Being the furnace, and a giant blacksmith hammer, I'd like to see the affix do a secondary attack based on item durability. Something along the lines of:
* Chance on hit to absorb durability from your equipped items to rip open a fissure of molten steel, dealing X damage to an area over X time.
Mixed with Spaulders of Zakara, that could be a cool concept.
The idea isn't to remove the gambling. You can still gamble. There would be rifts, Kadala and greater rifts (and technically there is no guarantee you would get exactly what you wanted just like before, so in every zone you are infact gambling.) All that I'm suggesting is to limit everything else outside of rifts to zone specific farming. As for tiered farming, I fail to see the issue since everyone has been doing it since RoS. Certain items do not drop, period, until you hit a specific level. This is a form of tiered drop rate, just tiered off your level not difficulty. There are also a large number of items that do not drop until you are on Torment 1 or higher. This is exactly what I'm referring to. The only difference is that I suggest they spread it out more so people can focus on gear choices with higher success and in turn, create different adventures with every playthrough. My demon hunter may not care for act 1 drops as much as act 3 while my undead charming witchdoctor might be the exact opposite. Paired with my friends, we can create adventures to go on. When we feel we've put in our duty in those acts, we can round out the adventure with a rift run and maybe a greater rift if so lucky. I honestly cannot believe some people are satisfied with running rifts to play the game. There is SO much in the game to do but being funneled into a streamline of repeated randomly generated dungeons is asinine. The only reason we do it is it's the most efficient way to get items. I think by making different zones the place to hunt for specific gear while keeping rifts as the "everything drops here" place to farm, it will give a nice balance so players can take a break from the same thing, over... and over... and over... and over again.
As for the tempering, I explained that nothing changed except that you can eventually max out stats; regardless of the cost, that is the point. This enforces skill play. If two people walk in with the "exact same gear," they will know who is the better player after gaming together. This will make players seek good gameplay habits if they want to progress in the game because the farming game is no longer their motivation (provided they have the exact gear they want.)
But that issue could be easily fixed with drop rate changes. I'd rather play different zones to make each experience fresh than just doing rifts over and over. If I get frustrated, I can go to a new zone instead of having to do another rift because, right now, that's really all I can do for efficiency's sake. Hell, if they actually worked on magic find, it may not be terrible. No matter how you look at it, farming for 1 out of 5-10 items is better than 1 out of 250+.
I also wouldn't mind, with them being conscious of zone farming, for them to take the time to revisit some old zones and tinker with them for a better dungeon crawl experience.
The hot topics for D3 these days seem to be RNG dictates everything so luck outweighs skill. I agree to a point. The point of the game is to farm though. It got me thinking that done right, we could make this cake and eat it too.
Area Farming - Make item types more prevalent in certain acts and zones. This makes players looking for certain gear more likely to seek out certain zones rather than rift forever and ever creating repetitive gameplay. Chest become the jack of all trades however: Normal chests allow players to gain access to ANY item in the act while resplendent chests allow players to gain any item from all acts. We keep the absolute RNG factor through chest, but constrain it while actually hunting zones.
Undead related gear in act 1.
Demon slaying gear in act 3.
Poison related gear in the blood marsh. Etc.
Difficulty farming - Legendaries are limited to difficulties: Normal to Torment 6. This creates layers that progresses players from point A to B. Farm your character up to master and get a few legendaries. Now move into T2. It's hard yes, but now new gear opens up and you can farm this difficulty and hunt for gear here to help you progress to the next stage. This also alows scaling to be fixed. People don't fight bosses unless it's for a bounty at this point, and because of RNG, players could have gotten lucky on stats and will just plow through them in 10-30 seconds. Boring. By creating tiers and knowing what players have access to, the game will become interesting to play at all levels as every new difficulty will pose a new challenge and grant you the next step in evolving your characters gear.
"I heard there was an enemy in Act 3/Torment 1 that dropped the rare marauder's helm!"
"Whoa! I love that set. I'm off to do some act 3 bounties then and see if I can get it."
Tempering - Getting the item you wanted since you started is really disappointing when it's got the lowest stats you can get. It's actually a slap to the face. You were basically punished for being unlucky. Tempering is the idea that a player can spend crafting resources to max out his stats on gear. Changing stat affixes is for the enchantress, so you can still be unlucky on WHICH stats you get but once you do get them, you'll be able to start capping them... at a price of course. Every point raised in this item will raise the cost of the next point you raise. Depending on how rare the gear is, you might actually consider farming it again for better stats as paying 450 million gold just doesn't sound worth it. This will also bring value back to gold again. This will provide huge value to farming and salvaging in general. Depending on how ridiculous the Devs wanted to be, it could be quite extravagant:
1 Veil Crystal + x gold = +1 Strength, +1 Dexterity, or +1 Intelligence.
1 Veil Crystal + x gold = +1 Vitality
1 Veil Crystal + x gold = +1 Armor
10 Lizard Eye + x gold = +0.1% Critical Hit Chance
TL;DR - I think Diablo 3 will be better when RNG is constrained without taking it away. You can hunt for specific items, but chests will serve as RNG like in D3's current state. Blood shards and Kadala are just alternative ways to play with RNG as well. Tempering.
With a lot of the new content on the rise and a lot of ideas showing up to help replayability; micro-transactions, pvp racing, ancient legendary gifts, etc. I wanted to bring a couple of other ideas to the table which I think will help expand the value of Diablo 3 as a whole and how players can feel they are less victims of RNG and have more focus and progression in their character play through.
I enjoy playing diablo 3. However I do not like farming in Diablo 3. People tell me that's the point of the game and I disagree. The point of the game is to get gear and eventually create something of your own that helps you kick demon ass. RNG is just a drug in this game, an addiction, dopamine straight to brain kind of deal; players farm and farm just to get that rush of picking up that item they've been hunting for for hundreds of hours. This is great feeling and is tried and true in a lot of games but with the pool of items being flooded with more legendaries and now ancient lengendaries,the game is going to slowly become a game where the skill of players is less relevant than luck (it is already most of the way there, but skill can take you very far in this game. I sure as hell can't do G. Rift 40+ even with the right gear.) So the question I've been asking myself is how does diablo 3 progress into a state of skill based farming without bastardizing the core concept the game is created on?
Area and tier based loot drops with a tempering system (will explain tempering shortly.) This concept actually goes back to D2 as farming certain areas and enemies yielded better chances to get the loot you needed. This created opportunities with players to hunt out spots and give personal goals not dictated by the game which, to many people I played with back then and now, still is an ideal way to play any game with farming. I suggest that certain legendaries are available from normal to master difficulty only. In Torment 1 a new stack of legendaries is added that are available in T1 only. So on and so forth for all the legendaries in the game and finishing with ancient legendaries for items in T6. In addition to limiting items to difficulty, constricting them to acts or bosses (such as the butcher's cleaver only dropping on the butcher... like act 4 or something) you are creating game play where a person can push their characters at a steady rate to end game without creating frustration that you just weren't lucky this season (furnace anyone?)
To further this steady progression I suggest a tempering system. Unlike crafting and enchanting where you are completely gambling on stats or affixes, tempering is a system that takes all your crafting materials and let's you expend them to raise the stat points of individual affixes so you can eventually max out your dream gear. "It was hard enough to get your marauders set but you didn't get the stats you needed... Yeah I know you farmed 200 hours and just got your 5th piece. I know. Yeah it's not going to take you past greater rift 35. Go farm some more and come back." It's a shitty feeling to know you have played SO long on a toon and to get gear you absolutely need for a build and it counts for little when you get it because it had terrible stats. Tempering will solve this issue without trivializing crafting and enchanting (also it makes veil crystals worth getting again) because where as crafting resets whole items, and enchanting resets a single affix, tempering brings their values to a maximum. This will make players feel like they are steadily progressing and bring people more in line with a skill difference rather than a luck difference. Depending on how the Devs want to approach this, it could be incredibly complex or simple, either making the rarest components raise stats by a 1 to 1 ratio while less rare components take multiple of the same to accomplish the same feat or just make veil crystals raise stats by a static value (dictated by the affix) and make the gold value go up as you craft more into it.
That's my idea anyways and I'm sure people disagree but I think it would bring a lot of power to the players to let them be able to hunt more specific gear they needed and eventually max it out. Time and proper gameplay being the biggest factors of improvement of course.
Thank you for the reply. I actually posted the majority of these a couple months back with nothing but positive feedback, aside from a very small percentage that asked, "why bother?" Guess now I can speculate I was secretly hoping for this opportunity to pop up. I guess it would look like a block of text, but mostly explaining why I designed the items the way I did. Guess it's worth the gamble.
Diablo 3's Endgame has been the Infernal Machine since they added it back in vanilla.
the only problem with it now is that good toons outscale the shit of them Ubers.
Yeah I have a huge problem with this. I remember my friend talking about the Ubers from D2 and how hard they were (unless you were a hammerdin) and how he spent months trying to make a Amazon who could beat them. Maybe rescaling them would be a good idea and I'd prefer if they were only available on T6 like D2 ubers were only available in Hell.
I am really digging the Boss mode idea! I'm also agreeing with source specific legendaries. It falls in line pretty well with what I'd want out of the game.
No offense, but it's pretty obvious why your post got deleted. You offer no insight as to how they can overcome their issues and are basically just complaining.
^ This. No offense OP, but saying there is a problem with the game helps no one. Start creating threads on how the game can be pushed in the right direction with complete and concrete ideas. I'd love to read what the community thinks and I'll probably join in myself.
Well, he is a customer, as we all are, and he does point out his issues (bugs, balance etc.). Is he supposed to provide revised lines of code to fix the game? I don't understand how pointing out problems "helps no one". OP is not trolling and is post is at least semi-well thought out, so I am surprised that blizz would delete a thread from a customer expressing their dissatisfaction.
Because it's not constructive criticism. It's just criticism which is looked down on. The three examples he gave about bugs and problems were fixed: two prior to his post, which he was aware of, and the other was fixed last patch (the pet survive-ability problem.) According to his post, he very much claimed that he knew how to program and knows how to implement it to fix it. No one expects him to, but if he can do it, then maybe he should. Complaining isn't going to fix the problem. The new development team doesn't read minds so we, the fan base, should do our best to explain why we need changes and ideas on how they can fix it. OP is "beating a dead horse." It's a saying that means what he's doing has no point unless his goal was to "beat a dead horse" or, in this case, ramble on about problems that were addressed without providing any sort of substance on how they should have been handled or should be.
I don't agree with an account ban on what he has written here, if this is an exact replica of what he wrote. It is far from offensive to deserve such a punishment but we'll never know what was written on the official forums in detail as it was removed.
I would actually like to switch the topic at this point if we can. We now know that there are people that do feel there is no "end game." Let's say that someone that could potentially could influence the direction of D3 sees this. I'd want them to see some ideas on what direction they could take this to fix the problem. I have an idea or two, but I'm sure plenty of people could give better input than myself as they've probably played way longer than I have.
My idea is to assign tiers to all items (and future ones) that prohibit them from dropping below a certain torment difficulty. By gauging item strengths, we can make players work for their gear outside of RNG. It's really distressing that a game that is designed around loot and the progression of getting stronger to get better loot, doesn't actually require you to get any stronger to get said loot. Hitting Torment 1 unlocks access to all items (aside from bounties... which the legendaries can drop in normal which is also silly) defeats the point of working towards the higher difficulties. Yes the drop rate goes up, that does not change the fact that in theory, a player through pure luck and lack of skill can get end game gear. As a gamer in general, I find that a little upsetting.
As players begin to round out gear in T1, they will start to move into T2 and have incredible difficulty. However if they persist and use the mechanics they have worked on all this time, they could net a legendary exclusive to T2 and under. This could help tip the scales to let them work through T2 comfortably. Thy round out their build and work towards T3. Etc, etc.
My other idea involves the crafting system and allows a complete revamp of how materials interact with items: By assigning multiple affixes to crafting materials that already exist (such as... "this item has a chance to imbue x life on hit, or x life %, or life regen"), players can craft white items into blue items, then to yellow items as they imbue more affixes. They can't reroll affixes but can improve existing affixes for a hefty price and materials. Everyone seems hurt on "the hunt" for the perfect item, and by limiting the improvement per material to a minimum (one material improves a statistic by 1-2), the hunt will be not only on for the next big drop, but specific materials that could "make" your next big drop. By also assigning better drop rates to specific creatures and/or types, players will have goals that they can set to gather materials in general. I believe the last unique material system was boring because it was always a boss that dropped the legendary crafting material which made it repetitive because you know exactly where to go. By assigning it to monster types, players can explore the world but keep eyes out for specific elites/mobs that drop what they are looking for creating a new experience that sends them place to place in a controlled setting dictated by their desires. Just throwing out some ideas.
I agree completely. I remember my friends playing inferno and talking about how crazy hard it was. I jumped on reaper of souls after all the changes so I never had the pleasure.
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* Chance on hit to absorb durability from your equipped items to rip open a fissure of molten steel, dealing X damage to an area over X time.
Mixed with Spaulders of Zakara, that could be a cool concept.
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As for the tempering, I explained that nothing changed except that you can eventually max out stats; regardless of the cost, that is the point. This enforces skill play. If two people walk in with the "exact same gear," they will know who is the better player after gaming together. This will make players seek good gameplay habits if they want to progress in the game because the farming game is no longer their motivation (provided they have the exact gear they want.)
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I also wouldn't mind, with them being conscious of zone farming, for them to take the time to revisit some old zones and tinker with them for a better dungeon crawl experience.
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Area Farming - Make item types more prevalent in certain acts and zones. This makes players looking for certain gear more likely to seek out certain zones rather than rift forever and ever creating repetitive gameplay. Chest become the jack of all trades however: Normal chests allow players to gain access to ANY item in the act while resplendent chests allow players to gain any item from all acts. We keep the absolute RNG factor through chest, but constrain it while actually hunting zones.
- Undead related gear in act 1.
- Demon slaying gear in act 3.
- Poison related gear in the blood marsh. Etc.
Difficulty farming - Legendaries are limited to difficulties: Normal to Torment 6. This creates layers that progresses players from point A to B. Farm your character up to master and get a few legendaries. Now move into T2. It's hard yes, but now new gear opens up and you can farm this difficulty and hunt for gear here to help you progress to the next stage. This also alows scaling to be fixed. People don't fight bosses unless it's for a bounty at this point, and because of RNG, players could have gotten lucky on stats and will just plow through them in 10-30 seconds. Boring. By creating tiers and knowing what players have access to, the game will become interesting to play at all levels as every new difficulty will pose a new challenge and grant you the next step in evolving your characters gear."I heard there was an enemy in Act 3/Torment 1 that dropped the rare marauder's helm!"
"Whoa! I love that set. I'm off to do some act 3 bounties then and see if I can get it."
Tempering - Getting the item you wanted since you started is really disappointing when it's got the lowest stats you can get. It's actually a slap to the face. You were basically punished for being unlucky. Tempering is the idea that a player can spend crafting resources to max out his stats on gear. Changing stat affixes is for the enchantress, so you can still be unlucky on WHICH stats you get but once you do get them, you'll be able to start capping them... at a price of course. Every point raised in this item will raise the cost of the next point you raise. Depending on how rare the gear is, you might actually consider farming it again for better stats as paying 450 million gold just doesn't sound worth it. This will also bring value back to gold again. This will provide huge value to farming and salvaging in general. Depending on how ridiculous the Devs wanted to be, it could be quite extravagant:
- 1 Veil Crystal + x gold = +1 Strength, +1 Dexterity, or +1 Intelligence.
- 1 Veil Crystal + x gold = +1 Vitality
- 1 Veil Crystal + x gold = +1 Armor
- 10 Lizard Eye + x gold = +0.1% Critical Hit Chance
- 1 Lizard Eye + x gold = +1.0% Critical Hit Damage
- 100 Arcane Dust + x gold = +1.0% Elemental Ability Damage
.... Something like that.TL;DR - I think Diablo 3 will be better when RNG is constrained without taking it away. You can hunt for specific items, but chests will serve as RNG like in D3's current state. Blood shards and Kadala are just alternative ways to play with RNG as well. Tempering.
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I enjoy playing diablo 3. However I do not like farming in Diablo 3. People tell me that's the point of the game and I disagree. The point of the game is to get gear and eventually create something of your own that helps you kick demon ass. RNG is just a drug in this game, an addiction, dopamine straight to brain kind of deal; players farm and farm just to get that rush of picking up that item they've been hunting for for hundreds of hours. This is great feeling and is tried and true in a lot of games but with the pool of items being flooded with more legendaries and now ancient lengendaries,the game is going to slowly become a game where the skill of players is less relevant than luck (it is already most of the way there, but skill can take you very far in this game. I sure as hell can't do G. Rift 40+ even with the right gear.) So the question I've been asking myself is how does diablo 3 progress into a state of skill based farming without bastardizing the core concept the game is created on?
Area and tier based loot drops with a tempering system (will explain tempering shortly.) This concept actually goes back to D2 as farming certain areas and enemies yielded better chances to get the loot you needed. This created opportunities with players to hunt out spots and give personal goals not dictated by the game which, to many people I played with back then and now, still is an ideal way to play any game with farming. I suggest that certain legendaries are available from normal to master difficulty only. In Torment 1 a new stack of legendaries is added that are available in T1 only. So on and so forth for all the legendaries in the game and finishing with ancient legendaries for items in T6. In addition to limiting items to difficulty, constricting them to acts or bosses (such as the butcher's cleaver only dropping on the butcher... like act 4 or something) you are creating game play where a person can push their characters at a steady rate to end game without creating frustration that you just weren't lucky this season (furnace anyone?)
To further this steady progression I suggest a tempering system. Unlike crafting and enchanting where you are completely gambling on stats or affixes, tempering is a system that takes all your crafting materials and let's you expend them to raise the stat points of individual affixes so you can eventually max out your dream gear. "It was hard enough to get your marauders set but you didn't get the stats you needed... Yeah I know you farmed 200 hours and just got your 5th piece. I know. Yeah it's not going to take you past greater rift 35. Go farm some more and come back." It's a shitty feeling to know you have played SO long on a toon and to get gear you absolutely need for a build and it counts for little when you get it because it had terrible stats. Tempering will solve this issue without trivializing crafting and enchanting (also it makes veil crystals worth getting again) because where as crafting resets whole items, and enchanting resets a single affix, tempering brings their values to a maximum. This will make players feel like they are steadily progressing and bring people more in line with a skill difference rather than a luck difference. Depending on how the Devs want to approach this, it could be incredibly complex or simple, either making the rarest components raise stats by a 1 to 1 ratio while less rare components take multiple of the same to accomplish the same feat or just make veil crystals raise stats by a static value (dictated by the affix) and make the gold value go up as you craft more into it.
That's my idea anyways and I'm sure people disagree but I think it would bring a lot of power to the players to let them be able to hunt more specific gear they needed and eventually max it out. Time and proper gameplay being the biggest factors of improvement of course.
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Sounds Cool! How Can I Participate?
Submitting an idea for the Legendary Workshop is easy! Here's how the process will work:- We'll begin accepting submissions on Friday, November 7 at 7:00 a.m. PST (10:00 a.m. EST).
- At that time, you can submit your idea one of three ways:
- You will have until Saturday, November 8 at 11:00 a.m. PST (2:00 p.m. EST) to submit your ideas.
Ideas submitted before or after the provided times, or using a method not described above, will not be considered.On the official Diablo III forums, in our dedicated thread.
- On Twitter, using the #LegendaryWorkshop hashtag.
- At the Community Corner, located between Halls B and C of the Anaheim Convention Center.
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I have a huge list and it's around 25 items. I was just going to post them all but I don't see any details on how to go about it.
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I don't agree with an account ban on what he has written here, if this is an exact replica of what he wrote. It is far from offensive to deserve such a punishment but we'll never know what was written on the official forums in detail as it was removed.
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My idea is to assign tiers to all items (and future ones) that prohibit them from dropping below a certain torment difficulty. By gauging item strengths, we can make players work for their gear outside of RNG. It's really distressing that a game that is designed around loot and the progression of getting stronger to get better loot, doesn't actually require you to get any stronger to get said loot. Hitting Torment 1 unlocks access to all items (aside from bounties... which the legendaries can drop in normal which is also silly) defeats the point of working towards the higher difficulties. Yes the drop rate goes up, that does not change the fact that in theory, a player through pure luck and lack of skill can get end game gear. As a gamer in general, I find that a little upsetting.
As players begin to round out gear in T1, they will start to move into T2 and have incredible difficulty. However if they persist and use the mechanics they have worked on all this time, they could net a legendary exclusive to T2 and under. This could help tip the scales to let them work through T2 comfortably. Thy round out their build and work towards T3. Etc, etc.
My other idea involves the crafting system and allows a complete revamp of how materials interact with items: By assigning multiple affixes to crafting materials that already exist (such as... "this item has a chance to imbue x life on hit, or x life %, or life regen"), players can craft white items into blue items, then to yellow items as they imbue more affixes. They can't reroll affixes but can improve existing affixes for a hefty price and materials. Everyone seems hurt on "the hunt" for the perfect item, and by limiting the improvement per material to a minimum (one material improves a statistic by 1-2), the hunt will be not only on for the next big drop, but specific materials that could "make" your next big drop. By also assigning better drop rates to specific creatures and/or types, players will have goals that they can set to gather materials in general. I believe the last unique material system was boring because it was always a boss that dropped the legendary crafting material which made it repetitive because you know exactly where to go. By assigning it to monster types, players can explore the world but keep eyes out for specific elites/mobs that drop what they are looking for creating a new experience that sends them place to place in a controlled setting dictated by their desires. Just throwing out some ideas.
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