There should definitely be an option to show anyone all of your equipment, but, for reasons stated above, I think it should require mutual consent. Much like sex.
I can almost guarantee you that there will at least be an armory-type thing on the community site where you can look up players gear, skills, traits, and any other build aspects. In a game where 90,000,000,000 + builds are possible, people will want to know what builds people are using.
Didn't they already confirm something similar to the armory?
Also I'd rather just have inspect than people having to go online a forum or the armory or whatever to read build guides or see someones gear or whatever. Because no matter what people are gonna want to copy what's "best" at the time.
I am sorry but it seems we have really diverged from the main topic here. We are not talking about guides and build choices being visible, just gear. In a game like diablo where ~50% of your gear will have random attributes on it, I don't see the problem with showing your gear. Even if someone wants to copy it, they have to grind or trade to find items with the same random attributes as your gear.
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Because no matter what people are gonna want to copy what's "best" at the time.
The point is to have "the best" undefined.
People are always going to find the best gear for their build even if it's through forums or guides, anyways though like Scyber said, they still won't know your build unless you display it to them or straight out tell them.
This is just about someone seeing your gear. I don't think anyone will be able to really tell what build you are by just looking at gear. Unless it's really streamlined. Like +5 to whirlwind on 3 of your items or something, which I don't think is even possible this time around.
This damn thread is still going on? over 100 posts seriously?
I would wager 20$ this is how its going to be.
You can inspect other players gear
but you will have an option to hide your gear if you choose to do so, so players can not see your gear if you toggle this option
period.
As Ophion said, there needs to be an option to always agree. The last thing I want to happen while hacking the denizens of Hell is a pop-up window "This other guys would like to inspect your gear. Do you agree?"
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I would assume that there must be an easy way to do this... as blizzard said in the first gameplay video, the most important part of the game is the loot 8)
It was posted on the first page. Allow other players to inspect. Yes. No. Friends only.
No one suggested popups.
Done. Who knows if Blizzard has given us the option though, I don't believe you can turn it off in WoW. So if you want the option you might have to have to bring it up on battle.net.
Making the best build is not a hard thing. Even if you managed to create the perfect build someone else will also plan the same build anyway (remember, D3 will have a huge amount of players). The build will most likely be available to everyone in the internet after a few months so I don't see the point in hiding your build for that motive.
The maim problem is people inspecting you just before an arena match to know your skills or griefers making fun of your noob gears and build. But those problems can be easily solved by letting each player decide if they want to show or hide their builds.
I would bet money that there will be some form of inspect option. Diablo differs from eve in that in EVE unless you remain in high-sec you are vulnerable to being ganked by other players. In diablo PvE and PvP are now separate. Sharing information helps newer players understand the game better. If a player sees the abilities you are casting and is interested in knowing how your character works, they will be able to inspect you and understand what mechanics are doing what. This is just easier for the majority of players to see whats going on.
The only reason to limit this information is to limit information and slow players learning times down. I realize some of you would prefer this so players would have to spend 'as much time' learning builds as you did to create your current build. However blizzard doesn't operate like this. Even in a highly competitive game such as starcraft one can download a replay from any player who has played you and they can see literally every action you make in the game, including where you are looking on the screen. And if a player cannot find your replay they can check your profile and get summary of your build and how you play.
Its cool dreaming about having an awesome and unique build. But I can tell you coming from competitive games that this wouldn't be the case. It is very unlikely you will find a build that will be both unique and powerful. If you do it wont remain unique to you for very long regardless of what information is freely given. Other players will stumble across it. Quickly if you play in public games. The only thing you can retain is an understanding of how your build and setup works which isn't explained from build information.
Even in a highly competitive game such as starcraft one can download a replay from any player who has played you and they can see literally every action you make in the game, including where you are looking on the screen.
StarCraft is not a building game, the comparison is invalid. It's very difficult to be unique in SC because there's no customization available, and the game is very rigid and balanced. All the possible opening sequences + reactions + followups are not difficult to write down on paper, it's how I started playing SCII.
For Diablo III, this is not true. It's not valid to compare it to neither WoW nor SCII nor even DII. This game will probably be THE most customizable game for the last 10 years, so I won't be surprised to see unique builds all over the place, and we would want to keep it that way.
This is NOT about PvP, or about any kind of competitive advantage/disadvantage, or about having the best build ever. It's about slowing down the rate at which people approach the "this build is the best and only build" metagame by making it unclear.
Okay...does ANYONE have a problem with this scenario:
-only gear is visible;
-you have to agree to it;
-you can disable all requests (as a preventive measure) OR you can permanently ignore certain users (to ward off spammers/trolls/douchebags in general) --> choose your option.
Lovin' it.
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"Ridicule is the only weapon which can be used against unintelligible propositions."
-Thomas Jefferson
StarCraft is not a building game, the comparison is invalid. It's very difficult to be unique in SC because there's no customization available, and the game is very rigid and balanced. All the possible opening sequences + reactions + followups are not difficult to write down on paper, it's how I started playing SCII.
For Diablo III, this is not true. It's not valid to compare it to neither WoW nor SCII nor even DII. This game will probably be THE most customizable game for the last 10 years, so I won't be surprised to see unique builds all over the place, and we would want to keep it that way.
This is NOT about PvP, or about any kind of competitive advantage/disadvantage, or about having the best build ever. It's about slowing down the rate at which people approach the "this build is the best and only build" metagame by making it unclear.
Im sorry but starcraft is a building game at its core. The game is far from 'rigid' and there is no way you wrote down every opening, reaction, and followup and for you to think so shows ignorance.
Anyway I just brought it up to show the stance and attitude blizzard has towards disclosing information and builds to anyone who is interested. They have shown very strongly that they want information to be available. Starcraft is a GREAT example because a large portion of high end players and fans want their replays and builds to not be freely available. But blizzard took the stance that they want all of that information public specifically so that new players could gather information. As well as to progress the metagame.
Personally I would love for builds and gear to be hidden. But you are setting yourself up for disappointment to think it will be.
Im sorry but starcraft is a building game at its core. The game is far from 'rigid' and there is no way you wrote down every opening, reaction, and followup and for you to think so shows ignorance.
I think it's the other way around.
If you don't know SC is a game made of predictable build orders and counters to them, you haven't played it long enough.
It seems like there are a lot of options but there really isn't, not after you realize that some openings give you too many restrictions so you discard them, and then there are counters that are vastly superior.
The only thing that changes this is the patches that come out every so often, but I remember in beta and shortly after launch a few pretty rigid setups were developed.
Openings are definitely easy to write. I mean, seriously, the game only has a few units and buildings. The only race that's complicated to deal with is Zerg.
SCII is not a game with a lot of stuff, it really isn't.
But blizzard took the stance that they want all of that information public specifically so that new players could gather information. As well as to progress the metagame.
No, Blizzard took that stance because it was standard for SC, it's standard for the entire scene, and because SC is an esport .
It has nothing, NOTHING to do with new players whatsoever. Nobody gives a crap about new players. It's entirely for pros and people who watch them. If you think any of this is for new players you're kidding yourself.
The armory, inspect options, and replays, are not there to serve new players at all.
Personally I would love for builds and gear to be hidden. But you are setting yourself up for disappointment to think it will be.
I am not interested, and never was, in hoping, or predicting, or giving a shit, about what a company is going to do; this thread for me serves only one purpose: to state and protect my opinion, irregardless of any company decisions. Perhaps you should read posts or know who you're talking to before you make all these assumptions that are just wasting everyone's time.
Im sorry but starcraft is a building game at its core. The game is far from 'rigid' and there is no way you wrote down every opening, reaction, and followup and for you to think so shows ignorance.
I think it's the other way around.
If you don't know SC is a game made of predictable build orders and counters to them, you haven't played it long enough.
It seems like there are a lot of options but there really isn't, not after you realize that some openings give you too many restrictions so you discard them, and then there are counters that are vastly superior.
The only thing that changes this is the patches that come out every so often, but I remember in beta and shortly after launch a few pretty rigid setups were developed.
Openings are definitely easy to write. I mean, seriously, the game only has a few units and buildings. The only race that's complicated to deal with is Zerg.
SCII is not a game with a lot of stuff, it really isn't.
But blizzard took the stance that they want all of that information public specifically so that new players could gather information. As well as to progress the metagame.
No, Blizzard took that stance because it was standard for SC, it's standard for the entire scene, and because SC is an esport .
It has nothing, NOTHING to do with new players whatsoever. Nobody gives a crap about new players. It's entirely for pros and people who watch them. If you think any of this is for new players you're kidding yourself.
The armory, inspect options, and replays, are not there to serve new players at all.
Personally I would love for builds and gear to be hidden. But you are setting yourself up for disappointment to think it will be.
I am not interested, and never was, in hoping, or predicting, or giving a shit, about what a company is going to do; this thread for me serves only one purpose: to state and protect my opinion, irregardless of any company decisions. Perhaps you should read posts or know who you're talking to before you make all these assumptions that are just wasting everyone's time.
I have read the thread and stated my opinions. Also its funny you claim I do not know starcraft 2. I stopped playing in March of this year but before that I was top 200 for many months and on a professional team. I had 3700 pts in master (before grand master) with about 500 bonus pool. http://sc2ranks.com/us/340771/ONEMedzo/season/1 http://us.battle.net/sc2/en/profile/340771/1/ONEMedzo/ladder/lastseason/leagues
But thing again I guess you seem to know me and what I do and do not know about starcraft 2. And you use this 'knowledge' to shut down my thoughts. Really silly. Seems to me you're the one who doesn't know what hes talking about.
Unless of course you're some kind of troll.
Anyway I don't really care about your personal opinions or desires for this game. I just came to this thread and decided to express my knowledge and opinions on how it will turn out, which I still believe to be accurate. And of course I could be wrong.
It's about slowing down the rate at which people approach the "this build is the best and only build" metagame by making it unclear.
That can't be slowed down. You take it out of the game they just make skill calculators and guides, or even gear calculators like I've seen for a lot of games. Taking it out of the game will just encourage people to go to fan sites to look for it. (yay for us? :P)
With a 4 player only game, it'll be a lot less effective actually to go through games looking at people's builds than it would be to just go online. Especially if there is an armory feature.
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Didn't they already confirm something similar to the armory?
Also I'd rather just have inspect than people having to go online a forum or the armory or whatever to read build guides or see someones gear or whatever. Because no matter what people are gonna want to copy what's "best" at the time.
Nobody wants cookie cutter builds ruining the creativity of the game.
-ZTZaorish
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People are always going to find the best gear for their build even if it's through forums or guides, anyways though like Scyber said, they still won't know your build unless you display it to them or straight out tell them.
This is just about someone seeing your gear. I don't think anyone will be able to really tell what build you are by just looking at gear. Unless it's really streamlined. Like +5 to whirlwind on 3 of your items or something, which I don't think is even possible this time around.
The point is that you would look online and find "OK" builds but few "great" builds.
If you inspect people game-by-game you will find much better builds.
I'd prefer people to not be able to see nothing without permission, regarldess of any conditions.
I would wager 20$ this is how its going to be.
You can inspect other players gear
but you will have an option to hide your gear if you choose to do so, so players can not see your gear if you toggle this option
period.
Find any Diablo news? Contact me or anyone else on the News team
No one suggested popups.
Done. Who knows if Blizzard has given us the option though, I don't believe you can turn it off in WoW. So if you want the option you might have to have to bring it up on battle.net.
Thanks Caniroth for the awesome sig!
The maim problem is people inspecting you just before an arena match to know your skills or griefers making fun of your noob gears and build. But those problems can be easily solved by letting each player decide if they want to show or hide their builds.
The only reason to limit this information is to limit information and slow players learning times down. I realize some of you would prefer this so players would have to spend 'as much time' learning builds as you did to create your current build. However blizzard doesn't operate like this. Even in a highly competitive game such as starcraft one can download a replay from any player who has played you and they can see literally every action you make in the game, including where you are looking on the screen. And if a player cannot find your replay they can check your profile and get summary of your build and how you play.
Its cool dreaming about having an awesome and unique build. But I can tell you coming from competitive games that this wouldn't be the case. It is very unlikely you will find a build that will be both unique and powerful. If you do it wont remain unique to you for very long regardless of what information is freely given. Other players will stumble across it. Quickly if you play in public games. The only thing you can retain is an understanding of how your build and setup works which isn't explained from build information.
StarCraft is not a building game, the comparison is invalid. It's very difficult to be unique in SC because there's no customization available, and the game is very rigid and balanced. All the possible opening sequences + reactions + followups are not difficult to write down on paper, it's how I started playing SCII.
For Diablo III, this is not true. It's not valid to compare it to neither WoW nor SCII nor even DII. This game will probably be THE most customizable game for the last 10 years, so I won't be surprised to see unique builds all over the place, and we would want to keep it that way.
This is NOT about PvP, or about any kind of competitive advantage/disadvantage, or about having the best build ever. It's about slowing down the rate at which people approach the "this build is the best and only build" metagame by making it unclear.
Lovin' it.
-Thomas Jefferson
Im sorry but starcraft is a building game at its core. The game is far from 'rigid' and there is no way you wrote down every opening, reaction, and followup and for you to think so shows ignorance.
Anyway I just brought it up to show the stance and attitude blizzard has towards disclosing information and builds to anyone who is interested. They have shown very strongly that they want information to be available. Starcraft is a GREAT example because a large portion of high end players and fans want their replays and builds to not be freely available. But blizzard took the stance that they want all of that information public specifically so that new players could gather information. As well as to progress the metagame.
Personally I would love for builds and gear to be hidden. But you are setting yourself up for disappointment to think it will be.
If you don't know SC is a game made of predictable build orders and counters to them, you haven't played it long enough.
It seems like there are a lot of options but there really isn't, not after you realize that some openings give you too many restrictions so you discard them, and then there are counters that are vastly superior.
The only thing that changes this is the patches that come out every so often, but I remember in beta and shortly after launch a few pretty rigid setups were developed.
Openings are definitely easy to write. I mean, seriously, the game only has a few units and buildings. The only race that's complicated to deal with is Zerg.
SCII is not a game with a lot of stuff, it really isn't.
Which has nothing to do with anything.
No, Blizzard took that stance because it was standard for SC, it's standard for the entire scene, and because SC is an esport .
It has nothing, NOTHING to do with new players whatsoever. Nobody gives a crap about new players. It's entirely for pros and people who watch them. If you think any of this is for new players you're kidding yourself.
The armory, inspect options, and replays, are not there to serve new players at all.
I am not interested, and never was, in hoping, or predicting, or giving a shit, about what a company is going to do; this thread for me serves only one purpose: to state and protect my opinion, irregardless of any company decisions. Perhaps you should read posts or know who you're talking to before you make all these assumptions that are just wasting everyone's time.
I have read the thread and stated my opinions. Also its funny you claim I do not know starcraft 2. I stopped playing in March of this year but before that I was top 200 for many months and on a professional team. I had 3700 pts in master (before grand master) with about 500 bonus pool.
http://sc2ranks.com/us/340771/ONEMedzo/season/1
http://us.battle.net/sc2/en/profile/340771/1/ONEMedzo/ladder/lastseason/leagues
But thing again I guess you seem to know me and what I do and do not know about starcraft 2. And you use this 'knowledge' to shut down my thoughts. Really silly. Seems to me you're the one who doesn't know what hes talking about.
Unless of course you're some kind of troll.
Anyway I don't really care about your personal opinions or desires for this game. I just came to this thread and decided to express my knowledge and opinions on how it will turn out, which I still believe to be accurate. And of course I could be wrong.
That can't be slowed down. You take it out of the game they just make skill calculators and guides, or even gear calculators like I've seen for a lot of games. Taking it out of the game will just encourage people to go to fan sites to look for it. (yay for us? :P)
With a 4 player only game, it'll be a lot less effective actually to go through games looking at people's builds than it would be to just go online. Especially if there is an armory feature.