I'll admit that for the longest time I dismissed the idea of a melee wizard pretty fast. But I started another wizard to play wtih a friend, and went melee, and it's a lot of fun. But it got me wondering if it stays strong later on.
I was playing in a group, which could have something to do with it. But I had less life then the two monks in the group, and died way less, and have more damage. But am only in normal. I was considering leveling it up to 60 and having it to toy around with, but I don't want to get there and spend the gold to get it set up just to have it really not work.
I'd assume that you would need a crap ton of resistance and health and all the tanky type stats that you see on monks and barbs, but I just don't know if it would pan out.
If there are any out there what builds are you using?
I went straight melee so if it is a range attack at all I'm not using it. I think I heard of one a while back but the build he was using was just spectral blades instead of MM with the typical hyrda build otherwise, which isn't really a melee build to me.
Anyway, just curious as it was a lot of fun.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Tired of the same regurgitated blue posts? Want more in depth coverage of
the aspects of the game you want to know about? Check us out!
You need Critical Mass and a lot of Crit, Life on Hit, Resistance/Armor, and an okay chunk of health (~30k should do it). Diamond Skin is basically our version of Revenge, and if you stack crit high enough you can basically spam cast it like barbarians spam revenge.
I started out as a melee wizard, but have drifted more and more to ranged builds. At higher difficulties when you simply don't own great gear, kiting becomes a pretty appealing strategy. I haven't been melee since I finished Nightmare.
I've been planning to give it another go though. I really thought the build was fun and now that I've got far more runes than I did in Nightmare, it may be more viable. Would love to hear everyone else's experiences with it.
I'm working on getting gear to move onto act 2 inferno as a melee wizard. my skills are currently : http://us.battle.net/d3/en/calculator/wizard#WROXQl!afY!cbcaaZ. It is essentially part of the blizz hydra build but tuned to melee, as venom hydra is amazing for melee since stuff is generally standing still infront of you, and the freeze on blizz helps you take less damage. You still have to kite somewhat, though once you gear gets better doing so doesnt happen near as much, and i have been noticing that i need to do it less and less on my butcher runs as i get more resist.
See, this is why I've been saying a Melee wizard isn't viable in Inferno all along. If your using things like blizzard or meteor, or arcane orb, (unless its the orbit rune) then it's not a melee wizard. Simply using spectral blade does not make you a melee wizard.
However, It figured that you would need insane amounts of resistances and then still need to kite at times for things like fire chains or arcane enchanted. But why no teleport seems like it would be impossible to kite without it since your starting right in front of the monsters, certain affixes would just keep up with you without teleport.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Tired of the same regurgitated blue posts? Want more in depth coverage of
the aspects of the game you want to know about? Check us out!
I've been a melee wizard since the middle of Act II Nightmare and have absolutely fallen in love with the playstyle. It has it's downfalls and weak points but is an absolute blast to play. I've cleared Act I Inferno but there have been plenty of champion packs that have made me question whether or not going melee is worth it. I temporarily switched out to a more "kiting" style build but didn't enjoy it so back to melee I went.
That is my current build and the one I'm most comfortable with. I've tried using energy armor (prismatic, force, and pinpoint barrier) but went back to ice armor with frozen storm for the AoE slowing and damage allowing me to reposition and "mini-kite" if needed. I believe the frozen storm AoE is capable of critical hits which synergizes nicely with critical mass.
I need much better gear to progress in Act II but I'm determined to stick with this build. Have fairly decent up-time on frost nova and diamond skin which makes life a lot easier, more so when playing with a group. Being able to lock the mobs down with frost nova is absolutely amazing while the glass cannons in your group finish them off.
Solo is still exceptionally painful, but mostly doable as long as I don't get awful affix combinations but Inferno is a LOT more fun with friends, more so when you're on mumble/vent/whathaveyou. If you're interested in keeping tabs on my melee wiz build you're welcome to listen to the Diablo community podcast I do, Shattered Soulstone.
See, this is why I've been saying a Melee wizard isn't viable in Inferno all along. If your using things like blizzard or meteor, or arcane orb, (unless its the orbit rune) then it's not a melee wizard. Simply using spectral blade does not make you a melee wizard.
I am a melee wizard currently face-tanking act 3 inferno. I can confirm that it is most definitely viable in inferno. And no, I do not kite or use blizzard, arcane orb.
Meteor is necessary in conjunction with spectral blade because of it's ability to have the dot's crit, and the high life on hit and critical mass proc coefficient (but i cast it in front of me, not at range). I am at the point gear-wise where I do not take damage in act 1 or 2 unless it is a particularly brutal elite combo (and even then, I can survive and kill them without kiting).
In order to comfortably tank act 3, I have self buffed: between 1k and 1.2k resistances depending on resistance, 8.5k armor, 42% crit, 1k LoH, 10 arcane on crit, 40k hp, 20% with 4700 block and some melee and elite damage reduction. After 1.03 these requirements wont be as strict.
I use explosive blast, ice nova, diamond skin, meteor, spectral blade, and prismatic armor. Blur, Evocation, and Critical Mass.
See, this is why I've been saying a Melee wizard isn't viable in Inferno all along. If your using things like blizzard or meteor, or arcane orb, (unless its the orbit rune) then it's not a melee wizard. Simply using spectral blade does not make you a melee wizard.
However, It figured that you would need insane amounts of resistances and then still need to kite at times for things like fire chains or arcane enchanted. But why no teleport seems like it would be impossible to kite without it since your starting right in front of the monsters, certain affixes would just keep up with you without teleport.
Wait, so barbarians and monks stand in fire chains, desecration, frozen, molten and arcane enchanted in acts 3 and 4? Taking 2 steps back so you're not taking unnecessary damage doesn't make you a ranged caster.
can i ask you about your dps? just out of curiosity...no bashing intended
I currently have 18k DPS. Fairly low, but considering I stand still, can spam meteors and explosive blast (due to arcane on crit) I'm fairly sure that my 18k is considerably more than a standard wizard's 18k, where they spend half their time running away.
Also, Agreed Proxy. Everyone needs to step away from arcane, frozen, molten, etc, even standard melee classes. That doesn't mean barbs and monks are "kiting" if they avoid unnecessary damage.
18k dps sounds fairly nice to be honest, since barbs have around 11k and still manage to play...
that is if you REALLY can stand face to face...gonna try this shit out, to me it sounds much better than running around like tard for X mins, then do 1 (ONE) mistake in glass cannon build...BAM...mobs heal to full and do it all over again
You can definitely stand face to face. But, be aware, that much like Barbs or Monks, melee wizards are very gear dependent, and it is going to cost you quite a bit to gear up for it. Focus on Resistances, crit / crit damage, vit, and int. In that order.
I actually tried that build and the damage output is alot more than 18k would suggest (im at about 17k myself) and your cooldowns come back like crazy when fighting groups. I think i will alter it more to my playstyle some later, possibly switch out frost nova for slow time with the extra damage. My question is why evocation? frost nova and diamond skin arent that bad with CDs, and with 42% crit i would think you would almost be able to chain cast them. (with only 17% crit and that build i could have 2 slow times up at once for a few seconds) I would think throwing either galvanized ward or either conflag or arcane dynamo would be better for the extra damage. (actually now that i think about it i think dynmo would be very good with this build since both meteor and explosive blast have such high damage already)
I already have a standard wizard in Inferno, so this new wizard won't be a main focus, but this certainly sounds like a fun side project to keep an eye out for gear.
It's just a really fun play style, and it was so surprising to see some of the damage that I was doing. I definitely see what you mean about 18k being more than a standard wizard having 18k. I'm not in Inferno on my melee wizard, hell I'm not even in NM yet, but I often felt like I was doing way more damage then the rest of my group was even with lower damage values.
I am a little lost on this meteor thing though. Why is it necessary, is it for the AP return? Or for the LoH? I want to try and find a way to use only melee attacks. Something a bit closer to this, which is pretty close to one posted by someone on the first page I think:
That's pretty close to the build I'm using now. I would probably change to force armor after I got enough resistances to not need the boost. But anyway, why is the Meteor that important?
And what do you guys think of Arcane Orbit? It's what I'm using right now, kind of due to lack of options at my low level, the only thing I don't really like about it thouhg is the slow animation for activating it.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Tired of the same regurgitated blue posts? Want more in depth coverage of
the aspects of the game you want to know about? Check us out!
I already have a standard wizard in Inferno, so this new wizard won't be a main focus, but this certainly sounds like a fun side project to keep an eye out for gear.
It's just a really fun play style, and it was so surprising to see some of the damage that I was doing. I definitely see what you mean about 18k being more than a standard wizard having 18k. I'm not in Inferno on my melee wizard, hell I'm not even in NM yet, but I often felt like I was doing way more damage then the rest of my group was even with lower damage values.
I am a little lost on this meteor thing though. Why is it necessary, is it for the AP return? Or for the LoH? I want to try and find a way to use only melee attacks. Something a bit closer to this, which is pretty close to one posted by someone on the first page I think:
That's pretty close to the build I'm using now. I would probably change to force armor after I got enough resistances to not need the boost. But anyway, why is the Meteor that important?
And what do you guys think of Arcane Orbit? It's what I'm using right now, kind of due to lack of options at my low level, the only thing I don't really like about it thouhg is the slow animation for activating it.
Sleet storm is good, the only issue is you cant move at all while using it, where the others (like meteor/explosive blast/blizzard) you can reposition while doing damage. (which you NEED vs molten/firechains) Arcane orbit in my opinion is horrible. the cast animation is kinda slow and the orbs explode when touching ANYTHING destructable, so you have to cast it VERY VERY often. also it is dependent on when each orb actually touches a monster, so you may have a bunch of them grouped infront of you, but lose a couple on a random few that come from the side or behind.
Also for explosive blast i prefer the short fuse rune. 2.5 seconds on time bomb is ALOT of time for stuff to move out of the way, if it be something that tries range kiting you, or a fast molten fire chains you need to keep moving for, it essentially makes that rune useless.
just finished act2, tried act 3 siegebreaker, got absolutely obliterated, i guess i need more then 1k resist ><
Swap to force armor, he hits too hard for prismatic unless you've got 1300 physical resist/9k armor. And avoid getting hit by his 3-hit combo, it's the only thing that should be able to kill you.
I'm actually running right now without the Critical Mass/Crit build, and pretty happy with it. Not been comfortable in Act 2 just yet, but Act 1 is a laughing stock.
I find that with Evocation + Cooldown reductions on Wave of Force and Frost Nova, they are up pretty often.
With Enchantress + Energy Armor
54k Health, 12.5k DPS, 857 LoH, 6175 Armor (67.30%), 700-800 Resists.
My resists will improve if I can find a usable helm that is an actual upgrade with some All Resist (thinking 50-60). Also need some resists on my Belt, Pants, and Gloves too. Thinking the 15% IAS on my gloves will be quickly devauled soon with the adjustment to IAS in 1.0.3.
1.0.3 has made melee wizard at least twice as powerful. I can survive getting vortexed into fire chains/molten for a few seconds now. (In act 3, that is.)
Also steamrolling soul rippers/soul lashers.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
I was playing in a group, which could have something to do with it. But I had less life then the two monks in the group, and died way less, and have more damage. But am only in normal. I was considering leveling it up to 60 and having it to toy around with, but I don't want to get there and spend the gold to get it set up just to have it really not work.
I'd assume that you would need a crap ton of resistance and health and all the tanky type stats that you see on monks and barbs, but I just don't know if it would pan out.
If there are any out there what builds are you using?
I went straight melee so if it is a range attack at all I'm not using it. I think I heard of one a while back but the build he was using was just spectral blades instead of MM with the typical hyrda build otherwise, which isn't really a melee build to me.
Anyway, just curious as it was a lot of fun.
Tired of the same regurgitated blue posts? Want more in depth coverage of
the aspects of the game you want to know about? Check us out!
Here's an Izual kill: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vJFoau5MofQ&feature=plcp
4 stacks of NV there, so same build does work against elite/champ packs in act 4.
http://us.battle.net/d3/pt/calculator/wizard#WcXROm!agX!YYYbcc
It's not execly an melee build but it's the closest thing that works. The idea of getting tanky items is to make good use out of Archon.
I've been planning to give it another go though. I really thought the build was fun and now that I've got far more runes than I did in Nightmare, it may be more viable. Would love to hear everyone else's experiences with it.
However, It figured that you would need insane amounts of resistances and then still need to kite at times for things like fire chains or arcane enchanted. But why no teleport seems like it would be impossible to kite without it since your starting right in front of the monsters, certain affixes would just keep up with you without teleport.
Tired of the same regurgitated blue posts? Want more in depth coverage of
the aspects of the game you want to know about? Check us out!
http://us.battle.net/d3/en/calculator/wizard#WZYXfS!fga!aYZacZ
That is my current build and the one I'm most comfortable with. I've tried using energy armor (prismatic, force, and pinpoint barrier) but went back to ice armor with frozen storm for the AoE slowing and damage allowing me to reposition and "mini-kite" if needed. I believe the frozen storm AoE is capable of critical hits which synergizes nicely with critical mass.
I need much better gear to progress in Act II but I'm determined to stick with this build. Have fairly decent up-time on frost nova and diamond skin which makes life a lot easier, more so when playing with a group. Being able to lock the mobs down with frost nova is absolutely amazing while the glass cannons in your group finish them off.
Solo is still exceptionally painful, but mostly doable as long as I don't get awful affix combinations but Inferno is a LOT more fun with friends, more so when you're on mumble/vent/whathaveyou. If you're interested in keeping tabs on my melee wiz build you're welcome to listen to the Diablo community podcast I do, Shattered Soulstone.
Cheers!
I am a melee wizard currently face-tanking act 3 inferno. I can confirm that it is most definitely viable in inferno. And no, I do not kite or use blizzard, arcane orb.
Meteor is necessary in conjunction with spectral blade because of it's ability to have the dot's crit, and the high life on hit and critical mass proc coefficient (but i cast it in front of me, not at range). I am at the point gear-wise where I do not take damage in act 1 or 2 unless it is a particularly brutal elite combo (and even then, I can survive and kill them without kiting).
In order to comfortably tank act 3, I have self buffed: between 1k and 1.2k resistances depending on resistance, 8.5k armor, 42% crit, 1k LoH, 10 arcane on crit, 40k hp, 20% with 4700 block and some melee and elite damage reduction. After 1.03 these requirements wont be as strict.
I use explosive blast, ice nova, diamond skin, meteor, spectral blade, and prismatic armor. Blur, Evocation, and Critical Mass.
Act 4 still smashes my face in though.
I currently have 18k DPS. Fairly low, but considering I stand still, can spam meteors and explosive blast (due to arcane on crit) I'm fairly sure that my 18k is considerably more than a standard wizard's 18k, where they spend half their time running away.
Also, Agreed Proxy. Everyone needs to step away from arcane, frozen, molten, etc, even standard melee classes. That doesn't mean barbs and monks are "kiting" if they avoid unnecessary damage.
I got lucky with my finds on the AH.
I already have a standard wizard in Inferno, so this new wizard won't be a main focus, but this certainly sounds like a fun side project to keep an eye out for gear.
It's just a really fun play style, and it was so surprising to see some of the damage that I was doing. I definitely see what you mean about 18k being more than a standard wizard having 18k. I'm not in Inferno on my melee wizard, hell I'm not even in NM yet, but I often felt like I was doing way more damage then the rest of my group was even with lower damage values.
I am a little lost on this meteor thing though. Why is it necessary, is it for the AP return? Or for the LoH? I want to try and find a way to use only melee attacks. Something a bit closer to this, which is pretty close to one posted by someone on the first page I think:
http://us.battle.net/d3/en/calculator/wizard#WZYXOh!fga!aYZacZ
That's pretty close to the build I'm using now. I would probably change to force armor after I got enough resistances to not need the boost. But anyway, why is the Meteor that important?
And what do you guys think of Arcane Orbit? It's what I'm using right now, kind of due to lack of options at my low level, the only thing I don't really like about it thouhg is the slow animation for activating it.
Tired of the same regurgitated blue posts? Want more in depth coverage of
the aspects of the game you want to know about? Check us out!
Sleet storm is good, the only issue is you cant move at all while using it, where the others (like meteor/explosive blast/blizzard) you can reposition while doing damage. (which you NEED vs molten/firechains) Arcane orbit in my opinion is horrible. the cast animation is kinda slow and the orbs explode when touching ANYTHING destructable, so you have to cast it VERY VERY often. also it is dependent on when each orb actually touches a monster, so you may have a bunch of them grouped infront of you, but lose a couple on a random few that come from the side or behind.
Also for explosive blast i prefer the short fuse rune. 2.5 seconds on time bomb is ALOT of time for stuff to move out of the way, if it be something that tries range kiting you, or a fast molten fire chains you need to keep moving for, it essentially makes that rune useless.
My Build: http://us.battle.net/d3/en/calculator/wizard#WRYdXO!afb!cbZZac
I find that with Evocation + Cooldown reductions on Wave of Force and Frost Nova, they are up pretty often.
With Enchantress + Energy Armor
54k Health, 12.5k DPS, 857 LoH, 6175 Armor (67.30%), 700-800 Resists.
My resists will improve if I can find a usable helm that is an actual upgrade with some All Resist (thinking 50-60). Also need some resists on my Belt, Pants, and Gloves too. Thinking the 15% IAS on my gloves will be quickly devauled soon with the adjustment to IAS in 1.0.3.
Also steamrolling soul rippers/soul lashers.