With the last couple patches Basic Attacks have been phased out of the game for the Witch Doctor, Demon Hunter, and Wizard. With promises of Melee versions of these characters touted at official blizzard events it is distressing to see the rigidity of class role being forced upon our characters.
As With this thread on the blizzard website I will reiterate here that this is not about what does the most damage. This is about being able to bind and use basic attack when we want to. Even if Everything else we could use would be better than basic attack it wont provide us with the gameplay we desire, such as a tanky melee wizard with a sword and shield or a Demon Hunter that fights in melee and uses traps and such. (LIKE A NINJA!!!!!)
This is about showing blizzard that we want Basic Attack in our game.
If you think like us then support this thread and keep it alive.
Um, I'm pretty sure wizards aren't meleeing with the basic attack. They are probably going to use spectral blade or something. Other classes are pretty similar. You'll just be using close range skills - if you have a slot for basic attack, you're, as they say, doing it wrong.
Basic attacks? Never used em in D2 not too fond of em on any game with upgradable attacks. I will not be joining your cause. Good luck though if you wish to use em should be your option.
Just read your thread over the the official forums, and I have to say that while I personally probably won't be using basic/normal attack on my wizard, I still think it should be there. Diablo's always been about freedom of play style and ingenuity/creativity of character builds. Taking away one of the most basic building blocks of the game (the melee attack for all classes) flies in the face of this. It's a slippery slope from here to a change such as "Barbarians can't use a bow," etc., and I think a lot of the fun and memorable moments from D2 came from just that sort of creativity. Bravo for standing up for this issue, Darkmikolai!
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i would choose my own religion and worship my own spirit, but if he ever preached to me i wouldn't want to hear it. i'd drop him, a forgotten god, languishing in shame; and then if i hit stormy seas, i'd have myself to blame.
They could just add it. No need to rework anything. If it is not viable it should not be a problem. I just wonder if it is not actually available via that elective mode. Or maybe it's a bug.
I'm pretty sure basic attack goes against there philosophy of "you can never have too much power". Basic attack just really doesn't scream power to me. Also, as Jay would argue, "It's not AWESOME." But, hey, when you're out of rage and use an ability, the barb will basic attack! Woo! I think they want to move away from it because using abilities is always more tactical and meaningful. If nothing else, it requires you to manage your resources and think about what skills you're using at any given time, instead of relying on your generic, non-commital attack all the time.
Couldn't you just activate elective mode and make sure you don't assign ability to your mouse button?
I've heard reports of people having trouble doing this. It's not a chooseable skill, so as soon as you get your second skill, basic attack just sort of disappears into a void. Which probably leads to 1999.
Prior to this patch, Blizzard said that you could assign a 2nd skill to your right-mouse-button (or possibly left-mouse-button), and pressing a certain key would allow you to alternate between your two RMB skills.
In this way, even with a dedicated potions slot replacing one of your previous slots, you would still have access to 7 skills.
However, with this new interface, it looks like we're only going to have access to 6 skills - that's possibly even more detrimental to those of us who may want to use a build that relies on basic attacks, since we'll have less support spells to make up for the fact that we're relying on basic attacks.
In the case of a petless Witch Doctor (yeah I keep going on about this :P), running out of mana is a much more real problem, and it'd be comforting to know that I'd have at least some form of attack to use if I'm out of mana (the latest patch notes seem to have significantly nerfed the mana sustainability of the WD).
Ok sorry for not responding just got back from school. Some of the comments made have some good questions regarding this so id like to answer a few.
1. Cant you fix this in elective mode?
No, currently there are no game mechanics that facilitate binding the basic attack to another key, this is partly due to the new interface but mostly due to the fact that there is six skills you can pick and one slot for each of those no room for basic attack. And even if you wanted to sacrifice a skill for it there is no way to simply unbind a skill and leave it blank.
2. Why do you want to use an attack when you have a better alternative?
Mostly for fun, but others have brought up actual gameplay mechanics that revolve around needing basic attacks for example a Wizard that relies primarily on buffs, or a WD that is petless leaving him with insane mana issues most of the time will need basic attacks to deal damage. Also this freedom allows another way to play the class. More variants give more personality to the game, and those who were really looking forward to a Melee DH or Wizard are really distressed at the absence of this.
There is zero reason to use basic attacks when you have zero-cost, resource generating abilities. Consequently, there is no reason for them to be in the game.
There is zero reason to use basic attacks when you have zero-cost, resource generating abilities. Consequently, there is no reason for them to be in the game.
Fin.
Actually both the Demon Hunter and the Wizard have passives that REQUIRE the use of basic attacks.
I've linked to them below, but the Wizard's "Virtuoso" passive doubles the damage of the wand attack (where you "shoot" them with the spell, so it's not actually a melee thing) and makes it generate 15 arcane power and regenerate 1% of you total life on a successful attack. The Demon Hunter has "Fundamentals" which doubles the damage of the basic attack with a ranged or melee weapon and also makes successful attacks generate 4 hatred.
Back when we had access to 7 key bindings but only had 6 skills to assign that made it possible to make a build where you lose a passive to buffing your basic attack to be a part of your rotation, but in the process free up another skill slot for a "spender" type ability. Also looks very useful for making a melee demon hunter, which was going to be my alt. I really really hope this is oversight on Blizzard's part because the way they've got it set up at the moment, the skill UI effectively makes it impossible to use one of the skills, and also makes impossible a couple of builds which the skills seem designed to allow.
I honestly thought that was a bug cause why the hell couldn't my WD use her awesome dagger? Mana regenerates so fast though it does take a bit of the value out of using melee..
Unlike in D2 where early on in the game you were frequently low on mana with some classes so it was like kind of awesome to get to rely on your melee weapon. I would hate carrying around any weapon I couldn't use. Granted for like casters and stuff you use them a lot less, but it puts a different value on a different stage of the game where you need your melee weapon more despite your mana.
And that's what's bothered me about the WD at least (haven't played Wizard much). The mana recharges so fast it's just so inconsequential. And the cooldown time on more mana consuming skills makes their mana cost also irrelevant. This IS just a beta thing, right?
What in the name of Diablo are you fucking talking about?
Who uses a basic attack, and for what purpose? When you're switching out skills? And even then, when won't you have another skill to use? Before level 4 or 5?
This is clearly a thread made just to get post count up. I've seen some of the most misinformed, uneducated people post things here in the last week than I ever have for a shot at a Beta Key.
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"When men are most sure and arrogant, they are commonly the most mistaken, and have then given views to passion, without that proper deliberation and suspense which can alone secure them from the grossest absurdities"
What in the name of Diablo are you fucking talking about?
Who uses a basic attack, and for what purpose? When you're switching out skills? And even then, when won't you have another skill to use? Before level 4 or 5?
This is clearly a thread made just to get post count up. I've seen some of the most misinformed, uneducated people post things here in the last week than I ever have for a shot at a Beta Key.
I really disagree with you, fella. I'm not saying basic attack is essential, but there is no reason for it not to be there. Why would weapons then even have damage stats? And I like the idea that starting out you may need to rely more on basic attacks because you are relatively weak to begin with and you need to utilize a combination of your skills and basic attacks to plow through sometimes. As opposed to having limitless access to your skills right away. I mean, it increase the incentive of leveling up, right?
Besides, shove it. I love a good solid basic attack. In D2 it was great in the beginning of the game to have merely a club and you just had to wallop on a zombie with it because you already used up your precious mana and it just wasn't regenerating fast enough to continuously be using Teeth early on.
So even if you wanna hate basic attacks and you see no point in them, there's still no reason to actually forbid you from using your melee weapon. I've got this wicked bad ass dagger for my WD and I can't use it for melee and quite frankly that's stupid. And the game should be balanced in a way to not render a melee weapon completely useless. It may become less useful as you level up and use your skills more and have more resources, but in the beginning that's just the way it should be-where you need a melee weapon sometimes cause you're simply not that powerful and your strategy early on is going to be affected by that.
And stop thinking you're clever by accusing people of upping their post count by creating a thread. It's like the OP threw out a one liner. He wrote more than a couple paragraphs so chill out, bra.
There is zero reason to use basic attacks when you have zero-cost, resource generating abilities. Consequently, there is no reason for them to be in the game.
Fin.
Could you please point out these zero-cost, resource generating abilities that I can use on my Witch Doctor when I run low on mana?
I don't think this is a big loss for the Barbarian and Monk, but I did run into a few cases that I wished I had an auto-attack button on my Witch Doctor. While playing with Poison Dart, Grasp of the Dead, and Zombie Dogs I would run out of mana on a prolonged fight like the Skeleton King. Since Grasp of the Dead costs ~3 times as much as Poison Dart I had to just stop attacking for a second or two if I wanted to be able cast Grasp. This feels really annoying.
In addition, some people prefer not to have a spell that costs resources (mana) bound to their LMB so they don't waste a cast if they mis-click on a monster when they just wanted to run to a spot nearby.
Finally, this basically makes it impossible for people to play a melee Demon Hunter of Wizard. Those may not be optimal builds, but there were plenty of people that played a melee Sorceress in D2 just for the fun of it and there were at least some who were really looking forward to trying out similarly odd builds in D3.
There is zero reason to use basic attacks when you have zero-cost, resource generating abilities. Consequently, there is no reason for them to be in the game.
Fin.
Could you please point out these zero-cost, resource generating abilities that I can use on my Witch Doctor when I run low on mana?
I don't think this is a big loss for the Barbarian and Monk, but I did run into a few cases that I wished I had an auto-attack button on my Witch Doctor. While playing with Poison Dart, Grasp of the Dead, and Zombie Dogs I would run out of mana.......
Damm had not seen that prob...dont you then auto do basic attacks wen out of mana?
i mean if you havent enoughf mana to cast either RMB or LMB wont the "click" generate a basic attack instead?
Maybe try unequpping ur weapon and then try and attack someone maybe u can throw a few punches here and there n gain ur resorces
I'm going to laugh when all these "Basic Attack" advocates try to use that crap in Inferno.
Sigh...
Seriously, feel my sigh.
As I've said, basic attacks are nice early on the game and it's just logical that you would rely more on them early on in the game where your skills can't always cut it.
I'm disappointed in a lot of you who are so bonery for your special effects and super duper skills. Yeah I'm all for that shit too. In fact I love the skills in D3. But there's nothing like a good solid thump or slash or jab or whatever of a good melee attack. And it would only be useful early on in the game just like it was in D2. And that's actually one of the funnest stages of the game, I think. When you're just starting out and you gotta use a cudgel like a peasant. But you damn kids and your designer drugs just can't appreciate all that.
You're even against it all to the point of thinking there shouldn't even be a melee attack for casting and summoner classes. Or basic attacks at all. I don't want to live on this planet anymore. Kwwshhhhweooooooooooooo.....vvvvvvvv
Ever since the beta I could never understand the basic attack. With only 6 buttons, what kind of idiot would use one of them for a normal swing? Ohh thats right a noob that doesn't know any better. Even if you get one of the passive abilities to generate resources, basic attack is still lame. They serve no purpose other than to over-complicate the game for new players, in other words an all around bad idea.
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One is never hurt by being given additional choices, only by taking them away. A QUADRILLION MAGIC FIND is worthless if you can't kill shit!
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As With this thread on the blizzard website I will reiterate here that this is not about what does the most damage. This is about being able to bind and use basic attack when we want to. Even if Everything else we could use would be better than basic attack it wont provide us with the gameplay we desire, such as a tanky melee wizard with a sword and shield or a Demon Hunter that fights in melee and uses traps and such. (LIKE A NINJA!!!!!)
This is about showing blizzard that we want Basic Attack in our game.
If you think like us then support this thread and keep it alive.
http://us.battle.net...opic/4079840521
If we can show them how much this means to us WE CAN SUCCEED!!
I've heard reports of people having trouble doing this. It's not a chooseable skill, so as soon as you get your second skill, basic attack just sort of disappears into a void. Which probably leads to 1999.
In this way, even with a dedicated potions slot replacing one of your previous slots, you would still have access to 7 skills.
However, with this new interface, it looks like we're only going to have access to 6 skills - that's possibly even more detrimental to those of us who may want to use a build that relies on basic attacks, since we'll have less support spells to make up for the fact that we're relying on basic attacks.
In the case of a petless Witch Doctor (yeah I keep going on about this :P), running out of mana is a much more real problem, and it'd be comforting to know that I'd have at least some form of attack to use if I'm out of mana (the latest patch notes seem to have significantly nerfed the mana sustainability of the WD).
1. Cant you fix this in elective mode?
No, currently there are no game mechanics that facilitate binding the basic attack to another key, this is partly due to the new interface but mostly due to the fact that there is six skills you can pick and one slot for each of those no room for basic attack. And even if you wanted to sacrifice a skill for it there is no way to simply unbind a skill and leave it blank.
2. Why do you want to use an attack when you have a better alternative?
Mostly for fun, but others have brought up actual gameplay mechanics that revolve around needing basic attacks for example a Wizard that relies primarily on buffs, or a WD that is petless leaving him with insane mana issues most of the time will need basic attacks to deal damage. Also this freedom allows another way to play the class. More variants give more personality to the game, and those who were really looking forward to a Melee DH or Wizard are really distressed at the absence of this.
Fin.
Actually both the Demon Hunter and the Wizard have passives that REQUIRE the use of basic attacks.
I've linked to them below, but the Wizard's "Virtuoso" passive doubles the damage of the wand attack (where you "shoot" them with the spell, so it's not actually a melee thing) and makes it generate 15 arcane power and regenerate 1% of you total life on a successful attack. The Demon Hunter has "Fundamentals" which doubles the damage of the basic attack with a ranged or melee weapon and also makes successful attacks generate 4 hatred.
Back when we had access to 7 key bindings but only had 6 skills to assign that made it possible to make a build where you lose a passive to buffing your basic attack to be a part of your rotation, but in the process free up another skill slot for a "spender" type ability. Also looks very useful for making a melee demon hunter, which was going to be my alt. I really really hope this is oversight on Blizzard's part because the way they've got it set up at the moment, the skill UI effectively makes it impossible to use one of the skills, and also makes impossible a couple of builds which the skills seem designed to allow.
http://www.diablo3sk...ndamentals.html
http://www.diablo3sk...9/virtuoso.html
Unlike in D2 where early on in the game you were frequently low on mana with some classes so it was like kind of awesome to get to rely on your melee weapon. I would hate carrying around any weapon I couldn't use. Granted for like casters and stuff you use them a lot less, but it puts a different value on a different stage of the game where you need your melee weapon more despite your mana.
And that's what's bothered me about the WD at least (haven't played Wizard much). The mana recharges so fast it's just so inconsequential. And the cooldown time on more mana consuming skills makes their mana cost also irrelevant. This IS just a beta thing, right?
Siaynoq's Playthroughs
Who uses a basic attack, and for what purpose? When you're switching out skills? And even then, when won't you have another skill to use? Before level 4 or 5?
This is clearly a thread made just to get post count up. I've seen some of the most misinformed, uneducated people post things here in the last week than I ever have for a shot at a Beta Key.
Besides, shove it. I love a good solid basic attack. In D2 it was great in the beginning of the game to have merely a club and you just had to wallop on a zombie with it because you already used up your precious mana and it just wasn't regenerating fast enough to continuously be using Teeth early on.
So even if you wanna hate basic attacks and you see no point in them, there's still no reason to actually forbid you from using your melee weapon. I've got this wicked bad ass dagger for my WD and I can't use it for melee and quite frankly that's stupid. And the game should be balanced in a way to not render a melee weapon completely useless. It may become less useful as you level up and use your skills more and have more resources, but in the beginning that's just the way it should be-where you need a melee weapon sometimes cause you're simply not that powerful and your strategy early on is going to be affected by that.
And stop thinking you're clever by accusing people of upping their post count by creating a thread. It's like the OP threw out a one liner. He wrote more than a couple paragraphs so chill out, bra.
Siaynoq's Playthroughs
Could you please point out these zero-cost, resource generating abilities that I can use on my Witch Doctor when I run low on mana?
I don't think this is a big loss for the Barbarian and Monk, but I did run into a few cases that I wished I had an auto-attack button on my Witch Doctor. While playing with Poison Dart, Grasp of the Dead, and Zombie Dogs I would run out of mana on a prolonged fight like the Skeleton King. Since Grasp of the Dead costs ~3 times as much as Poison Dart I had to just stop attacking for a second or two if I wanted to be able cast Grasp. This feels really annoying.
In addition, some people prefer not to have a spell that costs resources (mana) bound to their LMB so they don't waste a cast if they mis-click on a monster when they just wanted to run to a spot nearby.
Finally, this basically makes it impossible for people to play a melee Demon Hunter of Wizard. Those may not be optimal builds, but there were plenty of people that played a melee Sorceress in D2 just for the fun of it and there were at least some who were really looking forward to trying out similarly odd builds in D3.
Maybe try unequpping ur weapon and then try and attack someone maybe u can throw a few punches here and there n gain ur resorces
Seriously, feel my sigh.
As I've said, basic attacks are nice early on the game and it's just logical that you would rely more on them early on in the game where your skills can't always cut it.
I'm disappointed in a lot of you who are so bonery for your special effects and super duper skills. Yeah I'm all for that shit too. In fact I love the skills in D3. But there's nothing like a good solid thump or slash or jab or whatever of a good melee attack. And it would only be useful early on in the game just like it was in D2. And that's actually one of the funnest stages of the game, I think. When you're just starting out and you gotta use a cudgel like a peasant. But you damn kids and your designer drugs just can't appreciate all that.
You're even against it all to the point of thinking there shouldn't even be a melee attack for casting and summoner classes. Or basic attacks at all. I don't want to live on this planet anymore. Kwwshhhhweooooooooooooo.....vvvvvvvv
Siaynoq's Playthroughs
A QUADRILLION MAGIC FIND is worthless if you can't kill shit!