E-sports nonsense that leads into crappy PvP balancing and such like WoW? No thanks
In the end the game is essentially a PvE co-op game and while it may be true to say things like D2 only lasted 10 years because of the PvP craze it's still a co-op game. If you've watched all the interviews and read all the comments made they do intend on making more features for PvP just not at release and of course the solution to the grind-fest is the new auction house feature so that you don't need to do things like Baal runs to get super geared up for the arena.
I say... stop worrying so much about it before the game is even out and if it's THAT big of a deal to quote clockworkbeast "...if I want that [PvP] I'll play a different game. I like where they're going with D3."
So much complaining about this game and it's not even out... jeeze.
Indeed. So many people complaining about it and we're not even at public beta stage
People just loooooooooooooooooove to complain.
I would like a ranked PvP option but I'm not going to cry about it if we never get one. Maybe even just a top 100 list of players in each class, since as they said it will be unbalanced.
Also, Diablo is primarily a PvE game and I hope they never "balance" the classes around PvP.
So let me ask you: Have you been on Diablo 2 recently? Maybe even just 3 years ago, or yesterday? I'm guessing not, because you've been so busy with developing Diablo 3. But let me mention that the reason why Diablo 2 has survived until this day is due to PvP. Just pure PvP. That is the reason why people still purchase the Diablo Battle Chest at Best Buy for $40 a pop 10 years after release, when there are modern games like Portal 2 and Battlefield: Bad Company 2 on the shelves. For Christ sakes, Diablo 2 is over 10 years old, and thousands upon thousands of people still play it religiously every single day. As you've even claimed yourself, people spend actual $$$ on D2 pixels via 3rd party sites. Even for those people who do not spend real $$$, you know what they do? They do countless Meph runs, Chaos runs, Baal runs, and other such runs just to find better items. Why do people do all of that still? Because farming the same bosses over and over is fun? Because people enjoy spending money on pixels to look cool? No. It's because people want to build their characters up and become the best at PvP.
I decided to stop reading. I didn't buy this game for PvP. And people asking to duel and people going hostile...just doesn't happen that often. Some people ARE running quests/boss runs because its fun. (to find items)
Anyway, you want PvP to be more supported/prevalent in D3. I got your back on that. A lot of different people play Diablo for different reasons. the only reason I'm stopping at this point, is because you are saying everyone plays D2 for PvP. Maybe the people on your friends list. I find PvP in Diablo games strange. Thats me. But I support your desire for better PvP support, for sure. Just don't generalize your desire to the whole community of players, my friend!
You guys need to make up your minds about Blizzard.
"OMG they so greedy, real money auction house so they make more!"
...
"OMG people won't be buying their game for the next 10 years straight"
Conflicting arguments hurrdurr.
Also, I never gave a rat's ass about PvP in Diablo 2, but I'm probably one of the TEN people on these forums that still plays, because I enjoy the idea of making my character do even cooler things, even if I don't have to show them off by killing other players.
Because the PvP in Diablo 2 was so fun anyway, especially after Runewords were added, and if you didn't have Teleport then you were useless, or you just die instantly anyway from someone stacking 6 different auras, or your 3rd-party program would kick in and Save & Exit just before death.
I'm just hoping that the next step from this poll is not that anyone tries to suggest that a sample size of 100-200 people reflects the majority of the player base of the game. At the very least, anyone posting on this forum is likely in the small minority simply because of the fact that they are following a game and posting about it in a fan forum, before it's even out.
For the people who dont want competition in the game dont play the damn PVP mode, but dont stiff people who like pvp with crappy Pvp options/gameplay
Hmm, the whole point of the PVP system is to not label players pvp skill, this thread basically wants them to change their whole vision for the game, I'm glad they kept the pvp old school death match.
I think it's fair to say that we /will/ get all those features, just not on launch. The way they seem to be structuring this game is to make sure it has replay value. They are however building it from the ground up. First making sure the PvE base is solid and then moving on to the rest. Of course they have their own take on how things should be and are creating the game from that vision. You may or may not agree with it, but I'm not afraid that the good PvP stuff won't be in.
I'm not so sure, Blizzard is revamping the diablo series, saying that diablo isn't about PvP is BS and, amazingly, people are buying it, apparently everyone forgot that the team that created Diablo wanted pvp, and wanted the game to ''be a dangeourous place'' aka: PK (yes, from schaefer himself).
It doesn't need to be perfectly balanced, it doesn't need to be pretty, but just leaving it as it is is stupid, but stupid shouldn't be so surprising by now.
Anyway, i don't really care anymore, i will still play D3, after all, i've been waiting a ''few'' years for it, but i'm not expecting anything extraordinary from it, its just another game.
Get real, folks, the diablo you all knew is dead, a few years ago i said right here in this forum that D3 had a pretty good chance of being blizzard first bust (i was flamed to death ofc), and what you know, its not even beta and its already looking that way.
Do I want PvP structure? Don't really care. I guess it doesn't hurt to have more options.
Do I want the game balanced around PvP? Not one single bit.
I strongly confirm this as my own position and it's my belief that Jay operates on the same paradigm.
Perhaps one day there will be a pvp ladder, but the lack of such a ladder does not detract at all from my enjoyment of the game, nor does it detract from it's heritage as a part of the Diablo series. There is still more than enough pvp content to satisfy player-driven pvp competition and I think that is more than sufficient given the essence of the game was expressedly cooperative pve, much like it's predecessors.
Do you read the interviews, or do you just pick up on the rage-induced threads of your PvP Cult members?
It was pretty clearly stated that they are considering and willing to implement more PvP into Diablo III, but not for the initial release of the game (when it hardly matters anyway) so they can actually get it out this year. PvP is not the primary focus of Diablo III because it isn't Diablo or Diablo II. This game is a major player in the lore department, and is supposedly ending the game franchise after the subsequent expansions. That said, I would say PvE/PvM focus is pretty damn important, and I would rather have the game in my hands in December than have them rework a system that won't be immediately usable (I say that because I don't think many of us are going to hop on Diablo III in December, make a new character, and do Level 1 arenas).
You can argue all you want that Diablo and Diablo II are focused on PvP (for the record, they are not; just look at how imbalanced it is and how little Blizzard has done to intervene) but Diablo III is its own game and, at least at release, I don't think anyone wants to get griefed into the ground. Honestly, it just sounds like you are trying to argue for the old "HOSTILE AT ANY MOMENT" feature, which had far, far more drawbacks than benefits.
EDIT: Go login to Diablo II (oh, you probably don't have an active account anymore) and see how many PK games there are. Maybe one or two every hour. The rest are TRADE GAMES (go figure), BAAL RUNS (not just for PvP, whether you think so or not), and MAGIC FIND (for trades). If the RMAH was going to be as big of a problem as everyone thought, and everyone was constantly gearing purely for PvP, one would assume there would be heaps and heaps of fully-geared out PK games. But there aren't.
Do you read the interviews, or do you just pick up on the rage-induced threads of your PvP Cult members?
It was pretty clearly stated that they are considering and willing to implement more PvP into Diablo III, but not for the initial release of the game (when it hardly matters anyway) so they can actually get it out this year. PvP is not the primary focus of Diablo III because it isn't Diablo or Diablo II. This game is a major player in the lore department, and is supposedly ending the game franchise after the subsequent expansions. That said, I would say PvE/PvM focus is pretty damn important, and I would rather have the game in my hands in December than have them rework a system that won't be immediately usable (I say that because I don't think many of us are going to hop on Diablo III in December, make a new character, and do Level 1 arenas).
You can argue all you want that Diablo and Diablo II are focused on PvP (for the record, they are not; just look at how imbalanced it is and how little Blizzard has done to intervene) but Diablo III is its own game and, at least at release, I don't think anyone wants to get griefed into the ground. Honestly, it just sounds like you are trying to argue for the old "HOSTILE AT ANY MOMENT" feature, which had far, far more drawbacks than benefits.
EDIT: Go login to Diablo II (oh, you probably don't have an active account anymore) and see how many PK games there are. Maybe one or two every hour. The rest are TRADE GAMES (go figure), BAAL RUNS (not just for PvP, whether you think so or not), and MAGIC FIND (for trades). If the RMAH was going to be as big of a problem as everyone thought, and everyone was constantly gearing purely for PvP, one would assume there would be heaps and heaps of fully-geared out PK games. But there aren't.
Having ''plans'' to implement something doesn't mean it will happen, especially when the lead designers has such a carebear view on the game, you can argue all want aswell, I'm talking about the fact that Diablo was developed as a pve/pvp game, this is TRUE, saying that pvp is ''secondary'' as Mr. Wilson stated, is a LIE.
Btw, i lol'ed on how you think that me, not having a active D2 account is important on this matter. i´ve played this series for 13 years, i don't know how things are today, im talking on how they were back when the game was ''alive'' so to speak
Get real, folks, the diablo you all knew is dead, a few years ago i said right here in this forum that D3 had a pretty good chance of being blizzard first bust (i was flamed to death ofc), and what you know, its not even beta and its already looking that way.
Rated PVP implies balance which means the PVE game WILL suffer for PVP balance. Its impossible to have one not affect the other unless they are completely seperate(meaning each skill has a pve and pvp version). I hope pvp is kept in the game just as something extra to do and have fun with. Balance be damned.
I don't really mind that there isn't a rating system in PvP thus far, but maybe if there were separate leagues you could enter (maybe patched in after release) that were highly competitive that had ranks, then sure, why not. I understand there are a lot of players that are highly competitive and live and breath to see their skill displayed by definitive means, so why not cater to them a little bit by adding a separate and completely voluntary league?
Just as long as it doesn't taint the experience of the casual PvPers.
Having ''plans'' to implement something doesn't mean it will happen, especially when the lead designers has such a carebear view on the game, you can argue all want aswell, I'm talking about the fact that Diablo was developed as a pve/pvp game, this is TRUE, saying that pvp is ''secundary'' as Mr. Wilson stated, is a LIE.
Btw, i lol'ed on how you think that me, not having a active D2 account is important on this matter. i´ve played this series for 13 years, i don't know how things are today, im talking on how they were back when the game was ''alive'' so to speak
So if there's a large possibility it is going to happen, why write thread after furious thread that "it isn't going to happen, fuck Blizzard"?
Is Jay Wilson saying Diablo and Diablo II were not designed with equal PvE and PvP, or is he saying Diablo III is not? From my interpretation, he isn't denying that PvP was a large part of Diablo and Diablo II, he just doesn't want it to be a large part of Diablo III. Once again, touching on the fact that these are separate games.
Lol carebear view, because they are trying enforce account security, increase character build variation and viability, make it so every player can see what's happening on the screen...what else have they done to belittle you, the player?
Not to mention, this isn't necessarily a good balanced poll. The reason is because this particular question seems to be trying to tally the percentages of the Diablo playerbase, rather than simply getting the opinions of those who take it (I could be wrong.) I figure that the kinds of people who don't lurk around these forums (a large number) have a pretty hefty percentage who do not like the competitive aspects.
As long as they don't add a ladder or rankiing system, I'm all for more modes and other crap. Ranking systems just force them to try to balance which I ABSOLUTTELY don't want.
Indifference on my part. I didn't ever pvp much in D2. I mean, I totally tried, but my main focus was killing shit the entire time I played. Even this year, I still just mfed and crap. I tried making pvp characters, ww barb, trap sin, ww sin, rabies druid, etc etc. Didn't find it much fun. Especially since I mfed for most of the damn gear and it was still not good enough. I guess I enjoyed pvm much more since you could always kick the shit out of monsters with barely and decent gear =]
It is a bummer that games are being led by the PvE kids. I don't understand why the game cant be balanced separately, for both PvE and PvP. The lack of attention to PvP just seems like laziness.
It is a bummer that games are being led by the PvE kids. I don't understand why the game cant be balanced separately, for both PvE and PvP. The lack of attention to PvP just seems like laziness.
If you think this is an easy task, you should work in gaming, since to my knowledge no design team has ever done it successfully.
rofl. so many pvp haters making their voice heard in the thread where the poll shows otherwise.
how about we use the same argument as for the rmah. if you dont like it dont do it. it wont affect you since the game is not going to be balanced for pvp.
and to the guy quoting the SC2 about most players only played campaign. what a god awful statement.
tell me, what is that keeps starcraft BW still being played after 10 plus years. what is that will make sc2 be played equally as long. who gives a damn about pve in the long run? unless the content is updated as frequently as wow the pve portion of diablo is also going to get old fast.
why is pve players crying so badly that the game will contain more content that wont affect them? is it because you dont like that spotlight amongst players, epeen and bragging rights will move from pve to pvp?
The poll shows otherwise, what? You honestly believe that a poll with less than 200 respondents is a more accurate way of measuring interest in a game than the way that Blizzard has done? You think that one of the largest, most successful game companies, that has teams of professional people doing target market analysis and huge amounts of sales data know less about what the people they are selling to want... than someone that randomly posts here? I see.
I'd also like to point out that even here, less than half the people voted yes. That is not a majority.
The only people that seem to be upset are PvP players, that want more PvP content than is being offered. I've yet to see anyone upset about the existing PvP content because they think it somehow effects their PvE experience.
It is a bummer that games are being led by the PvE kids. I don't understand why the game cant be balanced separately, for both PvE and PvP. The lack of attention to PvP just seems like laziness.
If you think this is an easy task, you should work in gaming, since to my knowledge no design team has ever done it successfully.
That's obviously because they are just too lazy. I mean it's not like if they make a better game they will end up having more sales or something.
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Indeed. So many people complaining about it and we're not even at public beta stage
People just loooooooooooooooooove to complain.
Also, Diablo is primarily a PvE game and I hope they never "balance" the classes around PvP.
So let me ask you: Have you been on Diablo 2 recently? Maybe even just 3 years ago, or yesterday? I'm guessing not, because you've been so busy with developing Diablo 3. But let me mention that the reason why Diablo 2 has survived until this day is due to PvP. Just pure PvP. That is the reason why people still purchase the Diablo Battle Chest at Best Buy for $40 a pop 10 years after release, when there are modern games like Portal 2 and Battlefield: Bad Company 2 on the shelves. For Christ sakes, Diablo 2 is over 10 years old, and thousands upon thousands of people still play it religiously every single day. As you've even claimed yourself, people spend actual $$$ on D2 pixels via 3rd party sites. Even for those people who do not spend real $$$, you know what they do? They do countless Meph runs, Chaos runs, Baal runs, and other such runs just to find better items. Why do people do all of that still? Because farming the same bosses over and over is fun? Because people enjoy spending money on pixels to look cool? No. It's because people want to build their characters up and become the best at PvP.
I decided to stop reading. I didn't buy this game for PvP. And people asking to duel and people going hostile...just doesn't happen that often. Some people ARE running quests/boss runs because its fun. (to find items)
Anyway, you want PvP to be more supported/prevalent in D3. I got your back on that. A lot of different people play Diablo for different reasons. the only reason I'm stopping at this point, is because you are saying everyone plays D2 for PvP. Maybe the people on your friends list. I find PvP in Diablo games strange. Thats me. But I support your desire for better PvP support, for sure. Just don't generalize your desire to the whole community of players, my friend!
Let's just see what happens.
DKR
"OMG they so greedy, real money auction house so they make more!"
...
"OMG people won't be buying their game for the next 10 years straight"
Conflicting arguments hurrdurr.
Also, I never gave a rat's ass about PvP in Diablo 2, but I'm probably one of the TEN people on these forums that still plays, because I enjoy the idea of making my character do even cooler things, even if I don't have to show them off by killing other players.
Because the PvP in Diablo 2 was so fun anyway, especially after Runewords were added, and if you didn't have Teleport then you were useless, or you just die instantly anyway from someone stacking 6 different auras, or your 3rd-party program would kick in and Save & Exit just before death.
Hmm, the whole point of the PVP system is to not label players pvp skill, this thread basically wants them to change their whole vision for the game, I'm glad they kept the pvp old school death match.
I'm not so sure, Blizzard is revamping the diablo series, saying that diablo isn't about PvP is BS and, amazingly, people are buying it, apparently everyone forgot that the team that created Diablo wanted pvp, and wanted the game to ''be a dangeourous place'' aka: PK (yes, from schaefer himself).
It doesn't need to be perfectly balanced, it doesn't need to be pretty, but just leaving it as it is is stupid, but stupid shouldn't be so surprising by now.
Anyway, i don't really care anymore, i will still play D3, after all, i've been waiting a ''few'' years for it, but i'm not expecting anything extraordinary from it, its just another game.
Mindless/blind fanboyism, ready, go!
I strongly confirm this as my own position and it's my belief that Jay operates on the same paradigm.
Perhaps one day there will be a pvp ladder, but the lack of such a ladder does not detract at all from my enjoyment of the game, nor does it detract from it's heritage as a part of the Diablo series. There is still more than enough pvp content to satisfy player-driven pvp competition and I think that is more than sufficient given the essence of the game was expressedly cooperative pve, much like it's predecessors.
Do you read the interviews, or do you just pick up on the rage-induced threads of your PvP Cult members?
It was pretty clearly stated that they are considering and willing to implement more PvP into Diablo III, but not for the initial release of the game (when it hardly matters anyway) so they can actually get it out this year. PvP is not the primary focus of Diablo III because it isn't Diablo or Diablo II. This game is a major player in the lore department, and is supposedly ending the game franchise after the subsequent expansions. That said, I would say PvE/PvM focus is pretty damn important, and I would rather have the game in my hands in December than have them rework a system that won't be immediately usable (I say that because I don't think many of us are going to hop on Diablo III in December, make a new character, and do Level 1 arenas).
You can argue all you want that Diablo and Diablo II are focused on PvP (for the record, they are not; just look at how imbalanced it is and how little Blizzard has done to intervene) but Diablo III is its own game and, at least at release, I don't think anyone wants to get griefed into the ground. Honestly, it just sounds like you are trying to argue for the old "HOSTILE AT ANY MOMENT" feature, which had far, far more drawbacks than benefits.
EDIT: Go login to Diablo II (oh, you probably don't have an active account anymore) and see how many PK games there are. Maybe one or two every hour. The rest are TRADE GAMES (go figure), BAAL RUNS (not just for PvP, whether you think so or not), and MAGIC FIND (for trades). If the RMAH was going to be as big of a problem as everyone thought, and everyone was constantly gearing purely for PvP, one would assume there would be heaps and heaps of fully-geared out PK games. But there aren't.
Screw rated PVP, arenas, and e-sports.
Give me world PVP and PK.
Having ''plans'' to implement something doesn't mean it will happen, especially when the lead designers has such a carebear view on the game, you can argue all want aswell, I'm talking about the fact that Diablo was developed as a pve/pvp game, this is TRUE, saying that pvp is ''secondary'' as Mr. Wilson stated, is a LIE.
Btw, i lol'ed on how you think that me, not having a active D2 account is important on this matter. i´ve played this series for 13 years, i don't know how things are today, im talking on how they were back when the game was ''alive'' so to speak
Just as long as it doesn't taint the experience of the casual PvPers.
So if there's a large possibility it is going to happen, why write thread after furious thread that "it isn't going to happen, fuck Blizzard"?
Is Jay Wilson saying Diablo and Diablo II were not designed with equal PvE and PvP, or is he saying Diablo III is not? From my interpretation, he isn't denying that PvP was a large part of Diablo and Diablo II, he just doesn't want it to be a large part of Diablo III. Once again, touching on the fact that these are separate games.
Lol carebear view, because they are trying enforce account security, increase character build variation and viability, make it so every player can see what's happening on the screen...what else have they done to belittle you, the player?
Also, it's spelled "secondary."
If you think this is an easy task, you should work in gaming, since to my knowledge no design team has ever done it successfully.
The poll shows otherwise, what? You honestly believe that a poll with less than 200 respondents is a more accurate way of measuring interest in a game than the way that Blizzard has done? You think that one of the largest, most successful game companies, that has teams of professional people doing target market analysis and huge amounts of sales data know less about what the people they are selling to want... than someone that randomly posts here? I see.
I'd also like to point out that even here, less than half the people voted yes. That is not a majority.
The only people that seem to be upset are PvP players, that want more PvP content than is being offered. I've yet to see anyone upset about the existing PvP content because they think it somehow effects their PvE experience.
That's obviously because they are just too lazy. I mean it's not like if they make a better game they will end up having more sales or something.