Why I love WD, and why I no longer play it.

  • #1
    I am making this post to see if anyone else currently feels the same way I do about the Witch Doctor.

    I want to say that I completely LOVE the class. I was initially drawn to the class because pre-launch they really talked a lot and boasted about the pets. I have always played pet-classes in just about every video game I ever played. Normal mode, Nightmare, and the first few acts of Hell were a total BLAST. As I progressed through the end of Hell and the early parts of Inferno it became very clear to me that pets were just simply not going to be a part of the equation. So inevitably I had to completely change my play-style to a darts/snare build.

    It takes some getting used to, but I still think the end-game play-style of darts / snare is still pretty fun but until a very high level of gear it just doesn't get shit done. Playing the witch doctor in this fashion almost feels like you were given a toolbox to fix a sink with, but the toolbox is entirely empty except for two mismatched drill bits and broken measuring tape. It just does not feel like there is enough utility.

    So after beating my head into Act 3 for a long enough time, I decided to roll Wizard. As soon as I hit 60 I gave my Wizard all the WD's gear and started to farm with him. I think progressing through Act 2 is really when it really hit me.

    Witch Doctor, in it's current state, is totally and completely broken.

    I was totally blown away at how much more utility, damage, and control a wizard has compared to a WD. Now, the wizard doesn't have Vision Quest, but honestly, they don't even need it.

    And I think for the very short term I know how to fix it: Take the cool-down, entirely, off of Grasp of the Dead.

    In the long term, I think if they make pets a little more resilient, work out the kinks with zombie bears (and all of the zombie chargers, really), and fix that GOD-AWFUL cast animation on poison darts I will be returning happily to my Witch Doctor.

    Does anybody else feel the same way?



    tl;dr wah wah wah WD suck plz buff
  • #2
    i no longer play my WD also, i rolled a barb and im on him now. its a huge shame as i played him quite well with my darts

    i want to continue to use the darts but nothing is viable

    ok the very skilled players may not have a problem, i have soome skills, but im not amazing like some people who play WD's

    i even tried to fight the fights like PVP, killed shit a tad better but alas i was slain

    we shall see what happens in the future

    i think WD's need a huge revamp, if blizz were to do that, then alll they would have to revamp all classes

    i dont see that happening

    the future looks bright

    also what does TL;DR mean?
  • #3
    im still playing my WD and I still like it. Do i feel it needs a buff.... hell yeah who doesn't like buffs. But I like WD's play style and I've actually played with a monk and wiz, so far I've gone back to WD.
  • #4
    wd and monk are both a joke
  • #5
    If you want to, you can make pets viable in Inferno. It's not expensive.

    For Act 1:
    500 all resist
    1000 life regeneration
    ~4k armor
    passives: Fierce loyalty + 2 of your choice

    This is enough to keep zombie dogs and gargantuan alive in Inferno Act 1. However, zombie dogs will die fast against elites, but gargantuan will struggle for longer. In fact, these stats are enough for Gargantuan to solo one elite (not elite group) in Act 2, but if the elite has any offensive affix, he will die sooner or later.

    If you want the pets to be more offensive, I suggest adding reflect damage to your gear as well. You should easily get ~5000 at lv60. Keep in mind that gear with all resistance, life regeneration and reflect damage is cheap because no one really wants it (if those are the only stats on it).

    In my opinion the pets would be significantly better if they scaled with vitality. Currently the zombie dogs seem to have less than 15k HP, which is not enough for inferno Act 2 (or elites in Act 1).
  • #6
    WD can definitely see improvements but i like her overall. It's very huge dmg class with interesting abilities.
    You should never underestimate the predictability of stupidity.
  • #7
    Did the same as OP, rolled Wizzard and gave all WD gear to him, it's just much easier. I'll be back to my WD when the PVP lunches, hope it will be balanced better.
  • #8
    My brother is doing the opposite. He leveled a wizard to 60 and did some inferno (just act I) and now he's back to his WD as he feels it is more "fun". (granted he's only in hell with it)

    Also, I love your TL;DR :P

    (to the person asking above what it means: Too long; didnt read)
  • #9
    I played WD as my first class and brought him to A4 inferno pre 1.03 doing nothing but poison darts and lots of CC. Boring as hell. No variety at all. The only fun part is keeping myself from getting one shot. But with 1.03 that's no longer a concern. The nerf in IAS also made it even more boring to play WD. I'm glad I'm not the only one who thinks the poison dart animation is awful..
  • #10
    I was really sad by the time I got to Inferno when I realized I had to scrap my Garg. In Act 1 he can sort of buy me a few precious seconds when escaping a mob of elites, but he's certainly no clay golem. And some of the cooldowns are totally unnecessary that's for sure. I totally get it for like Soul Harvest and Spirit Walk to have cooldowns, But for the pets, considering they can't survive worth crap in Inferno, at least let me cast them again sooner. And the mana cost of the WD are quite expensive in resource anyway that just the mana regen by itself should count as its cooldown.

    I know wealthier WD players don't have this problem cause they have gear that regens their mana like crazy, but for poor WD's like me, having little mana regen AND cooldowns working against me makes my already useless pets even more useless. And yeah, other crowd control abilities like grasp or zombie wall, I hate their cooldown periods. I mean, the Necro had bonewall and even with no cooldown on that skill, it's not like it solved all your problems being able to stall your enemy. So why the long cooldowns on zombie wall anyway?
  • #11
    WD suffers from long cooldowns. BBV, Fetish Army and Zombie Wall should have cooldown 50% lower and the sill would be ok.

    I mean, you can't compare WotB / Archon and BBV/Fetish Army, thats a joke. In one case i get like 3x, 5x times my damage. In Wd you get 40% buff if you stay inside that freaking small area, c'mon. Or summon a bunch of guys that will tank stuff for me during 5 seconds ¬¬

    Wall of Zombies could have 15 or 20 seconds and it wouldn't be OP. Still WD have amazing survival skills: Spiritwalk and Hex. None is 10% as good as Smokescreen but SS is totally insane lol.
    "In time the hissing of her sanity
    Faded out her voice and soiled her name
    And like marked pages in a diary
    Everything seemed clean that is unstained
    The incoherent talk of ordinary days
    Why would we really need to live?
    Decide what is clear and what's within a haze
    What you should take and what to give" - Opeth
  • #12
    Yeah I think most can agree that you can drastically reduce cooldowns on a lot of WD skills and that'd be far from making them overpowered.

    And yes, WD does have awesome survival skills. I love the combinatino of Soul Harvest with life steal combined with Spirit Walk. But they seriously need to make pets more viable for this class. I mean, the WD is supposed to be THE summoner class, isn't it? I'm used to pets not being able to kill really from my Necromancer days, but gosh, at least let the pets have more life. Either that or just reduce the mana cost of skills or a combination of these things cause WD's totally getting the short end of the stick right now.
  • #13
    WD was my first too, solo act 1 and 2 inferno then made a wiz and never looked back. The play styles are too few if you want to do splinters make a hunter that will shoot for more than 60%... The other viable builds bats/bears required a unique 4 useless cds and passives. Also, I don't think pets will ever be on par unless they are completely reworked.
  • #14
    WD is good.
  • #15
    Quote from Espy

    Also, I don't think pets will ever be on par unless they are completely reworked.
    Well like I said I don't ever need my pet to have a lot of killing power. I just either wish it could tank, or even nearly tank, or at least have more diverse abilities that would give me a tactical advantage in dealing with mobs.
  • #16
    Well, they said that they are planning on making pets scale with vitality as well whenever they get around to the next patch, so I see them becoming a bit better after that, and everyone will be going back to their WD.

    I had put mine on the shelf for my wizard when I hit inferno as well, but now that I have a monk friend in good enough gear, we are farming ACT II with little issues. The biggest thing is that we get to do a great deal of damage if we have a tank, but if we have to kite, we juust can't get the damage in to kill stuff fast enough.

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  • #17
    Yeah I'm impatient for another patch to overhaul the WD. I don't feel like starting with a new class, and like a lot of people I'm just kinda stuck in Act 2 no matter how many times I respec. So I'm kind of bored of the game lately as a result and I'm just veggin' out on some Fallout.
  • #18
    Blizz is so afraid of doing summons even little viable.. wtf.

    In Diablo 2 with necro you could have 15 skeletons which pretty much never died in hell and not only that they were killing machines. With auras and + skills you could make them extremely strong, and what that overpowered? Of course not, that was one more viable build for necro.

    Here i got useless dogs which dies in normal Act2 already from everything, unless i select all passives for their survivability then they last until dunno hell or so. No one asks to make them dps machines, just at least make them tanks so they don't die.

    They showed dogs like in 2008 and in 4 years they didn't notice that they are complete garbage after normal? I mean you go to inferno, they die in 1 hit and then you have 60 sec cooldown until you can summon them, how can this not be seen?
    You should never underestimate the predictability of stupidity.
  • #19
    Welcome to the new Diablo. THEY decided that minions killing things aren't FUN, so they nerfed Zombie dogs to the ground and WILL keep nerfing them if you somehow make them do viable damage. This is just WoW style balancing, where when you find new playstyle that isn't intended, even if not giving gamebreaking boost, it will be nerfed until the game is played THEIR way.

    Sad, but don't expect any fun out of minions until they loose their playerbase and maybe notice that balance in PvM is not what people were looking for in D3.

    @Derwiv33

    My Monk with 600loh and 400 resist all can face tank elites while standing in their crap and basically never die. You have better stats, just to make your PETS die a bit slower. Not seeing problem?
  • #20
    @op:
    I pretty much think that - like others already have stated - the CDs should be lowered a bit. Beside of that other Skills like Explosive Beast, Bats or Acid Cloud should see a huge mana-reduce. Relating to their base-dmg a lot of skills are viable, they are simply too expensive to handle upcoming situations on Inferno. Six to eight casts and you can start running until your mana replenishes - if you won't have all your def-CDs running parallel.

    Quote from Kblavkalash

    Blizz is so afraid of doing summons even little viable.. wtf.

    In Diablo 2 with necro you could have 15 skeletons which pretty much never died in hell and not only that they were killing machines. With auras and + skills you could make them extremely strong, and what that overpowered? Of course not, that was one more viable build for necro.

    Here i got useless dogs which dies in normal Act2 already from everything, unless i select all passives for their survivability then they last until dunno hell or so. No one asks to make them dps machines, just at least make them tanks so they don't die.

    They showed dogs like in 2008 and in 4 years they didn't notice that they are complete garbage after normal? I mean you go to inferno, they die in 1 hit and then you have 60 sec cooldown until you can summon them, how can this not be seen?


    This is well said, but I think we should simply stop expecting something fun (D2/LoD-like) happening. I've expected a real hack'n'slash where I don't have to mind about CDs, or ressources, or exploiting to bring down overpowered packs (due to a lack of mobility and ressources). Maybe it's just the WD having problems, but I don't care.
    Yet this is what we've got - and it was dawning on me already before the release.

    Quote from Nivrax

    Welcome to the new Diablo. THEY decided that minions killing things aren't FUN, so they nerfed Zombie dogs to the ground and WILL keep nerfing them if you somehow make them do viable damage. This is just WoW style balancing, where when you find new playstyle that isn't intended, even if not giving gamebreaking boost, it will be nerfed until the game is played THEIR way.

    Sad, but don't expect any fun out of minions until they loose their playerbase and maybe notice that balance in PvM is not what people were looking for in D3.

    @Derwiv33

    My Monk with 600loh and 400 resist all can face tank elites while standing in their crap and basically never die. You have better stats, just to make your PETS die a bit slower. Not seeing problem?


    This is also true. I don't see a lot of sense in throwing so called "balance-patches" into a game without any competition between the players.
    We have no PVP, we have no ladder, we have no ranking system, we have not even a lobby where we can pose with our characters to show our shiny gear.
    IMO they should concentrate on bugfixes since parts of the game are just an insolence - instead of cutting important stats down half, before revamping badly designed classes.
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