The idea here is to have a lot of mana at your disposal and a couple trusty spells to continually spam. Horrify, soul harvest, mass confusion and fetish army will be used to provide periods of distraction. In addition, horrify is also another mana generator with a golden runestone. I don't mind the large cool-down on fetish army as it will almost ensure a 10-15 second engagement of the passive skill: vision quest to provide a lot of mana Regen while the distraction spells are on cooldown. I'll have to see if the 300% mana regen on vision quest is worth it otherwise, this whole build strategy is centered on activating vision quest and spaming low-mid cost offensive spells with the flow of mana.
The offensive strategy here simple, spam plague of toads and fire bomb (+obsidian) to lay waste to anything in your path. The issue here will be defense (critically) but maybe playing in a party or a follower could aid with that.
Another obvious but important point would be to use soul harvest, horrify, mass confusion and fetish army whenever you get the chance to make good use of vision quest. Rush of essence means that you wont be leaking out any mana on the spirit realm spells while trying to keep vision quest up.
The first passive I chose, spiritual attunement, is not at all critical to the way the build plays and could be changed to suit your play style and equipment (but more mana never hurt anybody). Even the offensive physical realm spells could be changed, I generally don't like expensive spells.
First of all, its a very viable build as your goal is mana effiency but I'd like to propose you some alternatives ways that may or may not increase your build and still stay in the same theme : the mana management.
I would suggest you switching your plague of toads for firebats here the reasons:
-Firebats have initally lower mana cost (not talking about runestones yet) which would prevent you to use a runestone to save mana
(plague of toads+ golden runestone)
- The difference between firebats un-runed and the plague of toad runed is only 83 mana
-Plague of toads is quite Rng on hit, you can cast in front of you and there are chances that one of them decide to go behind you or some sort of that. Example lightning bolt from diablo 2 if you have played but with much less projectiles. When you cast a PoT and they dont all hit their target it is way less mana effiecient as you may have to recast it a second time to finish off fewer targets or even critically injuried targets (overkilling)
-Firebats offer higher dmg if they are well runed, have an accurate firing and an area of effect as well.
Other thing would be to switch your first passive skill spiritual attunement ( it is a good one tho) to gruesome feast for a starter.
In Normal difficulty and low level as well. Your mana will be quite low so having 20% wont increase much your mana between lvl 1 to 15 and either your 2% mana per seconds. As normal is overflowing with health globes, you would be able to receiving a 10% mana every 2-3 kills i believe and hold a 50% attacks (damage) but indeed once you go nightmare and above i would strongly suggest spiritual attunement no matter what.
I didn't considered the progression of character, I was imagining a late game reliable build. I found it interesting that you brought up the gruesome feast passive because I haven't considered the health globe component of the game. Gruesome feast will be deadly when dieing enemies start dropping health globes 'attack bonus can stack up to 5 times', more mana and damage is a recipe for a massacre.
When it comes to plague of toads and firebomb those two skills can pretty much be changed to anything you want.The core idea is to activate vision quest with 4 cooled-down skills and use that mana to explode with 2 good offensive spells. Those offensive spells could be anything really. Fire bats is nice one, but I'm guessing (literally since I haven't played the beta and game looks like its never going to come out) that these two things are important when choosing the two offensive skills in this build.
1. Nothing with a cooldown. The whole vision quest buisness means you have 4 cool down spells up your sleeves already. You're dead if you get attacked and you have and empty bag of tricks. In addition, there should be a lot of mana available and the best thing to do is use it quickly.
2. Have one expensive spell and one cheap one (I'm cheap). I have no idea about this one, I could be wrong it's a total guess.
i think you went a bit overboard with the mana regen to be honest. you wont need that much if this is an end-game build because you'll have a few thousand mana and already decent regen, u dont need 5 sources to get your mana back.
since u dont need the 300% mana regen the long ass CD abilities are essentially just weighing you down. i see you have no pets and whiel this is a risky move if you would like to stay petless ill point you to more of a build like my signature but no pets like this:
you keep the CD abilities but since you have the passive that reduces them all by 1 second per enemy death close to you, you will be able to forever rotate them when needed and spam firebats to destroy everything in between. your grasp of the dead will generate massive amounts of health globes for u so you'll always be safe with health and always keeping gruesome feast at max potential as well as keeping you at full mana. you get the spirit vessel passive to use those abilities more often because they are the most important and itll save you from death every 90 seconds which will also be a must as a non-pet WD in inferno.
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"once the pretty hardcore gamers we had testing inferno found it fairly difficult, we then we doubled it" -trolololol jay wilson
Well considering that the game isn't out yet any of these end-game buil we are conjuring up are only speculation. The idea of putting together builds right now if fun and it provides some nice insight into how the game's mechanics are going to feel. With that being said yeah maybe I am overkilling the mana issue but as a caster you can never really have too much mana. No mana is a death sentence. The main concern for me with regards to the amount of mana I have is, how fast can I drain my mana reservoirs with only 2 non cooldown damage outputting spells. If I can bring myself to an empty mana pot then I would say, there is no such thing as too much mana. BUT, If the build doesn't have the capability to unleash all of its mana into two skills then you would be totally correct here and the build is crap. You can have all the mana in the world but if you can't really use it all what good is it to you. The main weakness here is that I have made somewhat of a glass 'cannon' WD and I will need the templar follower to stand a chance against juicy mobs.
Also, although I stated fetish army would be included in the build I am beginning to think I will need dogs or a gargantuan to make it out of fights alive. However, I will have to consider that zombie dogs and gargantuan cost mana that rush of essence won't give back to me. I realize this build might just not be defensively viable but at the same time there is a lot potential to unleash a lot of mana which equals a lot of damage..
I have a question that maybe someone more tuned into the D3 might be able to answer, the question could get complicated I hope you guys can follow my logic.
Rush of essence says that spirit spells return 125% of mana cost over 10 seconds. Now if vision quest activates at the same time rush of essence is activated will rush of essence be returning 375% mana cost OR the original 125% mana but over 3.333 seconds (1/3 of the time) instead of 10? Or does vision quest not apply to the kind mana regen in rush of essence.
Well considering that the game isn't out yet any of these end-game buil we are conjuring up are only speculation. The idea of putting together builds right now if fun and it provides some nice insight into how the game's mechanics are going to feel. With that being said yeah maybe I am overkilling the mana issue but as a caster you can never really have too much mana. The main concern for me with regards to the amount of mana I have is, how fast can I drain my mana reservoirs with only 2 non cooldown spells. If I can bring myself to an empty mana pot then there is no such thing as too much mana. If the build doesn't have the capability to unleash all of its mana into two skills then you would be totally correct here and the build is crap. The main weakness here is that I have made somewhat of a glass 'cannon' WD and I will need the templar follower to stand a chance against juicy mobs.
Also, although I stated fetish army would be included in the build I am beginning to think I will need dogs or a gargantuan to make it out of fights alive. But I have a gut feeling that this build has the potential to unleash a lot of mana.
I have a question that maybe someone more tuned into the D3 might be able to answer, the question could get complicated I hope you guys can follow my logic.
Rush of essence says that spirit spells return 125% of mana cost over 10 seconds. Now if vision quest activates at the same time rush of essence is activated will rush of essence be returning 375% mana cost OR the original 125% mana but over 3.333 seconds (1/3 of the time) instead of 10? Or does vision quest not apply to the kind mana regen in rush of essence.
very true BUT with the build i listed i have 2 ways of getting mana back, gruesome feast returns 10% per globe which will be everywhere with grasp of the dead rune effect and the other passive gives you 1% mana per enemy death also. that along with regular regen and regen from gear and your 4th templar ability gives 13 mana per second so itll be more then enough for never ending mana for firebats, all of your other CD abilities use barley any mana so they arent even an issue. you only need enough mana to spam firebats as long as needed till mobs are dead so only for a few seconds, and when your higher dmg CD's are refreshed you always use those so your mana comes back.
ya i agree the WD definitely needs a pet on top of templar to help him survive in inferno because of the potential to insta die. blizzard has said over and over incredibly difficult it will be so we cant underestimate it, i would always overestimate it just to be safe so shoot for more survivability and utility VS. something like never ending mana. because never endnig mana wont matter if you die before you can run out lol
and rush of essnece returns 125% mana of that specific ability so that will be a separate regen while the 300% from vision quest is your overall mana regen increased so those will be added together for total regen during that time.
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"once the pretty hardcore gamers we had testing inferno found it fairly difficult, we then we doubled it" -trolololol jay wilson
Yeah I'll admit the build I put together can get slaughtered if you slip up more so than the average WD.
I like your build looks like it would be a relaxing build to play very diablo. My issue with your build would be that spirit walk. Such a safe build and you had to throw in the riskiest skill. What if your caught too close to mob after the spell is over? And what if in addition your dogs are dead?
Also, too bad gargantuan doesn't have a rune-stone to make it cheaper eh... and another thing I would have chosen Bruiser (alabaster) or my favorite for this skill Restless Giant (crimson), why did you pick humongoid?
Yeah I'll admit the build I put together can get slaughtered if you slip up more so than the average WD.
I like your build looks like it would be a relaxing build to play very diablo. My issue with your build would be that spirit walk. Such a safe build and you had to throw in the riskiest skill. What if your caught too close to mob after the spell is over? And what if in addition your dogs are dead?
Also, too bad gargantuan doesn't have a rune-stone to make it cheaper eh... and another thing I would have chosen Bruiser (alabaster) or my favorite for this skill Restless Giant (crimson), why did you pick humongoid?
spirit walk will be for escaping and killing champions/bosses. it will do 900% dmg super fast and with your massive attack bonus's from gruesome feast and soul harvest itll do absolutely insane damage. you wont just use it on regular mobs whenever its available, you can use it to cut a path out of a big group of mobs to gain your bearing if your getting swarmed or quickly kill a champion, since it will obviously insta kill reg mobs you touch itll reduce the CD's on your other abilities allowing you to use them when the spell wears off . and i chose humongoid so he hits multiple mobs and will keep more enemies occupied and off me.
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"once the pretty hardcore gamers we had testing inferno found it fairly difficult, we then we doubled it" -trolololol jay wilson
Comparing to build1 this one has an average ability in DEF and ATT
more life for the pets
more dogs means more DMG for dog explosion
less DMG on fire and posion skills
both builds have poison & fire & physical multi-DMG output
What do u think about that?
i think your missing the entire point of the build. did i say ANYWHERE that i was trying to max dmg? no i said it has a lot of dmg and its for melee/close combat. it utilizes graps of the dead for health globes to keep gruesome feast up, with your build you wont be able to get the most of the bonus because itll ware off before you get another health globe, especially in inferno where health globes will be scarce. your builds do lots of damage but lack serious survivability.
and your having to explode your dogs in order to gain more damage so thats a VERY bad idea for survivability. my build is overall good where yours just mostly focuses on dmg. gotta think about the big picture and all angles man
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"once the pretty hardcore gamers we had testing inferno found it fairly difficult, we then we doubled it" -trolololol jay wilson
1 only fire DMG output is strong
2 pets are weak, so life link is weak, phyicial output is weak as well
3 Spririt walk is good but it's last only 2 secs.
1 only fire DMG output is strong
2 pets are weak, so life link is weak, phyicial output is weak as well
3 Spririt walk is good but it's last only 2 secs.
focus on only phyical DMG which is harder to be resisted in Hell mode.
spirit walk and soul harvest do insane damage and with their cooldowns being reduced by 1 sedcond for every 1 death i can rotate them back to back and use fire bats when needed. i have 4 pets which arent weak and they also get healed by the health globes so they can easily stay alive.
by watching gameplay footage of hell/inferno from blizzcon we can see that the health globes drop a lot less frequently then normal, and it takes longer to kill creeps to even get the healthglobes so without that huge bonus from GoTD rune effect u will not utilize gruesome feast to max potential.
i see no issues with my build on what you said, and again using sacrifice is a bad idea because you will need your dogs alive alot more then you will need a small damage boost. you'll also need blood spatter as a passive to reduce the CD's on your abilities and get more life/mana.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"once the pretty hardcore gamers we had testing inferno found it fairly difficult, we then we doubled it" -trolololol jay wilson
1 only fire DMG output is strong
2 pets are weak, so life link is weak, phyicial output is weak as well
3 Spririt walk is good but it's last only 2 secs.
focus on only phyical DMG which is harder to be resisted in Hell mode.
spirit walk and soul harvest do insane damage and with their cooldowns being reduced by 1 sedcond for every 1 death i can rotate them back to back and use fire bats when needed. i have 4 pets which arent weak and they also get healed by the health globes so they can easily stay alive.
by watching gameplay footage of hell/inferno from blizzcon we can see that the health globes drop a lot less frequently then normal, and it takes longer to kill creeps to even get the healthglobes so without that huge bonus from GoTD rune effect u will not utilize gruesome feast to max potential.
i see no issues with my build on what you said, and again using sacrifice is a bad idea because you will need your dogs alive alot more then you will need a small damage boost. you'll also need blood spatter as a passive to reduce the CD's on your abilities and get more life/mana.
Refer to your build, i have finally come out a final farmer build which will absolutely be my first Character.
The website is under maintenance, I just use your screen instead:-)
here...great!
molster (moderator on this site) made that website and just click "view dev site" and then you can click the middle box n paste your build link and click enter.
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"once the pretty hardcore gamers we had testing inferno found it fairly difficult, we then we doubled it" -trolololol jay wilson
GOD- Killed traget will have 50% chance to drop health globe.
What is " killed traget" mean?
1 It could be killed only by GOD- that sucks, we have to caculate the monster HP then cast GOD.
2 It could be in the spell area all killed tragets will take effect.
Which one will it be in the game?
if its all killed targets in area then thats SUPER OP considering we can always have it up. so most likley it will be killed by GOD. (lol god) but if were chain overlapping it and with a lvl 7 rune having an 80% chance to drop one it should be more then fine either way.
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"once the pretty hardcore gamers we had testing inferno found it fairly difficult, we then we doubled it" -trolololol jay wilson
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I haven't played the beta mind you.
The idea here is to have a lot of mana at your disposal and a couple trusty spells to continually spam. Horrify, soul harvest, mass confusion and fetish army will be used to provide periods of distraction. In addition, horrify is also another mana generator with a golden runestone. I don't mind the large cool-down on fetish army as it will almost ensure a 10-15 second engagement of the passive skill: vision quest to provide a lot of mana Regen while the distraction spells are on cooldown. I'll have to see if the 300% mana regen on vision quest is worth it otherwise, this whole build strategy is centered on activating vision quest and spaming low-mid cost offensive spells with the flow of mana.
The offensive strategy here simple, spam plague of toads and fire bomb (+obsidian) to lay waste to anything in your path. The issue here will be defense (critically) but maybe playing in a party or a follower could aid with that.
Another obvious but important point would be to use soul harvest, horrify, mass confusion and fetish army whenever you get the chance to make good use of vision quest. Rush of essence means that you wont be leaking out any mana on the spirit realm spells while trying to keep vision quest up.
The first passive I chose, spiritual attunement, is not at all critical to the way the build plays and could be changed to suit your play style and equipment (but more mana never hurt anybody). Even the offensive physical realm spells could be changed, I generally don't like expensive spells.
I would suggest you switching your plague of toads for firebats here the reasons:
-Firebats have initally lower mana cost (not talking about runestones yet) which would prevent you to use a runestone to save mana
(plague of toads+ golden runestone)
- The difference between firebats un-runed and the plague of toad runed is only 83 mana
-Plague of toads is quite Rng on hit, you can cast in front of you and there are chances that one of them decide to go behind you or some sort of that. Example lightning bolt from diablo 2 if you have played but with much less projectiles. When you cast a PoT and they dont all hit their target it is way less mana effiecient as you may have to recast it a second time to finish off fewer targets or even critically injuried targets (overkilling)
-Firebats offer higher dmg if they are well runed, have an accurate firing and an area of effect as well.
Other thing would be to switch your first passive skill spiritual attunement ( it is a good one tho) to gruesome feast for a starter.
In Normal difficulty and low level as well. Your mana will be quite low so having 20% wont increase much your mana between lvl 1 to 15 and either your 2% mana per seconds. As normal is overflowing with health globes, you would be able to receiving a 10% mana every 2-3 kills i believe and hold a 50% attacks (damage) but indeed once you go nightmare and above i would strongly suggest spiritual attunement no matter what.
When it comes to plague of toads and firebomb those two skills can pretty much be changed to anything you want.The core idea is to activate vision quest with 4 cooled-down skills and use that mana to explode with 2 good offensive spells. Those offensive spells could be anything really. Fire bats is nice one, but I'm guessing (literally since I haven't played the beta and game looks like its never going to come out) that these two things are important when choosing the two offensive skills in this build.
1. Nothing with a cooldown. The whole vision quest buisness means you have 4 cool down spells up your sleeves already. You're dead if you get attacked and you have and empty bag of tricks. In addition, there should be a lot of mana available and the best thing to do is use it quickly.
2. Have one expensive spell and one cheap one (I'm cheap). I have no idea about this one, I could be wrong it's a total guess.
since u dont need the 300% mana regen the long ass CD abilities are essentially just weighing you down. i see you have no pets and whiel this is a risky move if you would like to stay petless ill point you to more of a build like my signature but no pets like this:
you keep the CD abilities but since you have the passive that reduces them all by 1 second per enemy death close to you, you will be able to forever rotate them when needed and spam firebats to destroy everything in between. your grasp of the dead will generate massive amounts of health globes for u so you'll always be safe with health and always keeping gruesome feast at max potential as well as keeping you at full mana. you get the spirit vessel passive to use those abilities more often because they are the most important and itll save you from death every 90 seconds which will also be a must as a non-pet WD in inferno.
Also, although I stated fetish army would be included in the build I am beginning to think I will need dogs or a gargantuan to make it out of fights alive. However, I will have to consider that zombie dogs and gargantuan cost mana that rush of essence won't give back to me. I realize this build might just not be defensively viable but at the same time there is a lot potential to unleash a lot of mana which equals a lot of damage..
I have a question that maybe someone more tuned into the D3 might be able to answer, the question could get complicated I hope you guys can follow my logic.
Rush of essence says that spirit spells return 125% of mana cost over 10 seconds. Now if vision quest activates at the same time rush of essence is activated will rush of essence be returning 375% mana cost OR the original 125% mana but over 3.333 seconds (1/3 of the time) instead of 10? Or does vision quest not apply to the kind mana regen in rush of essence.
very true BUT with the build i listed i have 2 ways of getting mana back, gruesome feast returns 10% per globe which will be everywhere with grasp of the dead rune effect and the other passive gives you 1% mana per enemy death also. that along with regular regen and regen from gear and your 4th templar ability gives 13 mana per second so itll be more then enough for never ending mana for firebats, all of your other CD abilities use barley any mana so they arent even an issue. you only need enough mana to spam firebats as long as needed till mobs are dead so only for a few seconds, and when your higher dmg CD's are refreshed you always use those so your mana comes back.
ya i agree the WD definitely needs a pet on top of templar to help him survive in inferno because of the potential to insta die. blizzard has said over and over incredibly difficult it will be so we cant underestimate it, i would always overestimate it just to be safe so shoot for more survivability and utility VS. something like never ending mana. because never endnig mana wont matter if you die before you can run out lol
and rush of essnece returns 125% mana of that specific ability so that will be a separate regen while the 300% from vision quest is your overall mana regen increased so those will be added together for total regen during that time.
I like your build looks like it would be a relaxing build to play very diablo. My issue with your build would be that spirit walk. Such a safe build and you had to throw in the riskiest skill. What if your caught too close to mob after the spell is over? And what if in addition your dogs are dead?
Also, too bad gargantuan doesn't have a rune-stone to make it cheaper eh... and another thing I would have chosen Bruiser (alabaster) or my favorite for this skill Restless Giant (crimson), why did you pick humongoid?
spirit walk will be for escaping and killing champions/bosses. it will do 900% dmg super fast and with your massive attack bonus's from gruesome feast and soul harvest itll do absolutely insane damage. you wont just use it on regular mobs whenever its available, you can use it to cut a path out of a big group of mobs to gain your bearing if your getting swarmed or quickly kill a champion, since it will obviously insta kill reg mobs you touch itll reduce the CD's on your other abilities allowing you to use them when the spell wears off . and i chose humongoid so he hits multiple mobs and will keep more enemies occupied and off me.
Insane DMG? I think this could be improved.
My DMG MAX build1:
http://us.battle.net...hgVZ!cZe!YZZaYY
Passive skill +40% DMG & +50% attack
Dog sacrifice +24% maybe +48% after 2 times use
SH +126attack means +126% dmg
My DMG MAX build2:
http://us.battle.net/d3/en/calculator/witch-doctor#bThgfR!cWe!YZZaYZ
Comparing to build1 this one has an average ability in DEF and ATT
more life for the pets
more dogs means more DMG for dog explosion
less DMG on fire and posion skills
both builds have poison & fire & physical multi-DMG output
What do u think about that?
i think your missing the entire point of the build. did i say ANYWHERE that i was trying to max dmg? no i said it has a lot of dmg and its for melee/close combat. it utilizes graps of the dead for health globes to keep gruesome feast up, with your build you wont be able to get the most of the bonus because itll ware off before you get another health globe, especially in inferno where health globes will be scarce. your builds do lots of damage but lack serious survivability.
and your having to explode your dogs in order to gain more damage so thats a VERY bad idea for survivability. my build is overall good where yours just mostly focuses on dmg. gotta think about the big picture and all angles man
1 only fire DMG output is strong
2 pets are weak, so life link is weak, phyicial output is weak as well
3 Spririt walk is good but it's last only 2 secs.
in inferno where health globes will be scarce...
ok, where did u get this info.?
If it's true the GOD will be a must spell.
I take the advice and modified as following.
http://us.battle.net/d3/en/calculator/witch-doctor#bThYkg!cWe!YZZaaa
focus on only phyical DMG which is harder to be resisted in Hell mode.
spirit walk and soul harvest do insane damage and with their cooldowns being reduced by 1 sedcond for every 1 death i can rotate them back to back and use fire bats when needed. i have 4 pets which arent weak and they also get healed by the health globes so they can easily stay alive.
by watching gameplay footage of hell/inferno from blizzcon we can see that the health globes drop a lot less frequently then normal, and it takes longer to kill creeps to even get the healthglobes so without that huge bonus from GoTD rune effect u will not utilize gruesome feast to max potential.
i see no issues with my build on what you said, and again using sacrifice is a bad idea because you will need your dogs alive alot more then you will need a small damage boost. you'll also need blood spatter as a passive to reduce the CD's on your abilities and get more life/mana.
Refer to your build, i have finally come out a final farmer build which will absolutely be my first Character.
http://us.battle.net/d3/en/calculator/witch-doctor#YZVbhg!Zce!aYYYZc
All skills can be learned at Lv20.
Strong poison/fire/physical dmg.
Thanks for your ideas.
BTW, Where did u get your fantastic signature?
no problemo. i love discussing theory crafting
http://diablosigs.com/ just make a build on the main website and copy the link and itll make you a variety of signature from it
here...great!
molster (moderator on this site) made that website and just click "view dev site" and then you can click the middle box n paste your build link and click enter.
Conbined both Wizard's power and Bar's defense.... I hope BLZ wont nerf this build in the future.
id expect a few more buffs/nerfs before actual release but nothing major.
GOD- Killed traget will have 50% chance to drop health globe.
What is " killed traget" mean?
1 It could be killed only by GOD- that sucks, we have to caculate the monster HP then cast GOD.
2 It could be in the spell area all killed tragets will take effect.
Which one will it be in the game?
if its all killed targets in area then thats SUPER OP considering we can always have it up. so most likley it will be killed by GOD. (lol god) but if were chain overlapping it and with a lvl 7 rune having an 80% chance to drop one it should be more then fine either way.