Story delivery

  • #1
    Threre's enough threads about plot holes and inconsistancies. What I want to talk about is story delivery.

    First of all I think that story is rushed: it seems that too much is happening and the events are poorly linked. Let's take introduction of Adria and the Black Soulstone. We're trying to help those who live in the city and then BOOM! 'I'm Adria, I worked tirelessly for 20 years, let's take Black soulstone and destroy Lords of Hell with it'. There's no lines about 'I don't think it's possible to kill Lesser Evils forever without Soustones', there's no doubt from Tyrael and Leah about Adria plan. But by that time we knew that she was one the leaders of the Coven who left it, also later we learn that she marked Lesser and Prime Evils so that they were sucked into Black Soulstone. Nobody asked why she did it. Also nobody asked something like 'Weren't Diablo, Mephisto and Baal supposed to die when thir soulstones were hattered in Diablo 2 and what was the point of placing their essences into another soulstone again?'

    Imperius is Diablo's Arthas. He appeared in game 4 times. First time he was humiliated ty Tyrael, the second time he was beaten by Diablo, the third time he said to hero 'I will kill you but first I have to wash my socks', the fourth time he was going to beat hero but was defeated by Diablo again. So this charater looks very weak and almost comical.

    Blizzard created great cosmology, gret story of the Eternal Conflict and Sanctuary. But why the hell everyone in the game knows everything? The Book of Cain is the great way to deliver story to players, I get it. But why was it recreated in game? It seems like Sanctuary is not medieval realm but the scientific capital of XXI century world. 200 years ago poeple did now know about Ancient Egipt, Babylon and other civilizations. 600 years ago people had very poor knowledge about the way people lived before them - just look at the paintings of the Bible events.
    In many fantasy stories people know about Stone Age, evlotuion, etc. instead of having myеhs of religiuos beliefs about world and humans creation. There was no such knowldge during the Middle Ages.
    So why did Cain knew everything about very ancient nephalem who were forgotten by the time of Sin War and were remebered only as gods? Why did he knew everything about Sin War although those events were erased from the people memory? Looks like it all is common knowledge in Santuary. What would be more logical is more more sparse information about ancient events which could be added by multiple sources. Enchantress could know something about legendary nephalem, Tyrael could tell about their power and how it was achieved by Uldyssian.
    Also player does not need this information at all until almost an end of the game. It could be delivered in bits and pieces and just before the battle with Diablo angels could tell to doubtful hero: 'You're more powerful then both anges and demons because as nephalem descendant you're nephalem yourself . We can't beat Prime and Lesser Evils united in Diablo but you can'. Before that moment all what hero can do is within boundaries of human powers (Lesser Evils and Primes weakened by imprisonment in soulstones were defeated by humans in Diablo 2, there were no nephalem powers then since Worldstone haven't been destroyed yet), all the information hero needs is about Dark Exile and soulstones e.g. Horadrim information which Cain, Kull and Adria have.

    Also I don't like quest flow. Why do we need to destroy Sin Hearts, why are our quest objectives changing all the time? Diablo 2 had a great approach: hero knew that he had to do something from the beginning of the act. He had to investigate Rogue Monastey, he had to find Tal'Rasha's tomb, he had to kill Diablo, Mephisto and Baal. There were no other main objectives, other characters just told the hero 'By the way, could you please find/kill something on the way to main objective? It could healp us greately'. Thats all. Only act 4 od Diablo 3 feels that way. Act 3 is close too except for quest for Sin Hearts. 'Empowering Baal's army with them'? Really? We could just be sent to deal with army leutenants, that's enough. There's no need in multiple quest objectives, just many make big zones with many mobs, and let us choose what to do - kill Big Bad Boy or help those who in need.

    About atmosphere. There's almost no desperation. The story from hero point of view looks like 'well, we have some problems, people are dying, but I need to push forvard, kill some guys and everything will be allright'. And npcs mimic hero's words patting his back 'yes, you're mighty nephalem, you will do it'.

    Also I have question about Archangels and Tyrael. They did nothing in game (except for that one time when Tyrael met his leutenant) without apparent reason. 'You must defeat Diablo alose I will just stand here'. Really? Also strange Auriel's imprisonment by demon? I though that Archangels are at least as powerful as Lesser Evils and could beat any other demon in combat.
  • #2
    UnfortunatelyI can comment because Im waiting for the people who are actually playing the game to update the Diablo wiki. *hint hint nudge nudge* Come on people!
    Be it through hallowed grounds or lands of sorrow
    All in the Forger's wake is left bereft and fallow
    Is the residuum worth the cost of destruction and maiming;
    Or is the shaping a culling and exercise in taming?
    The road's goal is the dark Origin of Being
    But be wary through what thickets it winds.
    -Excerpt from the Litany of Residuum;
    As Translated by He Who Brings Order
  • #3
    There are a bunch of flaws in your argument:
    1.Adria is lone witch, not from some Coven, Cain trusted her, she was cleary an allie during D1 despite her unknown motivations.
    2. What Deckard Cain know is an billion light years far from common knowlegde. The Horadrim received guidance from Tyreal, someone who watched over Sanctuary from the Sin War's times. Cain know all those stuff because he have many of the Horadrim records and Horadrim knew it.
    In this regard the Horadrim and Cain plays a role similar to our the Chatolic Church in our history. It's institution that survived many ages and gathered record. XII, XIII century scholars knew evetyhing about ancient greece and other older civilisations, because they have records dating the Roman Empire and before.
    3. In that regard Tyreal looks much more like a joke imo. But I will agree with you, Archangel should rival the 7 seven evils and wits and in arms. But they look not only weak but stupid in this game.
    4. Did you play the game on multiplayer ? Because THAT toally destroy the quest flow and the very. It's impossible to know the character and they motivation w/o talking to then and reading their diaries. Imo what you said happens in D3:
    Act I: help and save tyreal
    Act 2: discover where belial is and outthrone him
    Act 3: Win the war against Asmodan
    Act 4: Save the HH

    Imo the biggest flaw in this game is the channels. Blizzard are freaking terrible with in-game scenes because they are horrible with animations. The fact that they don't use motion cap for animation already speaks for itself. The result is that you have to watch a story where the character have 3 or terrible made animations. D3 character almost looks like WoW character or RTS characters. Seriously you can't expect to deliver a story in those channels.

    D1 and D2 made such a good job execly because dev knew they didn't have any channels to deliver the story except CGs, diologs and what is between the lines. In one side they maintained a high quality because they avoided bad in game scenes, however because of that the game is very limited plot wise.
    "In time the hissing of her sanity
    Faded out her voice and soiled her name
    And like marked pages in a diary
    Everything seemed clean that is unstained
    The incoherent talk of ordinary days
    Why would we really need to live?
    Decide what is clear and what's within a haze
    What you should take and what to give" - Opeth
  • #4
    I loved it.
    https://www.youtube.com/channel/UChB2_IPc-HVXbi0jS1Riljg
    ^ YouTube.Com/IceBleuGaming ! It's a thing! Check it oooout!
  • #5
    Quote from italofoca

    There are a bunch of flaws in your argument:
    1.Adria is lone witch, not from some Coven, Cain trusted her, she was cleary an allie during D1 despite her unknown motivations.


    The Templar seems to think Adria was the other coven leader along with Magda. Presumably 20 years ago, she left the coven to just Magda so she could follow Diablo at tristram, and then continued doing his work.

    No I don't like Adria devoling into a two-bit demonic stooge, but them's the breaks.
  • #6
    I thought the story was alright, but some part were really lacking.

    The Tyreal becoming a mortal archangel plotline was really weak and unnecessary IMO. It raises far too many questions. What does it mean for an archangel to be mortal? What happens when he dies; does Justice cease to exist? Will a "replacement" archangel be born from the arch? I think it would have been better for him to have been cast out, and then be restored by the end. While still on the subject, how can he just change his alignment from Justice to Wisdom? That seemed way out of left field and added even more to a confusing plot point.

    I also was disappointed that the idea of heaven being really no better than Hell (in regards to human survival) wasn't elaborated on more. It was just a few scenes of Imperius being aggressive, but no more.

    I really hope that the some of these points are expanded upon and explained in the expansion(s). I'll actually be extremely disappointed if its not.

    Beyond those aspects, I think the story was fine. Nothing shocking, but still as good as I expected.
  • #7
    Don't forget that with both demonic and angelic heritage, Nephalem are stronger than any of them. If Diablo became The Prime Evil by absorbing his brothers - all the divided fragments of Tathamet - Nephalem contain not only that but angelic aspects as well, effectively becoming like the proto-deity that spawned both Anu and Tathamet (his/her light and dark halves), therefore stronger than either.

    Quote from italofoca
    3. In that regard Tyreal looks much more like a joke imo. But I will agree with you, Archangel should rival the 7 seven evils and wits and in arms. But they look not only weak but stupid in this game.


    Well if you talk to him Tyrael mentions having an opportunity to kill Asmodan in the Sin War, so I think he's at least as powerful as a Lesser Evil. And Auriel isn't a fighter, she's the Archangel of Hope, she's more of a mascot :P

    At this point the story is that the Archangels are dispirited and hopeless, kind of natural after an assault by the Lord of Terror. And remember that with all the other Evils contained within him Diablo at this point is more powerful than any one Archangel, possibly than all of them at once - he's essentially recreated Tathamet. All of this is discussed in the in-game lore books of course, it makes sense if you read enough!
  • #8
    In regards to Auriel, we don't really know the circumstances of her capture, only that she was. We don't know how many scores of demons attacked her. We do know from the Wrath video though that she does have some capable combat ability.
  • #9
    Quote from Eid_ot_emit

    In regards to Auriel, we don't really know the circumstances of her capture, only that she was. We don't know how many scores of demons attacked her. We do know from the Wrath video though that she does have some capable combat ability.


    Also, the scales were tipped heavily in Diablo's favor. Remember, at this point he was the Prime Evil with all seven aspects in his body and basically functioning as a resurrection of Tathamet. Ordinarily I don't think he ought to have been able to even set foot in Heaven.

    ;)
    Wizard's Orb, the prime Diablo III fansite!
  • #10
    This post illustrates a problem with the story telling attempts. They have critical background information (if you care about the story) in lore books and side conversations. And there is a gap between everyone who ignores the story, and everyone who somehow manages to find every single relevant book/conversation. This gap is filled with people who, through little to no fault of their own, are missing pieces of the story.
  • #11
    This Kulle story was brought to you by Bro Inc.
  • #12
    I dont agree
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