check out my armory in my signature and let me know what you guys think of the new gear. Idea's for changes are welcome (took most of the given advice already)
*edit* It would be nice to somehow get a little more life, but I think it would come at a DPS loss, which is kinda crappy as mobs stay up for quite a while as it is
Good call... Switched it up a bit.
Second, I highly recommend trying to get IAS on both rings instead of just CC+CD. The problem with the zuni is you'd have to get a trifecta, so that might be out of the question. Otherwise with IAS on one or both rings you could replace your Lacuni and/or Inna's with higher EHP items. If you like the high dps of Inna's at least you could use crafted bracers for higher dps and higher EHP. I happen to prefer BT pants because that+helm takes care of your LoH needs. You're forced to get LoH on the rings which is costing you a lot of extra gold.
You also might be able to swap zuni 2pc for rare ring+IC boots. Since you're using a Chanto MH you're only getting about half the benefit from the poison bonus on zuni boots so high Int IC can beat them out. The hard part is finding a good dps ring to replace the zuni and the 120 int 2pc bonus. You also will lose some AR in the process, but you can make up some of that by getting armor on the IC (something like 250+int, 50+vit, 500+total armor for the ICs).
Regarding your spec, if you're running groups then Bone Chill is great, otherwise I recommend Deep Freeze. With the mob density changes it's very easy to keep up most of the time, even against elites, and is basically BC+Evocation rolled into one. Also, you're losing a TON of effective dps using pinpoint barrier instead of SA, though I'm hoping that's just because you were trying high MP and needed the extra survivability.
Crusader DPS and EHP Spreadsheet, meant for Crusaders
My Wizard