Wow, people are getting upset over this. Like super upset, to the point where it's obnoxious.
Modding has never been supported for D1 or D2 EVEN THOUGH they were possible. So to expect Blizzard to support mods for D3 is expecting far too much. I'm not for or against mods, use them as you will, but people are starting to confuse D3 with WoW, which it is not. They also stated that the lack of mod support was to ensure someone wasn't using a mod to dupe or spawn items to sell on the RMAH. Getting upset will do no good at this point.
If none of you can grasp that simple thing, I'm not going to waste my fucking time.
I grasp the point perfectly, but you're just wrong. Diablo 3 is NOT an MMO.
MMOs have raids, D3 does not. MMOs have gear progression (in the strict sense), D3 has Legendary items that are essentially unique items from D2. MMOs are completely open and have thousands of people on each realm, D3 is limited to 4 people in a game world and that world is reset. MMOs worlds are not randomized, D3's world is random each time you log on.
I'm not going to get into an argument here, just gonna throw in my 0,02$.
Modding can be a great thing being limited only by the users creativity and dedication, just take a look at Half-Life. There are countless great mods there and even one Half-Life mod became one of the biggest games in PC history (Counter-Strike). Even with a simple map creator, Wc3 has spawned another game, Dota, which is also one of the most played PC games which has also led to Dota clones that is starting to become it's own genre. Hell, you could even argue that the skill-rune system in D3 was inspired by the Dota item "Aghanims Scepter".
I can only imagine what the Diablo 3 community could do with a simple map creator like the one in Wc3.
However, I do see how mod support could make Diablo 3 more vulnerable to hacks, dupes and what not.. Not to mention the implications that the RMAH puts on the whole issue.
I think it's worth pointing out that opening the WoW UI and exposing all that data for customization was one of, if not the biggest challenges we've endured, and for better or worse, changed the direction and development of World of Warcraft forever. There's a reason most MMO's don't dare do the same, and instead choose to take some of the more popular mod concepts and attempt to offer them as built-in solutions. I think it's unfortunate a lot of them take flak for it, but the reality is that opening your UI up like we did isn't just a convenience feature, it completely changes the expectations and direction of the game design itself. We overcame and ultimately were able to embrace it, but you can't blame a game that doesn't want data presentation and customization to drive its development. I think that holds true for Diablo III as well. We've spent a lot of time on designing a clean and simple interface, and we like the fact that you're limited by the data you're presented. In some ways it makes the game more challenging.
What I find endlessly amusing is how often a game "mod" and a UI "mod/add-on" are used as interchangable terms.
They are not the same. They are not even close to the same. Not everyone here confuses the two, but some do, and all over the forums people use the term 'mod' very loosely.
examples:
Starcraft 1: supports game mod's. You can create custom maps, scripted events and entire campaigns. You could not however modify the UI with the official tools.(for this sake of this example, i'm sticking to officially released tools.)
World of Warcraft: Supports UI mod's. You can modify the game's user interface in subtle ways, or drastic overhauls. The way the games data is presented to you can be customized to your hearts content. You can not however, "mod" world of warcraft in any way. You can't change the rules of the game, add content, items, maps, or anything that would deliver additional content to the game.
Starcraft 2: Supports everything you or I could think of, and then some. You can modify the UI, you can modify the game, you can use the game engine to create a 100% new game with its own rules, units, user interface, or anything else.
Diablo 1, 2, and 3: nothing. You can play the game as blizzard intended, no mods of any type are supported, or allowed by the EULA.
What the gaming community does outside of these preset rules is another story, usually it goes against the terms of service and license agreement and is potentially outright illegal. Yes people do it, yes they enjoy it, and more power to them, until Blizzards lawyers decide its worth their time to shut you down. And in Diablo 3 with real money transactions on the auction house, you can bet your ass they will shut down anyone running a private server, or hacking the game to dupe items and potentially ruin the economy.
I don't understand how Blizzard fails to understand why fan perception is mostly negative on this... yes D2 modding was not supported but it was still legal... Modding Diablo 3 will require an emulated player run server, which is against Blizzard ToS and illegal..
Is Blizzard that ignorant on it's own policies? "Not supported" is very different than prohibiting modding entirly.
What I find endlessly amusing is how often a game "mod" and a UI "mod/add-on" are used as interchangable terms.
They are not the same. They are not even close to the same. Not everyone here confuses the two, but some do, and all over the forums people use the term 'mod' very loosely.
Mod-i-fy
1. Make partial or minor changes to (something), typically so as to improve it or to make it less extreme.
As far as I'm concerned a UI alteration is still a mod.
Mods
I still don't understand why Blizzard couldn't include an offline single player mode. I know they wanted single player people to have an easy transition to multiplayer, to be able to use their single player character in multiplayer, but I don't know if this will help much in getting more people to play multiplayer. I don't think the tradeoff is worth it. I think mods could eventually be developed where you install the game in a separate place and install some files that modify stuff. The problem with that is it cuts off the server from the situation. If Blizzard ever found out you were using a mod, they could ban your account and you lose all the years you put into your characters. I don't think I will ever use a mod with Diablo 3 because of this.
UI addons
I think the problem with UI addons was that it made the game easier to play. You had more information about your character and the world, so you could make better decisions than someone who didn't. This forced Blizzard to tune boss difficulty around people using all the tools available including advanced UI addons. Then some UI addons became "essential" to beat bosses, which Blizzard did not like. They have always said they wanted UI addons to be optional, but it didn't work because guilds forced people to use addons. I don't think Blizzard will do UI addons in their future MMOs.
Modding anything is Legal lol. Its Illegal when you make money off of it. Blizzard has the exact same stance vs mods for Diablo as always. You may still be able to mod a single player game, if they make it like in SC2. Where you can log offline after you log in your first time. Doing this also disables achievements.
I mean Hellfire was one of the biggest mods in Diablo 1 history XD. Nor was it supported at all by Blizzard. They will only ban your account for modding if they ever see it in an online game. SC2 had the feature to create single player games if you went under the single player tab and hit go offline.
Other than that, its prob not supported as they will prob ban you.
Basically they don't support it, and you could probably be banned for it. If they don't allow singleplayer games as in SC2 then they downright are against mods.
TBH they are trying to make Diablo 3 a game that will last 10 years without mods. So I personally care for them naught.
Anyways the biggest reason why they would not allow mods in any fashion is due to the real money ah. After using Auctioneer and other very similar mods on World of Warcraft that would pretty much screw people who do not use such mods for the ah/rmah. Also for all of those who want benign mods... it would be a slippery slope when they allow some but not all mods. So they just outright do not allow mods so that there will never be an argument over what is ok and what is not.
It is very disappointing that those who do like to be creative will not have a chance in this game but as player it is a reasonable to keep the field the same for all users.
Seriously man, welcome to DFans and all that, but get with the program. The main point here are game content mods (or just 'mods'), not UI mods. I don't think anyone really wants UI mods in D3.
Most people don't differentiate between the two because they are both mods. If it modifies the game in any respect, it's a mod. Stop being so pedantic about it. There's really no basis behind your argument other than your personal opinion.
I think this whole thing is kinda cute. Group A doesn't like action X so instead of just not doing action X, they want to ban it completely and prevent Group B from doing action X as well.
People think too highly of themselves that they wish to push their opinions on others, when the actions wouldn't affect them in the first place.
Like I said, it's cute, because Group A is against something that isn't even going to affect them. (That action is modding, by the way.)
I think this whole thing is kinda cute. Group A doesn't like action X so instead of just not doing action X, they want to ban it completely and prevent Group B from doing action X as well.
People think too highly of themselves that they wish to push their opinions on others, when the actions wouldn't affect them in the first place.
Like I said, it's cute, because Group A is against something that isn't even going to affect them. (That action is modding, by the way.)
Thats cute....except you forgot that Group #1 only cares about the opinions of other numbers Group #1 does not even recognize any letters. Group #1 does not like X, Group #1 does not care what group B wants, thus X wont happen.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
One is never hurt by being given additional choices, only by taking them away. A QUADRILLION MAGIC FIND is worthless if you can't kill shit!
I find a reasonable opinion to have here is: Everybody that buys the game can do with it whatever the hell he want's (as long as he doesn't deny blizzard any money, assuming there is no monthly fee). And of course no other people are harmed.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"Traitors! Even in death, the armies of Khanduras will still obey their king!"
I think this whole thing is kinda cute. Group A doesn't like action X so instead of just not doing action X, they want to ban it completely and prevent Group B from doing action X as well.
People think too highly of themselves that they wish to push their opinions on others, when the actions wouldn't affect them in the first place.
Like I said, it's cute, because Group A is against something that isn't even going to affect them. (That action is modding, by the way.)
Thats cute....except you forgot that Group #1 only cares about the opinions of other numbers Group #1 does not even recognize any letters. Group #1 does not like X, Group #1 does not care what group B wants, thus X wont happen.
To clarify (As I don't think you understood what I said), Group A could be the people wanting to get rid of all mods, wanting to get rid of all smoking, wanting to get rid of all meat, wanting to do something that will affect everyone instead of not playing the mods, smoking, or eating meat respectively. Group B is the group that would be affected by Group 1. And Action X is either the mods, the smoking, the eating of meat, whatever.
Hope that clarified.
It's not just Diablo that this mindset is found, it's actually all across the nation and world.
Edit: Dolamiin is a good example of this. Instead of playing the way he wants to play and letting others play the way they want to play, he instead wants to ban the way he doesn't want to play, affecting others in a negative fashion while not affecting him in the least. (Because he wouldn't of played the mods regardless of whether they were allowed or not.)
Modding has never been supported for D1 or D2 EVEN THOUGH they were possible. So to expect Blizzard to support mods for D3 is expecting far too much. I'm not for or against mods, use them as you will, but people are starting to confuse D3 with WoW, which it is not. They also stated that the lack of mod support was to ensure someone wasn't using a mod to dupe or spawn items to sell on the RMAH. Getting upset will do no good at this point.
MMOs have raids, D3 does not. MMOs have gear progression (in the strict sense), D3 has Legendary items that are essentially unique items from D2. MMOs are completely open and have thousands of people on each realm, D3 is limited to 4 people in a game world and that world is reset. MMOs worlds are not randomized, D3's world is random each time you log on.
Modding can be a great thing being limited only by the users creativity and dedication, just take a look at Half-Life. There are countless great mods there and even one Half-Life mod became one of the biggest games in PC history (Counter-Strike). Even with a simple map creator, Wc3 has spawned another game, Dota, which is also one of the most played PC games which has also led to Dota clones that is starting to become it's own genre. Hell, you could even argue that the skill-rune system in D3 was inspired by the Dota item "Aghanims Scepter".
I can only imagine what the Diablo 3 community could do with a simple map creator like the one in Wc3.
However, I do see how mod support could make Diablo 3 more vulnerable to hacks, dupes and what not.. Not to mention the implications that the RMAH puts on the whole issue.
Official Blizzard Quote:
I think it's worth pointing out that opening the WoW UI and exposing all that data for customization was one of, if not the biggest challenges we've endured, and for better or worse, changed the direction and development of World of Warcraft forever. There's a reason most MMO's don't dare do the same, and instead choose to take some of the more popular mod concepts and attempt to offer them as built-in solutions. I think it's unfortunate a lot of them take flak for it, but the reality is that opening your UI up like we did isn't just a convenience feature, it completely changes the expectations and direction of the game design itself. We overcame and ultimately were able to embrace it, but you can't blame a game that doesn't want data presentation and customization to drive its development. I think that holds true for Diablo III as well. We've spent a lot of time on designing a clean and simple interface, and we like the fact that you're limited by the data you're presented. In some ways it makes the game more challenging.
They are not the same. They are not even close to the same. Not everyone here confuses the two, but some do, and all over the forums people use the term 'mod' very loosely.
examples:
Starcraft 1: supports game mod's. You can create custom maps, scripted events and entire campaigns. You could not however modify the UI with the official tools.(for this sake of this example, i'm sticking to officially released tools.)
World of Warcraft: Supports UI mod's. You can modify the game's user interface in subtle ways, or drastic overhauls. The way the games data is presented to you can be customized to your hearts content. You can not however, "mod" world of warcraft in any way. You can't change the rules of the game, add content, items, maps, or anything that would deliver additional content to the game.
Starcraft 2: Supports everything you or I could think of, and then some. You can modify the UI, you can modify the game, you can use the game engine to create a 100% new game with its own rules, units, user interface, or anything else.
Diablo 1, 2, and 3: nothing. You can play the game as blizzard intended, no mods of any type are supported, or allowed by the EULA.
What the gaming community does outside of these preset rules is another story, usually it goes against the terms of service and license agreement and is potentially outright illegal. Yes people do it, yes they enjoy it, and more power to them, until Blizzards lawyers decide its worth their time to shut you down. And in Diablo 3 with real money transactions on the auction house, you can bet your ass they will shut down anyone running a private server, or hacking the game to dupe items and potentially ruin the economy.
Is Blizzard that ignorant on it's own policies? "Not supported" is very different than prohibiting modding entirly.
Mod-i-fy
1. Make partial or minor changes to (something), typically so as to improve it or to make it less extreme.
As far as I'm concerned a UI alteration is still a mod.
I still don't understand why Blizzard couldn't include an offline single player mode. I know they wanted single player people to have an easy transition to multiplayer, to be able to use their single player character in multiplayer, but I don't know if this will help much in getting more people to play multiplayer. I don't think the tradeoff is worth it. I think mods could eventually be developed where you install the game in a separate place and install some files that modify stuff. The problem with that is it cuts off the server from the situation. If Blizzard ever found out you were using a mod, they could ban your account and you lose all the years you put into your characters. I don't think I will ever use a mod with Diablo 3 because of this.
UI addons
I think the problem with UI addons was that it made the game easier to play. You had more information about your character and the world, so you could make better decisions than someone who didn't. This forced Blizzard to tune boss difficulty around people using all the tools available including advanced UI addons. Then some UI addons became "essential" to beat bosses, which Blizzard did not like. They have always said they wanted UI addons to be optional, but it didn't work because guilds forced people to use addons. I don't think Blizzard will do UI addons in their future MMOs.
I mean Hellfire was one of the biggest mods in Diablo 1 history XD. Nor was it supported at all by Blizzard. They will only ban your account for modding if they ever see it in an online game. SC2 had the feature to create single player games if you went under the single player tab and hit go offline.
Other than that, its prob not supported as they will prob ban you.
Basically they don't support it, and you could probably be banned for it. If they don't allow singleplayer games as in SC2 then they downright are against mods.
TBH they are trying to make Diablo 3 a game that will last 10 years without mods. So I personally care for them naught.
Be my Buddy =^.^=
Anyways the biggest reason why they would not allow mods in any fashion is due to the real money ah. After using Auctioneer and other very similar mods on World of Warcraft that would pretty much screw people who do not use such mods for the ah/rmah. Also for all of those who want benign mods... it would be a slippery slope when they allow some but not all mods. So they just outright do not allow mods so that there will never be an argument over what is ok and what is not.
It is very disappointing that those who do like to be creative will not have a chance in this game but as player it is a reasonable to keep the field the same for all users.
Most people don't differentiate between the two because they are both mods. If it modifies the game in any respect, it's a mod. Stop being so pedantic about it. There's really no basis behind your argument other than your personal opinion.
People think too highly of themselves that they wish to push their opinions on others, when the actions wouldn't affect them in the first place.
Like I said, it's cute, because Group A is against something that isn't even going to affect them. (That action is modding, by the way.)
A QUADRILLION MAGIC FIND is worthless if you can't kill shit!
Oh well, it's a good topic.
END THIS GOD DAMN THREAD AND ALL LIKE IT.
CAPS UNFORTUNATE, BUT REQUIRED.
-Thomas Jefferson
To clarify (As I don't think you understood what I said), Group A could be the people wanting to get rid of all mods, wanting to get rid of all smoking, wanting to get rid of all meat, wanting to do something that will affect everyone instead of not playing the mods, smoking, or eating meat respectively. Group B is the group that would be affected by Group 1. And Action X is either the mods, the smoking, the eating of meat, whatever.
Hope that clarified.
It's not just Diablo that this mindset is found, it's actually all across the nation and world.
Edit: Dolamiin is a good example of this. Instead of playing the way he wants to play and letting others play the way they want to play, he instead wants to ban the way he doesn't want to play, affecting others in a negative fashion while not affecting him in the least. (Because he wouldn't of played the mods regardless of whether they were allowed or not.)
Thankyou Dolamiin for being an excellent example.
It is already quite too late regardless.
A QUADRILLION MAGIC FIND is worthless if you can't kill shit!