HC just gives you a reason to pay attention to what your doing. SC is to much of a mindless meat grind for me. If they were to penalize players for dying in SC, say the loss of an item or wiping of Paragon levels, than I might actually play SC. Until then, I'll be sticking with HC.
The biggest problem with HC right now, imo, is the lack of player base towards the middle/end of the season. A lot of big streamers have always played SC and the ones who didn't before have made the jump to SC for season 4.
Personally, I get why a lot of folks enjoy standard mode. It's kinda nice to be able to die and not have it be a big deal. But for me, I need a bit more excitement, especially without a sensible PvP in diablo 3.
One thing you'll never see in HC (something you hear a lot of complaints about in standard); You'll never see a paragon 5 with all yellows equipped trying to leech in t6-t10 games. That tells us a lot about the differences between these modes.
1. I don't know if it is just me, but I treat my softcore characters like they are HC when I'm pushing rifts. Dead DPS = no dps, so dying is very counterproductive to progression. Also, I hate high repair bills, so...
2. You have a really good point about the leaching player.
HC just gives you a reason to pay attention to what your doing. SC is to much of a mindless meat grind for me. If they were to penalize players for dying in SC, say the loss of an item or wiping of Paragon levels, than I might actually play SC.
There is already a mode with a penalty for death. I don't think Blizz would change that at this point.
HC just gives you a reason to pay attention to what your doing. SC is to much of a mindless meat grind for me. If they were to penalize players for dying in SC, say the loss of an item or wiping of Paragon levels, than I might actually play SC.
There is already a mode with a penalty for death. I don't think Blizz would change that at this point.
With the aspect of competition inexorably tied to Grifts, SC players suffer stacking time penalties from death. So there's that. That functions as a DP good enough I believe.
HC in all diablo's has never had boosted drops/exp, cheaper items, etc. The point is to actually lose something when you die. Making things twice as fast to obtain or level contradicts this philosophy. If anything they should do the opposite.. I think drops should be lowered and prices increased, or add even harder difficulties (i.e. higher torments) only in HC.
When we had a market HC items actually were less expensive than SC items. I should say more "sane" given that pieces became millions of gold, tens of millions of gold, and then hundreds of millions of gold out of reach for most players. But in HC items stayed relatively affordable and usable. In fact, that was one of the early draws to HC for many of us back then...the low level gear was actually usable rather than pointless. Back then whites were actually worn and you might have to use a yellow for a very long time. Now that's less true, but the market was the closest analogue to POE's economy given what he wrote (I've never played it) about things being cheaper; unless he means at a vendor.
I guess one benefit to playing HC is the sense of being an elitist prick you gain from thinking you're somehow better than anyone that doesn't play HC.
I agree with this somewhat. And a lot of the comments in this thread seem to prove this.
That being said, I know plenty of HC players that really suck at this game. So....take that for what it's worth.
Vouch; he's talking about me, the sucky part. I suck to much to be an elitist
The reason i play hardcore is because when i was playing SC i felt like there wasnt any challenge. When you play hardcore there is always that kind of fear of dying and when a friend of yours die it very nice to make fun of him.
The reason i play hardcore is because when i was playing SC i felt like there wasnt any challenge. When you play hardcore there is always that kind of fear of dying and when a friend of yours die it very nice to make fun of him.
I've always played both HC and SC. The two modes have rival pulls on me : in Hardcore, there is of course the ever-present sense of excitement and danger, you can never allow yourself to fall into the pattern of mindless grinding and farming. But on the flip-side, one of the things that I have always found iconic in Diablo is hurling yourself headlong into an enormous crowd of enemies, with no regard for danger, and Hardcore really discourages that playstyle. :-) So I love normal / "Softcore" mode for sheer visceral action, and I love Hardcore mode for tension and excitement.
And it would be a really bad idea for them to give different rewards.
The truth is; HC is more of a challenge than Standard, this cannot be argued. It isn't up for debate.
The game isn't more of a challenge, it just has a lose condition. In fact, the way many people play HC the game ends up being significantly LESS of a challenge, because you avoid anything that could seriously threaten the life of your character. In Season 3, a Softcore group of 4 cleared grift 77. In Hardcore, the higher cleared grift was 68. I would wager that nobody in Hardcore ever even attempted a 77.
Simply put, some people enjoy the challenge of taking on content that pushes the limits of their gear more than the "challenge" of not disconnecting and not having a partner that gets you killed. Some people enjoy trying again when they fail to meet that challenge, rather than giving up and starting over. Which isn't to discount the challenge of keeping yourself alive, but just to say that it is a very different challenge, and not necessarily "more" of one.
The truth is; HC is more of a challenge than Standard, this cannot be argued. It isn't up for debate.
The game isn't more of a challenge, it just has a lose condition. In fact, the way many people play HC the game ends up being significantly LESS of a challenge, because you avoid anything that could seriously threaten the life of your character. In Season 3, a Softcore group of 4 cleared grift 77. In Hardcore, the higher cleared grift was 68. I would wager that nobody in Hardcore ever even attempted a 77.
Simply put, some people enjoy the challenge of taking on content that pushes the limits of their gear more than the "challenge" of not disconnecting and not having a partner that gets you killed. Some people enjoy trying again when they fail to meet that challenge, rather than giving up and starting over. Which isn't to discount the challenge of keeping yourself alive, but just to say that it is a very different challenge, and not necessarily "more" of one.
I have to say I agree. On the times I've played HC, I was overly cautious and never tried "pushing" my character to see what he/she could handle. For people that play HC exclusively, I know they push WAY, WAY harder than someone like myself, but like HarleyM stated, they aren't going to go gonzo as often like a SC char will.
The truth is; HC is more of a challenge than Standard, this cannot be argued. It isn't up for debate.
The game isn't more of a challenge, it just has a lose condition. In fact, the way many people play HC the game ends up being significantly LESS of a challenge, because you avoid anything that could seriously threaten the life of your character. In Season 3, a Softcore group of 4 cleared grift 77. In Hardcore, the higher cleared grift was 68. I would wager that nobody in Hardcore ever even attempted a 77.
Simply put, some people enjoy the challenge of taking on content that pushes the limits of their gear more than the "challenge" of not disconnecting and not having a partner that gets you killed. Some people enjoy trying again when they fail to meet that challenge, rather than giving up and starting over. Which isn't to discount the challenge of keeping yourself alive, but just to say that it is a very different challenge, and not necessarily "more" of one.
There is a myth that most/all HC players "play it safe" by staying in low torments and hiding under low Grift tiers.
To boil out the fat; We see the challenge of softcore grifting is to beat the timer....that's it. You're against a clock and that's it.
In HC, you're against that same clock with the added challenge of not making a serious mistake and dying. Permanent death, you have to re-roll that character before you try again.
This is what I mean by "more of a challenge". There is literally more of a challenge in HC. Softcore players didn't clear 77 because they can face more of a challenge than HC players. They did so because they could die and keep going.
I absolutely assure you that many HC players tried to get higher than 68. There is no leaderboard showing "good tries". Many tried and failed because they cannot play with the same reckless abandon that SC players do. As well, many tried and failed because they died....ya know....due to the extra challenges of HC play.
That's what POE's tempest (HC) league is like. It's more difficult. Monsters can do more damage, have more hp, have resists to certain types of damage, their mod system is very detailed.
This would be kind of pointless in modern D3 because you have a difficulty slider you can adjust at any point in character progression. Particularly now that Torment 10 is being added.
I said many, not most, for a reason. I would guess that far more play it safe than you think, though likely fewer than I would guess. Either way, nobody on hardcore ever attempted 77. The challenges of a clock on 77 are inherently different than the same clock 9 levels lower, even if you add no death as a restriction. To some it is more of a challenge. To you it is less. I think we could both agree that softcore 77 is more of a challenge than hardcore 1, and similarly that hardcore 77 is more of a challenge than softcore 77... The question is where the inversion point is.
To say otherwise is to say that peewee football is more of a challenge than Olympic slalom skiing, because in skiing you are just facing a clock...that's it. It utterly disregards the fact that a clock can be more of a challenge than anything else. Whether you enjoy racing a clock is a different matter entirely, but it doesn't speak to "challenge".
I've seen more random disconnects from the game this season alone than in the previous 3 put together, so safe to say I'm glad I am not playing HC. I would consider it were I able to play it offline (thus not dependant upon a network connection), but with the game as is, nope. It's enough to "start over" once a season as it is for me. But what is my cup of tea isn't everyone else's.
I personally play HC on PoE because the game seems balanced around it unlike D3 imo.
I won't explain in details because this is a diablo forums but I will list what I don't like about D3 HC.
You keep all your paragon levels when you die (That alone defeats the purpose of HC for me)
You can be power level in like 15 minutes
If your ISP or BNET decides to derp pray that your character can live 30 seconds.
PoE HC also has its flaws but they are minor things or not as big of a deal to me, to be clear I want to play HC but it is handled too poorly in this game for me to bother.
HC just gives you a reason to pay attention to what your doing. SC is to much of a mindless meat grind for me. If they were to penalize players for dying in SC, say the loss of an item or wiping of Paragon levels, than I might actually play SC. Until then, I'll be sticking with HC.
The biggest problem with HC right now, imo, is the lack of player base towards the middle/end of the season. A lot of big streamers have always played SC and the ones who didn't before have made the jump to SC for season 4.
SC is supposedly more competitive too.
2. You have a really good point about the leaching player.
BurningRope#1322 (US~HC) Request an invite to the official (NA) <dfans> Clan
Vouch; he's talking about me, the sucky part. I suck to much to be an elitist
The reason i play hardcore is because when i was playing SC i felt like there wasnt any challenge. When you play hardcore there is always that kind of fear of dying and when a friend of yours die it very nice to make fun of him.
I've always played both HC and SC. The two modes have rival pulls on me : in Hardcore, there is of course the ever-present sense of excitement and danger, you can never allow yourself to fall into the pattern of mindless grinding and farming. But on the flip-side, one of the things that I have always found iconic in Diablo is hurling yourself headlong into an enormous crowd of enemies, with no regard for danger, and Hardcore really discourages that playstyle. :-) So I love normal / "Softcore" mode for sheer visceral action, and I love Hardcore mode for tension and excitement.
And it would be a really bad idea for them to give different rewards.
Simply put, some people enjoy the challenge of taking on content that pushes the limits of their gear more than the "challenge" of not disconnecting and not having a partner that gets you killed. Some people enjoy trying again when they fail to meet that challenge, rather than giving up and starting over. Which isn't to discount the challenge of keeping yourself alive, but just to say that it is a very different challenge, and not necessarily "more" of one.
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To boil out the fat; We see the challenge of softcore grifting is to beat the timer....that's it. You're against a clock and that's it.
In HC, you're against that same clock with the added challenge of not making a serious mistake and dying. Permanent death, you have to re-roll that character before you try again.
This is what I mean by "more of a challenge". There is literally more of a challenge in HC. Softcore players didn't clear 77 because they can face more of a challenge than HC players. They did so because they could die and keep going.
I absolutely assure you that many HC players tried to get higher than 68. There is no leaderboard showing "good tries". Many tried and failed because they cannot play with the same reckless abandon that SC players do. As well, many tried and failed because they died....ya know....due to the extra challenges of HC play.
BurningRope#1322 (US~HC) Request an invite to the official (NA) <dfans> Clan
This would be kind of pointless in modern D3 because you have a difficulty slider you can adjust at any point in character progression. Particularly now that Torment 10 is being added.
I said many, not most, for a reason. I would guess that far more play it safe than you think, though likely fewer than I would guess. Either way, nobody on hardcore ever attempted 77. The challenges of a clock on 77 are inherently different than the same clock 9 levels lower, even if you add no death as a restriction. To some it is more of a challenge. To you it is less. I think we could both agree that softcore 77 is more of a challenge than hardcore 1, and similarly that hardcore 77 is more of a challenge than softcore 77... The question is where the inversion point is.
To say otherwise is to say that peewee football is more of a challenge than Olympic slalom skiing, because in skiing you are just facing a clock...that's it. It utterly disregards the fact that a clock can be more of a challenge than anything else. Whether you enjoy racing a clock is a different matter entirely, but it doesn't speak to "challenge".
@OP: There is no advantage, per se.
I've seen more random disconnects from the game this season alone than in the previous 3 put together, so safe to say I'm glad I am not playing HC. I would consider it were I able to play it offline (thus not dependant upon a network connection), but with the game as is, nope. It's enough to "start over" once a season as it is for me. But what is my cup of tea isn't everyone else's.
Every time your screen flashes red, it's like you have a heart attack, you just don't get that from softcore
I personally play HC on PoE because the game seems balanced around it unlike D3 imo.
I won't explain in details because this is a diablo forums but I will list what I don't like about D3 HC.
PoE HC also has its flaws but they are minor things or not as big of a deal to me, to be clear I want to play HC but it is handled too poorly in this game for me to bother.
With adjustable difficulties hardcore died when mp lvls came into the game in like 1.2.
When hardcore mattered only monsters in inferno could drop the good stuff, now they drop in easy mode