Im paragon 600 and have great gear, lots of defensive stats with 12 million toughness. i play a jade harvester build and cant help but notice witch doctors die more then any other class besides demon hunters "which will be buffed". It seems to me that witch doctors are going from best class to worst class considering if you die next patch in a major rift you have to run back from last check point. pet build might survive more sure, but you need a ton of rare gear to play that build. so it seems to me that witch doctor might not be the best class next patch and if that wasn't bad enough, i bet they Nerf them even MORE just because they do okay damage. i personally like jade build but it may be obsolete because of the low survival. in solo play they may be okay because of unity, but in group play they get hit like a truck. I hope im wrong but that is the way i picture it now, if i am wrong please clarify why..id really like to play WD but if i cant i guess its crusader because they dont die at all.
12m toughness and you die alot as a jade? You are playing wrong. I have half your toughness and I dont use Unity and I don't have issues on t6 solo/group play...
Also Pet docs are some of the best tanks
Also also, FA wont kill off FS...just imagine 23 little guys doing 8-20m in dmg and taking hits...
Learn to stay alive, if you are dying a lot as a WD, you will die MUCH more with any other class..
If you have 12M toughness and die "a lot" my guess is you have too much HP and not enough mitigation. Most people I see who complain about dying too often have neglected the % reduced melee/ranged/elite damage affix on items. It should also be noted that using a 6 piece set for any class tends limit the defensive gear that you can wear, and as such you are sacrificing defense for potent offense. In my view jade WD do best in group with a pull monk, which controls the mobs and reduces other party members needs for defense.
As a side note, spirit walk is a great defensive skill, as is horrify.
My 8 mil toughness jade never dies in T6 solo or fast group clear. I am able to keep up with mantra pull monk and sg sader even if they skip groups. With more cdr and grave injustice your spirit walk should be ready to spam 70% of the time. When you soul harvest entire group not only you get ur health back you also reset your spirit walk.
Im guess you need cdr or life after kill. Seriously mara dh is way more squishier than jade doc
I was playing in a t6 group earlier and 4 or 5 terror demons popped out and 1 shorted me before i could even cast a spell. is that playing my class wrong? and when 8 exarchs charge at you and you die immediately. is that playing your class wrong to? or how about when a savage beast charges you for 60% of your health and your already at 50% hp. or when you have an elite pack that sucks you into lazers or ice you die immediately sometimes. im wearing string of ears and i have plenty of reduced melee damage and physical resist. if you say you never die that is a complete lie unless everyone in your group moves together and is made with a near perfect group combo.i feel like im playing good, its the things that are unavoidable that kill me. like when your in a small room and theres a poison nova you die within 3 seconds.if your spirit walks off cool down. i want to change some of my vit to cdr but im kinda worried ill die even faster.
You ask for an opinion and people give them. This is just the people that chose to respond. You'd get more responses like this if more people respond. I'm gonna throw my opinion in as well, my WD has half your toughness, no unity, and I'm fine in T6 solo and especially group play. My mara DH on the other hand... I like him but if a couple off-screen anarchs charge at me I'm in trouble.
The fact is, 12m toughness you shouldn't die that much, even to the "unavoidable" stuff you mentioned unless that toughness is from inflated HP and not "real" toughness. Still, with WD gaining resist from int, even with inflated vit you should still be pretty tough. In short, youredoingitwrong. Witch doctors will be fine. If you have trouble here, stick with the WD because anything other than a straight tank would infuriate you.
LOL I think Jade Harvester is in a good spot. It probably seems like they die more often because Pet build Doctors don't die ever :-P
I'm not gonna lie, I have a death here and there while playing my Jade set and its not actually a toughness issue (around 6-7 mil), its usually because of cooldown maintenance or not getting enough CD reduction off a Harvest.
I think if you play a bit more defensively/passively or monitor your use of Soul Harvest and make adjustments, youll be fine.
I was playing in a t6 group earlier and 4 or 5 terror demons popped out and 1 shorted me before i could even cast a spell. is that playing my class wrong? and when 8 exarchs charge at you and you die immediately. is that playing your class wrong to? or how about when a savage beast charges you for 60% of your health and your already at 50% hp. or when you have an elite pack that sucks you into lazers or ice you die immediately sometimes. im wearing string of ears and i have plenty of reduced melee damage and physical resist. if you say you never die that is a complete lie unless everyone in your group moves together and is made with a near perfect group combo.i feel like im playing good, its the things that are unavoidable that kill me. like when your in a small room and theres a poison nova you die within 3 seconds.if your spirit walks off cool down. i want to change some of my vit to cdr but im kinda worried ill die even faster.
You have time to press spirit walk or move for all of the things you mentioned. Playing HC solo t6 7.1m toughness, no unity, serpent mojo, horrify, and leaching beasts rune, haven't died yet.
Spirit walk is probably the best defensive skill in the game, witch doctors will be fine. Plus they're nerfing healing globe bonuses and buffing healing on gear and leaching beasts rune is already awesome and it'll just be that much more awesome next patch.
dYeah, I agree with the rest of the group. I was playing a half jade spec with my WD with only 7 mill toughness and I was running with my group in t6. For my "jade" build I was running Queltz helm, jade chest/gloves, cap crimsom pants/boots, auglid shoulders/bracers, sting of ears, cold ammy, sunkeeper and serpent. I only die when I play carelessly, lag or if spirit walk was on cool down. Now I switch to a pet build cuz I have full zuni set but no moj, no smk, no tmf, no t&t, no soj and I'm playing with my group in t6. My wiz, monk are way more geared than my WD but they don't even come close with survivability. http://us.battle.net/d3/en/profile/im2kul-1814/hero/6013024
Are you using spirit vessel passive? If you are not using it yes u will be dying.
I agree terror demons and archangels are tough to deal with, but yes you just have to be careful and watch ur cool down. Again link us ur armory.
And yes I do not die in T6 when I play my jade, that is not a lie that is pretty common with jades. Jade only dies when spirit vessel or spirit walk is on cool down. In theory you should never get on shotted unless u are unaware of your spirit vessel cool down
Have to agree with most posts- I think 12m is HEAPS of toughness- MY Jade WD has about 6-7 depending on what Im wearing...about 77% cold and only around 850 sheet dmg.(Still getting the 2-500mill white dmg)I play only T6 solo or grp and yes I die a bit but Im also using an offensive harvest- the healing harvest may be safer... but less fun Oh- and if the grp is just OK balanced I don't die much at all- it's usually when we have a double or triple elite grp scenario
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"Age and treachery will always defeat youthfulness and zeal..."
I have been playing WD since vanilla, and 95% of my deaths have been because i was doing something wrong. I truly believe the game sometime decides that you have to die, (perfect storm of affixes, mob density, map configuration, and cd usage) and nothing you can do will prevent it. Each of the mobs have specific mechanics you must avoid, and it is specific to the class you are playing how you do that. Proper character movement allows you to utilize Soul Harvest and save Spirit Walk for a defensive CD. I agree with everyone here, link your profile and we can actually help other than make assumptions based on our opinions.
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Also Pet docs are some of the best tanks
Also also, FA wont kill off FS...just imagine 23 little guys doing 8-20m in dmg and taking hits...
Learn to stay alive, if you are dying a lot as a WD, you will die MUCH more with any other class..
As a side note, spirit walk is a great defensive skill, as is horrify.
u can check my profile
My 8 mil toughness jade never dies in T6 solo or fast group clear. I am able to keep up with mantra pull monk and sg sader even if they skip groups. With more cdr and grave injustice your spirit walk should be ready to spam 70% of the time. When you soul harvest entire group not only you get ur health back you also reset your spirit walk.
Im guess you need cdr or life after kill. Seriously mara dh is way more squishier than jade doc
The fact is, 12m toughness you shouldn't die that much, even to the "unavoidable" stuff you mentioned unless that toughness is from inflated HP and not "real" toughness. Still, with WD gaining resist from int, even with inflated vit you should still be pretty tough. In short, youredoingitwrong. Witch doctors will be fine. If you have trouble here, stick with the WD because anything other than a straight tank would infuriate you.
Probably won't suck next patch
LOL I think Jade Harvester is in a good spot. It probably seems like they die more often because Pet build Doctors don't die ever :-P
I'm not gonna lie, I have a death here and there while playing my Jade set and its not actually a toughness issue (around 6-7 mil), its usually because of cooldown maintenance or not getting enough CD reduction off a Harvest.
I think if you play a bit more defensively/passively or monitor your use of Soul Harvest and make adjustments, youll be fine.
Spirit walk is probably the best defensive skill in the game, witch doctors will be fine. Plus they're nerfing healing globe bonuses and buffing healing on gear and leaching beasts rune is already awesome and it'll just be that much more awesome next patch.
Are you using spirit vessel passive? If you are not using it yes u will be dying.
I agree terror demons and archangels are tough to deal with, but yes you just have to be careful and watch ur cool down. Again link us ur armory.
And yes I do not die in T6 when I play my jade, that is not a lie that is pretty common with jades. Jade only dies when spirit vessel or spirit walk is on cool down. In theory you should never get on shotted unless u are unaware of your spirit vessel cool down
"Age and treachery will always defeat youthfulness and zeal..."