*edit- im adding a post i made on page 2 as no doubt heaps of people only read the first page then skip to the last page to post so im adding it to the end of the original post
when quite clearly the paladins get their help from the heavens...
During the mid-twelfth century, after the Church of Zakarum had gained prominence in the East, the Church decreed that the visions of Akarat would be spread throughout the known world in order to redeem the masses. Thus, the Church selected a group of its most charismatic and devoted priests and sent them on a mission to proselytize the people of the West.
Unfortunately, the Church had not prepared these men for the rigors of travel nor the hazards of the world. The priests who survived their missions recounted tales of harsh weather, inadequate supplies, attacks from bandits and even encounters with horrible monsters. To ensure the success of future missions, the Church set about training holy warriors, Paladins, to accompany and safeguard their missionaries. In practice, these "Protectors of the Word" proved to be more successful at converting the native peoples than the Priests that they were assigned to defend. Impressing the locals with daring deeds, powerful weapons, and martial prowess was far more convincing than the condemnations of a soft-spoken monk. However, once the Word had been spread to every major city of the West, the "Protectors of the Word" faded from public view.
Some decades later, Paladins were again called into service. During the height of the Time of Troubles, the Church commenced a second campaign of conversion. This time, however, the inconvincible were deemed evil. The Zakarum Inquisition spread through the lands like a tempest, laying waste to all suspected of demonic possession or corruption. Leading this crusade was a new generation of Paladins, known as the "Hand of Zakarum." These cavaliers of righteousness swept through the lands, expunging the taint of demonic contamination wherever they found it.
In the midst of this bloody crusade, a rebellion arose within the ranks of the Paladins of Zakarum. The rebels condemned the methods of the Inquisition, proclaiming that the new Order of Paladins should protect the innocent, and that the evil corruption was rooted in their forebear's failure. They resolved to fight the true source of corruption, the Three Prime Evils - Diablo, Baal and Mephisto. And so, these rebellious Paladins left their Zakarum brethren and ventured west. Traits and Abilities:
Paladins use holy magic as gifted by the High Heavens. They maintain strictly ordered lives, constantly upholding the cause of Virtue and Light. They must never succumb to worldly temptations lest they risk being deceived into following "false lights" - demons masquerading as Heavenly beings.
Paladins may use their skills to increase their prowess with sword and shield, as well as cast blessing "Auras" on themselves and to any who join them. They are particularly skilled against the undead, as they know many holy incantations effective against these types of creatures.
In Diablo 1 and 2 we were given a very vivid sense of fighting for sanctuary. Along our path as mortals we were also given the sense of having the heavens being there to guide us. Naturally we thought the heavens were good guys there to protect us, like the Christian view on God. We or at least i found it quite clear that we didnt see heavens armies down on sanctuary because like God, they would only guide us and occaisonally come down to aid us, similiar to Jesus or any other instance where an angel comes down from heaven in the bible.
I dont think it ever occured to anyone before the books that heaven could be filled with douche bag angels who couldnt care less about Earth and would actually want to destroy it. Sure we saw Izual and thought, o ok well i guess angels can fall into darkness as well. But that still coincided with what we knew so far about diablo following sort of the rough guide lines of the bible and medieval europe.
however then comes Richard A Knaak and boom. The heavens are just as bad as Hell and in some ways worse as they want to blow sanctuary right out of existence where as Hell just wants to control it. Now i dont know about anyone else but i would rather live and fight to the death than simply be blown away.
And then he did the unthinkable and made Tyrael bad... but then gave him a change of heart so as to fit with the diablo 2 game. Basically thats like taking Optimus Prime and have him rape children but then let him have a change of heart... that would FOREVER change my view on optimus prime and i would never think him as awesome as he once was in my eyes.
And then he took the necromancers and made their 'god' God... or rather what we once envisioned as how a god would act. Ie doing everything within his power to make human existence enjoyable... Where once necromancers were viewed as having sort of tapped the powers of Hell itself to fight Hell.. so using its own powers against them. we now have this new god trang-oul (he changed the name to trag-oul i believe). so basically that changed the cool necro feel to meh... (imo at least)
So now we have the Paladin worshiping false gods that would wish to destroy the very place in which he lives... We also have the problem of the heavens giving paladins holy power but then Knaak totally fucked that up by haaving the heavens want to destroy sanctuary. (thats one of my biggest gripes... that really fubars everything up... it actually makes me feel sick inside thinking about how badly he destroyed the canon)
And now we have the Necromancer who follows the teachings of an actual good god fighting for sanctuary.
So really now that the books exist, the places of the paladin and necro have been reversed. (i feel i made that sentence quite clear but no doubt someone wont understand what that means... then ill be forced into some long explanation... because the person who didnt understand is busy yelling at me in this thread and complaining about how they like how the canon has been fucked up...)
So in conclusion im pissed as hell because Knaak destroyed the canon of the Diablo universe so perfectly created in the Diablo 1 and 2 games.
There are obviously some in the High Heavens who believe it is worth interfering. The degree of their interference can make them either unpopular, rebellious, or even threatening.
I always imagined that Tyrael's interference made him become ostracized with the rest of the heavenly community.
As far as the Paladin's powers, such a power could simply be there for the harvesting if one is willing to learn how to use them. Just as one can learn demonic magics.
It IS possible..it certainly isn't IMpossible. Look at Izual, Tyrael and all that crap going on. Look at Hadriel standing their IN THE MIDDLE OF HELL..WHAT THE FUCK..THEY'RE DRIVING ME CRAZY..
yes but i would imagine that demons allow their power to be used.
plus "Paladins use holy magic as gifted by the High Heavens." i dont think they would say that if it wasnt true
Quote from name="-Mephisto"s Lament-" »
It IS possible..it certainly isn't IMpossible. Look at Izual, Tyrael and all that crap going on. Look at Hadriel standing their IN THE MIDDLE OF HELL..WHAT THE FUCK..THEY'RE DRIVING ME CRAZY..
Izual is an angel. He shouldn't interfere in any way, shape, or form with anything that might give one side any form of advantage over the other. He helped the Prime Evils execute their plan, thus giving them leverage over the opposing side. That biatch.
your grasp on the english language doesnt seem to be that firm...
Quote from "Siaynoq" »
Right. He helped the Prime Evils. In other words, he defected.
i thought for a good moment you said defecated
Quote from name="-Mephisto"s Lament-" »
Right. Meaning it's possible that one side fucks with the other, gaining them some sort of leverage.
.... that statement was a tad redundant wasnt it... we already knew that....
anyways lets keep it simple. anyone saying the heavens dont interfere has no idea what they are talking about. In d2 and d1 the heavens helped sanctuary and the mortals on it. But now in d3 it appears that the heavens are just as bad as hell. this change came because of the books..
thanks Mr. Knaak you seriously fucked everyone up the ass with your shitty books.
thanks Mr. Knaak you seriously fucked everyone up the ass with your shitty story.
What an immature attitude. First of all, Knaak's stories, particularly the Sin War trilogy, are based on some guidelines of Blizzard as they want the new lore to be consistent with their upcoming titles. Second, please provide the example of how Knaak's content has fucked anyone up the ass (assuming this means that he contradicted something important) and whether you feel disenfranchised from the series. Third, did you suddenly think this forum had gone totally lenient all over again? Can you justify putting your criticism in such a way that doesn't call for a ban?
ok i shall go on a long rant just give me a sec to write it *i shall edit this post to add it in, but wanted to post this first so that i wasnt banned...*
In Diablo 1 and 2 we were given a very vivid sense of fighting for sanctuary. Along our path as mortals we were also given the sense of having the heavens being there to guide us. Naturally we thought the heavens were good guys there to protect us, like the Christian view on God. We or at least i found it quite clear that we didnt see heavens armies down on sanctuary because like God, they would only guide us and occaisonally come down to aid us, similiar to Jesus or any other instance where an angel comes down from heaven in the bible.
I dont think it ever occured to anyone before the books that heaven could be filled with douche bag angels who couldnt care less about Earth and would actually want to destroy it. Sure we saw Izual and thought, o ok well i guess angels can fall into darkness as well. But that still coincided with what we knew so far about diablo following sort of the rough guide lines of the bible and medieval europe.
however then comes Richard A Knaak and boom. The heavens are just as bad as Hell and in some ways worse as they want to blow sanctuary right out of existence where as Hell just wants to control it. Now i dont know about anyone else but i would rather live and fight to the death than simply be blown away.
And then he did the unthinkable and made Tyrael bad... but then gave him a change of heart so as to fit with the diablo 2 game. Basically thats like taking Optimus Prime and have him rape children but then let him have a change of heart... that would FOREVER change my view on optimus prime and i would never think him as awesome as he once was in my eyes.
And then he took the necromancers and made their 'god' God... or rather what we once envisioned as how a god would act. Ie doing everything within his power to make human existence enjoyable... Where once necromancers were viewed as having sort of tapped the powers of Hell itself to fight Hell.. so using its own powers against them. we now have this new god trang-oul (he changed the name to trag-oul i believe). so basically that changed the cool necro feel to meh... (imo at least)
So now we have the Paladin worshiping false gods that would wish to destroy the very place in which he lives... We also have the problem of the heavens giving paladins holy power but then Knaak totally fucked that up by haaving the heavens want to destroy sanctuary. (thats one of my biggest gripes... that really fubars everything up... it actually makes me feel sick inside thinking about how badly he destroyed the canon)
And now we have the Necromancer who follows the teachings of an actual good god fighting for sanctuary.
So really now that the books exist, the places of the paladin and necro have been reversed. (i feel i made that sentence quite clear but no doubt someone wont understand what that means... then ill be forced into some long explanation... because the person who didnt understand is busy yelling at me in this thread and complaining about how they like how the canon has been fucked up...)
So in conclusion im pissed as hell because Knaak destroyed the canon of the Diablo universe so perfectly created in the Diablo 1 and 2 games.
Quote from "Siaynoq" »
What an immature attitude. First of all, Knaak's stories, particularly the Sin War trilogy, are based on some guidelines of Blizzard as they want the new lore to be consistent with their upcoming titles. Second, please provide the example of how Knaak's content has fucked anyone up the ass (assuming this means that he contradicted something important) and whether you feel disenfranchised from the series. Third, did you suddenly think this forum had gone totally lenient all over again? Can you justify putting your criticism in such a way that doesn't call for a ban?
you have to admit though, was that not funny? eh eh? haha
yah that guy is a total douche for fucking up the story line, basicly saying that there is no good just evil and every thing is not in chaos wich basicly meens justice is not rewarded and evil is not punished. How gay knaak u fag, u ruined it alll!!! and Tyreal has just gone to 5th place in my cool people list, which makes chuck norris at number 1, master chief at number 2, my-self at number 3, kratos at number 4, and Tyreal at the end and all by himself at number five, kinda like pluto but more gay
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Mattew 18:18
"I tell you the truth, whatever you bind on earth will be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth will be lossed in heaven."
yah that guy is a total douche for fucking up the story line, basicly saying that there is no good just evil and every thing is not in chaos wich basicly meens justice is not rewarded and evil is not punished. How gay knaak u fag, u ruined it alll!!! and Tyreal has just gone to 5th place in my cool people list, which makes chuck norris at number 1, master chief at number 2, my-self at number 3, kratos at number 4, and Tyreal at the end and all by himself at number five, kinda like pluto but more gay
haha lmao. i laugh but cannot tell if that is sarcasm
"The Angels fought to defend humanity against this demonic oppression, but all too often their austere methods and severe punishments succeeded only in alienating those whom they sought to protect."
Just like the bible however. there was one passage that said that followers who worked on sunday were to be killed. and this one guy went to chop wood on sunday and the others around him killed him... this was before jesus however.
"The Angels fought to defend humanity against this demonic oppression, but all too often their austere methods and severe punishments succeeded only in alienating those whom they sought to protect."
Just like the bible however. there was one passage that said that followers who worked on sunday were to be killed. and this one guy went to chop wood on sunday and the others around him killed him... this was before jesus however.
so its to interpretation that passage.
I don't think "severe punishment" is in any way up for 'interpretation". You got all pissed off that Knaak "messed up" the story line and it turns out that it was "messed up" from the beginning, epic irony.
ok i shall go on a long rant just give me a sec to write it *i shall edit this post to add it in, but wanted to post this first so that i wasnt banned...*
In Diablo 1 and 2 we were given a very vivid sense of fighting for sanctuary. Along our path as mortals we were also given the sense of having the heavens being there to guide us. Naturally we thought the heavens were good guys there to protect us, like the Christian view on God. We or at least i found it quite clear that we didnt see heavens armies down on sanctuary because like God, they would only guide us and occaisonally come down to aid us, similiar to Jesus or any other instance where an angel comes down from heaven in the bible.
I dont think it ever occured to anyone before the books that heaven could be filled with douche bag angels who couldnt care less about Earth and would actually want to destroy it. Sure we saw Izual and thought, o ok well i guess angels can fall into darkness as well. But that still coincided with what we knew so far about diablo following sort of the rough guide lines of the bible and medieval europe.
however then comes Richard A Knaak and boom. The heavens are just as bad as Hell and in some ways worse as they want to blow sanctuary right out of existence where as Hell just wants to control it. Now i dont know about anyone else but i would rather live and fight to the death than simply be blown away.
And then he did the unthinkable and made Tyrael bad... but then gave him a change of heart so as to fit with the diablo 2 game. Basically thats like taking Optimus Prime and have him rape children but then let him have a change of heart... that would FOREVER change my view on optimus prime and i would never think him as awesome as he once was in my eyes.
And then he took the necromancers and made their 'god' God... or rather what we once envisioned as how a god would act. Ie doing everything within his power to make human existence enjoyable... Where once necromancers were viewed as having sort of tapped the powers of Hell itself to fight Hell.. so using its own powers against them. we now have this new god trang-oul (he changed the name to trag-oul i believe). so basically that changed the cool necro feel to meh... (imo at least)
So now we have the Paladin worshiping false gods that would wish to destroy the very place in which he lives... We also have the problem of the heavens giving paladins holy power but then Knaak totally fucked that up by haaving the heavens want to destroy sanctuary. (thats one of my biggest gripes... that really fubars everything up... it actually makes me feel sick inside thinking about how badly he destroyed the canon)
And now we have the Necromancer who follows the teachings of an actual good god fighting for sanctuary.
So really now that the books exist, the places of the paladin and necro have been reversed. (i feel i made that sentence quite clear but no doubt someone wont understand what that means... then ill be forced into some long explanation... because the person who didnt understand is busy yelling at me in this thread and complaining about how they like how the canon has been fucked up...)
So in conclusion im pissed as hell because Knaak destroyed the canon of the Diablo universe so perfectly created in the Diablo 1 and 2 games.
<
Originally Posted by Diablo I Manual The coming of the Great Conflict to the mortal realm is known as the Sin War. Angels and Demons, disguising themselves while traveling amongst men, attempted to secretly lure mortals to their respective causes. Over time, the forces of Darkness discovered that mortals responded much more to brute force than to subtle coercion, and so began to terrorize Man into submission. The Angels fought to defend humanity against this demonic oppression, but all too often their austere methods and severe punishments succeeded only in alienating those whom they sought to protect.
It IS possible..it certainly isn't IMpossible. Look at Izual, Tyrael and all that crap going on. Look at Hadriel standing their IN THE MIDDLE OF HELL..WHAT THE FUCK..THEY'RE DRIVING ME CRAZY..
Technically, Izual and Hadriel are/were in Hell, not Sanctuary, so they weren't interfering with human affairs. Of course, since they couldn't fix the problems, those problems inevitably became human affairs some time later.
The Zakarum access power from Heaven, the angelics themselves are not presently active. Their power is generic "holy" magic. The angelics themselves have not interfered with human affairs since the tainting of the Worldstone by Inarius, if my memory serves me right, and that was done to harm humanity. Tyrael is the only angel for a long time to actually descend in to Sanctuary and actually help humanity, against the orders of Heaven. Or rather, without the confirmation of Heaven.
I don't think "severe punishment" is in any way up for 'interpretation". You got all pissed off that Knaak "messed up" the story line and it turns out that it was "messed up" from the beginning, epic irony.
<
dude.... no.... to follow heaven was to follow strict rules but it was ultimately rules that were good. As i said, in the bible there was strict punishment but it was the price to pay for following God.
Just as those strict ways were enforced on the people of sanctuary it was the price they had to pay.
Quote from "Ivaron" »
I think it's cool that the Necromancers are actually good guys. It makes the story seem more believable imo, because when is anything the way it seems to be in the real world?
he was a good guy either way fuck how do you not see that? omg.......... he just dabbled in dark magic before but now its completely different sort of magic
dude.... no.... to follow heaven was to follow strict rules but it was ultimately rules that were good. As i said, in the bible there was strict punishment but it was the price to pay for following God.
There isn't a "God" in the Diablo world's "Heaven". There are only angels in the High Heavens, ruled and managed by the Angiris Council
when quite clearly the paladins get their help from the heavens...
http://www.battle.net/diablo2exp/classes/paladinhistory.shtml
In Diablo 1 and 2 we were given a very vivid sense of fighting for sanctuary. Along our path as mortals we were also given the sense of having the heavens being there to guide us. Naturally we thought the heavens were good guys there to protect us, like the Christian view on God. We or at least i found it quite clear that we didnt see heavens armies down on sanctuary because like God, they would only guide us and occaisonally come down to aid us, similiar to Jesus or any other instance where an angel comes down from heaven in the bible.
I dont think it ever occured to anyone before the books that heaven could be filled with douche bag angels who couldnt care less about Earth and would actually want to destroy it. Sure we saw Izual and thought, o ok well i guess angels can fall into darkness as well. But that still coincided with what we knew so far about diablo following sort of the rough guide lines of the bible and medieval europe.
however then comes Richard A Knaak and boom. The heavens are just as bad as Hell and in some ways worse as they want to blow sanctuary right out of existence where as Hell just wants to control it. Now i dont know about anyone else but i would rather live and fight to the death than simply be blown away.
And then he did the unthinkable and made Tyrael bad... but then gave him a change of heart so as to fit with the diablo 2 game. Basically thats like taking Optimus Prime and have him rape children but then let him have a change of heart... that would FOREVER change my view on optimus prime and i would never think him as awesome as he once was in my eyes.
And then he took the necromancers and made their 'god' God... or rather what we once envisioned as how a god would act. Ie doing everything within his power to make human existence enjoyable... Where once necromancers were viewed as having sort of tapped the powers of Hell itself to fight Hell.. so using its own powers against them. we now have this new god trang-oul (he changed the name to trag-oul i believe). so basically that changed the cool necro feel to meh... (imo at least)
So now we have the Paladin worshiping false gods that would wish to destroy the very place in which he lives... We also have the problem of the heavens giving paladins holy power but then Knaak totally fucked that up by haaving the heavens want to destroy sanctuary. (thats one of my biggest gripes... that really fubars everything up... it actually makes me feel sick inside thinking about how badly he destroyed the canon)
And now we have the Necromancer who follows the teachings of an actual good god fighting for sanctuary.
So really now that the books exist, the places of the paladin and necro have been reversed. (i feel i made that sentence quite clear but no doubt someone wont understand what that means... then ill be forced into some long explanation... because the person who didnt understand is busy yelling at me in this thread and complaining about how they like how the canon has been fucked up...)
So in conclusion im pissed as hell because Knaak destroyed the canon of the Diablo universe so perfectly created in the Diablo 1 and 2 games.
I always imagined that Tyrael's interference made him become ostracized with the rest of the heavenly community.
As far as the Paladin's powers, such a power could simply be there for the harvesting if one is willing to learn how to use them. Just as one can learn demonic magics.
Siaynoq's Playthroughs
Rise and rise again, until lambs become lions
plus "Paladins use holy magic as gifted by the High Heavens." i dont think they would say that if it wasnt true
so which side are you on? lol
That one?..
Rise and rise again, until lambs become lions
Siaynoq's Playthroughs
Rise and rise again, until lambs become lions
Siaynoq's Playthroughs
Rise and rise again, until lambs become lions
your grasp on the english language doesnt seem to be that firm...
i thought for a good moment you said defecated
.... that statement was a tad redundant wasnt it... we already knew that....
anyways lets keep it simple. anyone saying the heavens dont interfere has no idea what they are talking about. In d2 and d1 the heavens helped sanctuary and the mortals on it. But now in d3 it appears that the heavens are just as bad as hell. this change came because of the books..
thanks Mr. Knaak you seriously fucked everyone up the ass with your shitty books.
Siaynoq's Playthroughs
In Diablo 1 and 2 we were given a very vivid sense of fighting for sanctuary. Along our path as mortals we were also given the sense of having the heavens being there to guide us. Naturally we thought the heavens were good guys there to protect us, like the Christian view on God. We or at least i found it quite clear that we didnt see heavens armies down on sanctuary because like God, they would only guide us and occaisonally come down to aid us, similiar to Jesus or any other instance where an angel comes down from heaven in the bible.
I dont think it ever occured to anyone before the books that heaven could be filled with douche bag angels who couldnt care less about Earth and would actually want to destroy it. Sure we saw Izual and thought, o ok well i guess angels can fall into darkness as well. But that still coincided with what we knew so far about diablo following sort of the rough guide lines of the bible and medieval europe.
however then comes Richard A Knaak and boom. The heavens are just as bad as Hell and in some ways worse as they want to blow sanctuary right out of existence where as Hell just wants to control it. Now i dont know about anyone else but i would rather live and fight to the death than simply be blown away.
And then he did the unthinkable and made Tyrael bad... but then gave him a change of heart so as to fit with the diablo 2 game. Basically thats like taking Optimus Prime and have him rape children but then let him have a change of heart... that would FOREVER change my view on optimus prime and i would never think him as awesome as he once was in my eyes.
And then he took the necromancers and made their 'god' God... or rather what we once envisioned as how a god would act. Ie doing everything within his power to make human existence enjoyable... Where once necromancers were viewed as having sort of tapped the powers of Hell itself to fight Hell.. so using its own powers against them. we now have this new god trang-oul (he changed the name to trag-oul i believe). so basically that changed the cool necro feel to meh... (imo at least)
So now we have the Paladin worshiping false gods that would wish to destroy the very place in which he lives... We also have the problem of the heavens giving paladins holy power but then Knaak totally fucked that up by haaving the heavens want to destroy sanctuary. (thats one of my biggest gripes... that really fubars everything up... it actually makes me feel sick inside thinking about how badly he destroyed the canon)
And now we have the Necromancer who follows the teachings of an actual good god fighting for sanctuary.
So really now that the books exist, the places of the paladin and necro have been reversed. (i feel i made that sentence quite clear but no doubt someone wont understand what that means... then ill be forced into some long explanation... because the person who didnt understand is busy yelling at me in this thread and complaining about how they like how the canon has been fucked up...)
So in conclusion im pissed as hell because Knaak destroyed the canon of the Diablo universe so perfectly created in the Diablo 1 and 2 games.
you have to admit though, was that not funny? eh eh? haha
"I tell you the truth, whatever you bind on earth will be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth will be lossed in heaven."
Newsboys Rock!!!!
http://www.newsboys.com/
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
haha lmao. i laugh but cannot tell if that is sarcasm
Just like the bible however. there was one passage that said that followers who worked on sunday were to be killed. and this one guy went to chop wood on sunday and the others around him killed him... this was before jesus however.
so its to interpretation that passage.
<
Fuck you, I'm a dragon.
Technically, Izual and Hadriel are/were in Hell, not Sanctuary, so they weren't interfering with human affairs. Of course, since they couldn't fix the problems, those problems inevitably became human affairs some time later.
The Zakarum access power from Heaven, the angelics themselves are not presently active. Their power is generic "holy" magic. The angelics themselves have not interfered with human affairs since the tainting of the Worldstone by Inarius, if my memory serves me right, and that was done to harm humanity. Tyrael is the only angel for a long time to actually descend in to Sanctuary and actually help humanity, against the orders of Heaven. Or rather, without the confirmation of Heaven.
dude.... no.... to follow heaven was to follow strict rules but it was ultimately rules that were good. As i said, in the bible there was strict punishment but it was the price to pay for following God.
Just as those strict ways were enforced on the people of sanctuary it was the price they had to pay.
he was a good guy either way fuck how do you not see that? omg.......... he just dabbled in dark magic before but now its completely different sort of magic
There isn't a "God" in the Diablo world's "Heaven". There are only angels in the High Heavens, ruled and managed by the Angiris Council