This game is NOT AH dependent. That is a fallacy. That is a steaming pile of bullshit.
Please interpret Bashiok's own words. PS, this is his clarification statement which previously specifically said that the AH was taken into account when determining drops.
Bashiok: What I said, and what is true, is that with far more players and an increased proliferation of item trade, we have to factor in how many items are being found by players and how quickly a player can gear up by 'sourcing' items from others through trade and the convenience of the gold auction house.
It has nothing to do with the auction house per se, but the general ease at which players have access to more items than they would without it and us needing to keep that in mind while balancing drops. It would be rather poorly thought out if we balanced drops completely ignoring all of the ways players can gear up, and trading is certainly one of them.
Obviously everyone wants the best gear possible as quickly as possible, and us attempting to mediate that through design that takes all factors into account is not always going to be a popular notion.
PS, I don't think this is a bad thing, except in relationship to SET pieces, which I feel should be more common.
edit: I reread your statement and you're right, the game is absolutely NOT AH dependent. Taking the AH into consideration of drop rates vs. making the AH dependent are two totally different things.
1: No its not, at all, as has been stated hundreds of times by blues. Stop feeding the masses false information. You are basing this on what one blue posted which was then recanted by himself and every other diablo 3 dev/blue in existence.
2: /shrug DPS will still matter, will just be harder to tell if a weapon + effect is actually higher DPS than another. I would rather outright kill a mob than drop a cool line of fire that might burn him a little if he gets to move towards me.
3: Levels are random enough as they are. No need to waste money to placate whining babies.
4: I hope they don't increase levels at all and instead just add max level content.
5: agreed.
As to expansions, the expansion for D2 only added content, not levels. If D3 expansions increase levels I will probably quit because as you said, all our gearing would have turned out to be nothing more than wasted time, massive amounts of wasted time.
#1, Didn't realize that one blue post was recanted. Saw it on another website and didn't know the context. The dependancy of the AH for some item types still resonates with me, because of the very limited # of sets. As a level 60 player, I still haven't encountered one set of anything. I can't imagine putting together a matching set in a less than 300 hours. Sets to me = auction house. In all practicality, matching sets are only feasible to me through the AH. Whether or not that was a conscious design decision is irrelevant.
#2 Some people go for DPS for grasp of the dead Rune and some people go for max slow effect rune. Some people go for Dire Bats and some people go for cloud of bats. Point is, the way things do damage can be just as important as how much damage. To me it's more fun to have variety of effects than having a single # of importance, where one is clearly better than the other. This also provides a qualitative variety in weapons versus just a quantitative difference.
#3 To each their own. I get the I've been there before feeling and I believe with smaller building blocks, levels can have a greater variety. You like Duplos, I like Legos. Personal preference.
4. I recall Jay wilson saying that having everyone cap at level 60 makes expansion packs so much easier to release, because everyone is at the same level. The marketing will be so much more compelling to say now you can have a level 70 Barbarian. If you don't get the expansion, you're stuck at 60. More people will buy it if you can have a higher level cap.
Also, How would it be possible for everyone to keep their weapons from farming Inferno? Wouldn't that be boring if you can't gain levels and can't find better weapons? If better weapons are not available and you need to farm the hell out of inferno to play the expansion, then, the only people who could play the expansion are people who spend hundreds of hours farming. The headlines would be hilarious, "Blizzard releases expansion pack that only 50,000 people can play. In response to the millions of people who bought the original D3, Blizzard says play it for 300 more hours before buying the expansion."
5. Glad we agree on this. One of the magical moments that happened to me during the Beta, was opening up a chest right before the skeleton king. It looked boobie trapped and it was. I got swarmed by a bunch of skeletons. It'd be great to see more events like that. Or even hidden things where you can pull on a torch attached to a wall, that looks like it's part of the background and a secret room opens up. So many possibilities.
First off I want to say D3 is an incredible value. Almost everyone reading this is getting top notch entertainment for less than $1 an hour. That being said, the expansion packs are going to similar to WOW in the sense that it will probably kill the existing content, because it will become too easy. If you've played WOW (which on this forum is a 4 letter word), you know that the drops from random mobs at the START of the expansions are better than your top rated drops that you spent months grinding for. This design gives the previously maxed out players a reason to play again.
Can you imagine the uproar people are going to have after spending $ at the RMAH and then finding out the blues from the expansion are more powerful than their item they spent $250 on?
The future of Diablo is not going into some cave which descends down unlimited levels, the future is buying an expansion to get more play. In a sense Diablo is a content subscription based game.
Rather than just release new levels, the expansion will provide a time to improve upon the game mechanics. Here are my ideas (which I liberally stole from others) & feel free to share yours:
#1 Yes, we all know and there are blue posts proving this...the drops rates for sets & legendaries are built around the auction house. So what about having sets being much more common. I'm level 60 and still have not found one set item. Sets in the expansion should be just like the McDonald's Monopoly game, where everyone can get park place, but Boardwalk is VERY rare. The last item of each set should be VERY RARE, and maybe 2 items in the same set are very uncommon. That way, there can be sets that everyone can find and enjoy without using the AH, but if you want that helmet to complete the set, then you'll have to save your gold.
#2. Weapons can have special effects so DPS is not the defining factor anymore. What about a bow, which leaves trails of fire? Or a shield which can sometimes stun people when you get hit. Or boots which leave a trail of frost. Or a mace which causes enemies to explode when they die? Point is, with special abilities residing inside the gear, it will no longer be just about DPS, but about the fun factor of an item.
#3 More randomization of levels. Right now, Blizzard went top $ on production value and you can see how big of building blocks they used for the "random" levels. Maybe this was to make the levels seem grand, but they need to go back to D2 style by making the random level building blocks smaller, so that random levels appear much more random. This will give it a lot more replayability.
#4 This is the time to release the + levels that Kripp was talking about. Whenever you gain a + level, you get just 1 stat point to place where you want. One point is nothing, but it allows you to get rewarded w/ experience points vs just gold for playing.
#5 More random events, booby traps, etc. Random optional quest givers in the middle of a dungeon.
Star Wars has real geeky fans. They memorize every line from the movies, waited decades between installments, and love to dress in character, even when they get married.
Star Trek has one of the most annoying fan base, because they memorize every frickin stat, and then have nerdy arguments in Klingon about how fast Defiant class space ship travels vs the Zodiac class.
Now, I'm starting to worry about Diablo fans. Let's face it, everyone who goes to this website is a fan. Whether they're complaining or praising. And if I were to describe the typical post on Reddit, Diablofans, or on Battle.net forums...it would be, "I've played this game for 400 hours and it sucks. They keep breaking the game. Just when I thought it was already broken, they break it again."
TBH, I have a level 59 WD in Hell and have not started Inferno yet. I'm having fun. I guess it comes down to one question, is the game fun for you?
Great suggestions. Even if you get just 1 stat point to spend after each "plus" level above 60, that would be enough incentive for people to continue on. The AH is the great equalizer and it is just a matter of time until beating inferno is mainstream. There needs to be an endgame.
The problem here is the crystal clear Feng Shui rule violation:
A bedroom door shall NEVER face a stair case (source).
Stairs should not end at a door, such as the front door, or face a bedroom door. This creates poison arrows or killing chi (double that if a mirror reflects the staircase). If a staircase stops at a bedroom door, it can cause energy to drain away from the residents of the bedroom, causing financial and health-related problems related to low energy, such as low thyroid or depression.
There is a new psychosis going around affecting people who spent 200+ hours who find a precious legendary item. They dream of this item, worship it, salivate at it's value, the hunch over their screen and mutter, "My precious...my precious..." They haven't showered for several weeks, they're too hungry to go to the store to buy deoderant...then they log on to the RMAH and find out that their precious legendary item is lowly rolled and a better one has not sold on the house at $1.50. These hobbits are forming a class action lawsuit against blizzard for paying them slave wages. $1.50 / 200+ hours. We need to help the afflicted by taking apart their Diablos.
Now I REALLY love this game. I've put in over 60 hours and there is so much more that I want to do. Whimshire, Inferno, use different characters, hardcore, and more.
Before the game came out Diablofans was all about Diablo Fans. Now it is about there was a change to the game and it's worse now.
Here's the future: every patch will include a nerf.
As one blue poster said, it is easier to trim down abilities than to OP other skills to match up, because then things get out of hand.
I play a WD, and can spam powerful zombie bears all day long doing over 1000% weapon damage. It's just a matter of time until that gets nerfed. And that's a good thing, because then I will actually have a choice between different builds, versus going with the OBVIOUS choice.
Point is, keep a look at the big picture. Enjoy the game as a work in progress and be happy that Blizzard is still working on the game. When you see road construction near you, be happy that the government is improving your neighborhood, don't complain, "Pity me, there is more traffic here. Why are they doing this to me? I loved them glorious pot holes."
Diablo 3 is under construction. And for the better.
A lot of credit to Krippi. Watching the Wizard's POV was a lot more impressive than the barbarian who basically did the same thing over and over. The Wizard had to keep Diablo at the edge or out of the screen at all times or DIE! When watching the POV, it is impressive that he has so much situational awareness and seems to know where Diablo is, even when he is off screen. Sometimes he uses his Hydra's shooting as a way to triangulate where Diablo is, but other times, he just seems to know. He also uses the map to his advantage as well. A lot of what he does is subtle, but it is the difference between life and death.
Everyone raves about MF. But, AH>MF and the only way to buy stuff on the AH is gold. So rather than decking out in MF gear, what about decking out in GF gear. Also from my understanding in multi player games, the GF doesn't get neutered like MF does.
Here are the plusses:
You don't have to go back to town as often to sell off your gold
Saves lots of time at the AH trying to price items to sell, reselling unsold items, etc.
The GF PASSIVELY helps you earn gold
MF makes you work for gold, you have to determine which items to break down, which ones to sell to vendors, which ones to sell at the AH.
In my opinion you are better off with GF, than MF unless you are trying to hit the lottery by finding that ONE item that somebody is willing to pay 1,000,000 gold for.
What are your thoughts? Do you know if GF gets divided in multi player games?
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Please interpret Bashiok's own words. PS, this is his clarification statement which previously specifically said that the AH was taken into account when determining drops.
Bashiok:
What I said, and what is true, is that with far more players and an increased proliferation of item trade, we have to factor in how many items are being found by players and how quickly a player can gear up by 'sourcing' items from others through trade and the convenience of the gold auction house.
It has nothing to do with the auction house per se, but the general ease at which players have access to more items than they would without it and us needing to keep that in mind while balancing drops. It would be rather poorly thought out if we balanced drops completely ignoring all of the ways players can gear up, and trading is certainly one of them.
Obviously everyone wants the best gear possible as quickly as possible, and us attempting to mediate that through design that takes all factors into account is not always going to be a popular notion.
[source]
PS, I don't think this is a bad thing, except in relationship to SET pieces, which I feel should be more common.
edit: I reread your statement and you're right, the game is absolutely NOT AH dependent. Taking the AH into consideration of drop rates vs. making the AH dependent are two totally different things.
0
#1, Didn't realize that one blue post was recanted. Saw it on another website and didn't know the context. The dependancy of the AH for some item types still resonates with me, because of the very limited # of sets. As a level 60 player, I still haven't encountered one set of anything. I can't imagine putting together a matching set in a less than 300 hours. Sets to me = auction house. In all practicality, matching sets are only feasible to me through the AH. Whether or not that was a conscious design decision is irrelevant.
#2 Some people go for DPS for grasp of the dead Rune and some people go for max slow effect rune. Some people go for Dire Bats and some people go for cloud of bats. Point is, the way things do damage can be just as important as how much damage. To me it's more fun to have variety of effects than having a single # of importance, where one is clearly better than the other. This also provides a qualitative variety in weapons versus just a quantitative difference.
#3 To each their own. I get the I've been there before feeling and I believe with smaller building blocks, levels can have a greater variety. You like Duplos, I like Legos. Personal preference.
4. I recall Jay wilson saying that having everyone cap at level 60 makes expansion packs so much easier to release, because everyone is at the same level. The marketing will be so much more compelling to say now you can have a level 70 Barbarian. If you don't get the expansion, you're stuck at 60. More people will buy it if you can have a higher level cap.
Also, How would it be possible for everyone to keep their weapons from farming Inferno? Wouldn't that be boring if you can't gain levels and can't find better weapons? If better weapons are not available and you need to farm the hell out of inferno to play the expansion, then, the only people who could play the expansion are people who spend hundreds of hours farming. The headlines would be hilarious, "Blizzard releases expansion pack that only 50,000 people can play. In response to the millions of people who bought the original D3, Blizzard says play it for 300 more hours before buying the expansion."
5. Glad we agree on this. One of the magical moments that happened to me during the Beta, was opening up a chest right before the skeleton king. It looked boobie trapped and it was. I got swarmed by a bunch of skeletons. It'd be great to see more events like that. Or even hidden things where you can pull on a torch attached to a wall, that looks like it's part of the background and a secret room opens up. So many possibilities.
0
First off I want to say D3 is an incredible value. Almost everyone reading this is getting top notch entertainment for less than $1 an hour. That being said, the expansion packs are going to similar to WOW in the sense that it will probably kill the existing content, because it will become too easy. If you've played WOW (which on this forum is a 4 letter word), you know that the drops from random mobs at the START of the expansions are better than your top rated drops that you spent months grinding for. This design gives the previously maxed out players a reason to play again.
Can you imagine the uproar people are going to have after spending $ at the RMAH and then finding out the blues from the expansion are more powerful than their item they spent $250 on?
The future of Diablo is not going into some cave which descends down unlimited levels, the future is buying an expansion to get more play. In a sense Diablo is a content subscription based game.
Rather than just release new levels, the expansion will provide a time to improve upon the game mechanics. Here are my ideas (which I liberally stole from others) & feel free to share yours:
#1 Yes, we all know and there are blue posts proving this...the drops rates for sets & legendaries are built around the auction house. So what about having sets being much more common. I'm level 60 and still have not found one set item. Sets in the expansion should be just like the McDonald's Monopoly game, where everyone can get park place, but Boardwalk is VERY rare. The last item of each set should be VERY RARE, and maybe 2 items in the same set are very uncommon. That way, there can be sets that everyone can find and enjoy without using the AH, but if you want that helmet to complete the set, then you'll have to save your gold.
#2. Weapons can have special effects so DPS is not the defining factor anymore. What about a bow, which leaves trails of fire? Or a shield which can sometimes stun people when you get hit. Or boots which leave a trail of frost. Or a mace which causes enemies to explode when they die? Point is, with special abilities residing inside the gear, it will no longer be just about DPS, but about the fun factor of an item.
#3 More randomization of levels. Right now, Blizzard went top $ on production value and you can see how big of building blocks they used for the "random" levels. Maybe this was to make the levels seem grand, but they need to go back to D2 style by making the random level building blocks smaller, so that random levels appear much more random. This will give it a lot more replayability.
#4 This is the time to release the + levels that Kripp was talking about. Whenever you gain a + level, you get just 1 stat point to place where you want. One point is nothing, but it allows you to get rewarded w/ experience points vs just gold for playing.
#5 More random events, booby traps, etc. Random optional quest givers in the middle of a dungeon.
1
Star Trek has one of the most annoying fan base, because they memorize every frickin stat, and then have nerdy arguments in Klingon about how fast Defiant class space ship travels vs the Zodiac class.
Now, I'm starting to worry about Diablo fans. Let's face it, everyone who goes to this website is a fan. Whether they're complaining or praising. And if I were to describe the typical post on Reddit, Diablofans, or on Battle.net forums...it would be, "I've played this game for 400 hours and it sucks. They keep breaking the game. Just when I thought it was already broken, they break it again."
TBH, I have a level 59 WD in Hell and have not started Inferno yet. I'm having fun. I guess it comes down to one question, is the game fun for you?
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0
0
0
Yes, this is THE $100 post. I tried doing the same thing, but it was like pooping in my pants. I just couldn't get myself to do it.
Actually. It's Diablo.
4
A bedroom door shall NEVER face a stair case (source).
Stairs should not end at a door, such as the front door, or face a bedroom door. This creates poison arrows or killing chi (double that if a mirror reflects the staircase). If a staircase stops at a bedroom door, it can cause energy to drain away from the residents of the bedroom, causing financial and health-related problems related to low energy, such as low thyroid or depression.
0
0
0
4
Before the game came out Diablofans was all about Diablo Fans. Now it is about there was a change to the game and it's worse now.
Here's the future: every patch will include a nerf.
As one blue poster said, it is easier to trim down abilities than to OP other skills to match up, because then things get out of hand.
I play a WD, and can spam powerful zombie bears all day long doing over 1000% weapon damage. It's just a matter of time until that gets nerfed. And that's a good thing, because then I will actually have a choice between different builds, versus going with the OBVIOUS choice.
Point is, keep a look at the big picture. Enjoy the game as a work in progress and be happy that Blizzard is still working on the game. When you see road construction near you, be happy that the government is improving your neighborhood, don't complain, "Pity me, there is more traffic here. Why are they doing this to me? I loved them glorious pot holes."
Diablo 3 is under construction. And for the better.
0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DIYJAzZ3xgg
0
Here are the plusses:
- You don't have to go back to town as often to sell off your gold
- Saves lots of time at the AH trying to price items to sell, reselling unsold items, etc.
- The GF PASSIVELY helps you earn gold
- MF makes you work for gold, you have to determine which items to break down, which ones to sell to vendors, which ones to sell at the AH.
In my opinion you are better off with GF, than MF unless you are trying to hit the lottery by finding that ONE item that somebody is willing to pay 1,000,000 gold for.What are your thoughts? Do you know if GF gets divided in multi player games?