Their view on items is that it's better to have a crapload of useless items drop as opposed to the occasional useful item. When you played Diablo 2, did you even think of a non-magic or better item dropping as even BEING a drop? When you were playing with friends, and you killed something that didn't drop a rare, but dropped an extra white item, did you say "wooo double drop off Pindle!"? I'm assuming not.
They are just generating screen clutter to disguise the fact that the items that you do pick up aren't as interesting as they were hoping they would be. I have no idea what other changes they are planning on making, but none of the ones they just announced make me go "oooh, that's way better than what it was before"
They can continue to modify this game all they want, eventually they either have to release it or eat the who knows how much money they spent developing it. I'm sure when they release it they will sell a lot of copies and that most people here will buy one, but seriously, I grew bored with the Beta in under a week, I'd rather start new characters in Skyrim than play more Diablo 3 and I don't really see that changing even after release, they just don't seem to be making it that much more interesting. That being said, I'm fairly confident when the game comes out I'll buy it and play for awhile, but I doubt I'll bother playing to inferno at all and I probably won't play past normal on more than one character if that. If their goal is to make the game lasting, this isn't helping, but if their goal is to sell one-off copies, they probably, correctly, figure "who cares"?
TLDR: Meh, release delayed, boring changes that don't mean much.
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- Clypheous
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Member for 12 years and 8 months
Last active Thu, May, 10 2012 05:43:28
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I suspect though since there will be relatively few "long term" players that will be playing in normal much since there's no reason really to start characters over, that pretty quickly the Normal and Nightmare mats won't be worth much. I expect the Hell and Inferno mats to maintain significant value over time.
I don't understand the purpose of hoarding all this gear when you could sell it for gear that you actually have on your character. In Hardcore I understand, but in softcore? I don't get it at all.
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I don't see how this makes sense. Maybe I am understanding it wrong. If you can play with people who are not in your region, and trade with them, doesn't that basically mean they are creating a group of people who going to do arbitrage between the various Real Money Auction Houses? You will own a character that does U.S. and have someone own a character that does China. You will have them both play on U.S. Servers, but one will have access to U.S. RMAH and one will have access to Chinese RMAH. So basically, you're creating a de facto exchange between the regions, something I thought they were trying to avoid.
I don't really care that much personally one way or the other, but it kind of seems like, from an international law perspective, that this is doing exactly what Blizzard has said repeatedly they did not want to do.
Am I getting something wrong here?
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I don't know how effective that build will be, but the one suggestion I'd make is to change the rune in Marked for Death to Indigo for Contagion. You've got lots of healing abilities but having the 20% damage debuff spread constantly while you're in melee seems like it could be very useful. It certainly looks like that could be fun city!
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As far as the higher base damage from cooldown attacks, you could be correct about that, but that's not a good argument for the two handed weapon doing more damage. It's an argument that's saying if you take a build that's designed for a two handed weapon and give that build dual pistols, it's not going to do as well, which I can certainly agree on. The skill choices each of these builds would choose will be different. Dual crossbows will want more crit, more crit damage, and more attack damage, 2H crossbows or bows will want attack speed and ways to increase hatred regen so they can use their damaging attacks more often.
I also don't understand where you are getting your information that two handers have a higher base DPS, the highest level hand crossbow does ~168-190DPS by default whereas the highest level crossbow does 171-183 and the highest level bow does 164-181. How is that higher base DPS than the hand crossbow? Is there something I'm missing, or are you basing your numbers off different kinds of items? You wanted me to quote specifics, there are your specifics. The highest level item of each of those classes and the one with the highest base DPS is the hand crossbow.
I'm not saying you can't make a build that would exploit the benefits of having a crossbow instead of dual hand crossbows, but I just don't see any basis for saying it's better. It's just a matter of playstyle, just like everything else.
I appreciate the input though and I think you've made several good points and you are absolutely right about regen favoring slower weapons and cooldown skills probably being better for them, but I suspect dual crossbow builds won't use those skills as much and will look to other skills that are more direct damage to compensate. I certainly agree that quivers are going to make other weapons viable, one thing I can also say is that all my arguments are subject to change the moment we start finding out about affixes that are going to appear on these items.
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If you have a crossbow that shoots once per second and averages 100 damage a .25 increase in attack speed means you'll now be shooting 1.25 times per second, or a 25% increase in damage. i.e. you now do 125 damage per second.
If you have a pistol crossbow that shoots twice per second and averages 50 damage a hit, a .25 increase in attack speed only translates into a 12.5% increase in damage. Significantly lower.
It's possible that for players dual wielding that the increase in attack speed is somehow doubled, permitting both weapons to gain from it equally and increasing total attack speed by .5 APS, but that seems highly unlikely as it could easily start getting Demon Hunters firing as such insane speeds as to potentially break something. If you could get yourself to 3 attacks per second using gear, if you used both Shadow Power and Rapid Fire at the same time, you would be looking at an attack rate of 36 shots per second. I'm not sure what that would look like, but I think since the firing rate could be faster than your frame rate, it would get to be somewhat blinding.
But back to my original point, if they leave it this way, eventually Crossbows will be the exclusive weapon of all min-maxing Demon Hunters because they will do, by far, the most damage due to the scaling of damage due to increased speed. Has anyone seen a Blue commenting on this anywhere?
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Well, OK, what are you talking about? You didn't quote me so I'm not sure what I need to clarify. If it was regarding shields and how sorcs had shields in D2 as damage mitigation you're absolutely right, just because they had mobility didn't make them invincible. However, a "normal" non-melee sorc that was consistently sitting in melee was a bad idea. I'm not saying a shield is worthless to a DH, I'm saying it's less useful than a quiver or a second hand crossbow given how the skills are set up for a DH.
There's obviously no way to absolutely prove that at this point, but from everything I've seen, that's my somewhat informed opinion.
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And if skill attack speed isn't directly related to weapon speed, that's just all kinds of screwed up. I cannot imagine that it wouldn't be linked, because if it's not and only auto-attacks are related to weapon speed, you'd either never use skills, or get the slowest weapon possible because it would do the most damage.
I don't think your conclusion that 2 handed weapons do more damage is accurate. I think that both are going to be pretty similar, I think it's going to come down to how useful the 15% speed bonus is to determine exactly how DH's play. But I have to expect that, since all the DH sets are based on pistol crossbows, that they will make them competitive with anything else, or why force people into using them?
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The biggest factor to keep in mind is that, yes, each individual shot with the Demon Hunter does less damage with dxbow, but you also fire about twice as fast. With the addition of hatred generating skills, this will, after the patch, eliminate these problems. Basically you will be able to fire two Impales in X amount of time that each do about half the damage of one Impale fired with a normal full crossbow. If you have a skill that generates a lot of hatred, or, take the passive that generates a lot of hatred, you should be fine in this regard.
The 15% increase in attack speed for double xbows is going to make them almost twice the speed of a standard crossbow which will give you a lot less wasted damage on targets that don't need the full hit. The most efficient way to do damage is quickly in small chunks as opposed to huge amounts slowly.
I plan on getting the two fastest crossbows I can find, loading them up and trying to see how fast I can shoot under the best circumstances. I'm thinking Shadow Power, Rapid Fire with Dual Crossbows. That's going to be as close to a machine gun as this game gets!
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First off, when people realize that you fit a niche that they need filled, you're always in demand.
Second, when you find gear for the most popular class you can sell it for a premium, while conversely gear for your class is significantly less expensive because there is less demand.
Third the least popular classes are often boosted and improved, while the most popular classes are more likely to be nerfed or otherwise subverted. Starting with the least popular class increases the likelihood of your class getting better in the future making it even easier to do stuff.
Lastly, I just like the Demon Hunter motif and think it will be a lot of fun. I mean, all the classes are demon hunters, so why not play the actual Demon Hunter? The female one of course, to me the male one sounds kinda goofy.
If your goal is to provide resources for future playthroughs with other classes, pick the least popular classes, if your goal is to power thru content and figure out how to rush, then by all means, pick Wizard or something like that.
As an aside, for Force's videos, comparing his first barb run to anything else is silly. Each class he played had better gear to start than the class before. After the Barb he always loaded each class up with all kinds of goodies from previous runs, making them insanely more powerful.
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You're going to hell and I don't mean Act IV.
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Forgive me Your Holiness! I had no idea that you played Diablo! I suppose, in a way, it does make sense. After all, fighting evil is kind of your domain.
So, I'm assuming you'll be playing a Monk?
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There is absolutely no way that this is true unless you plan on playing your DH as a melee character. As a DH you should never be getting close enough for anything to try to hit you, if you are, you need some avoidance skills. You want to shoot as rapidly as possible to maintain maximum mobility. If monsters are close enough to you that you need a shield, you're already in serious trouble, if it happens frequently enough to be a problem you're either playing a "unique" build or you're out of practice.
Personally I'm looking forward to enchanting my weapon with cold damage and having a machine gun of slow effect on enemies I attack.
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Man, I remember when no game had an "end game" you could either play it again from the beginning or buy a new game. That was pretty much it, now all games have to keep you interested forever. I feel sorry for Blizzard designers, they have created a monster!