Okay, so I had a hell of an adventure while logged into D3, but not while playing...
This all happened while I was discussing gearing issues with a friend until I saw the following on the trade channel:
[Paraphrased] "So did anyone here spend real money on their toon?"
Being the helpful person that I am, I offered my two cents and told him, "Yep, I spent quite a few bucks on my character."
Then the discussion proceeded to "how?" and "when did you start?" and "why did you start?"
And so I explained, I played a lot and farmed normally with diligence until I hit about 100K unbuffed DPS (this included flipping AH items for a while since that's what most of my hardcore gamer friends were doing at the time), then I got a few lucky drops here and there and eventually hit 250K unbuffed DPS. At one point, I thought it'd be fun to try and get into the U.S. wizard DPS leaderboard on DiabloProgress, so I started putting in a small percentage of my paycheck every week or so to build up gold. That's where I got to where I am today.
Now I initially expected a lot of hooplah coming from people who despised the fact that someone bought their way into the high ranks, but I was surprised that most people were simply curious and merely asked for gearing advice, such as which stats to look for long-term, etc.
But then there was ONE person—we'll call him Trail—that came out of nowhere and basically said:
[Paraphrased] "I don't know what's wrong with all of you, but I pity people who spend money on game items."
This is when the argument really started. First off, it wasn't really a "pay to win" argument, it was an argument based on what's an appropriate way to deal with differentiating opinions and how to "properly" spend your money. No exaggeration here, but every single person that was involved with the conversation within the trade channel other than Trail was on my side.
Collectively, our opinion was "No one has the right to tell a person how to use their personal income and how to enjoy their own entertainment."
Meanwhile, Trail's opinion was "No one should spend any money on virtual goods because that's worthless in comparison to real life activities."
I work full time as a public relations manager at an internet company, where I put in about 40+ hours a week. I'm in my 20s, so I'm young and I really only need to look after myself by maintaining living expenses, food, gas, bills, the works. But I have the extra income to put into my personal things, which include entertainment like D3.
So basically I usually play about two to three hours a night if I'm up for it and whenever I feel like it on weekends. I'm on a mission to build a trophy character, and hopefully one day make it into the Top 5 or even #1 wizard DPS on the U.S. server. That's one of the ways I'm having fun. Unfortunately, Trail doesn't understand this. His way of having fun involves taking people to dinner, going to the movies, and flying to California. I counter by saying I also have fun hanging out with family and friends, going to the movies, and flying out to California. However, I also have fun building a top-tier D3 character and have fun grinding it out in-game. But because I put real-life currency into the game, my fun is now unjustified and am deemed a pitiable person.
By the time I logged off over an hour after the discussion began, I understood Trail's opinion (the guy claimed to be a service man at an oil company, so I'm going to assume he's of similar financial background) but I started to pity him instead because he really has tunnel vision. What he doesn't understand is that people have different hobbies, different ways to have fun in life, different tastes in entertainment, different places they invest money into, so on and so forth. What I got out of the conversation (which was absolutely hilarious at one point considering half the people were more offended by Trail's remarks than I was) was "Whatever you do that I don't approve of is clearly wrong."
Oh, the only time I was actually offended by Trail's comments was when he said I prefer D3 over spending time with my friends and family. Putting words in someone else's mouth is just not the way to go. That's when he really crossed the line and fired me up.
So here's the question: - What is your opinion on spending real-life currency on virtual entertainment goods?
the way i see it, if people are willing to PAY to play some games, what wrong with allowing your self a set amount to use on the RMAH?
Understandable. And that makes sense regarding subscription based games. How much was WoW per month? If someone's been playing since vanilla way, way, way back... geez, that's a lot of money, even if they didn't buy third-party services and whatnot.
But then we can get into the argument about how that's not the same, considering you're paying for a "service," technically. Or not?
First of all, it's your money, you worked for it. Sounds to me Trail might be young kid hating on the more 'adult' players for beeing able to put money in the game. Anyways... @ the end of the line you choose what to do with your money...
Actually, he claimed to be some service guy at an oil company. I'll drop that in there as an important tidbit. Just going to assume he's of age and a working man.
Personnally i prefer to sell but i never sell any gear that is my best gear for any 60 i have,
i spent and bought on both way, i think its ok if you can afford it.
its our choice to buy or not and you can only sell if you want to make profit of course
what really suck is that blizzard is exploited/hacked and i dont believe they do a good job on removing the duped gear and gold botted from the game since they dont cancel any rmah auction (every transaction is final) and neither had a sign of any duped gem sold for 5million gold deleted from anyone.
this said it could be unfair if that was a competitive game for people who cant afford it but the only competition in this game are hypothetic beside maybe world 1rst kill/fastest kill
it s in from start and everyone playing know the feature before they purchased or had the chance to know.
spending money over a video game isnt much more of a waste then spending it on beer at the bar
First of all, it's your money, you worked for it. Sounds to me Trail might be young kid hating on the more 'adult' players for beeing able to put money in the game. Anyways... @ the end of the line you choose what to do with your money...
I wouldn't make that assumption. Many old school RPG'ers like myself frown on short-cuts, no matter what your excuse is. I work too, only part time but I own several rental properties that consume much of my time, not to mention being a single father.
True pride in your character can only be achieved by doing it 'the old fashioned way'. By purchasing gold/items, you have chosen a shortcut, you have chosen to bypass effort and cut straight to the quick with your wallet.
In seconds, you achieve what takes me weeks, even months to reach.
It is your own business how you game, as well, how you achieve prominence in-game. But do not pretend that there is any sense of pride to be gleamed from a bought character.
What i was saying is that it's his choice. Nobody is taking pride here...? I hate the fact that there is an rmah. But i get it. Otherwise the black market takes over. Like second era of D2.
Agreed. I am just giving my only objection here; and that is people whom are so proud of what I consider to be absolutely nothing.
The RMAH is the PC worlds Game Genie. Enter code; Win.
First of all, it's your money, you worked for it. Sounds to me Trail might be young kid hating on the more 'adult' players for beeing able to put money in the game. Anyways... @ the end of the line you choose what to do with your money...
I wouldn't make that assumption. Many old school RPG'ers like myself frown on short-cuts, no matter what your excuse is. I work too, only part time but I own several rental properties that consume much of my time, not to mention being a single father.
True pride in your character can only be achieved by doing it 'the old fashioned way'. By purchasing gold/items, you have chosen a shortcut, you have chosen to bypass effort and cut straight to the quick with your wallet.
In seconds, you achieve what takes me weeks, even months to reach.
It is your own business how you game, as well, how you achieve prominence in-game. But do not pretend that there is any sense of pride to be gleamed from a bought character.
i dont see why buying gear with money would be different then buying gear with gold or gear given by anyone. Self looted gear or no point to claim for old school pride but still this pride dont really come from the gear i think, its more of what you can do with what you have.
What i was saying is that it's his choice. Nobody is taking pride here...? I hate the fact that there is an rmah. But i get it. Otherwise the black market takes over. Like second era of D2.
Agreed. I am just giving my only objection here; and that is people whom are so proud of what I consider to be absolutely nothing.
The RMAH is the PC worlds Game Genie. Enter code; Win.
Right. My whole spending and gearing spree lately was after I decided to pursue the leaderboards as a personal project and building a trophy character (by whatever means available). My alt classes were geared solely on drops and gold AH trading, but my wizard is a different story.
But what the guy I argued with had trouble understanding is that I can do what I want with my money just like he can do what he wants with his. At the end, it's a game and everyone has their own way of playing the game and having fun.
As for pride... Eh, I think the pride I have right now is that I know how to properly gear, stat-wise. Other than that, what I do with the gear I ended up getting.
I remember WAY back in the day I took the $80 or so I had sitting in paypal and bought some stuff as it was "money" I hadn't thought about for years just sitting in there. To actually spend money I use for bills etc isn't for me but I could see if I had a more disposable income I'd spend it on d3.
I mean there is NO monthly fee, god knows how much money I sunk on EVE, WOW, Rift, etc's monthly fees.
side note: Do you mind if I add you in game to see your gear Jaetch? I'm kinda stuck for upgrade ideas.
It is your own business how you game, as well, how you achieve prominence in-game. But do not pretend that there is any sense of pride to be gleamed from a bought character.
When you renovate a house, you use your own ideas for what you want yet you hire workers to carry out said renovation.
When you buy a classic muscle car with ideas to return it to its glory you send it to a rod shop(or 15 different work shops) to carry out said restoration.
Any normal human would take pride in these things when completed yet they did not carry out the work alone. They used money they had aquired by other means.
There is no shame in spending hard earned money on products that fulfil your desires.
If people didnt spend money on products not aquirable by other means the world be "1000 years behind its current state". <- good or bad thing i dont know.
"No one should spend any money on virtual goods because that's worthless in comparison to real life activities."
To me this statement just doesn't make any sense. For starters he was playing Diablo III which is in itself a virtual good I assume he purchased. Clearly actually playing is a real life activity as well so what is this comparison to real life activities about? And what about all the other virtual goods many of us use day-to-day: from Pay TV, to music we pay for from for example iTunes, even going to a cinema is really not different to watching a movie on your computer or on TV, reading a book on an e-Reader from Amazon, reading a newspaper subscription on-line, ... These are all activities in which we 'consume' virtual goods we pay for. Are these all 'worthless' in his opinion because they don't constitute 'real life activities'? Is reading a print newspaper 'real life' while reading an on-line newspaper is 'not real life'?
This entire thread is the epitome of douche! You wrote a whole tl;dr post about how one guy antagonized you over something, which is all good and fine, but then you go ahead and say you PITY him?! Isn't that a little hypocritical at the very least? If you want to act all high and mighty about something, at least be the bigger man and take the high road. Saying you understand his opinion and pity him for it is extremely presumptuous. This trail kid could've easily posted his own thing about how he understands the opinion of this Jaetch kid he argued with on bnet and pities Jaetch for having elementary incorrect opinions which are easily understood. Your tunnel vision is evidently blinding you since you can't see this!
Anyway I'm with whoever said the game genie bit. But I have no problem with people who spend on the rmah! Without them I wouldn't be able to sell my digital stuff for irl cash money!
You asked for opinion.
Is it acceptable? - Yes, it's your money.
Is it reasonable? - No, it's kinda stupid.
But playing the video game is kinda stupid anyway, you should not be doing this in the first place, you're just wasting your time... But we all do play the game, so one stupid thing leads to another. Anyway you probably would throw your money away on drinks or women or whatever - if you prefer things you can't touch or taste , but help you to fight imaginary demon lord - it's you choice, no one who plays the game is in position to judge you.
As for pride... Eh, I think the pride I have right now is that I know how to properly gear, stat-wise. Other than that, what I do with the gear I ended up getting.
That's an excellent point. Knowing how to use your build (tactics/skill) would also be included in this line of thought.
I did a lot of competitive melee dueling in D2 and went up against quite a few people whom obviously (sometimes admittedly) just bought full zealot gears, but they didn't understand the subtleties of AR/IAS breakpoints etc.
I don't want anyone thinking I was trying to take a shot at people whom spend real money on gears, as if they're incapable or lazy. I'm just stating how I feel, personally, about what leaves me fulfilled with a game like Diablo. I am only fulfilled when I accomplish character upgrades without resorting to real money purchases, much the same I wouldn't feel fulfilled by scamming people. Though the moral implications of scamming go way beyond what anyone could fairly claim against RMAH'ers.
Much of the bitterness that 'straight edge' players like myself have toward people whom buy gear/gold comes from the bad apples that buy all their gear and then make fun of others (whom don't buy gears) for having less than elite gears.
Jaetch seems like the type of player that would never do this.
But playing the video game is kinda stupid anyway, you should not be doing this in the first place, you're just wasting your time... But we all do play the game, so one stupid thing leads to another.
You shouldn't listen to the shit that some outside of our interests have to say. I've had a few people drop this line of bullshit on me before, and I was quick to point out that (moderate) gaming is no more a waste of time than watching 6 hours of DVR'd television content every night.
I so love it when some dizzy cunt tells me gaming is a waste yet she/he goes home and watches American Idol, along with a long list of equally brainless fodder.
Pursuing hobbies is a waste of time.
This whole debate is more philosophical than anything else.
If I want to glue together little parts so it gets a one big thing,is this stupid? Of course it is, you don't "gain" anything from it.
At least nothing material, but what you gain is satisfaction and fun.
The same that people gain who don't have the time to grind 500 hours elite but want to play the game and a higher level.
I see your point, but hobbies can be different. I'm looking into two kind of activities: you create something or you're wasting your time. So say crafting, music, painting, art, etc or even sport are somehow productive hobbies improving you as a person and producing some stuff for other people, while videogaming, drinknig etc. are counterproductive. But I'm not like pointing fingers, more like amittiing things )
I have no problem with people chosing to spend a little of their own hard earned money on the rmah. Without those, the rest of us wouldnt be able to sell stuff on rmah.
"No one should spend any money on virtual goods because that's worthless in comparison to real life activities."
Have you ever considered, that they can do both?
Its generaly teenagers who angers about people spending some money on their character. The exact same people, who every weekend spend pretty much every dime they have on alchohol. And they talk about blowing money away lol.
Don't worry what other people spend their own money for. Who knows maybe that can just afford it, maybe they do it instead of buying small trains og collecting toy cars.... Spending a few hundred $ a month on diablo, is still cheaper than ie golfing for a hobby.
And take into consideration, without anyone to buy the stuff, we wont be able to sell the stuff. Buyers complete the circle.
You asked for opinion.
Is it acceptable? - Yes, it's your money.
Is it reasonable? - No, it's kinda stupid.
But playing the video game is kinda stupid anyway, you should not be doing this in the first place, you're just wasting your time... But we all do play the game, so one stupid thing leads to another. Anyway you probably would throw your money away on drinks or women or whatever - if you prefer things you can't touch or taste , but help you to fight imaginary demon lord - it's you choice, no one who plays the game is in position to judge you.
Pursuing hobbies is a waste of time.
This whole debate is more philosophical than anything else.
If I want to glue together little parts so it gets a one big thing,is this stupid? Of course it is, you don't "gain" anything from it.
At least nothing material, but what you gain is satisfaction and fun.
The same that people gain who don't have the time to grind 500 hours elite but want to play the game and a higher level.
If we wish to pursue the philosophical line; I could argue that anything you do outside of securing provisions for your survival, is a waste of time.
So here's the question: - What is your opinion on spending real-life currency on virtual entertainment goods?
Waist of time. I want to find my loot while playing. I have already paid for Diablo 3 and I never liked WoW for the monthly cost. Things that cost extra is something I take a distance from. I just want things I really need in life, and "virtual goods" does not make my life any easier or happier. This is why I do not spend on useless things, both in-game and outside of games.
This all happened while I was discussing gearing issues with a friend until I saw the following on the trade channel:
Being the helpful person that I am, I offered my two cents and told him, "Yep, I spent quite a few bucks on my character."
Then the discussion proceeded to "how?" and "when did you start?" and "why did you start?"
And so I explained, I played a lot and farmed normally with diligence until I hit about 100K unbuffed DPS (this included flipping AH items for a while since that's what most of my hardcore gamer friends were doing at the time), then I got a few lucky drops here and there and eventually hit 250K unbuffed DPS. At one point, I thought it'd be fun to try and get into the U.S. wizard DPS leaderboard on DiabloProgress, so I started putting in a small percentage of my paycheck every week or so to build up gold. That's where I got to where I am today.
Now I initially expected a lot of hooplah coming from people who despised the fact that someone bought their way into the high ranks, but I was surprised that most people were simply curious and merely asked for gearing advice, such as which stats to look for long-term, etc.
But then there was ONE person—we'll call him Trail—that came out of nowhere and basically said:
This is when the argument really started. First off, it wasn't really a "pay to win" argument, it was an argument based on what's an appropriate way to deal with differentiating opinions and how to "properly" spend your money. No exaggeration here, but every single person that was involved with the conversation within the trade channel other than Trail was on my side.
Collectively, our opinion was "No one has the right to tell a person how to use their personal income and how to enjoy their own entertainment."
Meanwhile, Trail's opinion was "No one should spend any money on virtual goods because that's worthless in comparison to real life activities."
I work full time as a public relations manager at an internet company, where I put in about 40+ hours a week. I'm in my 20s, so I'm young and I really only need to look after myself by maintaining living expenses, food, gas, bills, the works. But I have the extra income to put into my personal things, which include entertainment like D3.
So basically I usually play about two to three hours a night if I'm up for it and whenever I feel like it on weekends. I'm on a mission to build a trophy character, and hopefully one day make it into the Top 5 or even #1 wizard DPS on the U.S. server. That's one of the ways I'm having fun. Unfortunately, Trail doesn't understand this. His way of having fun involves taking people to dinner, going to the movies, and flying to California. I counter by saying I also have fun hanging out with family and friends, going to the movies, and flying out to California. However, I also have fun building a top-tier D3 character and have fun grinding it out in-game. But because I put real-life currency into the game, my fun is now unjustified and am deemed a pitiable person.
By the time I logged off over an hour after the discussion began, I understood Trail's opinion (the guy claimed to be a service man at an oil company, so I'm going to assume he's of similar financial background) but I started to pity him instead because he really has tunnel vision. What he doesn't understand is that people have different hobbies, different ways to have fun in life, different tastes in entertainment, different places they invest money into, so on and so forth. What I got out of the conversation (which was absolutely hilarious at one point considering half the people were more offended by Trail's remarks than I was) was "Whatever you do that I don't approve of is clearly wrong."
Oh, the only time I was actually offended by Trail's comments was when he said I prefer D3 over spending time with my friends and family. Putting words in someone else's mouth is just not the way to go. That's when he really crossed the line and fired me up.
So here's the question:
- What is your opinion on spending real-life currency on virtual entertainment goods?
Armory | YouTube | Twitter | Clan Site
Understandable. And that makes sense regarding subscription based games. How much was WoW per month? If someone's been playing since vanilla way, way, way back... geez, that's a lot of money, even if they didn't buy third-party services and whatnot.
But then we can get into the argument about how that's not the same, considering you're paying for a "service," technically. Or not?
Armory | YouTube | Twitter | Clan Site
Actually, he claimed to be some service guy at an oil company. I'll drop that in there as an important tidbit. Just going to assume he's of age and a working man.
Armory | YouTube | Twitter | Clan Site
i spent and bought on both way, i think its ok if you can afford it.
its our choice to buy or not and you can only sell if you want to make profit of course
what really suck is that blizzard is exploited/hacked and i dont believe they do a good job on removing the duped gear and gold botted from the game since they dont cancel any rmah auction (every transaction is final) and neither had a sign of any duped gem sold for 5million gold deleted from anyone.
this said it could be unfair if that was a competitive game for people who cant afford it but the only competition in this game are hypothetic beside maybe world 1rst kill/fastest kill
it s in from start and everyone playing know the feature before they purchased or had the chance to know.
spending money over a video game isnt much more of a waste then spending it on beer at the bar
I wouldn't make that assumption. Many old school RPG'ers like myself frown on short-cuts, no matter what your excuse is. I work too, only part time but I own several rental properties that consume much of my time, not to mention being a single father.
True pride in your character can only be achieved by doing it 'the old fashioned way'. By purchasing gold/items, you have chosen a shortcut, you have chosen to bypass effort and cut straight to the quick with your wallet.
In seconds, you achieve what takes me weeks, even months to reach.
It is your own business how you game, as well, how you achieve prominence in-game. But do not pretend that there is any sense of pride to be gleamed from a bought character.
BurningRope#1322 (US~HC) Request an invite to the official (NA) <dfans> Clan
Agreed. I am just giving my only objection here; and that is people whom are so proud of what I consider to be absolutely nothing.
The RMAH is the PC worlds Game Genie. Enter code; Win.
BurningRope#1322 (US~HC) Request an invite to the official (NA) <dfans> Clan
i dont see why buying gear with money would be different then buying gear with gold or gear given by anyone. Self looted gear or no point to claim for old school pride but still this pride dont really come from the gear i think, its more of what you can do with what you have.
Right. My whole spending and gearing spree lately was after I decided to pursue the leaderboards as a personal project and building a trophy character (by whatever means available). My alt classes were geared solely on drops and gold AH trading, but my wizard is a different story.
But what the guy I argued with had trouble understanding is that I can do what I want with my money just like he can do what he wants with his. At the end, it's a game and everyone has their own way of playing the game and having fun.
As for pride... Eh, I think the pride I have right now is that I know how to properly gear, stat-wise. Other than that, what I do with the gear I ended up getting.
Armory | YouTube | Twitter | Clan Site
I mean there is NO monthly fee, god knows how much money I sunk on EVE, WOW, Rift, etc's monthly fees.
side note: Do you mind if I add you in game to see your gear Jaetch? I'm kinda stuck for upgrade ideas.
When you renovate a house, you use your own ideas for what you want yet you hire workers to carry out said renovation.
When you buy a classic muscle car with ideas to return it to its glory you send it to a rod shop(or 15 different work shops) to carry out said restoration.
Any normal human would take pride in these things when completed yet they did not carry out the work alone. They used money they had aquired by other means.
There is no shame in spending hard earned money on products that fulfil your desires.
If people didnt spend money on products not aquirable by other means the world be "1000 years behind its current state". <- good or bad thing i dont know.
To me this statement just doesn't make any sense. For starters he was playing Diablo III which is in itself a virtual good I assume he purchased. Clearly actually playing is a real life activity as well so what is this comparison to real life activities about? And what about all the other virtual goods many of us use day-to-day: from Pay TV, to music we pay for from for example iTunes, even going to a cinema is really not different to watching a movie on your computer or on TV, reading a book on an e-Reader from Amazon, reading a newspaper subscription on-line, ... These are all activities in which we 'consume' virtual goods we pay for. Are these all 'worthless' in his opinion because they don't constitute 'real life activities'? Is reading a print newspaper 'real life' while reading an on-line newspaper is 'not real life'?
I simply don't get it...
Anyway I'm with whoever said the game genie bit. But I have no problem with people who spend on the rmah! Without them I wouldn't be able to sell my digital stuff for irl cash money!
Flame on
Is it acceptable? - Yes, it's your money.
Is it reasonable? - No, it's kinda stupid.
But playing the video game is kinda stupid anyway, you should not be doing this in the first place, you're just wasting your time... But we all do play the game, so one stupid thing leads to another. Anyway you probably would throw your money away on drinks or women or whatever - if you prefer things you can't touch or taste , but help you to fight imaginary demon lord - it's you choice, no one who plays the game is in position to judge you.
That's an excellent point. Knowing how to use your build (tactics/skill) would also be included in this line of thought.
I did a lot of competitive melee dueling in D2 and went up against quite a few people whom obviously (sometimes admittedly) just bought full zealot gears, but they didn't understand the subtleties of AR/IAS breakpoints etc.
I don't want anyone thinking I was trying to take a shot at people whom spend real money on gears, as if they're incapable or lazy. I'm just stating how I feel, personally, about what leaves me fulfilled with a game like Diablo. I am only fulfilled when I accomplish character upgrades without resorting to real money purchases, much the same I wouldn't feel fulfilled by scamming people. Though the moral implications of scamming go way beyond what anyone could fairly claim against RMAH'ers.
Much of the bitterness that 'straight edge' players like myself have toward people whom buy gear/gold comes from the bad apples that buy all their gear and then make fun of others (whom don't buy gears) for having less than elite gears.
Jaetch seems like the type of player that would never do this.
BurningRope#1322 (US~HC) Request an invite to the official (NA) <dfans> Clan
You shouldn't listen to the shit that some outside of our interests have to say. I've had a few people drop this line of bullshit on me before, and I was quick to point out that (moderate) gaming is no more a waste of time than watching 6 hours of DVR'd television content every night.
I so love it when some dizzy cunt tells me gaming is a waste yet she/he goes home and watches American Idol, along with a long list of equally brainless fodder.
BurningRope#1322 (US~HC) Request an invite to the official (NA) <dfans> Clan
I see your point, but hobbies can be different. I'm looking into two kind of activities: you create something or you're wasting your time. So say crafting, music, painting, art, etc or even sport are somehow productive hobbies improving you as a person and producing some stuff for other people, while videogaming, drinknig etc. are counterproductive. But I'm not like pointing fingers, more like amittiing things )
"No one should spend any money on virtual goods because that's worthless in comparison to real life activities."
Have you ever considered, that they can do both?
Its generaly teenagers who angers about people spending some money on their character. The exact same people, who every weekend spend pretty much every dime they have on alchohol. And they talk about blowing money away lol.
Don't worry what other people spend their own money for. Who knows maybe that can just afford it, maybe they do it instead of buying small trains og collecting toy cars.... Spending a few hundred $ a month on diablo, is still cheaper than ie golfing for a hobby.
And take into consideration, without anyone to buy the stuff, we wont be able to sell the stuff. Buyers complete the circle.
Currently played toon: https://eu.battle.net/d3/en/profile/Rage-2973/hero/97362116
If we wish to pursue the philosophical line; I could argue that anything you do outside of securing provisions for your survival, is a waste of time.
BurningRope#1322 (US~HC) Request an invite to the official (NA) <dfans> Clan
Waist of time. I want to find my loot while playing. I have already paid for Diablo 3 and I never liked WoW for the monthly cost. Things that cost extra is something I take a distance from. I just want things I really need in life, and "virtual goods" does not make my life any easier or happier. This is why I do not spend on useless things, both in-game and outside of games.
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