Unless you can provide charts/graphs or actual data, your argument is purely speculative.
The fact remains is that the community is split. Some people love playing against others, and some people simply detest the idea.
Well.. hopefully blizzard won't make me play with those who detest PvP by seperating us by servers. I mean, does anyone remember the ear full of childish crying every time you killed someone who didn't want to be killed. It was rediculous, haha... and strangely made me want to kill them more.
Yea its somewhat annoying to be running around and have someone hostile you; but then isn't it fun to pwn their face when they were so bent on their victory? At least in a normal PK you have the ability to win. I'm not trying to start a war, I'm just saying there's good and bad to it.
This is like saying allowing people to be mugged is okay because every once in a while someone will beat the crap out of their would-be mugger and foil them, and get a feeling of satisfaction from it.
Besides the obvious problem with that logic, there's also the fact that PKers would obviously always be built for PvP, with skills etc. set up for that explicit purpose. On the other hand, their victims rarely are. In the same way, few people are 'prepared' to deal with a mugger in real life. The end result is very rare 'fun' you describe, but a huge list of victims.
Not worth it.
=====NEXT POST=====
Quote from "Timaah" »
does anyone remember the ear full of childish crying every time you killed someone who didn't want to be killed. It was rediculous, haha... and strangely made me want to kill them more.
That's because you're exactly the kind of disruptive player that shouldn't be catered to. Your fun relies on ruining other players' fun, and this is why Blizzard isn't very likely to care what that kind of player wants when it comes to Diablo 3. Think about it--what does Blizzard have to gain by making the game fun for people like you, when that will directly cause the game to be less fun for everyone else? There are definitely a lot more 'victims' than there are griefers, so catering to griefers is not only illogical, but a bad business decision as well.
Point of the matter, that the Anti-PK camp is just not understanding, is that PKing/PvP was as much a part of diablo as PvE was. Maybe not eveyone utilized this... but it was there and intricatly part of the game. That was the uniqueness of the Diablo game play. By listening to the complaints of people who didn't utilize it and removing this system you are effectivly removing a HUGE part of the game play experience from this series.
Now, this was always one of the best series... there really is no reason to change it because some people... even if it is a majority... don't like to be PKd and ONLY want the PvE experience.
To that i say, too bad! its part of the game and always has been wether you like it or not.
(thatll change tho because blizzard will listen to you guys and press the destruct button on one of their greatest games)
This is like saying allowing people to be mugged is okay because every once in a while someone will beat the crap out of their would-be mugger and foil them, and get a feeling of satisfaction from it.
Besides the obvious problem with that logic, there's also the fact that PKers would obviously always be built for PvP, with skills etc. set up for that explicit purpose. On the other hand, their victims rarely are. In the same way, few people are 'prepared' to deal with a mugger in real life. The end result is very rare 'fun' you describe, but a huge list of victims.
Not worth it.
=====NEXT POST=====
That's because you're exactly the kind of disruptive player that shouldn't be catered to. Your fun relies on ruining other players' fun, and this is why Blizzard isn't very likely to care what that kind of player wants when it comes to Diablo 3. Think about it--what does Blizzard have to gain by making the game fun for people like you, when that will directly cause the game to be less fun for everyone else? There are definitely a lot more 'victims' than there are griefers, so catering to griefers is not only illogical, but a bad business decision as well.
Thats the game man! Thats PART of Diablo! I chose to utilize part of the game that the developers PURPOSLY put in.
The only reason the idea of taking it out is being entertained is because not only is the core diablo team not even working on D3... but blizzard has been softened from years of working with the WoW crowed. And not to put the WoW people down.
Getting rid of something that amounts to nothing more than "bigger dick syndrome" or "see how many unsuspecting n00bs I can make cry" is just a smart move on Blizzard's part.
Allowing two warriors to test each other in the arena of battle is one thing, being a douche and killing people who had no intention of fighting you in the first place is another.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
It's time to welcome the other 80% of the color wheel to a Diablo game.
Getting rid of something that amounts to nothing more than "bigger dick syndrome" or "see how many unsuspecting n00bs I can make cry" is just a smart move on Blizzard's part.
Allowing two warriors to test each other in the arena of battle is one thing, being a douche and killing people who had no intention of fighting you in the first place is another.
It doesnt amount to nothing.. im playing the game and thats part of the game man... i dont want to prance around in blueby land, only playing cooperativly with other people. Competition is a driving force of diablo and that is mostly achieved through PvP. Having only consensual pvp removes a huge feel to the game.
You must have not really liked the game if you didnt get a rush and a chill in your spine evry time someone came into the game and went hostile. Its that feeling that was a part of the game. the fear.
It doesnt amount to nothing.. (1) im playing the game and thats part of the game man... (2)i dont want to prance around in blueby land, (3)only playing cooperativly with other people. Competition is a driving force of diablo and that is mostly achieved through PvP. (4)Having only consensual pvp removes a huge feel to the game.
(5)You must have not really liked the game if you didnt get a rush and a chill in your spine evry time someone came into the game and went hostile. (6)Its that feeling that was a part of the game. the fear.
1. Yes. It's a part of the game. But not one that was expressly put in for people to be douches.
2. Prance around in Blueby land? Pardon me, but what the fuck are you talking about?
3. Playing co-op was a huge part of why D2 is still alive today. Because you can just hop on with your friend and do some MFing or Baal runs and have a good time.
4. That's why people don't like playing PvP. Because idiots like you come in and kill. No questions, no remorse. If PvP is going to be in D3, it needs to be monitored and only in certain sections. Maybe they could have an arena where two guys could come in and duke it out and one emerges the victor, but killing people who did not want to PvP is not only ruining the game, it's making yourself look like an asshole.
5. To be honest, I stopped playing on the realms when people like you started douching up the servers. I love the Diablo series, I just don't like the douches who feel the need to destroy and hinder while the community should be trying to foster growth and knowledge.
6. If you want to never feel safe, go play in traffic or walk the streets of Detroit throwing up gang signs. As for me (and I'm sure a large majority of the Diablo fanbase), I only want to kill or be killed WHEN I ACTUALLY AGREE TO IT.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
It's time to welcome the other 80% of the color wheel to a Diablo game.
Unless you can provide charts/graphs or actual data, your argument is purely speculative.
The fact remains is that the community is split. Some people love playing against others, and some people simply detest the idea.
Dead_Metal, if you actually need tangable records to show that most people farmed to get better at PvP, you havn't played much bnet. PvP was overwhelmingly popular in D2, and it's the only reason that myself, all of my friends, and most people I saw in trading channels ever bothered to farm or trade for gear.
I would also farm to get better at PvE, but only for MF characters, which, in turn, would farm for my PvP characters.
Sure, when I first strated playing the game I liked to find items to kill monsters with. But that got old really fast.
It doesnt amount to nothing.. im playing the game and thats part of the game man... i dont want to prance around in blueby land, only playing cooperativly with other people. Competition is a driving force of diablo and that is mostly achieved through PvP. Having only consensual pvp removes a huge feel to the game.
You must have not really liked the game if you didnt get a rush and a chill in your spine evry time someone came into the game and went hostile. Its that feeling that was a part of the game. the fear.
Well I guess since Blizzard does not want PK in diablo3 that this is no longer part of the intended game play. I really did like diablo2 and played it for years and years, and personally I always felt that Pking was for the most part, just for people who wanted to constantly annoy others.
Listen I'm not a WoW fanboy, nor did I really mind Pking in Diablo2, but at least for me, it wasn't very exciting, I never felt any kind of achievement from it... maybe when I was much younger it had a sort of fun fear factor to it. However now that I'm getting into my late 20's I just think that for the most part PKing was and is unnecessary, and it a makes sense to me why Blizzard would opt to remove it from the game.
I can remember on more than one occasion having to just abandon games because a PK'er joined and started harassing me and my party. It didn't scare me, but it did annoy me and when they didn't leave after a few minuets and would constantly toggle their hostility on and off it just meant that I would have to remake the game. When this happens over and over it just gets repetitive and old really fast. Sometimes I'd just get my level 97 barb to join the game and they would leave, but it all just seemed like a big waste of my time.
Read number 5 above as to why I don't play on the realms.
Other than that, I understand that plenty of the community is all about the PvP, but I think it needs to be more moderated...none of this stuff that's going on now. It should be more of a test of wits and mettle, not sneaking up on a guy who is just trying to play the game.
As I said, a good idea is a separate section of the game where two (or more) people could go at it...i.e. Coliseum/Arena.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
It's time to welcome the other 80% of the color wheel to a Diablo game.
1. Yes. It's a part of the game. But not one that was expressly put in for people to be douches.
2. Prance around in Blueby land? Pardon me, but what the fuck are you talking about?
3. Playing co-op was a huge part of why D2 is still alive today. Because you can just hop on with your friend and do some MFing or Baal runs and have a good time.
4. That's why people don't like playing PvP. Because idiots like you come in and kill. No questions, no remorse. If PvP is going to be in D3, it needs to be monitored and only in certain sections. Maybe they could have an arena where two guys could come in and duke it out and one emerges the victor, but killing people who did not want to PvP is not only ruining the game, it's making yourself look like an asshole.
5. To be honest, I stopped playing on the realms when people like you started douching up the servers. I love the Diablo series, I just don't like the douches who feel the need to destroy and hinder while the community should be trying to foster growth and knowledge.
6. If you want to never feel safe, go play in traffic or walk the streets of Detroit throwing up gang signs. As for me (and I'm sure a large majority of the Diablo fanbase), I only want to kill or be killed WHEN I ACTUALLY AGREE TO IT.
Dude.. your rediculous. Not only do you respond to a perfectly good argument with flaming and ludicrous ideas like playing in traffic = not feeling safe in a video game. But your also just plain wrong. There was nothing douchy about PKing, it was INTENDED to be part of this game. Im sorry that you were on the recieving end, but thats how the cookie crumbles.
Dude.. your rediculous. Not only do you respond to a perfectly good argument with flaming and ludicrous ideas like playing in traffic = not feeling safe in a video game. But your also just plain wrong. There was nothing douchy about PKing, it was INTENDED to be part of this game. Im sorry that you were on the recieving end, but thats how the cookie crumbles.
I respond to a "perfectly good argument" with a calm and ordered list of why you are wrong and why you are exactly the reason PvP is on the knife edge of getting cut out of D3.
Also, it's not the way the cookie crumbles, it's the sign of a deranged individual who pleasures from torturing others.
And if PKing was instended to be a part of the game, why is it on the verge of being left out?
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
It's time to welcome the other 80% of the color wheel to a Diablo game.
Point of the matter, that the Anti-PK camp is just not understanding, is that PKing/PvP was as much a part of diablo as PvE was.
Except that while informally-structured PvP (since there was no 'official' system in D2) and PvE involved competition and cooperation respectively, griefing (a term I prefer because it's more descriptive and less confusing--technically all PvP involves "PKing" since players die when you duel) involves enjoying the game at the cost of directly interfering with others' enjoyment of the game.
For those players who like the 'thrill' of being at risk of being griefed, they can leave 'free'/'open' PvP on in games they create. Others shouldn't have to subject themselves to griefing just because a griefer enjoys screwing with them.
Maybe not eveyone utilized this... but it was there and intricatly part of the game. That was the uniqueness of the Diablo game play. By listening to the complaints of people who didn't utilize it and removing this system you are effectivly removing a HUGE part of the game play experience from this series.
If it's such a "HUGE" part, why is the solution of allowing people to toggle it in their games such an issue? If it's such a "HUGE" part, few would opt out of it, right?
Now, this was always one of the best series... there really is no reason to change it because some people... even if it is a majority... don't like to be PKd and ONLY want the PvE experience.
1. I find it funny that you would consider even a majority to be "some people"--nice try at being misleading. Now, let's see how your sentence would sound if written accurately:
"there really is no reason to change it [just] because most people don't like to be PKd"
Now you read that to yourself and tell me if you think it makes sense.
Also, you made a straw man. Who says that everyone who doesn't like the concept of griefing "ONLY want[s] the PvE experience"? What if they enjoy structured PvP instead, or also? There's probably a good number of players who focus on PvP, but are interested only in honorable fights, as opposed to griefer's sneaky ambushes. They could very well argue that it takes more skill to beat a player who's ready and willing to take you on, and that griefing doesn't attract them for that reason.
To that i say, too bad! its part of the game and always has been wether you like it or not.
Two-dimensional graphics have also always been a part of the game. This is the is-ought fallacy--just because something is (or was) a certain way doesn't mean it ought to be/stay that way.
(thatll change tho because blizzard will listen to you guys and press the destruct button on one of their greatest games)
Like I said, if there is a system where you can toggle 'open' PvP (allowing griefing) when you make a game:
1. If most people opt into it, then there's no problem--griefers will have plenty of places to 'do their thing', while the minority can also do their thing, enjoying the game their way.
2. If most people opt OUT of it, then there's no argument that removing griefing would 'destruct' Diablo 3, since that would be proof positive that griefers are a small minority that wouldn't have any significant effect on the success of the game.
You're just being a doomsayer. Claiming that removing griefing will completely wreck the game is absurd, especially with the addition of structured PvP, something that Diablo 2 never had to begin with.
Thats the game man! Thats PART of Diablo! I chose to utilize part of the game that the developers PURPOSLY put in.
The only reason the idea of taking it out is being entertained is because not only is the core diablo team not even working on D3... but blizzard has been softened from years of working with the WoW crowed. And not to put the WoW people down.
It was more than just the WoW crowd. Only 3 games have been, to my rememberance, have had sucess evenwith PK'ing: EQ 1, Ultima Online, and Diablo series. The other MMO's I can't speak for being that I haven't played them. The majority MAY have some type of PvP, but not a PK'ing system, par se. EQ had PvP servers and Ultima online and Diablo 1 had open season. D2 had a hostility button. I would look further into the history of PK'ing through ALL games and see where it's been leading. The player base for random PK'ing MAY be smaller than you think, or at least SHRINKING over the years. These are theories so don't flame, please. I'm just suggesting more research to see where the majority populace is going. I won't matter what I say or anybody else for that matter.
Yeah I said I wouldn't say anything on the topic any more, but I really don't think we should bash a crowd from another game for not wanting PK'ing in Diablo 3. Acutally, they shouldn't have a say unless they actually PLAYED D1 and D2 on a regular basis.
There is another thread which already dealt with all this so I really dont wanna get worked up again and start defending PK.. especially not to you guys as it makes no difference what you think. If you give a damn about why PK should be in the game then check out that thread.
Other then that, i hope they divide us by realms because some of us like diablo as it was and as it was intended. Choas was the name of the game.. not structured kiddie BS.
There is another thread which already dealt with all this so I really dont wanna get worked up again and start defending PK.. especially not to you guys as it makes no difference what you think.
Please. You obviously care what we think or else you wouldn't be posting here at all. Who do you think you're kidding?
Choas was the name of the game..
"Choas" isn't even a word. (you walked into it)
not structured kiddie BS.
1. Isn't pointless flaming like this the reason another thread on the subject got locked?
2. By that logic, real life is "kiddie BS" because there are laws against disturbing the peace.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
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Well.. hopefully blizzard won't make me play with those who detest PvP by seperating us by servers. I mean, does anyone remember the ear full of childish crying every time you killed someone who didn't want to be killed. It was rediculous, haha... and strangely made me want to kill them more.
http://www.bingegamer.net/index.php/2008/an-open-letter-to-diablo-iii-fanboys
So true...
This is like saying allowing people to be mugged is okay because every once in a while someone will beat the crap out of their would-be mugger and foil them, and get a feeling of satisfaction from it.
Besides the obvious problem with that logic, there's also the fact that PKers would obviously always be built for PvP, with skills etc. set up for that explicit purpose. On the other hand, their victims rarely are. In the same way, few people are 'prepared' to deal with a mugger in real life. The end result is very rare 'fun' you describe, but a huge list of victims.
Not worth it.
=====NEXT POST=====
That's because you're exactly the kind of disruptive player that shouldn't be catered to. Your fun relies on ruining other players' fun, and this is why Blizzard isn't very likely to care what that kind of player wants when it comes to Diablo 3. Think about it--what does Blizzard have to gain by making the game fun for people like you, when that will directly cause the game to be less fun for everyone else? There are definitely a lot more 'victims' than there are griefers, so catering to griefers is not only illogical, but a bad business decision as well.
Now, this was always one of the best series... there really is no reason to change it because some people... even if it is a majority... don't like to be PKd and ONLY want the PvE experience.
To that i say, too bad! its part of the game and always has been wether you like it or not.
(thatll change tho because blizzard will listen to you guys and press the destruct button on one of their greatest games)
http://www.bingegamer.net/index.php/2008/an-open-letter-to-diablo-iii-fanboys
So true...
Thats the game man! Thats PART of Diablo! I chose to utilize part of the game that the developers PURPOSLY put in.
The only reason the idea of taking it out is being entertained is because not only is the core diablo team not even working on D3... but blizzard has been softened from years of working with the WoW crowed. And not to put the WoW people down.
http://www.bingegamer.net/index.php/2008/an-open-letter-to-diablo-iii-fanboys
So true...
Allowing two warriors to test each other in the arena of battle is one thing, being a douche and killing people who had no intention of fighting you in the first place is another.
It's time to welcome the other 80% of the color wheel to a Diablo game.
It doesnt amount to nothing.. im playing the game and thats part of the game man... i dont want to prance around in blueby land, only playing cooperativly with other people. Competition is a driving force of diablo and that is mostly achieved through PvP. Having only consensual pvp removes a huge feel to the game.
You must have not really liked the game if you didnt get a rush and a chill in your spine evry time someone came into the game and went hostile. Its that feeling that was a part of the game. the fear.
http://www.bingegamer.net/index.php/2008/an-open-letter-to-diablo-iii-fanboys
So true...
1. Yes. It's a part of the game. But not one that was expressly put in for people to be douches.
2. Prance around in Blueby land? Pardon me, but what the fuck are you talking about?
3. Playing co-op was a huge part of why D2 is still alive today. Because you can just hop on with your friend and do some MFing or Baal runs and have a good time.
4. That's why people don't like playing PvP. Because idiots like you come in and kill. No questions, no remorse. If PvP is going to be in D3, it needs to be monitored and only in certain sections. Maybe they could have an arena where two guys could come in and duke it out and one emerges the victor, but killing people who did not want to PvP is not only ruining the game, it's making yourself look like an asshole.
5. To be honest, I stopped playing on the realms when people like you started douching up the servers. I love the Diablo series, I just don't like the douches who feel the need to destroy and hinder while the community should be trying to foster growth and knowledge.
6. If you want to never feel safe, go play in traffic or walk the streets of Detroit throwing up gang signs. As for me (and I'm sure a large majority of the Diablo fanbase), I only want to kill or be killed WHEN I ACTUALLY AGREE TO IT.
It's time to welcome the other 80% of the color wheel to a Diablo game.
Dead_Metal, if you actually need tangable records to show that most people farmed to get better at PvP, you havn't played much bnet. PvP was overwhelmingly popular in D2, and it's the only reason that myself, all of my friends, and most people I saw in trading channels ever bothered to farm or trade for gear.
I would also farm to get better at PvE, but only for MF characters, which, in turn, would farm for my PvP characters.
Sure, when I first strated playing the game I liked to find items to kill monsters with. But that got old really fast.
Well I guess since Blizzard does not want PK in diablo3 that this is no longer part of the intended game play. I really did like diablo2 and played it for years and years, and personally I always felt that Pking was for the most part, just for people who wanted to constantly annoy others.
Listen I'm not a WoW fanboy, nor did I really mind Pking in Diablo2, but at least for me, it wasn't very exciting, I never felt any kind of achievement from it... maybe when I was much younger it had a sort of fun fear factor to it. However now that I'm getting into my late 20's I just think that for the most part PKing was and is unnecessary, and it a makes sense to me why Blizzard would opt to remove it from the game.
I can remember on more than one occasion having to just abandon games because a PK'er joined and started harassing me and my party. It didn't scare me, but it did annoy me and when they didn't leave after a few minuets and would constantly toggle their hostility on and off it just meant that I would have to remake the game. When this happens over and over it just gets repetitive and old really fast. Sometimes I'd just get my level 97 barb to join the game and they would leave, but it all just seemed like a big waste of my time.
Other than that, I understand that plenty of the community is all about the PvP, but I think it needs to be more moderated...none of this stuff that's going on now. It should be more of a test of wits and mettle, not sneaking up on a guy who is just trying to play the game.
As I said, a good idea is a separate section of the game where two (or more) people could go at it...i.e. Coliseum/Arena.
It's time to welcome the other 80% of the color wheel to a Diablo game.
Dude.. your rediculous. Not only do you respond to a perfectly good argument with flaming and ludicrous ideas like playing in traffic = not feeling safe in a video game. But your also just plain wrong. There was nothing douchy about PKing, it was INTENDED to be part of this game. Im sorry that you were on the recieving end, but thats how the cookie crumbles.
http://www.bingegamer.net/index.php/2008/an-open-letter-to-diablo-iii-fanboys
So true...
I respond to a "perfectly good argument" with a calm and ordered list of why you are wrong and why you are exactly the reason PvP is on the knife edge of getting cut out of D3.
Also, it's not the way the cookie crumbles, it's the sign of a deranged individual who pleasures from torturing others.
And if PKing was instended to be a part of the game, why is it on the verge of being left out?
It's time to welcome the other 80% of the color wheel to a Diablo game.
Except that while informally-structured PvP (since there was no 'official' system in D2) and PvE involved competition and cooperation respectively, griefing (a term I prefer because it's more descriptive and less confusing--technically all PvP involves "PKing" since players die when you duel) involves enjoying the game at the cost of directly interfering with others' enjoyment of the game.
For those players who like the 'thrill' of being at risk of being griefed, they can leave 'free'/'open' PvP on in games they create. Others shouldn't have to subject themselves to griefing just because a griefer enjoys screwing with them.
If it's such a "HUGE" part, why is the solution of allowing people to toggle it in their games such an issue? If it's such a "HUGE" part, few would opt out of it, right?
1. I find it funny that you would consider even a majority to be "some people"--nice try at being misleading. Now, let's see how your sentence would sound if written accurately:
"there really is no reason to change it [just] because most people don't like to be PKd"
Now you read that to yourself and tell me if you think it makes sense.
Also, you made a straw man. Who says that everyone who doesn't like the concept of griefing "ONLY want[s] the PvE experience"? What if they enjoy structured PvP instead, or also? There's probably a good number of players who focus on PvP, but are interested only in honorable fights, as opposed to griefer's sneaky ambushes. They could very well argue that it takes more skill to beat a player who's ready and willing to take you on, and that griefing doesn't attract them for that reason.
Two-dimensional graphics have also always been a part of the game. This is the is-ought fallacy--just because something is (or was) a certain way doesn't mean it ought to be/stay that way.
Like I said, if there is a system where you can toggle 'open' PvP (allowing griefing) when you make a game:
1. If most people opt into it, then there's no problem--griefers will have plenty of places to 'do their thing', while the minority can also do their thing, enjoying the game their way.
2. If most people opt OUT of it, then there's no argument that removing griefing would 'destruct' Diablo 3, since that would be proof positive that griefers are a small minority that wouldn't have any significant effect on the success of the game.
You're just being a doomsayer. Claiming that removing griefing will completely wreck the game is absurd, especially with the addition of structured PvP, something that Diablo 2 never had to begin with.
It was more than just the WoW crowd. Only 3 games have been, to my rememberance, have had sucess evenwith PK'ing: EQ 1, Ultima Online, and Diablo series. The other MMO's I can't speak for being that I haven't played them. The majority MAY have some type of PvP, but not a PK'ing system, par se. EQ had PvP servers and Ultima online and Diablo 1 had open season. D2 had a hostility button. I would look further into the history of PK'ing through ALL games and see where it's been leading. The player base for random PK'ing MAY be smaller than you think, or at least SHRINKING over the years. These are theories so don't flame, please. I'm just suggesting more research to see where the majority populace is going. I won't matter what I say or anybody else for that matter.
Yeah I said I wouldn't say anything on the topic any more, but I really don't think we should bash a crowd from another game for not wanting PK'ing in Diablo 3. Acutally, they shouldn't have a say unless they actually PLAYED D1 and D2 on a regular basis.
It's time to welcome the other 80% of the color wheel to a Diablo game.
Much appreciated.
Other then that, i hope they divide us by realms because some of us like diablo as it was and as it was intended. Choas was the name of the game.. not structured kiddie BS.
http://www.bingegamer.net/index.php/2008/an-open-letter-to-diablo-iii-fanboys
So true...
Please. You obviously care what we think or else you wouldn't be posting here at all. Who do you think you're kidding?
"Choas" isn't even a word. (you walked into it)
1. Isn't pointless flaming like this the reason another thread on the subject got locked?
2. By that logic, real life is "kiddie BS" because there are laws against disturbing the peace.