I've been running this build for a while now, and I have to say im not that impressed anymore.
The build felt really good in the beginning but now im being outperformed by every DH running the fire/multishot variant.
I even have a half decent ancient calamity, but its simply not enough damage and seems to get boring really fast.
Well, it must be said that with the Yang's the MS build has got a fairly big boost in damage, while the DA build is basically an exercise of style trying to create a powerful synergy with not dedicated gear.
Yang's makes MS around 100% more effective and it adds to an already existing powerful quiver (DML). DA build has no actual weapon (Buriza is good but not on Yang's level) and the quiver is pretty much underwhelming and overlapping the weapon bonus.
Add over this tha MS is both a good ST ability with Arsenal rune and is one of the biggest AoE in game, you end with a very convenient and efficient setup which is hardly countered until other items are added.
What i'd really like? Another 1h xbow set based on HA to use in conjunction with UE.
Yes, for sure there was a F/R equipped and CoE cubed. I have dropped only one on nonseason and i'm leaving it for the wizard since it has INT.
I suppose that an eventual Unity will appear much later if it's not really needed because of bracers.
Also intersting choices:
- the aoe rune for MfD: i say interesting because it covers the lack of AoE damage of DA, worth trying it VS contagion rune especially since last hits are really humongous.
- Etrayu: i'm not confident on this but it's likely he didn't have a better Calamity. The reason is that the 20% cold damage goes on top of 20% from bracers and 20% he had on amulet, making it relatively less powerful. on the contrary, Calamity grants the same bonus damage with no downsides (thus a full 20%) can roll +disc aswell and has an higher as. If the choice was for max damage, then a 2h xbow would have been better.
- fire MS instead of cold: may be working but i'm not entirely sure of it. We stack cold damage, we don't spam it and he doesn't take the Ballistic passive, so missiles are not the factor here. Yes, they hit harder but they're single target and we already have enoguh ST power imho. I'd still go cold MS for easy spread of Calamity+Iceblink.
EDIT: i'm more and more confident that we won't need RoRG; this will leave a lot of good jewelry options and an eventual immunity slot.
Here I leave a video using this build. The video is in Spanish sorry, but you can see how it works in Gr 55, but can be made substantially higher with this build.
15:40 minutes, you can see it in action.
Awesome vid. Would really like to know the gear/gems/cube/skills setup.
I've seen interesting choices like running fire MS and incredible stuff like an 11 billions DA.
This thread made me decide on running DH again for this season. To be on the safe side i'll try to push to GR60 with the standard MS build which has alredy proven to be functional, but this buid will be definitely the standard i'll play.
You can Cube DD, Equip full set and Hunters Wrath? RoRG is optional
Yeah, you're right. I need to search if there are other worth pieces of armor to use for the build (afaik nothing seems a so big improvement other than Frostburn) otherwise a CoE could be used instead of the RoRG in cube.
As expected, time isn't stellar but my experience on high GR is very limited to non-existant, so it could have been a good time.
What makes me happy is that from your gear there's room for improvements: Calamity and DML in first place, didin't look at gems but it seems you run a BotT+Ice+SS, i'm going to try BotT+Ice+Zei given the kiting potential.
Looks pretty good and worth playing; it may be not rank#1 material but looks playable.
Equip Hunters wrath, cube Depth Diggers, Cube RRoG, Equip Frostburn.
Altough you will miss an opportunity to cube a second element immunity amulet, or an Convection of Elements
To use DD you need to cube RoRG anyway. Going full offensive requires RoRG to stack as many bonuses as possible.
If you don't cube RoRG, you either miss F/R (which is not advised) or DD. The second option seems more likely, it all depends on what we will need to have to tackle high level GR. For farming status, i don't think we need either immunity amu (i'd go for a good rolled Hellfire).
I am currently in the servers, sifting through all the shit from Season 3. I will be setting this build up and pushing grifts later tonight. Will report back in a few hours.
Assuming you go with Calamity as weapon (as it seems the only option) test both Cirri and DML. I suppose that since AoE is become kinda a big deal, DML will turn out better.
Also test different legendary gems setup (Zei, SS, IceBlink).
EDIT: is it possible to throw Frostburn into the equation? maybe equipping hunter's wrath and cubing the gloves.
Etrayu could be an option if you want to boost cold dmg. I was using it along with Cirri on PTR
Pro: cold damage boost which is not found anywhere else as weapon.
Cons: bows are the middle ground in both attack spped and damage - meaning they don't shine neither in number of attacks or max damage. Also considering thatw e have Calamity which is basically a 20% dmg increase to all damage also for party, plus having high as, there's no reason to use a bow.
You can't actually equip the Buriza without a significant damage loss. The Buriza cannot roll discipline or be rerolled with discipline as a secondary affix. This means we cannot utilize the Buriza affix unless we Cube the weapon. Due to this, the 2.2 version of the build failed spectacularly.
Didn't they change it or was it only for 1h xbows and bows? Well, given this i suppose there's not much of a choice about weapons. Calamity+DML seems to be the best option out until they add something more.
And i'm asking myself why we got a Sticky Trap weapon instead They could add stuff for current sets and leave the weapon for the next pacth when the new sets are added.
Devouring Arrow with the new belt and Buriza bonus on cube seems a good F/R activator + damage mitigator (new bracers) while Multishot is main damage dealer on groups. When facing a single target, Devouring becomes the prime and Multishot to activate F/R.
Basically this - following is the reasoning.
- Cirri is a good HA cenetered bonus, but Buriza giving a guaranteed 2 jumps + travel limit makes the quiver a smaller damage increase than it appears. Also, the Buriza pierces are counted "in advance" so you have a 100% - 100% - base% chance of jump.
- Buriza jumps count towards DA damage increases.
- DML is still a very good quiver because either you focus on MS or run DA, the damage increase is higher compared to Cirri. Given also the fact that we don't have any good/viable 1h xbow apart Calamity i'm just assuming that DML is the way to go until they add some other item (maybe a 1h xbow that adds an HA rune by default).
- Calamity VS Buriza: it's the same of AoE VS single target; bosses/rift guardians benefit much more from sustained damage, so Calamity should be the winner. On AoE farming MS may be the winner due to bigger burst hence Buriza should be better. Tbh, matter of preference since we can cube either of the weapons and use the other one, so we're not actually missing any bonus.
The +Disc rings give 'additive' damage, and the Focus and Restaint combo gives 'multiplicative' damage.
This - there's not even questioning about the ring combo unfortunately.Given current setups, i expect a lot of builds cubing RoRG and go F/R if they couldn't do it before.
The HA build here goes the same way for the opposite reason: we would have gone F/R anyway, we cube RoRG just to get the advantage of freeing a gear slot and use Depth Diggers, which are nice but arguably the less powerful piece of gear.
Another option: equip Hunter's Wrath, cube Depth Diggers and free the jewelry slot i case we want to use an Hellfire or immunity amulet or another ring like Broken Promises.
The problem about dropping MS is that you need another spender to proc F/R buffs.
About Broken Promises: looks good on paper but actually math shows a maximum 60-ish% uptime, which is still dominated by RNG. If you want to truly use it, it's best to remove all CC from gear and reoll it to AS to maximize the procs.
Still, i don't think it pairs with Depth Diggers (100%dmg is a lot) and for sure it doesn't stand a chance against F/R - cubing BP means no RoRG.
Another "issue" i have is that Cirri is not stellar even for this build, but we don't actually have a weapon to pair with Calamity for dualwield dreamers. Very likely if you're going for a quiver dead Man's Legacy looks just better because even if the focus is not on MS making it dealing double damage is good since it still gets the bonus from UE and cold damage. Not at Arsenal level for sure but still worth considering.
Ok, that sounds right - i'll prolly run iceblink for starters since it's a defnitie damage increase, unless i run with a CC man around. Looks also a better option for solo because of CC. I'll level up Zei in any case.
As for defensive gems(if needed) should we go with GIzzard or are there better options around?
EDIT: i'll try also to get a decent dual wield setup, though we don't have a weapon required for this build - we can eiher run Buriza and cube Calamity for the special or the opposite to get the exact same benefits; as for the caluclations above 1h seems to perform better, but more tests need to be done.
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ModeratorWell, it must be said that with the Yang's the MS build has got a fairly big boost in damage, while the DA build is basically an exercise of style trying to create a powerful synergy with not dedicated gear.
Yang's makes MS around 100% more effective and it adds to an already existing powerful quiver (DML). DA build has no actual weapon (Buriza is good but not on Yang's level) and the quiver is pretty much underwhelming and overlapping the weapon bonus.
Add over this tha MS is both a good ST ability with Arsenal rune and is one of the biggest AoE in game, you end with a very convenient and efficient setup which is hardly countered until other items are added.
What i'd really like? Another 1h xbow set based on HA to use in conjunction with UE.
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ModeratorTry and test a DML instead of a Cirri - relative power of the two quivers seems to point towards DML.
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ModeratorYes, for sure there was a F/R equipped and CoE cubed. I have dropped only one on nonseason and i'm leaving it for the wizard since it has INT.
I suppose that an eventual Unity will appear much later if it's not really needed because of bracers.
Also intersting choices:
- the aoe rune for MfD: i say interesting because it covers the lack of AoE damage of DA, worth trying it VS contagion rune especially since last hits are really humongous.
- Etrayu: i'm not confident on this but it's likely he didn't have a better Calamity. The reason is that the 20% cold damage goes on top of 20% from bracers and 20% he had on amulet, making it relatively less powerful. on the contrary, Calamity grants the same bonus damage with no downsides (thus a full 20%) can roll +disc aswell and has an higher as. If the choice was for max damage, then a 2h xbow would have been better.
- fire MS instead of cold: may be working but i'm not entirely sure of it. We stack cold damage, we don't spam it and he doesn't take the Ballistic passive, so missiles are not the factor here. Yes, they hit harder but they're single target and we already have enoguh ST power imho. I'd still go cold MS for easy spread of Calamity+Iceblink.
EDIT: i'm more and more confident that we won't need RoRG; this will leave a lot of good jewelry options and an eventual immunity slot.
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ModeratorI've seen interesting choices like running fire MS and incredible stuff like an 11 billions DA.
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ModeratorThis thread made me decide on running DH again for this season. To be on the safe side i'll try to push to GR60 with the standard MS build which has alredy proven to be functional, but this buid will be definitely the standard i'll play.
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ModeratorOk, nice video for starters
As expected, time isn't stellar but my experience on high GR is very limited to non-existant, so it could have been a good time.
What makes me happy is that from your gear there's room for improvements: Calamity and DML in first place, didin't look at gems but it seems you run a BotT+Ice+SS, i'm going to try BotT+Ice+Zei given the kiting potential.
Looks pretty good and worth playing; it may be not rank#1 material but looks playable.
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ModeratorIf you don't cube RoRG, you either miss F/R (which is not advised) or DD. The second option seems more likely, it all depends on what we will need to have to tackle high level GR. For farming status, i don't think we need either immunity amu (i'd go for a good rolled Hellfire).
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ModeratorAssuming you go with Calamity as weapon (as it seems the only option) test both Cirri and DML. I suppose that since AoE is become kinda a big deal, DML will turn out better.
Also test different legendary gems setup (Zei, SS, IceBlink).
EDIT: is it possible to throw Frostburn into the equation? maybe equipping hunter's wrath and cubing the gloves.
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ModeratorPro: cold damage boost which is not found anywhere else as weapon.
Cons: bows are the middle ground in both attack spped and damage - meaning they don't shine neither in number of attacks or max damage. Also considering thatw e have Calamity which is basically a 20% dmg increase to all damage also for party, plus having high as, there's no reason to use a bow.
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ModeratorAnd i'm asking myself why we got a Sticky Trap weapon instead
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ModeratorBasically this - following is the reasoning.
- Cirri is a good HA cenetered bonus, but Buriza giving a guaranteed 2 jumps + travel limit makes the quiver a smaller damage increase than it appears. Also, the Buriza pierces are counted "in advance" so you have a 100% - 100% - base% chance of jump.
- Buriza jumps count towards DA damage increases.
- DML is still a very good quiver because either you focus on MS or run DA, the damage increase is higher compared to Cirri. Given also the fact that we don't have any good/viable 1h xbow apart Calamity i'm just assuming that DML is the way to go until they add some other item (maybe a 1h xbow that adds an HA rune by default).
- Calamity VS Buriza: it's the same of AoE VS single target; bosses/rift guardians benefit much more from sustained damage, so Calamity should be the winner. On AoE farming MS may be the winner due to bigger burst hence Buriza should be better. Tbh, matter of preference since we can cube either of the weapons and use the other one, so we're not actually missing any bonus.
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ModeratorThis - there's not even questioning about the ring combo unfortunately.Given current setups, i expect a lot of builds cubing RoRG and go F/R if they couldn't do it before.
The HA build here goes the same way for the opposite reason: we would have gone F/R anyway, we cube RoRG just to get the advantage of freeing a gear slot and use Depth Diggers, which are nice but arguably the less powerful piece of gear.
Another option: equip Hunter's Wrath, cube Depth Diggers and free the jewelry slot i case we want to use an Hellfire or immunity amulet or another ring like Broken Promises.
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ModeratorThe problem about dropping MS is that you need another spender to proc F/R buffs.
About Broken Promises: looks good on paper but actually math shows a maximum 60-ish% uptime, which is still dominated by RNG. If you want to truly use it, it's best to remove all CC from gear and reoll it to AS to maximize the procs.
Still, i don't think it pairs with Depth Diggers (100%dmg is a lot) and for sure it doesn't stand a chance against F/R - cubing BP means no RoRG.
Another "issue" i have is that Cirri is not stellar even for this build, but we don't actually have a weapon to pair with Calamity for dualwield dreamers. Very likely if you're going for a quiver dead Man's Legacy looks just better because even if the focus is not on MS making it dealing double damage is good since it still gets the bonus from UE and cold damage. Not at Arsenal level for sure but still worth considering.
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ModeratorOk, that sounds right - i'll prolly run iceblink for starters since it's a defnitie damage increase, unless i run with a CC man around. Looks also a better option for solo because of CC. I'll level up Zei in any case.
As for defensive gems(if needed) should we go with GIzzard or are there better options around?
EDIT: i'll try also to get a decent dual wield setup, though we don't have a weapon required for this build - we can eiher run Buriza and cube Calamity for the special or the opposite to get the exact same benefits; as for the caluclations above 1h seems to perform better, but more tests need to be done.