So paragon levels have been combined across the account. How is this going to work exactly?
Don't you eventually just max out all the categories and then lose any customization at all?
The only way I could see this not being possible is if the levels are ridiculously hard after a certain point or if they implement a cap.
Lylirra on twitter: "@peli_can_flip Bonuses are retroactive. I.E. If you have two p100 heroes right now, the current plan is that you'd have 200 points in ROS."
Is it better now to have four paragon level 50 characters than two level 100 since they will both reward 200 points at expansion launch? (1-50 being substantially easier than 51-100)
How do the points work? You gain an account level and every character you have will get a point to allocate individually?
When you create a new character and he hits 70 (the new cap) does he automatically get all the points you've obtained thus far?
I assume your softcore and hardcore characters will have a different paragon systems still?
EDIT:
- Lylirra has confirmed that paragon experience for the new system will be used by adding up your current characters paragon EXPERIENCE; not paragon LEVELS. This is great news.
- Lylirra's twitter also states that softcore and hardcore paragon systems will be separate.
1) We don't know how it's going to work out exactly, because it has just been announced and even if Blizzard has a plan for how it might work, it's all subject to change because there will be a beta.
2) Maxing out: I would be more concerned if there was no max at all and people could abuse this to get to 100% crit, +2000 main stat, or some other game breaking stuff - for them the game would become super boring and if Blizzard were to deal with this (e.g., increase difficulty tenfold) all other players couldn't kill a single mob anymore. I'm sure Blizzard will balance this out, they've seen how crazy people are.
3) Retroactive changes: No one knows. Lylirra's quote can be interpreted in many ways, for example, only your highest paragon will be carried over, plus all p100 chars. Not sure. If it's simply a game of adding up, I'm sure everyone will just level 10 chars to p30 or so (at least I will :P).
4) How do points work, no idea yet. Stay tuned. But even if they have details on that, like I said, all subject to change anyways. Don't freak out over some details, it won't stay the same until release anyways.
5) New character: I guess so, otherwise account-wide paragon wouldn't really be account-wide. That's the whole new point; people with a p100 character feel like super gimps if they switch to a new level 60 character now, and that's what account-wide paragon is meant to change.
6) I'm sure it will, otherwise you'd just level paragon as crazy on SC and then invest all the points in defense for HC. HC and SC always have been separated.
How do the points work? You gain an account level and every character you have will get a point to allocate individually?
This is not clear (yet). As I understood it in Joshs presentation, all characters share a pool of points, but his wording wasn't 100% precise on this, so it might be individual afterall. If it's shared, I see a major flaw in this.
I'm confused as well because from this screenshot it seems like you can assign the paragon points to individual characters:
From another screen shot it seems like each attribute is capped at 50 paragon points. Each paragon point giving you 5 stat points (1 paragon point is 5 strength, etc).
As far as retroactively assigning your acount paragon level, it would make no sense if they just added up your individual paragon levels as its much less exp for the early paragon levels.
Well, I watched Josh's presentation and he did indeed say paragon is endless. I can't see how that's possible if all the attributes have a cap. Notice on the screen shot it says "Intelligence: 0/50" "Vitality: 0/50". I guess the only way I can see this as true is if when you gain a level, you only gain one point universally to pick which character you want to spend it on, not each of your characters gain one point that they each can spend.
I agree that it can't truly be endless for one character, otherwise I would just keep spending points on DPS until it's so astronomical the game is easy even on MP10.
As far as retroactively assigning your acount paragon level, it would make no sense if they just added up your individual paragon levels as its much less exp for the early paragon levels.
Correct, it would obviously make much more sense to add up the total paragon XP across the account.
Well, I watched Josh's presentation and he did indeed say paragon is endless. I can't see how that's possible if all the attributes have a cap.
I would guess after a certain level you have maxed out all the paragon stats, but can still increase the paragon level for wall pissing rights.
It is likely still that the utility bar has a time-consuming point sinks, of a trivial nature. I.e. once you've maxed core, attack and defense, (which honestly I doubt will be imbalanced, probably more like paragon 100 now plus 500k ehp 200k dps), after an amazing amount of hours, then you can invest points in movement speed, bag space, TP cooldown reduction, etc.. After that it is hard to think of examples, but certainly new banners/dyes/colors are an option, as well as pets. They'd have to be cosmetic, and very likely of a wall pissing nature. But they could be released often enough to keep players from reaching the end.
The botters love this new no cap thing with paragon lvl
So what? Let them love it. Look at your character and feel the sense of achievement. A botter looking at his p500 character won't feel it. He'll just be like "OMFG I'm so powerful!" and an hour later he'll be like "damn, I can't make any progress, this is boring, I'll quit". Btw, you can't sell paragon levels, so I don't care if someone bots their way to p1000.
My take is:
All your paragon exp across all chars is added up into the new number.
So if you have 5x P20 you get a certain amount of exp. Due to the non-linear nature of the paragon system 5x P20 is not P100. It is more like P40. So your 5x P100 are not going to be a new P500 with 500 points... more like P200 or even less. And we all know how long it takes to get there. Even if there is no P-limit, its not going to be easy to get to P999 (unless you are a bot).
The difference between low and high end is out of proportion when the expension hits. I therefor think they will add the following details;
- Only the 2 highest paragon level characters will be added up.
- The total experience of the 2 characters will determine the new paragon level.
Imagine someone having 5-10x paragon 100. If all experience is added up, that player can forget leveling up any time soon, as the difficulty should increase per level. The player should still feel rewarded for leveling up multiple characters when the highest 2 are eligible for the new paragon system.
I think the above mentioned should protect the player as well as balance issues.
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The little boat gently drifted across the pond exactly the way a bowling ball wouldn’t...
It seems very strange that you couldn't customize each individual character with there own custom blend of paragon points - but it really only makes sense if they are NOT sharing the point but rather all characters allotted the same number of points based on total paragon experience. Their past comments lead me to believe they really want you to feel like you are still contributing to your paragon levels even if you jump down to a lesser (lower) character - so pooled paragon experience makes sense.
If they pooled the points (not experience) and all characters shared the same paragon bonuses I would HATE sitting there thinking "Do I use my new point in INT for my WD or throw it in to DEX for my DH...."
From a customization standpoint (which they keep saying they REALLY want to do) it only makes sense if I can tweek each character individually without worrying about the impact on my other characters.
If I may be bold enough... what if I level 5 barbs, maybe I level 10! AND maybe I do this because I have the best gear for a barb. So I know that I will level those paragon levels so fast on all of my characters that now I have an unspeakable amount of paragon points
Lyirra (sp?) confirmed that it will be averaged paragon experience that determines shared paragon.
So 1 p100 char > 20 p10 chars.
Total experience counts, so the only way you're wasting time now is playing a p100 char.
There won't be any p100 characters. It's and account stat now.
Think what he's saying is having 1 P100 character will place your account paragon at a higher level than having a bunch of lower lever characters who's total (combined) level is greater than 100.
In other words, don't waste your time filling you char slots with lower level paragon characters because you're hoping it will get you some cheap easy levels in the new systems.
Don't you eventually just max out all the categories and then lose any customization at all?
The only way I could see this not being possible is if the levels are ridiculously hard after a certain point or if they implement a cap.
Lylirra on twitter: "@peli_can_flip Bonuses are retroactive. I.E. If you have two p100 heroes right now, the current plan is that you'd have 200 points in ROS."
Is it better now to have four paragon level 50 characters than two level 100 since they will both reward 200 points at expansion launch? (1-50 being substantially easier than 51-100)
How do the points work? You gain an account level and every character you have will get a point to allocate individually?
When you create a new character and he hits 70 (the new cap) does he automatically get all the points you've obtained thus far?
I assume your softcore and hardcore characters will have a different paragon systems still?
************************************************************************************
EDIT:
- Lylirra has confirmed that paragon experience for the new system will be used by adding up your current characters paragon EXPERIENCE; not paragon LEVELS. This is great news.
- Lylirra's twitter also states that softcore and hardcore paragon systems will be separate.
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Highest: Rank 6 // Greater Rift 42 12m40s
2) Maxing out: I would be more concerned if there was no max at all and people could abuse this to get to 100% crit, +2000 main stat, or some other game breaking stuff - for them the game would become super boring and if Blizzard were to deal with this (e.g., increase difficulty tenfold) all other players couldn't kill a single mob anymore. I'm sure Blizzard will balance this out, they've seen how crazy people are.
3) Retroactive changes: No one knows. Lylirra's quote can be interpreted in many ways, for example, only your highest paragon will be carried over, plus all p100 chars. Not sure. If it's simply a game of adding up, I'm sure everyone will just level 10 chars to p30 or so (at least I will :P).
4) How do points work, no idea yet. Stay tuned. But even if they have details on that, like I said, all subject to change anyways. Don't freak out over some details, it won't stay the same until release anyways.
5) New character: I guess so, otherwise account-wide paragon wouldn't really be account-wide. That's the whole new point; people with a p100 character feel like super gimps if they switch to a new level 60 character now, and that's what account-wide paragon is meant to change.
6) I'm sure it will, otherwise you'd just level paragon as crazy on SC and then invest all the points in defense for HC. HC and SC always have been separated.
I'm confused as well because from this screenshot it seems like you can assign the paragon points to individual characters:
From another screen shot it seems like each attribute is capped at 50 paragon points. Each paragon point giving you 5 stat points (1 paragon point is 5 strength, etc).
As far as retroactively assigning your acount paragon level, it would make no sense if they just added up your individual paragon levels as its much less exp for the early paragon levels.
I agree that it can't truly be endless for one character, otherwise I would just keep spending points on DPS until it's so astronomical the game is easy even on MP10.
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Highest: Rank 6 // Greater Rift 42 12m40s
Correct, it would obviously make much more sense to add up the total paragon XP across the account.
I'm sure they are doing this to not burn those who spend time leveling all five character to 500 total.
But I agree, they should just add up total experience on all characters and apply it to the new system. That would be the real fair way to do it.
Top 10 Solo Wizard Leaderboard - North America
Highest: Rank 6 // Greater Rift 42 12m40s
I would guess after a certain level you have maxed out all the paragon stats, but can still increase the paragon level for wall pissing rights.
It is likely still that the utility bar has a time-consuming point sinks, of a trivial nature. I.e. once you've maxed core, attack and defense, (which honestly I doubt will be imbalanced, probably more like paragon 100 now plus 500k ehp 200k dps), after an amazing amount of hours, then you can invest points in movement speed, bag space, TP cooldown reduction, etc.. After that it is hard to think of examples, but certainly new banners/dyes/colors are an option, as well as pets. They'd have to be cosmetic, and very likely of a wall pissing nature. But they could be released often enough to keep players from reaching the end.
http://www.diabloprogress.com/hero/sodomir-2220/
So what? Let them love it. Look at your character and feel the sense of achievement. A botter looking at his p500 character won't feel it. He'll just be like "OMFG I'm so powerful!" and an hour later he'll be like "damn, I can't make any progress, this is boring, I'll quit". Btw, you can't sell paragon levels, so I don't care if someone bots their way to p1000.
All your paragon exp across all chars is added up into the new number.
So if you have 5x P20 you get a certain amount of exp. Due to the non-linear nature of the paragon system 5x P20 is not P100. It is more like P40. So your 5x P100 are not going to be a new P500 with 500 points... more like P200 or even less. And we all know how long it takes to get there. Even if there is no P-limit, its not going to be easy to get to P999 (unless you are a bot).
There'll be a cap just like for the stats.
- Only the 2 highest paragon level characters will be added up.
- The total experience of the 2 characters will determine the new paragon level.
Imagine someone having 5-10x paragon 100. If all experience is added up, that player can forget leveling up any time soon, as the difficulty should increase per level. The player should still feel rewarded for leveling up multiple characters when the highest 2 are eligible for the new paragon system.
I think the above mentioned should protect the player as well as balance issues.
If they pooled the points (not experience) and all characters shared the same paragon bonuses I would HATE sitting there thinking "Do I use my new point in INT for my WD or throw it in to DEX for my DH...."
From a customization standpoint (which they keep saying they REALLY want to do) it only makes sense if I can tweek each character individually without worrying about the impact on my other characters.
So 1 p100 char > 20 p10 chars.
Total experience counts, so the only way you're wasting time now is playing a p100 char.
There won't be any p100 characters. It's and account stat now.
Think what he's saying is having 1 P100 character will place your account paragon at a higher level than having a bunch of lower lever characters who's total (combined) level is greater than 100.
In other words, don't waste your time filling you char slots with lower level paragon characters because you're hoping it will get you some cheap easy levels in the new systems.
So yeah my account wide paragon should be like 80 i guess?
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Highest: Rank 6 // Greater Rift 42 12m40s
Do you have an offical link to that? it be great if true, seems to be the only fair way.