Well those are good points, but the fact of the matter is that they've handled D3 in a horrible way. Im all for them taking their time to make the game and making it good. But announcing it that early, and then making us wait 1-2 years for a game we've been waiting for about 7 years. Its all just ridiculous, the game will probably do well in terms of sales especially if they do a huge campaign to sell it like Dragon Age did. But it just wont make extraordinary sales at release. Maybe a couple of years later it will still be selling copies just like D1 and D2 are, but thats about it.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]"The lord of murder shall perish, but in his death he shall spawn a score of mortal progeny. Chaos shall be sown in their footsteps"
-So sayeth the wise Alaundo
Firstly, Blizzard games have never been known for their state of the art graphics, and frankly, who'd want just another hollow graphics showcase showing off exactly how hairy the dude's balls look like so they can license the graphics engine and live off it.
Since the discussion is about breaking sales records then graphics are definitely going to factor into sales figures when it comes to attracting new gamers. There are many people who will take a pass on D3 if it does not look as current as the rest of the games being released in 2011.. maybe even 2012. That's a long time for other studios to raise the bar for the status quo.
Quote from "Don_guillotine" »
I'm also not exactly sure where you're getting with jerking too many fans by taking too much time to make the game. I mean it was announced about 18 months ago and probably released around halfway 2011 (I'm being optimistic!) giving it about 3 years announcement prior to the release.
If you paid attention to my post, I said that complaint was coming from someone who has been following the SC2 development for years. I don't know if you have been following the development of SC2, but it has been absolutely ridiculous this year when it comes to news and announcements by Blizzard. They are missing targets for news bits by months. They also said in no uncertain terms at the beginning of the year that the beta was starting "soon" and then followed up by saying the beta would start in the summer. Blizzard really needs to shut the hell up until they know exactly when they can deliver. If that means they can't announce anything until the day before the event.. then so be it. I would rather know something for certain than get jerked around by their horribly ambiguous language ALL THE TIME. I'm sure they still think it's cute, but it's growing really old really fast.
Their first mistake with D3 is announcing it so early, knowing that it's going to take at least 3 years to complete. In the coming years I can expect the same piss poor PR management that has been coming from the SC2 development team.
If you think that ill-will is not being generated here due to this, then you are mistaken. People who were mildly interested in D3 when it was announced will have basically forgotten about it when it is released. Who knows if they'll care to pick it up then.
So.. combine the lack of interest by old fans.. and the lack of new and up to date looks for new fans.. and you can expect that this is going to eat into the sales numbers.
Quote from "Don_guillotine" »
Now I'm being cynical, but 3 years is hardly a lot unless somebody's sorta young, very impatient or have the attention span of fifteen seconds - or maybe all at once.
Excuse me? I don't like waiting 3 or more years for a game that I've already been waiting at least 5 years for indicates that I have an attention span of 15 seconds..?? Sorry, no. It indicates that I DON'T HAVE AN ATTENTION SPAN OF 3 BLOODY YEARS. People are going to lose interest in the game by the time it is released. I know the buzz has already worn off for me for SC2. I'm still buying it because I'm a hardcore fan, you see. But it's going to take a helluva lot more than the hardcore fans to break any sales numbers. They need new blood to do that. Remember that this is what the topic is about. Sales numbers.
Quote from "Don_guillotine" »
Also I'm bit cynical towards adding development resources having any real effect. It's the classical problem that if you ordered a man to dig a hole and thought you'd speed things up and hire another man to dig with him, they would get the job done faster, but the effectiveness of adding an extra person diminishes with each person added. In the end there'll just be a few guys digging the hole and the rest watching them.
I believe you're right that, in some case, adding more development resources is not going to help. Too many cooks spoil the broth, right? If you double the team that was responsible for concepting the character skills then you might generate too much tension and too many ideas start to conflict.. and it takes too long to resolve differences. Okay, I get that. I don't want to see the quality of the game suffer because they *rushed* through development. But, taking SC2 as an example again (and yes it is valid to use SC2s development as examples here) if they had added more resources to the development of battle.net, which is basically a separate project from Sc2 and D3 and which was blamed for the delay of SC2 since they grossly underestimated how much work needed to be done, then maybe SC2 would have been on time for a 2009 release.
Also, don't be fooled.. there is a lot of grunt work to be done building these games. Once the basic formula is establish and foundations are built.. you need people to start churning out all sorts of character models for holding different weapons, for generating new dungeons, for drawing all of the items.. etc. All of these things CAN be improved by throwing more people at the project. It's mainly at the concepting level that it hurts to have too many people working on the same thing. But when it comes to churning out digital assets like rigging models and setting triggers on maps.. the more the better. To put it into the same terms as your example.. once you plan out where all the holes have to be dugg, what shape they have to be and how deep you have to go.. then you can hire as many people as you want to digg those holes and speed up the process.
-----------------
The disgruntled fans and the new players that dismiss the game due to graphics are, admittedly, not the majority. Even though I am peeved with Blizz about the way they are handling SC2 and D3 development I'm pretty sure I'll be buying them (SC2, for sure, anyway). So don't take what I said and assume that I am trying to draw a picture of a roudy and angry fan base and a whole world that doesnt care what Blizzard is making because it doesn't look "the best". I am not trying to paint that picture. I am just explaining some reasons why Blizzard is probably not going to break any sales records.. and it basically boils down to an inability to generate a lot of interest from new players, and taking too long with the development that casual fans may simply not care about the game in a couple of years. Either way, the momentum won't be there to break the top sales records that have been set in recent years. Especially those records by console games.
PC sales history was already made by WoW expansions twice. I don't see Diablo breaking the in-one-day sales record, but perhaps the copies-sold record eventually.
That, and a cancellation of their account, is exactly why they aren't in a hurry to release it. Until that changes, don't hold your breath - if you ran a business with a $billion-a-year title coming in nice and steady, would you want to swap half of those addicts, er, I mean customers for a one-time box sale windfall of maybe $300 million in the best of all worlds?
Why not? If most of those people will pay for it and play it. They are in competition with themselves. If most of those people dislike D3 then they'll reactivate their WoW account and get back to rocking the fuck out. Blizzard wins regardless. I'll buy D3 because I have been playing Diablo for a long time and I am interested in how the story will unfold. I haven't played D2 in a year and I am anxiously awaiting D3.
Edit: Yes I think D3 will break sales records. I know many people that are grinding it out on other games and just waiting for it's release.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
The blind mind's eye replies with a sigh and a tear of contempt for those who see the world as it truly is.
Geez you guys write too much text for something that's very simple. My take on it is : "there are other things than gaming in life". It's certain that if you focus on 1 game for 3 years that you're gonna get pissed off and frustrated. After 2 years you'll lose interest and start arguing with people about how much they fail at managing their stuff and whatnot. This is a sign of unnecessary torment and you must all realize that D3 isn't coming out until 1 year and 1/2. Now...it's time to go explore other stuff and freshen up!
Why not? If most of those people will pay for it and play it. They are in competition with themselves. If most of those people dislike D3 then they'll reactivate their WoW account and get back to rocking the fuck out. Blizzard wins regardless. I'll buy D3 because I have been playing Diablo for a long time and I am interested in how the story will unfold. I haven't played D2 in a year and I am anxiously awaiting D3.
Edit: Yes I think D3 will break sales records. I know many people that are grinding it out on other games and just waiting for it's release.
It will probbaly sell a few million over a few years no doubt(maybe even the first year)....quite possibly more then diablo 2 simply due to the fact they can advertise the game for free on WoW on that startup news thingy it has...No doubt its going to be a huge selling game but history making in terms of sales I doubt.
Yes this game will make history and will join the rank of famous games like "Daikatana" or "Duke Nuken Forever", depending on what they are doing right now in Blizzard.
Personally, I think Blizzard are working on using a new full 3D engine like in Starcraft to make good competition to Torchlight and Guild Wars2. In doing so, they are delaying the game by several years.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Thread: Diablo III Release "still a long way to go" #205 08-30-2009, 02:38 AM
yes4me: it is probably going to take until 2012 or 2013 Thread: Will D3 Make History? #44 11-12-2009, 07:26 PM
yes4me: "will make history and will join the rank of famous games like "Daikatana" or "Duke Nuken Forever"
Since the discussion is about breaking sales records then graphics are definitely going to factor into sales figures when it comes to attracting new gamers. There are many people who will take a pass on D3 if it does not look as current as the rest of the games being released in 2011.. maybe even 2012. That's a long time for other studios to raise the bar for the status quo.
If you paid attention to my post, I said that complaint was coming from someone who has been following the SC2 development for years. I don't know if you have been following the development of SC2, but it has been absolutely ridiculous this year when it comes to news and announcements by Blizzard. They are missing targets for news bits by months. They also said in no uncertain terms at the beginning of the year that the beta was starting "soon" and then followed up by saying the beta would start in the summer. Blizzard really needs to shut the hell up until they know exactly when they can deliver. If that means they can't announce anything until the day before the event.. then so be it. I would rather know something for certain than get jerked around by their horribly ambiguous language ALL THE TIME. I'm sure they still think it's cute, but it's growing really old really fast.
Their first mistake with D3 is announcing it so early, knowing that it's going to take at least 3 years to complete. In the coming years I can expect the same piss poor PR management that has been coming from the SC2 development team.
If you think that ill-will is not being generated here due to this, then you are mistaken. People who were mildly interested in D3 when it was announced will have basically forgotten about it when it is released. Who knows if they'll care to pick it up then.
So.. combine the lack of interest by old fans.. and the lack of new and up to date looks for new fans.. and you can expect that this is going to eat into the sales numbers.
Excuse me? I don't like waiting 3 or more years for a game that I've already been waiting at least 5 years for indicates that I have an attention span of 15 seconds..?? Sorry, no. It indicates that I DON'T HAVE AN ATTENTION SPAN OF 3 BLOODY YEARS. People are going to lose interest in the game by the time it is released. I know the buzz has already worn off for me for SC2. I'm still buying it because I'm a hardcore fan, you see. But it's going to take a helluva lot more than the hardcore fans to break any sales numbers. They need new blood to do that. Remember that this is what the topic is about. Sales numbers.
I believe you're right that, in some case, adding more development resources is not going to help. Too many cooks spoil the broth, right? If you double the team that was responsible for concepting the character skills then you might generate too much tension and too many ideas start to conflict.. and it takes too long to resolve differences. Okay, I get that. I don't want to see the quality of the game suffer because they *rushed* through development. But, taking SC2 as an example again (and yes it is valid to use SC2s development as examples here) if they had added more resources to the development of battle.net, which is basically a separate project from Sc2 and D3 and which was blamed for the delay of SC2 since they grossly underestimated how much work needed to be done, then maybe SC2 would have been on time for a 2009 release.
Also, don't be fooled.. there is a lot of grunt work to be done building these games. Once the basic formula is establish and foundations are built.. you need people to start churning out all sorts of character models for holding different weapons, for generating new dungeons, for drawing all of the items.. etc. All of these things CAN be improved by throwing more people at the project. It's mainly at the concepting level that it hurts to have too many people working on the same thing. But when it comes to churning out digital assets like rigging models and setting triggers on maps.. the more the better. To put it into the same terms as your example.. once you plan out where all the holes have to be dugg, what shape they have to be and how deep you have to go.. then you can hire as many people as you want to digg those holes and speed up the process.
-----------------
The disgruntled fans and the new players that dismiss the game due to graphics are, admittedly, not the majority. Even though I am peeved with Blizz about the way they are handling SC2 and D3 development I'm pretty sure I'll be buying them (SC2, for sure, anyway). So don't take what I said and assume that I am trying to draw a picture of a roudy and angry fan base and a whole world that doesnt care what Blizzard is making because it doesn't look "the best". I am not trying to paint that picture. I am just explaining some reasons why Blizzard is probably not going to break any sales records.. and it basically boils down to an inability to generate a lot of interest from new players, and taking too long with the development that casual fans may simply not care about the game in a couple of years. Either way, the momentum won't be there to break the top sales records that have been set in recent years. Especially those records by console games.
I just want to let you know that I read all of it...nice read, and I completely agree with I'd say everything...
Quote from "emilemil1" »
I wonder if it is going to be all over the web and have tons of TV-ads like WoW. I have still not seen a single SC2 ad. I didn't even know it was in development before I read it in this forum, and that was long after the release. And it is like what, half a year from release.
Like I mentioned before; Blizzard needs to use the television to mass advertise for Diablo III 2-3 weeks before release. There are so many people that probably don't even know that D3 was announced.
To the other comment, it is true that D3 was announced too early. I completely forgot about it till I saw it on the internet. After that I was excited for about 6 months till a year, then I got bored waiting. I remember I told my friend that never played the Diablo games that this game was announced, and he saw the videos and said that it looks amazing. After a while he realized that the development was so behind, and thought it was a ridiculous wait - and I agree..
The reason I said this is because a person can only wait so long before he gets sick of waiting..Hardcore fans might be able to wait longer, but not forever.. I will get my masters by the time its released..
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"Not Even Death Can Save You From Me" ~ Diablo (II)
Did you honestly need to post just to let people know that you're too lazy to read a couple of paragraphs?
Waiting for Diablo 3 in particular is a good thing. Adding a lot of content(unique items, loot and the like.) can take awhile, and the longer the game is in development, the more content you get out of the box.
Titan Quest was in development for 6 years. I have played through it on each difficulty about 5 times(15 complete playthroughs) and I was still finding epic and legendary weapons I didn't find before.
If just a week goes by after Diablo 3 releases and there's a database listing all the items in Diablo 3, then that would just be a disappointment.
Considering all the hype surrounding Diablo 3 and judging from the reactions from every WOW playing friend I know, I don't doubt Diablo 3 will make history.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
-So sayeth the wise Alaundo
Since the discussion is about breaking sales records then graphics are definitely going to factor into sales figures when it comes to attracting new gamers. There are many people who will take a pass on D3 if it does not look as current as the rest of the games being released in 2011.. maybe even 2012. That's a long time for other studios to raise the bar for the status quo.
If you paid attention to my post, I said that complaint was coming from someone who has been following the SC2 development for years. I don't know if you have been following the development of SC2, but it has been absolutely ridiculous this year when it comes to news and announcements by Blizzard. They are missing targets for news bits by months. They also said in no uncertain terms at the beginning of the year that the beta was starting "soon" and then followed up by saying the beta would start in the summer. Blizzard really needs to shut the hell up until they know exactly when they can deliver. If that means they can't announce anything until the day before the event.. then so be it. I would rather know something for certain than get jerked around by their horribly ambiguous language ALL THE TIME. I'm sure they still think it's cute, but it's growing really old really fast.
Their first mistake with D3 is announcing it so early, knowing that it's going to take at least 3 years to complete. In the coming years I can expect the same piss poor PR management that has been coming from the SC2 development team.
If you think that ill-will is not being generated here due to this, then you are mistaken. People who were mildly interested in D3 when it was announced will have basically forgotten about it when it is released. Who knows if they'll care to pick it up then.
So.. combine the lack of interest by old fans.. and the lack of new and up to date looks for new fans.. and you can expect that this is going to eat into the sales numbers.
Excuse me? I don't like waiting 3 or more years for a game that I've already been waiting at least 5 years for indicates that I have an attention span of 15 seconds..?? Sorry, no. It indicates that I DON'T HAVE AN ATTENTION SPAN OF 3 BLOODY YEARS. People are going to lose interest in the game by the time it is released. I know the buzz has already worn off for me for SC2. I'm still buying it because I'm a hardcore fan, you see. But it's going to take a helluva lot more than the hardcore fans to break any sales numbers. They need new blood to do that. Remember that this is what the topic is about. Sales numbers.
I believe you're right that, in some case, adding more development resources is not going to help. Too many cooks spoil the broth, right? If you double the team that was responsible for concepting the character skills then you might generate too much tension and too many ideas start to conflict.. and it takes too long to resolve differences. Okay, I get that. I don't want to see the quality of the game suffer because they *rushed* through development. But, taking SC2 as an example again (and yes it is valid to use SC2s development as examples here) if they had added more resources to the development of battle.net, which is basically a separate project from Sc2 and D3 and which was blamed for the delay of SC2 since they grossly underestimated how much work needed to be done, then maybe SC2 would have been on time for a 2009 release.
Also, don't be fooled.. there is a lot of grunt work to be done building these games. Once the basic formula is establish and foundations are built.. you need people to start churning out all sorts of character models for holding different weapons, for generating new dungeons, for drawing all of the items.. etc. All of these things CAN be improved by throwing more people at the project. It's mainly at the concepting level that it hurts to have too many people working on the same thing. But when it comes to churning out digital assets like rigging models and setting triggers on maps.. the more the better. To put it into the same terms as your example.. once you plan out where all the holes have to be dugg, what shape they have to be and how deep you have to go.. then you can hire as many people as you want to digg those holes and speed up the process.
-----------------
The disgruntled fans and the new players that dismiss the game due to graphics are, admittedly, not the majority. Even though I am peeved with Blizz about the way they are handling SC2 and D3 development I'm pretty sure I'll be buying them (SC2, for sure, anyway). So don't take what I said and assume that I am trying to draw a picture of a roudy and angry fan base and a whole world that doesnt care what Blizzard is making because it doesn't look "the best". I am not trying to paint that picture. I am just explaining some reasons why Blizzard is probably not going to break any sales records.. and it basically boils down to an inability to generate a lot of interest from new players, and taking too long with the development that casual fans may simply not care about the game in a couple of years. Either way, the momentum won't be there to break the top sales records that have been set in recent years. Especially those records by console games.
Any Diablo 3 gonna make a huge success I think, but in 2012 or later?
Good. Because it wasn't addressed to you. It was addressed to the other guy who wrote a wall of text.
Why not? If most of those people will pay for it and play it. They are in competition with themselves. If most of those people dislike D3 then they'll reactivate their WoW account and get back to rocking the fuck out. Blizzard wins regardless. I'll buy D3 because I have been playing Diablo for a long time and I am interested in how the story will unfold. I haven't played D2 in a year and I am anxiously awaiting D3.
Edit: Yes I think D3 will break sales records. I know many people that are grinding it out on other games and just waiting for it's release.
The average Joe > The people you know.
Sorry but thats just the sad truth.
What the fuck is that supposed to mean? I thought me and my friends are average Joes.
If SC 2 is a hit (i'm sure it will be) that could encourage more people to get D3 too.
Personally, I think Blizzard are working on using a new full 3D engine like in Starcraft to make good competition to Torchlight and Guild Wars2. In doing so, they are delaying the game by several years.
yes4me: it is probably going to take until 2012 or 2013
Thread: Will D3 Make History? #44 11-12-2009, 07:26 PM
yes4me: "will make history and will join the rank of famous games like "Daikatana" or "Duke Nuken Forever"
previous recordholder was GTA4 with a little over 7 million on the first day.
just letting you know what we're up against
I just want to let you know that I read all of it...nice read, and I completely agree with I'd say everything...
Like I mentioned before; Blizzard needs to use the television to mass advertise for Diablo III 2-3 weeks before release. There are so many people that probably don't even know that D3 was announced.
To the other comment, it is true that D3 was announced too early. I completely forgot about it till I saw it on the internet. After that I was excited for about 6 months till a year, then I got bored waiting. I remember I told my friend that never played the Diablo games that this game was announced, and he saw the videos and said that it looks amazing. After a while he realized that the development was so behind, and thought it was a ridiculous wait - and I agree..
The reason I said this is because a person can only wait so long before he gets sick of waiting..Hardcore fans might be able to wait longer, but not forever.. I will get my masters by the time its released..
Waiting for Diablo 3 in particular is a good thing. Adding a lot of content(unique items, loot and the like.) can take awhile, and the longer the game is in development, the more content you get out of the box.
Titan Quest was in development for 6 years. I have played through it on each difficulty about 5 times(15 complete playthroughs) and I was still finding epic and legendary weapons I didn't find before.
If just a week goes by after Diablo 3 releases and there's a database listing all the items in Diablo 3, then that would just be a disappointment.
I'm going to stick with the same name, i've had it for too long not to keep it...