Another major problem I have with religion, is the sense that people feel they are being noble or righteous for having faith. Faith is an extremely dangerous thing and should NOT be considered honorable. Having faith means that you come to a decision based on feelings, not fact. Faith en masse gives those in charge absolute power, and you know the saying... This extends beyond churches, to governments as well.
I know some German people, and they are good-willed individuals. However fifty years ago millions of Germans had no problem with the genocide of the Jews and even sided with Hitler on that they were a plague needing to be cleansed. Hitler was a very charismatic and determined individual, and many people followed him blindly without question, even though his actions from an outside point of view are appauling. Hitler used his charm and vigilance as well as christianity to launch his own brutal crusade.
We live in a real world, and the fantastical ideal of being a holy 'Paladin' (hey this is a Diablo forum ;)) is just that, fantasy. The simple truth is that those who have faith are taken advantage of.
I agree, in many ways. Faith is very very dangerous. But what i dont agree with is that you said faith is based on emotions and that just isn't true. Its based on an understanding of something and in the case of religion one gets that faith if he/she is actually smart from tons of research and biblical study, and then after that person feels that what he/she has seen and read seems a possible reason for existence then they make that leap of faith to believe it to be truth. I dont base my own faith on emotion at all, it just simply isn't where it comes from.
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"I want to say something but I'll keep it to myself I guess and leave this useless post behind to make you aware that there WAS something... "
-Equinox
"We're like the downtown of the Diablo related internet lol"
-Winged
No, faith is a belief in something without any factual evidence. Again, what you described is not faith, it is a calculated guess. And I assume you are leading this back towards evolution vs. creationism which I don't really want touch again but: Evolution is a near-perfect model for the biomass of the Earth. And by accepting it as fact, science and biology works out perfectly without any need for a magical entity from above waving a wand.
And once again, please stop claiming I used words that I didn't. 'Emotion' is similar to 'feelings' but the connotations and context make a big difference. People feel something to be true doesn't necessarily have to do with any emotions.
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---- And the evil that was once vanquished shall rise anew! ----
In many cases Linkx.....very true, but i still dont see the point. if it's that theres no way the bible could be true cuz of all the cruelty that is plausible, but it could also be that there is agod and it is just the sad world we live in and how we are. Like in song reference and movie reference ive seen many put existence with the idea of god in a very depressing transcendental way of looking at it. Such as "god is just a kid with an ant farm" and things like that. I dont support this idea but ya never know, ya know?
Humans were actually kind to one another a long time ago before Monotheism came to town. When Judaism and Christianity and Islam and all that came about shit hit the fan. And it hit the fan hard.
Quote from "The_wind" »
Wait but isnt that why we have the internet?
What? Can I have what your smoking?... Please?...
Quote from "Umpa65" »
Haha how true. But consider this. Technically if there is ONE religion that is completely right and if they're god was real and it wanted everyone in one religion or they would all be annihilated, following blindly doesn't sound like a bad idea imo.
If there is ONE religion that is completely right and the god they believe in was real, what is the chances in hell (pardon the pun) that that religion was YOURS??? How many religions are there on Earth??? How many Gods??? What the hell makes your religion so goddamn special that it negates all the other religions of the world!?
Quote from "Umpa65" »
I agree, in many ways. Faith is very very dangerous. But what i dont agree with is that you said faith is based on emotions and that just isn't true. Its based on an understanding of something and in the case of religion one gets that faith if he/she is actually smart from tons of research and biblical study, and then after that person feels that what he/she has seen and read seems a possible reason for existence then they make that leap of faith to believe it to be truth. I dont base my own faith on emotion at all, it just simply isn't where it comes from.
Faith is very dangerous. Faith is deadly. If the Pope says that Such-in-such is evil, every catholic has to believe that. If your pastor says that the Holy book says you gotta pay 20 dollers a week in tithes then every good christian has to believe that.
Shoot, Crusades, War on Terror, World War 2, the list goes on and on and on.
Humans were actually kind to one another a long time ago before Monotheism came to town. When Judaism and Christianity and Islam and all that came about shit hit the fan. And it hit the fan hard.
What? Can I have what your smoking?... Please?...
If there is ONE religion that is completely right and the god they believe in was real, what is the chances in hell (pardon the pun) that that religion was YOURS??? How many religions are there on Earth??? How many Gods??? What the hell makes your religion so goddamn special that it negates all the other religions of the world!?
Faith is very dangerous. Faith is deadly. If the Pope says that Such-in-such is evil, every catholic has to believe that. If your pastor says that the Holy book says you gotta pay 20 dollers a week in tithes then every good christian has to believe that.
Shoot, Crusades, War on Terror, World War 2, the list goes on and on and on.
Who said it was my religion? not me certainly! it was hypothetical Linkx, im pretty sure that was clear so chill out. It was an example of when blindly following would be useful. Lets say there was a video game of it.
Its an RTS, you compete against others in converting people, you represent the god, the other person is the anti god, you try to convince everyone to join you or else they will die and the anti god will only trap you rawr rawr rawr! lol. But see? it was hypothetical, if by some chance tht is how things were laid out then following blindly would actually prove usefull. And remember, nowhere did i ever state that i supported such a method in making such a life decision
Oh and can you tell me of a time before religion in recorded history? lol?
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"I want to say something but I'll keep it to myself I guess and leave this useless post behind to make you aware that there WAS something... "
-Equinox
"We're like the downtown of the Diablo related internet lol"
-Winged
Following blindly is never useful. If such a great and all powerful god did exist, he would understand why people did not believe in him due to lack of any proof or logic. He would not send you Hell for being intuitive.
Umpa, religion started out as more of a spiritual worshiping of the Sun. The Sun is the driving force of all life on the planet and the ancients knew it. Why do you think the day of worship is called 'SUNday'? Other than the Sun, Pagan religions also were very aware of the constellations and their relative position to the Earth. Every 2150 years a different constellation aligns itself under the setting Sun due to a slight wobble in the Earth's orbit. In 2150BC the Zodiac constellation Taurus was aligned and Moses is the metaphorical embodiment of this (as the ram's horn is a prominent Jewish symbol). 2150 years later a carpenter comes along named Jesus. He is the metaphorical embodiment of the new aligned constellation: Pisces. Why do you think there is soooooo much fish symbolism in Christianity? Heck, that ><JESUS> fish on the back of your car, do you even know what it means? It is a Pagan symbol for the era that we live in, the era of Pisces. Christians don't even celebrate Jesus' birthday on his birthday. Dec 25 was picked because it was already a prominent Pagan holiday that marked the Sun beginning to raise higher in the sky; making the days longer and crops flourish. Many religions have the same roots, and our description of God is always changing, meaning that there can be no 'static' or true God unless he obeys the rule of Dogma and changes with our descriptions.
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---- And the evil that was once vanquished shall rise anew! ----
Following blindly is never useful. If such a great and all powerful god did exist, he would understand why people did not believe in him due to lack of any proof or logic. He would not send you Hell for being intuitive.
Umpa, religion started out as more of a spiritual worshiping of the Sun. The Sun is the driving force of all life on the planet and the ancients knew it. Why do you think the day of worship is called 'SUNday'? Other than the Sun, Pagan religions also were very aware of the constellations and their relative position to the Earth. Every 2150 years a different constellation aligns itself under the setting Sun due to a slight wobble in the Earth's orbit. In 2150BC the Zodiac constellation Taurus was aligned and Moses is the metaphorical embodiment of this (as the ram's horn is a prominent Jewish symbol). 2150 years later a carpenter comes along named Jesus. He is the metaphorical embodiment of the new aligned constellation: Pisces. Why do you think there is soooooo much fish symbolism in Christianity? Heck, that ><JESUS> fish on the back of your car, do you even know what it means? It is a Pagan symbol for the era that we live in, the era of Pisces. Christians don't even celebrate Jesus' birthday on his birthday. Dec 25 was picked because it was already a prominent Pagan holiday that marked the Sun beginning to raise higher in the sky; making the days longer and crops flourish. Many religions have the same roots, and our description of God is always changing, meaning that there can be no 'static' or true God unless he obeys the rule of Dogma and changes with our descriptions.
Firstly can you prove pagan religions were the first religions ever? What ancient civilization had paganism before Christianity or anything (it would be wise not to answer this because the oldest civilization we know of is Ur and it's clear that it goes way farther back than that but in todays era we have no idea what happened at all before Ur and im not sure but there was probably pagan worship in Ur but also Moses was a son of Ur so christianity was there too)
Second, Once again you are trying to put yourself in a christian God's shoes when you try to imagine how he/she/it would think. I never said it was a Christian god, i said a god, a higher being that can decide our fates. You wouldn't be able to comprehend the thought process and it could very well regard us as incredibly insignificant, it doesn't have to answer to anyone and makes up what is moral and what is not moral so destroying humans might not be an issue. Also it doesnt have to be hell. Basically im saying as a human if there is a supreme power our methods of thinking would be absolutely pointless in trying to relate unless the bible is truly divinly inspired.
So in result, if we were truly insignificant and the god was not a Christian "nice" god then he could do away with us if we did not follow. once again BLINDLY FOLLOWING would prove VERY useful if one wanted to survive.
I did not say you used the word emotion, I used the word emotion , nowhere where there "". Its called a synonym, you can use those to expand vocabulary O_o.
And to me faith and calculated guessing go together just fine. As a person with a faith of a higher existence i know that my faith comes from extensive research. I can choose to believe it or not to, but i have faith that many are true in one way or another. The evidence may not be factual by your standards but it is to mine, and i choose to believe a lot of it by faith. Its very hard to distinguish the two to me, why i would rather leave them together i guess.
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"I want to say something but I'll keep it to myself I guess and leave this useless post behind to make you aware that there WAS something... "
-Equinox
"We're like the downtown of the Diablo related internet lol"
-Winged
1. The most ancient religions known were of this type, that's all I have to go on.
2. Again, the last sentence is not specific to Christianity, and Hell was an example.
3. This is ridiculous, as far as anyone knows blindly following a God might piss him off more for you being stupid! And even more importantly, because of the thousands of gods to choose from, you most likely will pick wrong (assuming there is one). And by blindly believing in a false idol you might piss Him off more! Any way you look at it it's a lose lose situation and a paradox. So why waste your time and effort believing at all?
I'm done for the night, bye.
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---- And the evil that was once vanquished shall rise anew! ----
1. The most ancient religions known were of this type, that's all I have to go on.
2. Again, the last sentence is not specific to Christianity, and Hell was an example.
3. This is ridiculous, as far as anyone knows blindly following a God might piss him off more for you being stupid! And even more importantly, because of the thousands of gods to choose from, you most likely will pick wrong (assuming there is one). And by blindly believing in a false idol you might piss Him off more! Any way you look at it it's a lose lose situation and a paradox. So why waste your time and effort believing at all?
I'm done for the night, bye.
Well...Aren't you a transcendental mascot.
it was a hypothetical example. One that if true, following blindly correctly would prove useful.It was all hypothetical to show that it could be useful, Wind was the only one who actually got that one. my bad if it went over your head roflmao. You and linkx dont seem to understand that its very hypothetical.
ugh, you leave no room to discuss when you simply SAY they are the oldest religions, dont be afraid of links or maybe cluing everyone in on a history lesson give examples PLEASE. Make the "conversation" more lively and in depth.
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"I want to say something but I'll keep it to myself I guess and leave this useless post behind to make you aware that there WAS something... "
-Equinox
"We're like the downtown of the Diablo related internet lol"
-Winged
Well what if you followed blindly, but you followed the WRONG god? Lots of gods (and goddesses) are jealous, and would be pissed if you followed the wrong god.
Oh, and Christianity is one thousand nine hundred eighty five years old. (Because "Jesus" died one thousand nine hundred eighty five years.) Judaism is an older religion, but not the oldest, not scientifically or historically at least. The oldest religions were Shamanistic in nature, and worshiped not only the sun but the female form. In fact, many of the first religions worshiped the Moon more then the Sun because the Sun was considered the representation of the Male God and the Moon was considered the representation of the Female Goddess.
Well what if you followed blindly, but you followed the WRONG god? Lots of gods (and goddesses) are jealous, and would be pissed if you followed the wrong god.
Oh, and Christianity is one thousand nine hundred eighty five years old. (Because "Jesus" died one thousand nine hundred eighty five years.) Judaism is an older religion, but not the oldest, not scientifically or historically at least. The oldest religions were Shamanistic in nature, and worshiped not only the sun but the female form. In fact, many of the first religions worshiped the Moon more then the Sun because the Sun was considered the representation of the Male God and the Moon was considered the representation of the Female Goddess.
The moon also doesn't damage your eyes beyond repair if you stare at it. So, I would think that most societies would prefer to worship the moon than the sun.
I'm pretty sure that the existing god just spawned a bunch of religions on accident and he's either laughing his ass off right now or not here at all.
I remember the old anecdote:
Some guy dies, and he's a Christian, so he comes to the doors of heaven, and goes like "I worship Christ!" or something. So the angel is like "wtf?" And he goes to talk to Jesus, and tells him there is a guy outside worshiping him. So Jesus is like
"Dang, I made a fishing club some hundreds of years ago, and it's still alive!"
I'm pretty sure that the existing god just spawned a bunch of religions on accident and he's either laughing his ass off right now or not here at all.
I remember the old anecdote:
Some guy dies, and he's a Christian, so he comes to the doors of heaven, and goes like "I worship Christ!" or something. So the angel is like "wtf?" And he goes to talk to Jesus, and tells him there is a guy outside worshiping him. So Jesus is like
"Dang, I made a fishing club some hundreds of years ago, and it's still alive!"
(the fish is a symbol of the Catholics)
Why would it represent catholics? the only reason i could see for this would be the church's domination of the fish market, "dont eat mean on fridays!eat fish" and then the catholic church would get loaded from the fish market rofl.
Equinox, when you say "im pretty sure that the existing god" how are you pretty sure? what evidence leads you to believe that you understand a/the "god's" thought process and that he/she/it did something accidentally?If such a god exists. Just curious.
But from a biblical standpoint i would think that it would be more viable that Lucifer (not the star XD) created a giant web of religions that confuse everything together to make right seem wrong and wrong seem right.
And Linkx, in that scenario you would be 100% correct, but once again my example was HYPOTHETICAL rofl, am i talking to myself here? I MADE it UP in order to give a situation where follwing blindly would be beneficial because someone said it is never beneficial, and i simply replied with an example that basically says "never say never".
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"I want to say something but I'll keep it to myself I guess and leave this useless post behind to make you aware that there WAS something... "
-Equinox
"We're like the downtown of the Diablo related internet lol"
-Winged
I believe God is our eternal father(this making all of us brothers and sisters in spirit), and we were once with him before we came to earth, there was a veil put over us to make us forget all that we knew before we were sent here, we now have the chance to enjoy life on the earth(righteously) and to strive to be worthy to meet God again.
For all those who do not believe in God because he does not heal, and believe in science, God inspires men to create cures and to help aid in other inventions. But like anything this knowledge can be used for evil too.
Take science, it helps in medicine, but also created nuclear weapons and biological warfare.
A more mundane example of what is good that is twisted towards evil would be the internet and TV. A lot of good things can be learned and seen through TV and the internet, but there are also many terrible things on them. (namely pornography and other evils).
Many people believe God to be silent, but I believe the contrary. I believe God reveals his teachings through his servants the prophets. This includes latter day prophets as well as prophets of old.
Some of these teachings includes the Word of Wisdom, Commandments, and many other modern day revelations which help us to fight against our modern day temptations.
The Word of Wisdom is basically a Health guideline which includes no hot drinks(coffee, strong teas, etc.) No alcohol, Tobacco or Drugs, and also things which we should do such as eat meat sparingly, eat our grains and vegetables and other health guidelines. The Word of Wisdom has been a blessing in my life, I have been around drugs, alcohol, and cigarettes almost everyday for the last 5 years, yet I have never taken one drag off a cigarette, one taste of alcohol, or any other drugs.
I believe people are aware what the commandments are, but one many do not follow is to keep the Sabbath day holy, or to treat Sundays with more reverence and to refrain from doing some things you would do other days of the week on sundays. The other ones include easier ones to follow such as do not kill. One other one which is largely not followed is to not use the lords name in vain.(omG, Jesus Christ, etc.) (Have you ever wondered why Heavenly Mother is never mentioned, because God holds her in too high of an esteem to mention her, if she was mentioned her name would be desicrated just like his already has been)
Some modern day revelations include the warnings against the evils of pornography, as well as the admonishment to have a year supply of food ready for when a natural disaster occurs.
I also believe in eternal families, that when married if we are worthy we can be sealed for time and all eternity, not till death do we part. We will one day see our loved ones who we have lost, even infants who died from childbirth or at young ages, they await us and pray that we will be worthy to be with them again.
An amazing example of this is the Penrod family from church, their mother and wife just died recently at the age of 41-43, but instead of becoming depressed and resentful they remain happy and optimistic, they are true examples of faith, they know that as long as they strive to be righteuos and remain worthy they will see their mother and wife again.
We are given the ability to repent and be made clean through the atonement of Christ. It is amazing what he did for us, and we should utilize his sacrifice in our lives.
I know I am about to get mauled for this post, but this is what I believe, and through the Holy Spirit and an open heart and an open mind, I know many others could come to believe these things, but that is not the point of this post,
it was simply to state what I believe.
PS: If needed I can make a large edit to my post as in deleting every word I wrote.
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"This is the triumph of man:
Where there is truth, he must find.
Where there is destruction, he must rebuild.
Where there is love, he must protect."
World's Fair Exhibit
"God gave us memories, that in life's garden we may have June roses in December."
eh i dont think that "agnostic athiest" is the right term... agnostic is unsure and athiest is dont believe in god... ur athiest but if presented with overwhelming evidence of a god you would believe... i dont think thats agnostic athiest but idk what to call it lol
I only use those terms to explain my position, here's a video that helped me determine where I fall, i used to just consider myself an agnostic. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fkEJtQJ5tz4
Equinox, when you say "im pretty sure that the existing god" how are you pretty sure? what evidence leads you to believe that you understand a/the "god's" thought process and that he/she/it did something accidentally? If such a god exists. Just curious.
Look at the existing religions. They are all similar, and I am mostly talking about the common, established ones, Buddhism, Christianity, Islam, etc. I believe they could not have been so similar without being established for the same reason. This is one of my arguments for the existence of a being such as "god". I don't believe that people can randomly make up a god that's very similar to the god made up somewhere else. And each religions have their Jesus, or Buddha, or Magamet, or whoever. They all teach morals, each in their own crooked way which seems to have to do with the racial/national beliefs of each race.
I believe they prove someone such as god existed + he did make some sort of contact with our world, and I think the Bible is not 100% based on what humans think. But, in making such contact he did not do anything specific. What did he say really can't be known, and I think most things that churches and monks talk about these days were made up by humans to control the masses. That's why I say accidental.
I also don't think he was evil. First of all, why would he be, second of all, we don't live in a horrible world, third of all, most established religions are not really all that bad, if you look deeper in them and look at the more concrete stuff, such as the 10 commandments instead of the 600 laws of god doesn't know what.
Quote from "Umpa65" »
But from a biblical standpoint i would think that it would be more viable that Lucifer (not the star XD) created a giant web of religions that confuse everything together to make right seem wrong and wrong seem right.
I'm not really interested in lucifer. As far as I am concerned, he was made up.
If you wanted a possible explanations of many different Bible based religions I could provide a possible one. Many people interpreted the Bible differently, they then went and formed churches based on their interpretation. Or there may be a disagreement in a religion and those who disagree form their own faction. Religion can also be instated by those in power for personal gain, for example, I forget which King it was, but a King of England wanted to get divorced but the church would not let him, so he created the church of England. Some religions are created for the purpose to drain money from its followers in order to create a source of money for the leaders. One religion has no payed ministry and is completely volunteer run.
I did not spend hours researching this, so do not ask me for facts or proof, these are my thoughts on why SOME religions are formed. (I am fairly certain about the church of england part, if you feel inclined look it up yourself)
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"This is the triumph of man:
Where there is truth, he must find.
Where there is destruction, he must rebuild.
Where there is love, he must protect."
World's Fair Exhibit
"God gave us memories, that in life's garden we may have June roses in December."
-Equinox
"We're like the downtown of the Diablo related internet lol"
-Winged
And once again, please stop claiming I used words that I didn't. 'Emotion' is similar to 'feelings' but the connotations and context make a big difference. People feel something to be true doesn't necessarily have to do with any emotions.
Humans were actually kind to one another a long time ago before Monotheism came to town. When Judaism and Christianity and Islam and all that came about shit hit the fan. And it hit the fan hard.
What? Can I have what your smoking?... Please?...
If there is ONE religion that is completely right and the god they believe in was real, what is the chances in hell (pardon the pun) that that religion was YOURS??? How many religions are there on Earth??? How many Gods??? What the hell makes your religion so goddamn special that it negates all the other religions of the world!?
Faith is very dangerous. Faith is deadly. If the Pope says that Such-in-such is evil, every catholic has to believe that. If your pastor says that the Holy book says you gotta pay 20 dollers a week in tithes then every good christian has to believe that.
Shoot, Crusades, War on Terror, World War 2, the list goes on and on and on.
Its an RTS, you compete against others in converting people, you represent the god, the other person is the anti god, you try to convince everyone to join you or else they will die and the anti god will only trap you rawr rawr rawr! lol. But see? it was hypothetical, if by some chance tht is how things were laid out then following blindly would actually prove usefull. And remember, nowhere did i ever state that i supported such a method in making such a life decision
Oh and can you tell me of a time before religion in recorded history? lol?
-Equinox
"We're like the downtown of the Diablo related internet lol"
-Winged
Umpa, religion started out as more of a spiritual worshiping of the Sun. The Sun is the driving force of all life on the planet and the ancients knew it. Why do you think the day of worship is called 'SUNday'? Other than the Sun, Pagan religions also were very aware of the constellations and their relative position to the Earth. Every 2150 years a different constellation aligns itself under the setting Sun due to a slight wobble in the Earth's orbit. In 2150BC the Zodiac constellation Taurus was aligned and Moses is the metaphorical embodiment of this (as the ram's horn is a prominent Jewish symbol). 2150 years later a carpenter comes along named Jesus. He is the metaphorical embodiment of the new aligned constellation: Pisces. Why do you think there is soooooo much fish symbolism in Christianity? Heck, that ><JESUS> fish on the back of your car, do you even know what it means? It is a Pagan symbol for the era that we live in, the era of Pisces. Christians don't even celebrate Jesus' birthday on his birthday. Dec 25 was picked because it was already a prominent Pagan holiday that marked the Sun beginning to raise higher in the sky; making the days longer and crops flourish. Many religions have the same roots, and our description of God is always changing, meaning that there can be no 'static' or true God unless he obeys the rule of Dogma and changes with our descriptions.
Firstly can you prove pagan religions were the first religions ever? What ancient civilization had paganism before Christianity or anything (it would be wise not to answer this because the oldest civilization we know of is Ur and it's clear that it goes way farther back than that but in todays era we have no idea what happened at all before Ur and im not sure but there was probably pagan worship in Ur but also Moses was a son of Ur so christianity was there too)
Second, Once again you are trying to put yourself in a christian God's shoes when you try to imagine how he/she/it would think. I never said it was a Christian god, i said a god, a higher being that can decide our fates. You wouldn't be able to comprehend the thought process and it could very well regard us as incredibly insignificant, it doesn't have to answer to anyone and makes up what is moral and what is not moral so destroying humans might not be an issue. Also it doesnt have to be hell. Basically im saying as a human if there is a supreme power our methods of thinking would be absolutely pointless in trying to relate unless the bible is truly divinly inspired.
So in result, if we were truly insignificant and the god was not a Christian "nice" god then he could do away with us if we did not follow. once again BLINDLY FOLLOWING would prove VERY useful if one wanted to survive.
I did not say you used the word emotion, I used the word emotion , nowhere where there "". Its called a synonym, you can use those to expand vocabulary O_o.
And to me faith and calculated guessing go together just fine. As a person with a faith of a higher existence i know that my faith comes from extensive research. I can choose to believe it or not to, but i have faith that many are true in one way or another. The evidence may not be factual by your standards but it is to mine, and i choose to believe a lot of it by faith. Its very hard to distinguish the two to me, why i would rather leave them together i guess.
-Equinox
"We're like the downtown of the Diablo related internet lol"
-Winged
2. Again, the last sentence is not specific to Christianity, and Hell was an example.
3. This is ridiculous, as far as anyone knows blindly following a God might piss him off more for you being stupid! And even more importantly, because of the thousands of gods to choose from, you most likely will pick wrong (assuming there is one). And by blindly believing in a false idol you might piss Him off more! Any way you look at it it's a lose lose situation and a paradox. So why waste your time and effort believing at all?
I'm done for the night, bye.
Well...Aren't you a transcendental mascot.
it was a hypothetical example. One that if true, following blindly correctly would prove useful.It was all hypothetical to show that it could be useful, Wind was the only one who actually got that one. my bad if it went over your head roflmao. You and linkx dont seem to understand that its very hypothetical.
ugh, you leave no room to discuss when you simply SAY they are the oldest religions, dont be afraid of links or maybe cluing everyone in on a history lesson give examples PLEASE. Make the "conversation" more lively and in depth.
-Equinox
"We're like the downtown of the Diablo related internet lol"
-Winged
Oh, and Christianity is one thousand nine hundred eighty five years old. (Because "Jesus" died one thousand nine hundred eighty five years.) Judaism is an older religion, but not the oldest, not scientifically or historically at least. The oldest religions were Shamanistic in nature, and worshiped not only the sun but the female form. In fact, many of the first religions worshiped the Moon more then the Sun because the Sun was considered the representation of the Male God and the Moon was considered the representation of the Female Goddess.
The moon also doesn't damage your eyes beyond repair if you stare at it. So, I would think that most societies would prefer to worship the moon than the sun.
I remember the old anecdote:
Some guy dies, and he's a Christian, so he comes to the doors of heaven, and goes like "I worship Christ!" or something. So the angel is like "wtf?" And he goes to talk to Jesus, and tells him there is a guy outside worshiping him. So Jesus is like
"Dang, I made a fishing club some hundreds of years ago, and it's still alive!"
(the fish is a symbol of the Catholics)
Why would it represent catholics? the only reason i could see for this would be the church's domination of the fish market, "dont eat mean on fridays!eat fish" and then the catholic church would get loaded from the fish market rofl.
Equinox, when you say "im pretty sure that the existing god" how are you pretty sure? what evidence leads you to believe that you understand a/the "god's" thought process and that he/she/it did something accidentally?If such a god exists. Just curious.
But from a biblical standpoint i would think that it would be more viable that Lucifer (not the star XD) created a giant web of religions that confuse everything together to make right seem wrong and wrong seem right.
And Linkx, in that scenario you would be 100% correct, but once again my example was HYPOTHETICAL rofl, am i talking to myself here? I MADE it UP in order to give a situation where follwing blindly would be beneficial because someone said it is never beneficial, and i simply replied with an example that basically says "never say never".
-Equinox
"We're like the downtown of the Diablo related internet lol"
-Winged
For all those who do not believe in God because he does not heal, and believe in science, God inspires men to create cures and to help aid in other inventions. But like anything this knowledge can be used for evil too.
Take science, it helps in medicine, but also created nuclear weapons and biological warfare.
A more mundane example of what is good that is twisted towards evil would be the internet and TV. A lot of good things can be learned and seen through TV and the internet, but there are also many terrible things on them. (namely pornography and other evils).
Many people believe God to be silent, but I believe the contrary. I believe God reveals his teachings through his servants the prophets. This includes latter day prophets as well as prophets of old.
Some of these teachings includes the Word of Wisdom, Commandments, and many other modern day revelations which help us to fight against our modern day temptations.
The Word of Wisdom is basically a Health guideline which includes no hot drinks(coffee, strong teas, etc.) No alcohol, Tobacco or Drugs, and also things which we should do such as eat meat sparingly, eat our grains and vegetables and other health guidelines. The Word of Wisdom has been a blessing in my life, I have been around drugs, alcohol, and cigarettes almost everyday for the last 5 years, yet I have never taken one drag off a cigarette, one taste of alcohol, or any other drugs.
I believe people are aware what the commandments are, but one many do not follow is to keep the Sabbath day holy, or to treat Sundays with more reverence and to refrain from doing some things you would do other days of the week on sundays. The other ones include easier ones to follow such as do not kill. One other one which is largely not followed is to not use the lords name in vain.(omG, Jesus Christ, etc.) (Have you ever wondered why Heavenly Mother is never mentioned, because God holds her in too high of an esteem to mention her, if she was mentioned her name would be desicrated just like his already has been)
Some modern day revelations include the warnings against the evils of pornography, as well as the admonishment to have a year supply of food ready for when a natural disaster occurs.
I also believe in eternal families, that when married if we are worthy we can be sealed for time and all eternity, not till death do we part. We will one day see our loved ones who we have lost, even infants who died from childbirth or at young ages, they await us and pray that we will be worthy to be with them again.
An amazing example of this is the Penrod family from church, their mother and wife just died recently at the age of 41-43, but instead of becoming depressed and resentful they remain happy and optimistic, they are true examples of faith, they know that as long as they strive to be righteuos and remain worthy they will see their mother and wife again.
We are given the ability to repent and be made clean through the atonement of Christ. It is amazing what he did for us, and we should utilize his sacrifice in our lives.
I know I am about to get mauled for this post, but this is what I believe, and through the Holy Spirit and an open heart and an open mind, I know many others could come to believe these things, but that is not the point of this post,
it was simply to state what I believe.
PS: If needed I can make a large edit to my post as in deleting every word I wrote.
Where there is truth, he must find.
Where there is destruction, he must rebuild.
Where there is love, he must protect."
World's Fair Exhibit
"God gave us memories, that in life's garden we may have June roses in December."
John Barrie
I only use those terms to explain my position, here's a video that helped me determine where I fall, i used to just consider myself an agnostic.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fkEJtQJ5tz4
Look at the existing religions. They are all similar, and I am mostly talking about the common, established ones, Buddhism, Christianity, Islam, etc. I believe they could not have been so similar without being established for the same reason. This is one of my arguments for the existence of a being such as "god". I don't believe that people can randomly make up a god that's very similar to the god made up somewhere else. And each religions have their Jesus, or Buddha, or Magamet, or whoever. They all teach morals, each in their own crooked way which seems to have to do with the racial/national beliefs of each race.
I believe they prove someone such as god existed + he did make some sort of contact with our world, and I think the Bible is not 100% based on what humans think. But, in making such contact he did not do anything specific. What did he say really can't be known, and I think most things that churches and monks talk about these days were made up by humans to control the masses. That's why I say accidental.
I also don't think he was evil. First of all, why would he be, second of all, we don't live in a horrible world, third of all, most established religions are not really all that bad, if you look deeper in them and look at the more concrete stuff, such as the 10 commandments instead of the 600 laws of god doesn't know what.
I'm not really interested in lucifer. As far as I am concerned, he was made up.
It's the fact that's it's forced upon many unknowing children and thus brainwashing them.
I did not spend hours researching this, so do not ask me for facts or proof, these are my thoughts on why SOME religions are formed. (I am fairly certain about the church of england part, if you feel inclined look it up yourself)
Where there is truth, he must find.
Where there is destruction, he must rebuild.
Where there is love, he must protect."
World's Fair Exhibit
"God gave us memories, that in life's garden we may have June roses in December."
John Barrie
I want to say "Henry" with some Roman numerals following it, but I can't be sure. I've heard that before, though, yes.