That's why I said it was the closest we could get. I was just defending that it wasn't an unintelligent conclusion. Yes there are holes but...it's not like anyone has done any better.
But that is the best we are going to get: Nothing is certain, everything is subjective.
Hehe, not to derail the whole train of thought, but that reminded me of Assassins Creed. Nothing is true, everything is permitted. I heard Altair's voice when I was saying Nothing is certain, everything is subjective in my head. xD
Exactly =D Personally, if there WERE to be a heaven, frankly i'm pretty sure I'd be bored to death. I mean after a year of no challenge, hell I'd probably invent Earth and send myself there, wipe my memory just to get ~ 60 years of struggle, because face it, if everything is easy, everything is boring. Ever played a game in god mode for long? Only if there was still a challenge, like see what your god mode limits are, or fight other god mode players.
If there was a heaven, and it was the biblical heaven touted by the American Christians, I personally believe it would be almost as bad as hell.
Again, my opinion, not attempting to flame anybody.
"I want to say something but I'll keep it to myself I guess and leave this useless post behind to make you aware that there WAS something... "
-Equinox
"We're like the downtown of the Diablo related internet lol"
-Winged
There is a soul in each of us. There is a myth about being able to meassure the weight of a person before and after the soul leaves his body. Sounds kinda creepy to be honest.
I do think that souls exists. Its a conciousness. It does not end. IT exists in an infinite realm which is nothingness and everything combined. It is infinite.
Conciousness created the physical reality we live in. Before matter, there was conciousness. You can call it god to be honest.
Our senses are severely limited. Hell, our eyes can only view the spectrum known as "light".
It's funny, you don't know if you are being bathed in x rays right now. You will eventually find out when limbs start falling off, but you don't know right now.
As for Rene Descartes, he seems pretty smart until he got into that whole "I think therefore I am" phase...
Yeah. We're so primitive because we only see a certain wavelength, when it just so happens it's the only useful one. Do you want to be watching a basketball game, when all of a sudden you see random waves block the point gaurd's ass, which you love so much to watch, because your little brother is microwaving some popcorn, or your little sister is listening to Lady GaGa on the radio? Why would you be bathing in X Rays? Is there an X Ray source close to you? If you're being bathed in X Ray, trust me, the side effects would have shown a long time ago, unless X Rays affect logic, in which case...
Seriously though, X Rays don't make your limbs fall off.
Not really. Yes it is circular. But, it's the only logical conclusion you can really live with when you use that method of checking reality. It's the closest we can come to knowing I guess.
But who is to say that we are even thinking? Who is to say that we are not a mass of meat that some super-intelligent species is simply injecting thoughts and ideas into us? We believe we think, but we do not know for a fact that we think. And because we cannot know for certain whether what we do is actually thinking, or rather simply following the stimulation of an external creature (Or something else that is even more advanced that we cannot even understand) that make us believe that we are thinking.
I guess what I am saying is that we don't know anything 100%. We don't even know if we exist. This could, for instance, be a dream. How the hell do we know?
Because there is abundant proof regarding the process of "thought", nerves, nerve conduction, neurotransmitters, neural circuits...etc. Do you have any sort of clue that Barney is controlling us from Krypton 34? If this is a dream, then it means real bodies, somewhere, are dreaming. I'm discussing this with you. If I'm dreaming, you will reply with "OMG WTF you're such a genius!" because in most of our dreams, everything we want happens, and if it doesn't, we wake up soon, right? Still, that means an actual person, us, is dreaming somewhere, putting holes in your theory. It also means that if we're dreaming, then this, the dream state body I'm in, also happens to dream, and sometimes the person I dream of dreams, and behold! We're in Inception.
That's why I said it was the closest we could get. I was just defending that it wasn't an unintelligent conclusion. Yes there are holes but...it's not like anyone has done any better.
But that is the best we are going to get: Nothing is certain, everything is subjective.
Hehe, not to derail the whole train of thought, but that reminded me of Assassins Creed. Nothing is true, everything is permitted. I heard Altair's voice when I was saying Nothing is certain, everything is subjective in my head. xD
I am certain that my username is _Salvation. Is that subjective? No. Is that fact and certain? Yes.
"I want to say something but I'll keep it to myself I guess and leave this useless post behind to make you aware that there WAS something... "
-Equinox
"We're like the downtown of the Diablo related internet lol"
-Winged
Yeah. We're so primitive because we only see a certain wavelength, when it just so happens it's the only useful one. Do you want to be watching a basketball game, when all of a sudden you see random waves block the point gaurd's ass, which you love so much to watch, because your little brother is microwaving some popcorn, or your little sister is listening to Lady GaGa on the radio? Why would you be bathing in X Rays? Is there an X Ray source close to you? If you're being bathed in X Ray, trust me, the side effects would have shown a long time ago, unless X Rays affect logic, in which case...
Seriously though, X Rays don't make your limbs fall off.
Sorry meph, X rays were a bad example. Also, I never said that we are primitive, we evolved to see only light waves for a reason. I'm just saying that we don't see a lot of stuff in the universe.
Because there is abundant proof regarding the process of "thought", nerves, nerve conduction, neurotransmitters, neural circuits...etc. Do you have any sort of clue that Barney is controlling us from Krypton 34? If this is a dream, then it means real bodies, somewhere, are dreaming. I'm discussing this with you. If I'm dreaming, you will reply with "OMG WTF you're such a genius!" because in most of our dreams, everything we want happens, and if it doesn't, we wake up soon, right? Still, that means an actual person, us, is dreaming somewhere, putting holes in your theory. It also means that if we're dreaming, then this, the dream state body I'm in, also happens to dream, and sometimes the person I dream of dreams, and behold! We're in Inception.
And how do you know there is proof? You got the knowledge that the proof is there through your eyes and your ears (Touch, possibly? Whatever floats your boat), and so your eyes and your ears could be lying to you. You don't know for certain, because with this logic that Rene is using, there is nothing that can be known for certain. Absolutely nothing.
Also, what if we are all part of some other beings dream? Or a dream of something that doesn't exist? Who's to say, maybe in the real world outside of this dream, physics allows such things.
I am certain that my username is _Salvation. Is that subjective? No. Is that fact and certain? Yes.
You believe your username is _Salvation, but that is because you observe it with your eyes. Your eyes can and do lie on a regular basis (Ever heard of the blind spot? Not exactly the same concept, but you get the idea)
I seriously doubt the existence of a soul and free will, at least in the terms we understand them. Modern philosophy has tackled those questions with neuroscience and unless you're willing to selectively discount nature (or inject theology) the evidence is quite convincing.
the blindspot is where your optic nerve connects to your eye. no lies about that.
But your eye cannot see that one spot, and so your brain has to come up with an image, which may not be what is actually there, and imagine that it is there.
"Sorry meph, X rays were a bad example. Also, I never said that we are primitive, we evolved to see only light waves for a reason. I'm just saying that we don't see a lot of stuff in the universe."
Who the hell is meph? Are you now saying that early humans could see gamma rays, X rays, and all the spectrum? Are you seriously saying that? Please tell me you're not saying that.
"And how do you know there is proof? You got the knowledge that the proof is there through your eyes and your ears (Touch, possibly? Whatever floats your boat), and so your eyes and your ears could be lying to you. You don't know for certain, because with this logic that Rene is using, there is nothing that can be known for certain. Absolutely nothing.
Also, what if we are all part of some other beings dream? Or a dream of something that doesn't exist? Who's to say, maybe in the real world outside of this dream, physics allows such things."
Because the chance of the same information reaching billions of people in the exact same way (say, a loud noise being, you know, loud) if they are indeed being controlled by something somewhere, should be pretty low, unless we're being controlled by amazingly capable super drones. This isn't a science fiction movie.
"You believe your username is _Salvation, but that is because you observe it with your eyes. Your eyes can and do lie on a regular basis (Ever heard of the blind spot? Not exactly the same concept, but you get the idea)"
So everyone's eyes are lying in the exact same way to them, telling them that my username is _Salvation? Nice logic.
This is a silly debate. I will stop having this silly debate, especially with someone who keeps referring to me as this "meph" guy, or whatever.
Are you now saying that early humans could see gamma rays, X rays, and all the spectrum? Are you seriously saying that? Please tell me you're not saying that.
You misunderstand me. I mean that we evolved to only see visible, we didn't evolve the sight to see other waves.
Because the chance of the same information reaching billions of people in the exact same way (say, a loud noise being, you know, loud) if they are indeed being controlled by something somewhere, should be pretty low, unless we're being controlled by amazingly capable super drones. This isn't a science fiction movie.
Like I said, it could be that we are a dream, or we are being controlled by an amazingly advanced civilization, or a number of other possibilities. We simply don't know for certain.
But that is the best we are going to get: Nothing is certain, everything is subjective.
Hehe, not to derail the whole train of thought, but that reminded me of Assassins Creed. Nothing is true, everything is permitted. I heard Altair's voice when I was saying Nothing is certain, everything is subjective in my head. xD
If there was a heaven, and it was the biblical heaven touted by the American Christians, I personally believe it would be almost as bad as hell.
Again, my opinion, not attempting to flame anybody.
-Equinox
"We're like the downtown of the Diablo related internet lol"
-Winged
I do think that souls exists. Its a conciousness. It does not end. IT exists in an infinite realm which is nothingness and everything combined. It is infinite.
Conciousness created the physical reality we live in. Before matter, there was conciousness. You can call it god to be honest.
Yeah. We're so primitive because we only see a certain wavelength, when it just so happens it's the only useful one. Do you want to be watching a basketball game, when all of a sudden you see random waves block the point gaurd's ass, which you love so much to watch, because your little brother is microwaving some popcorn, or your little sister is listening to Lady GaGa on the radio? Why would you be bathing in X Rays? Is there an X Ray source close to you? If you're being bathed in X Ray, trust me, the side effects would have shown a long time ago, unless X Rays affect logic, in which case...
Seriously though, X Rays don't make your limbs fall off.
Because there is abundant proof regarding the process of "thought", nerves, nerve conduction, neurotransmitters, neural circuits...etc. Do you have any sort of clue that Barney is controlling us from Krypton 34? If this is a dream, then it means real bodies, somewhere, are dreaming. I'm discussing this with you. If I'm dreaming, you will reply with "OMG WTF you're such a genius!" because in most of our dreams, everything we want happens, and if it doesn't, we wake up soon, right? Still, that means an actual person, us, is dreaming somewhere, putting holes in your theory. It also means that if we're dreaming, then this, the dream state body I'm in, also happens to dream, and sometimes the person I dream of dreams, and behold! We're in Inception.
I am certain that my username is _Salvation. Is that subjective? No. Is that fact and certain? Yes.
"to the worm in horseradish, the world is horseradish."
-Equinox
"We're like the downtown of the Diablo related internet lol"
-Winged
Sorry meph, X rays were a bad example. Also, I never said that we are primitive, we evolved to see only light waves for a reason. I'm just saying that we don't see a lot of stuff in the universe.
And how do you know there is proof? You got the knowledge that the proof is there through your eyes and your ears (Touch, possibly? Whatever floats your boat), and so your eyes and your ears could be lying to you. You don't know for certain, because with this logic that Rene is using, there is nothing that can be known for certain. Absolutely nothing.
Also, what if we are all part of some other beings dream? Or a dream of something that doesn't exist? Who's to say, maybe in the real world outside of this dream, physics allows such things.
You believe your username is _Salvation, but that is because you observe it with your eyes. Your eyes can and do lie on a regular basis (Ever heard of the blind spot? Not exactly the same concept, but you get the idea)
Happy bacon strips? I don't care if they are happy, I just want them yummy!
i wanna say something about the blindspot comment, but ill just see what happens next. get em!
"to the worm in horseradish, the world is horseradish."
The Blindspot isn't exactly the same, and it's actually the eye that lies, but you get the idea. >.>
I need a life...
But, I approve of the gay bacon.
the blindspot is where your optic nerve connects to your eye. no lies about that.
"to the worm in horseradish, the world is horseradish."
But your eye cannot see that one spot, and so your brain has to come up with an image, which may not be what is actually there, and imagine that it is there.
Who the hell is meph? Are you now saying that early humans could see gamma rays, X rays, and all the spectrum? Are you seriously saying that? Please tell me you're not saying that.
"And how do you know there is proof? You got the knowledge that the proof is there through your eyes and your ears (Touch, possibly? Whatever floats your boat), and so your eyes and your ears could be lying to you. You don't know for certain, because with this logic that Rene is using, there is nothing that can be known for certain. Absolutely nothing.
Also, what if we are all part of some other beings dream? Or a dream of something that doesn't exist? Who's to say, maybe in the real world outside of this dream, physics allows such things."
Because the chance of the same information reaching billions of people in the exact same way (say, a loud noise being, you know, loud) if they are indeed being controlled by something somewhere, should be pretty low, unless we're being controlled by amazingly capable super drones. This isn't a science fiction movie.
"You believe your username is _Salvation, but that is because you observe it with your eyes. Your eyes can and do lie on a regular basis (Ever heard of the blind spot? Not exactly the same concept, but you get the idea)"
So everyone's eyes are lying in the exact same way to them, telling them that my username is _Salvation? Nice logic.
This is a silly debate. I will stop having this silly debate, especially with someone who keeps referring to me as this "meph" guy, or whatever.
No, not really.
You misunderstand me. I mean that we evolved to only see visible, we didn't evolve the sight to see other waves.
Like I said, it could be that we are a dream, or we are being controlled by an amazingly advanced civilization, or a number of other possibilities. We simply don't know for certain.
It's an example. Not the best example but the first one off the top of my head.
I love you too.