Official Blizzard Quote:
"Yes, true, as Jay said at BlizzCon we are planning to have some amount of items that will bind to a character upon equipping them.
We absolutely won't have items that bind when picked up, except for the obvious things like quest items and other character-specific items that wouldn't/shouldn't be tradable anyway.
That alone, I think, should dissuade the most severe concerns with binding items. And before I go on just understand that while a lot of this is very stable in its concepts, the details aren't final.
For Bind on Equip (BoE), the idea right now is that it would only be applied to "end game" items of specific quality levels. So to start, it's not every item, and it's not even every item above a certain level. For the BoE items that will exist, you can pick them up, if you don't want it you can still trade it, or give it to another character, a friend, vendor it, whatever you like. But, if you make the commitment to keeping the item and equipping it, yes, it's yours now.
The reasoning is that in reality we need a solid way to keep the economy stable at the end game. With items building up over a potentially infinite amount of time there's no way to have any measure of control over worth of items. While an item may be the rarest and best in the game, over four or five years a stockpile has built up and those items are now commonplace and hold little value as compared to their rarity. The gold being earned by players stays the same or likely increases as players become more proficient at playing the game while they spend less as items lose their value. Gold value drops, and we're skirting into a familiar cycle.
By ensuring we can rely on some amount of "consumption" of items, their relative worth stays high, the market is predictable and both sellers and buyers enjoy a stable marketplace for (hopefully) many years.
Diablo II has an inconsistent approach which is the somewhat stable Ladder economy, since it's quite literally flushed out every so often. But it's a very intrusive approach to a problem that could be solved through other means that don't require making everyone start over.
As a quasi-aside: There's an idea being thrown around, and this is really not guaranteed in any way, that some or potentially all items that are bound to you could be bound to your entire account. So if you yourself "own" an item from it being bound, you can trade it between all the characters on your account freely. Feed alts your old-but-still-very-nice items, etc. That's just an idea, it may not take shape, but it's a possibility."
I don't think you actually read the blue post.. what you wrote is misinformed and wrong in almost every way.
Go back, read, analyze, and stop jumping to conclusions.
I'd like to see the Diablo series where it is now without multiplayer.
I don't care how many copies you bought of diablo, diablo 2 and diablo 2 expansion. To say that is plain ignorance. And I mean, Plain ignorance.
Why you ask?
WoW is a game. Ok no difference between Diablo right? WoW has fans, just like Diablo right?
But UNLIKE diablo, WoW generates over $15 dollars a month from over 5 million users. Unless 5,000,000 Diablo fans are buying a copy of Diablo every month(which is absurd and is not happening) then WoW will ALWAYS generate more money. End of discussion.
Now unfortunately for you, a WoW hater, someone who probably hasn't even played that game, they will implement SOME of the working and cool ideas which allow for more customization. Will this wreck Diablo? To you it will. For everyone else... well its just obvious.
Before you start flaming and going on a rant, just think twice ok? All of us like Diablo 3 and trust Blizzard to do well. But you my friend
It's better left unsaid.
Its really not helpful to look at a new concept, from WoW or not, and see its application as nothing but hurtful. Diablo2 nor Diablo1 were ever perfect, and implications of new systems and structure were the only things that made D2 superior to D1. So please, stop tripping all over new implementations.
Binding items to accounts (as opposed to specific characters) is a genius idea. Once blizzard has a free reign to know the strength of the economy and control whats being traded and whats being kept, it can then strengthen the currency so any real player can have some sort of currency.
If your argument is that runes and runewords were a perfect currency for D2, please tell me how many high runes the average diablo player has ever seen drop?
1? 5? 10? I dont care who you are, it probably never exceeded 20. (Unless you have made D2 your job)
Let Blizzard do its thing, it has a huge shot to give us an awesome game, and to question them every step of the way is as smart as a one legged man entering an ass kicking contest.
OK OK OK...please explain WHY you think BOE "sucks" And please read Bashiok's reasoning behind it before you answer. I absolutely understand why it's being implemented in D3.
I couldn't agree more. I don't know how many times in D2 I've made a character, got relatively top end gear on him, played him for a couple days, didn't like him, traded off all his gear, and made a new character with relatively top end gear. Perfect set up, once you got wealthy enough to gear up a character with great gear, you could basically make any build in the game as long as you were a good trader. I guess if you sucked at trading in D2 and couldn't figure out the economy then this BoE crap is good, as it handicaps people who knew the game so you can keep up with them.
D2 economy would have been fine if it wasnt for duping and botting making things unfair for those people playing legit. Ladder reset once a year or so kept it fresh for people who loved trying to trade and get ahead, and nonladder was awesome for people who just wanted to get rich and always play with their GG gear.
I hate this idea when I look at it in terms of Diablo 2, if I spend 2 weeks worth of playing trading for high runes to trade for a griffin, and put it on a light sorc, and decide I really don't want a light sorc, I want to try out a cs zon, now I gotta go grind out another griffin. I hope with this awful system theres reclassing to go along with respeccing.
I'm just glad there hasn't been any pre-ordering for this game yet, I'd be pissed if I had any money invested in it.
And since we are going to see respecing as well, that your end game gear is binded to your character is not as big of a deal as it seems.
I guess you can't fucking make any arguments without immediately starting with a general insult.
I guess you are so insanely blinded by your "D2 love" that you can't even see how the D2 ecnomy is flawed in its very core, and that while it would've been much better without duping and botting, it certainly wouldn't be "fine".
See top of my post.
In short, just freakin' suck it up. Blizzard got no interest in making a game for the nostalgic or blind fans that just can't see anything else but D2 and how it was.
It's not a general insult. Some people sucked at trading, some were good. It was part of the game. Some learned it, some didn't.
Like I said, ladder was perfect for people who wanted a fresh start every now and then, and non-ladder perfect for perfectionist who just wanted to accumulate godlies. What was wrong about it, that not everyone could have all the best stuff?
Duh, like this isn't obvious yet? It just sucks balls when an item based economy was something in D2 that almost no other games have and they're obviously going to rip it out for D3. Your probably gonna argue why item based currencies are shitty, but an item based economy is one of the main features of D2 thats kept it popular.
Nostalgic or blind fans though, makes me laugh. I've been a fan of the Diablo series for years and what keeps me interested in Diablo is some of the core features it has that not many other games do, yet you act like this is a bad thing. I wish Blizzard would call this game Fairy Puff Land or something and at least let the Diablo series die an honorable death with D2.
If there are no sinks in the game, the game will accumulate more and more worth as time progresses, flooding the market with more and more items at a larger rate than new players are coming into the game. This was, as Bashoik pointed out, adresses in D2 through Ladder resets, in which the economy was completely wiped out once a reset commenced.
Eve, as above mentioned, has a more free conomy because people can loose stuff. Their ship gets blown up, and the gear is gone, meaning new has to be procured. This keeps the economy stable, as items and equipment disappears from the market everytime a player dies, which offsets new items being gained and created by players; thus the market isn't flooded.
In D3, you can't loose items. Even if you die, you can just pick up your body. Thus articifial ways of forcing items out of the market have to be created. Ladder is one, BoE is another. Removing items from the market continuously is imperative to create a healthy economy, to ensure that items don't loose their value and keep trade and treasure-hunting rewarding for all.
Yet at the same time, Blizzard has at this time demonstrated that they do not wish to hamper trade at all, since Bind on Pickup items will not be in the game. Such a limit would not benefit trade, and so Blizzard has opted not to include it. Have a little faith people, and try to look at this not as a copy from WoW, but as another aspect of the game designed to improve gameplay for all of us.
Waiiiiiit a minute there Jakey. Weren't you crying in another thread about how theres no uniquness in D2 yet your talking about end game class specific gear here like its a good thing? Seems like this + respecs in D3 = no uniqueness if everyone's gonna want the same BoE endgame pieces.
Ever play on battlenet? I was unaware mf'ing something I don't want at the time, and trading it for other items I do want was unfair or not working for it lol.
Thank you sir.
Its called ladder. D2's the only game I've ever played with this ladder/nonladder feature, and guess what was partially responsible for keeping me playing year after year.
On a side note, autostatting, respeccing, and bind on equip items, way to go Blizzard, way to chip away at things that gave D2 its replay value. I'm looking so excited for this game thats becoming more and more obvious any numbnuts who can sit down and grind for a month is gonna have a "perfect" character. No thought or game knowledge required.
So every time I want to make a different class, or build, depending how respecs are going to work,I have to start completely from scratch gear wise, because all the gear I have is now completely worthless since its all bound, and if vendoring it for gold is worthwhile, lord help us, grind gold based economies are awful.
BoE isn't going to change this, its just going to make it more annoying. If you thought it was hard to get a 2 socket CoA in D2, and they have anything near as rare in D3, imagine how much nut its going to suck when you equip it on a paladin, and decide a week later you want to play around with it on a barb.
Unless players can permanantly lose gear or there is some type of ladder resetting the economy is going to be stagnant. I don't know about most people but if it takes a long time to gear up a character with uber gear, I'm not gonna spend several months each time I want to make an alt, just to get them their binding end game game, just to see if I like how they play. At least with the no bind system you only wasted as much time as it took to level and trade your gear if you hated a specific build and wanted to play around with another. If I wanted to spend 6 months on a character every time I wanted to try something new out then I wouldn't be on this site, I'd be on some WoW site.
Well, the majority of people DO like to trade a lot and want a good economy unlike in D2 which started good then went down the sinker as dupes flooded the economy. you are entitled to your 2 cents but in the end majority rules.
Exactly. Botting and duping ruined the economy. If it wasn't for botters and dupers top end gear wouldnt be nearly as common, thus giving more stability to the ladder economy. So instead of seeing botters and dupers as a problem, lets just do something to make the game a pain in the ass for legit players.
Like, let's take this gentleman's post:
You express carelessness for the concept of economy. You don't give a crap, right? You only care for being able to trade an item that you have already chosen to wear on your character. Oh wait, you want to be able to trade freely but you don't care about the economy? Interesting!
The question is: WHY would you want to trade an item that you have chosen to wear? Because you have found a better one? Well, obviously, they only plan to make the end-game items BoE, which means that you CAN'T find better stuff to replace it with. You may find something that you prefer to wear in that slot, but you will still want to keep the old item in case you want to change your spec or play style since it is pretty much the same tier. Can you see the logic behind the decision to only apply this to end-game gear?
If you don't care about the economy that is your friggin' problem. You don't mind hurting the entire game economy just so that you could re-sell your old items when you decide to delete your character or whatever... That is stupid and cheap. If you want to trade, then obtain items. Work for them, trade for them, and don't wear them. Simple as that. It won't make your game any more 'casual' than it already is, it will just make it a more stable experience with an actual currency and where ladder resets will have become a nuisance.
NOOOOOOOOooooooooooo =( lolz
Second hand gear for noob only not for me =P
However, instead of telling these whiners to suck a nut, blizzard will dumb down D3 to appease them, thus making obtaining gear boringly easy.
I hope all you whiners enjoy a game where everybody all has the exact same gear now.
My impression of some of you people, ITS NOT FAIR THAT GUY HAS BETTER GEAR THEN ME ITS CLEARLY A FLAW IN THE GAME DESIGN WAHHHHHH!!!
P.S. Binding is not a gear sink. Your not removing anything from the game. Just because my 1337 armor binds when I wear it doesn't mean its going to make yours any more valuable if you want to trade it, and it will probably make it even mro annoying to trade. For example, if I am currently using a low enigma in d2 terms, I might be willing to trade for a higher one, and then trade off the low one I no longer need. If the low one binds, making it totally worthless to trade down the road, I'd just say screw it, not worth the effort, and stick with the low one unless I was so ridiculously rich I'd want to waste the time to get 2% more armor class.
First - you stated in response to MadScientist's post on Majority.
"First of all, majority rule by the deluded masses of ignorants is what's wrong with society at large."
This might be true but either way, the majority still rule regardless of their intelligence, at least in some societies that is.
Second - You went on to comment on Dimebob's response about your opinion on the economic effects this would or wouldn't have.
"I don't like the idea of an artificially induced attempt to control a superflous (superfluous) or non-existant (existent) economical concept interfering with core mechanics and gameplay where it will simply impede reasonable usage. The reasoning as to why or examples beyond that point is irrelevant, since the imposed band-aid or "sink" is entirely unnecessary and arbitrary if you're not concerned with the supposed "economy". "
Well I don't see how this attempt at controlling a "non-existent" economical concept" is "artificially induced" for starters. But since there is a supply of items that existed and may well exist in D2 and D3 respectively, as well as a varied level of demand.......that sounds like an economy to me, albeit basic. The only possible way this could interfere with whatever you might define as the core mechanics of this particular game would be that when you get an item and say to yourself "Hey this is better than what I have, I'll use this." and then equip it, you won't be able to trade it to another person. So unless the economy, which you've already stated is non-existent in this game, is a core mechanic, then this won't affect anything other than people's ability to exploit the "farming" aspect of D2, which would probably fall under your idea of "Reasonable Usage."
Third - Then you commented on a mention of the greater good of the developersintentions which was brought up by emilemil1.
"The issue of course being what is percieved (perceived) as "the greater good". To me, it's a game that is good in it's own right, without compromising gameplay features arbitrarily.
And in the context of Diablo, that greater good doesn't include enforcing BoE's. If they want to "fix" "the economy", they should strive to do it in a manner that doesn't compromise gameplay. It [the "solution"] should be an issue for those that practice trading, those that enforce the supposed economy - it shouldn't be a ball and chain to us that doesn't."
I'm guessing that when you use the word "arbitrarily" here you mean it in the sense that what was done was done without reason. That can't be so because you were in fact given multiple reasons in the original post that started this discussion. In fact, the first words that preface these reasons are "the reasoning is..."
I WILL however say that i like your idea about fixing the problem from the perspective of those creating the problem so those who remain frequently uninvolved will not be majorly affected. However, as far as I can tell, this solution does just that. If you're a person who got by on trading Items in the last game, you're going to have a much harder time proceeding through the game if you're intent on not wearing items for fear of the binding principal, OR you're going to have far fewer items to trade because you're needing them to get through the game. Now if you're a person who doesn't trade very frequently, then this rule won't affect you hardly at all because you're going to equip items whether they bind to you or not because you're not otherwise going to trade them. It might seem more of a critical hindrance to the latter group of people only because the few times they want to trade an item, they might have already equipped what they wanted to trade and be SOL which might make it seem like a bigger problem.