If you switch you lose the neph valor buff. If you don't have the buff, bosses drop crap loot.
Have they confirmed that or is it just being assumed? The 1st and last thing I heard about it was they were considering it.
Losing the buff if you changed a skill/rune/passive was confirmed from the second they announced it. One of the major points of the system was to not have people swapping builds between fights.
Making builds for inferno boss kills when you don't know what skills will or will not be effective on said bosses, nor the gear bonuses that you may have, seems.....silly.
exactly. thats why i made the build under the assumption that CC on bosses in inferno doesnt work. i mean if it did it would make it too easy IMO, being able to say super slow a melee boss just doesnt seem like something they would allow in the hardest difficulty. obviously they will have other abilties but i just dont see CC working on the end-act bosses in there.
it does the same exact thing only better... it's only 2 fundamental changes... but whatever.
the dogs are very crucial for survival. they not only distract the boss when summoned but also will drop many health globes over the course of the long fight when your exploding them and with a 35% chance to re-summon and re-explode pile-on doesnt even come close to a good substitute. if you miss with pile-on (because it takes a second to cast if youve seen it done) then you just wasted it and have to wait a half a minute to use it again. sacrifice will never miss because your dogs run toward the boss like homing missiles and each explodes in a 12 y radius
This is the build I will probably use pretty much through all of inferno I hope.
The problem comes when the boss hits his enrage timer and starts spawning a 3 times the amount of mobs in between his animation (as said by Jay Wilson in the interview post). This build allows me to single target the boss while still being able to deal with the aoe packs in a timely manner. It also gives me a lot of mana back for when I need to blow all cooldowns and get rid of all the spawned masses.
The problem with zdog explode is that you have no control over where the zdogs go. Let's say all of the dogs are attacking the boss but 10 adds just got summoned. You're a bit screwed in this situation because you don't want to use the dogs to only damage the boss. Kite them next to the dogs (right next to the boss)... yeah that's not very safe.
Also, if skeleton king is any indication, dogs will not last long at all in boss fights. This is a very safe assumption because bosses will be very scripted and the key to defeating them is avoiding their damage. Sadly, dogs are stupid and will get hit by every ability and therefore often get 1 shot. Using up 2 skill slots on a boss only build seems like a very odd choice when you can add an oh shit button and a CONTROLLABLE aoe skill. If you don't like pile on, add something like dire bats or zombie bears. Personally, I feel like Pile On is much better since it's likely that adds will only come about once every x seconds. I've seen the videos, it doesn't take long to fire off, I don't expect it to be a problem in the hands of a skilled player (which you claim to be) to be able to hit a mass of mobs.
It's just pure speculation like others have said... but the current facts we have shows that zdogs are horrible on bosses.
did you not read the part in my thread where i specifically said dogs will insta-die on bosses? and thats exactly WHY im exploding them. lol.... and u seemed to have completely ignored the part where they drop mad health globes to keep you alive
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"once the pretty hardcore gamers we had testing inferno found it fairly difficult, we then we doubled it" -trolololol jay wilson
The problem with zdog explode is that you have no control over where the zdogs go. Let's say all of the dogs are attacking the boss but 10 adds just got summoned. You're a bit screwed in this situation because you don't want to use the dogs to only damage the boss. Kite them next to the dogs (right next to the boss)... yeah that's not very safe.
Also, if skeleton king is any indication, dogs will not last long at all in boss fights. This is a very safe assumption because bosses will be very scripted and the key to defeating them is avoiding their damage. Sadly, dogs are stupid and will get hit by every ability and therefore often get 1 shot. Using up 2 skill slots on a boss only build seems like a very odd choice when you can add an oh shit button and a CONTROLLABLE aoe skill. If you don't like pile on, add something like dire bats or zombie bears. Personally, I feel like Pile On is much better since it's likely that adds will only come about once every x seconds. I've seen the videos, it doesn't take long to fire off, I don't expect it to be a problem in the hands of a skilled player (which you claim to be) to be able to hit a mass of mobs.
It's just pure speculation like others have said... but the current facts we have shows that zdogs are horrible on bosses.
did you not read the part in my thread where i specifically said dogs will insta-die on bosses? and thats exactly WHY im exploding them. lol.... and u seemed to have completely ignored the part where they drop mad health globes to keep you alive
15% to drop a hp globe is pretty low even if you have 4 dogs out trying to spawn them. I guess it all depends because if the HP globes never go away once they are spawned then the globe spawn could be great especially if you do a lot of kiting you could gather globes up in certain areas and then run to them when you need a quick pick me up and your hp pots are on CD. Personally I don't really like sacrifice builds in inferno because it makes the WD just seem so vulnerable. And by that I mean actually using the dogs to gain aggro against the mobs that spawn other than the SK. If the damage is huge it will be critical to make sure you spawn them at the same time the SK spawns mobs to help you get a little advantage.
The problem with zdog explode is that you have no control over where the zdogs go. Let's say all of the dogs are attacking the boss but 10 adds just got summoned. You're a bit screwed in this situation because you don't want to use the dogs to only damage the boss. Kite them next to the dogs (right next to the boss)... yeah that's not very safe.
Also, if skeleton king is any indication, dogs will not last long at all in boss fights. This is a very safe assumption because bosses will be very scripted and the key to defeating them is avoiding their damage. Sadly, dogs are stupid and will get hit by every ability and therefore often get 1 shot. Using up 2 skill slots on a boss only build seems like a very odd choice when you can add an oh shit button and a CONTROLLABLE aoe skill. If you don't like pile on, add something like dire bats or zombie bears. Personally, I feel like Pile On is much better since it's likely that adds will only come about once every x seconds. I've seen the videos, it doesn't take long to fire off, I don't expect it to be a problem in the hands of a skilled player (which you claim to be) to be able to hit a mass of mobs.
It's just pure speculation like others have said... but the current facts we have shows that zdogs are horrible on bosses.
did you not read the part in my thread where i specifically said dogs will insta-die on bosses? and thats exactly WHY im exploding them. lol.... and u seemed to have completely ignored the part where they drop mad health globes to keep you alive
The avarage of Health Orbs dropped by sacrifice with 4 dogs active is 0.6. Yeah, lower then one Health Globe per sacrifice. Not reliable imo.
They nerfed the whole sacrifice dogs engine to death.
The problem with zdog explode is that you have no control over where the zdogs go. Let's say all of the dogs are attacking the boss but 10 adds just got summoned. You're a bit screwed in this situation because you don't want to use the dogs to only damage the boss. Kite them next to the dogs (right next to the boss)... yeah that's not very safe.
Also, if skeleton king is any indication, dogs will not last long at all in boss fights. This is a very safe assumption because bosses will be very scripted and the key to defeating them is avoiding their damage. Sadly, dogs are stupid and will get hit by every ability and therefore often get 1 shot. Using up 2 skill slots on a boss only build seems like a very odd choice when you can add an oh shit button and a CONTROLLABLE aoe skill. If you don't like pile on, add something like dire bats or zombie bears. Personally, I feel like Pile On is much better since it's likely that adds will only come about once every x seconds. I've seen the videos, it doesn't take long to fire off, I don't expect it to be a problem in the hands of a skilled player (which you claim to be) to be able to hit a mass of mobs.
It's just pure speculation like others have said... but the current facts we have shows that zdogs are horrible on bosses.
did you not read the part in my thread where i specifically said dogs will insta-die on bosses? and thats exactly WHY im exploding them. lol.... and u seemed to have completely ignored the part where they drop mad health globes to keep you alive
Really? You plan on using the dogs for a single target nuke? Your build just got 100 times worse then. How exactly do you plan on killing the adds in boss fights? You will do 458% aoe damage over EIGHT seconds. That won't even be enough damage to kill the adds so how exactly do you plan on dealing with them?
I ignored the part about "mad" health globe drops because the drop rate is so low that on a skill with a 1 minute cooldown it's neglectable.
This is my ideal build for the witch doctor for both boss inferno PVE and (with some rune changes) PVP as well. I feel that it dps can be maximized with two damage over times (haunt and pestilent swarm) and one high single target dps (spirit barrage or poison dart). The rest of the abilities provide damage mitigation, which Jay highlights is an essential part of inferno. Bad medicine and pestilent swarm have great synergy providing both damage reduction and damage over time with some mana regen when dealing with packs. Haunt (runed) provides a quick 4 second boost of speed but also allows you to deal with any boss adds. The dogs serve as both distractors and damage mitigators (rune), somewhat mirroring the SL/SL lock from WoW. Haunt serves as both a slow and damage over time. Finally Spirit walk provides not only a quick escape from major damage but also enables quick regen. Personally, I think this is going to be THE build for witch doctors.
Really? You plan on using the dogs for a single target nuke? Your build just got 100 times worse then. How exactly do you plan on killing the adds in boss fights? You will do 458% aoe damage over EIGHT seconds. That won't even be enough damage to kill the adds so how exactly do you plan on dealing with them?
lol. yes because every single end-act boss will have adds right? we fought a mini-boss that had some adds, this says nothing about end-act bosses and no one will know until release. each boss will have different mechanics and perhaps some adds and in that case i would design builds to fight each bosses specific mechanics, this build is obviously under the assumption the boss is the only thing your fighting.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"once the pretty hardcore gamers we had testing inferno found it fairly difficult, we then we doubled it" -trolololol jay wilson
Really? You plan on using the dogs for a single target nuke? Your build just got 100 times worse then. How exactly do you plan on killing the adds in boss fights? You will do 458% aoe damage over EIGHT seconds. That won't even be enough damage to kill the adds so how exactly do you plan on dealing with them?
lol. yes because every single end-act boss will have adds right? we fought a mini-boss that had some adds, this says nothing about end-act bosses and no one will know until release. each boss will have different mechanics and perhaps some adds and in that case i would design builds to fight each bosses specific mechanics, this build is obviously under the assumption the boss is the only thing your fighting.
I think it's a safe assumption considering adds dying are the source of life back in this game. There is 0 reason to think that most bosses will have 0 adds in them.
Anyway, I now realize this is such a stupid thing to discuss about making a build for bosses we've yet to face. Each boss will likely have it's absolute best build so planning a build at this time is worthless.
Anyway, I now realize this is such a stupid thing to discuss about making a build for bosses we've yet to face. Each boss will likely have it's absolute best build so planning a build at this time is worthless.
lol
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"once the pretty hardcore gamers we had testing inferno found it fairly difficult, we then we doubled it" -trolololol jay wilson
Really? You plan on using the dogs for a single target nuke? Your build just got 100 times worse then. How exactly do you plan on killing the adds in boss fights? You will do 458% aoe damage over EIGHT seconds. That won't even be enough damage to kill the adds so how exactly do you plan on dealing with them?
lol. yes because every single end-act boss will have adds right? we fought a mini-boss that had some adds, this says nothing about end-act bosses and no one will know until release. each boss will have different mechanics and perhaps some adds and in that case i would design builds to fight each bosses specific mechanics, this build is obviously under the assumption the boss is the only thing your fighting.
I think it's a safe assumption considering adds dying are the source of life back in this game. There is 0 reason to think that most bosses will have 0 adds in them.
Anyway, I now realize this is such a stupid thing to discuss about making a build for bosses we've yet to face. Each boss will likely have it's absolute best build so planning a build at this time is worthless.
It's just an single target build, man relax. I think its a valid try because you're not allways soloing. In case you reach SICK single target damage you will surely be veyr wellcome in any party. Being able to quickly kill a key monster (a summoner, a resser, a rare) is important. Your party members can handle the CC and the AoE while you take down stuff one by one, quickly.
Still i agree sacrifice / dogs are bad, really bad, specially against bosses. Something like Fetish Army deals considerably more damage over the course of time and takes only one slot (it does potentially 2400% base damage over 2 minutes while Sac deals 1600%). Also it doesn't require passives to work well, so you can use important stuff like Jungle Fortitude with the extra slot.
BBV is another option. Combine both (BBV + Fetish Army) and you have a awesome antiboss burst.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"In time the hissing of her sanity
Faded out her voice and soiled her name
And like marked pages in a diary
Everything seemed clean that is unstained
The incoherent talk of ordinary days
Why would we really need to live?
Decide what is clear and what's within a haze
What you should take and what to give" - Opeth
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Losing the buff if you changed a skill/rune/passive was confirmed from the second they announced it. One of the major points of the system was to not have people swapping builds between fights.
This is the build I will probably use pretty much through all of inferno I hope.
http://us.battle.net/d3/en/calculator/witch-doctor#cSXZYT!ZdU!YaYaYc
The problem comes when the boss hits his enrage timer and starts spawning a 3 times the amount of mobs in between his animation (as said by Jay Wilson in the interview post). This build allows me to single target the boss while still being able to deal with the aoe packs in a timely manner. It also gives me a lot of mana back for when I need to blow all cooldowns and get rid of all the spawned masses.
did you not read the part in my thread where i specifically said dogs will insta-die on bosses? and thats exactly WHY im exploding them. lol.... and u seemed to have completely ignored the part where they drop mad health globes to keep you alive
15% to drop a hp globe is pretty low even if you have 4 dogs out trying to spawn them. I guess it all depends because if the HP globes never go away once they are spawned then the globe spawn could be great especially if you do a lot of kiting you could gather globes up in certain areas and then run to them when you need a quick pick me up and your hp pots are on CD. Personally I don't really like sacrifice builds in inferno because it makes the WD just seem so vulnerable. And by that I mean actually using the dogs to gain aggro against the mobs that spawn other than the SK. If the damage is huge it will be critical to make sure you spawn them at the same time the SK spawns mobs to help you get a little advantage.
The avarage of Health Orbs dropped by sacrifice with 4 dogs active is 0.6. Yeah, lower then one Health Globe per sacrifice. Not reliable imo.
They nerfed the whole sacrifice dogs engine to death.
Really? You plan on using the dogs for a single target nuke? Your build just got 100 times worse then. How exactly do you plan on killing the adds in boss fights? You will do 458% aoe damage over EIGHT seconds. That won't even be enough damage to kill the adds so how exactly do you plan on dealing with them?
I ignored the part about "mad" health globe drops because the drop rate is so low that on a skill with a 1 minute cooldown it's neglectable.
This is my ideal build for the witch doctor for both boss inferno PVE and (with some rune changes) PVP as well. I feel that it dps can be maximized with two damage over times (haunt and pestilent swarm) and one high single target dps (spirit barrage or poison dart). The rest of the abilities provide damage mitigation, which Jay highlights is an essential part of inferno. Bad medicine and pestilent swarm have great synergy providing both damage reduction and damage over time with some mana regen when dealing with packs. Haunt (runed) provides a quick 4 second boost of speed but also allows you to deal with any boss adds. The dogs serve as both distractors and damage mitigators (rune), somewhat mirroring the SL/SL lock from WoW. Haunt serves as both a slow and damage over time. Finally Spirit walk provides not only a quick escape from major damage but also enables quick regen. Personally, I think this is going to be THE build for witch doctors.
Criticism is much appreciated
lol. yes because every single end-act boss will have adds right? we fought a mini-boss that had some adds, this says nothing about end-act bosses and no one will know until release. each boss will have different mechanics and perhaps some adds and in that case i would design builds to fight each bosses specific mechanics, this build is obviously under the assumption the boss is the only thing your fighting.
I think it's a safe assumption considering adds dying are the source of life back in this game. There is 0 reason to think that most bosses will have 0 adds in them.
Anyway, I now realize this is such a stupid thing to discuss about making a build for bosses we've yet to face. Each boss will likely have it's absolute best build so planning a build at this time is worthless.
lol
It's just an single target build, man relax. I think its a valid try because you're not allways soloing. In case you reach SICK single target damage you will surely be veyr wellcome in any party. Being able to quickly kill a key monster (a summoner, a resser, a rare) is important. Your party members can handle the CC and the AoE while you take down stuff one by one, quickly.
Still i agree sacrifice / dogs are bad, really bad, specially against bosses. Something like Fetish Army deals considerably more damage over the course of time and takes only one slot (it does potentially 2400% base damage over 2 minutes while Sac deals 1600%). Also it doesn't require passives to work well, so you can use important stuff like Jungle Fortitude with the extra slot.
BBV is another option. Combine both (BBV + Fetish Army) and you have a awesome antiboss burst.