You lack discipline. Really bad build as it is now.
Remove shit-vault and replace with companion and it's decent (still going to have major discipline problems tho). Vault is a bad spell för PvE anyway.
EDIT: Should also remove custom engineering. Replace with perfectionist/vengeance/night stalker and it's going to be alright.
I don't see how vault isn't a good Pve spell, it's an awesome utility spell that enables the DH to put distance between herself and mobs (and yeah she is a ranged class that doesn't mean it won't get close up and brutal throughout the game). I can see this being very viable in nightmare and up where rares/champions and bosses have f**kton of HP and abilities.
You lack discipline. Really bad build as it is now.
Remove shit-vault and replace with companion and it's decent (still going to have major discipline problems tho). Vault is a bad spell för PvE anyway.
EDIT: Should also remove custom engineering. Replace with perfectionist/vengeance/night stalker and it's going to be alright.
I don't see how vault isn't a good Pve spell, it's an awesome utility spell that enables the DH to put distance between herself and mobs (and yeah she is a ranged class that doesn't mean it won't get close up and brutal throughout the game). I can see this being very viable in nightmare and up where rares/champions and bosses have f**kton of HP and abilities.
Just my opinion.
Vault is bad for several reasons:
1. It occupies a skill slot
2. It costs A LOT of discipline or has a LONG cooldown (depending on rune)
3. It's better to focus on actually preventing stuff from reaching you than allowing things to reach you and then jump backwards.
4. Using vault is always bad. Either you jump backwards, they way you came from, resulting in lost time (you'll have to rerun that distance) or you jump forward. If you are able to jump forward, then vault isn't even needed in the first place (jumping into the unkown should never be done unless the area is too easy for you - hence, vault is not needed).
4. The distance traveled by vault can be walked in ~0,3 additional second. It's nothing really.
Diablo is a hack n slash farming game. Time and efficiency is everything that matters. Vaulting back to save your ass lessens your efficiency and wastes your time. Better spend that discipline on more caltrops or more damage (preventing monsters from ever getting close) such as FoK.
Vault is nothing but a bad and comfortable skill.
There will be scenarios where you cant just out damage your way out of every situation, that's why utility and CC skills exsist. And in terms of lost time and efficiency, would you rather die? resulting in lost time to get back to your current position and the gold repairs will become more and more severe. The two or so seconds to regain control or attack position in a battle seems alot more plausable.
I don't agree with you so I'm not going to take it any further, we will just see on launch.
You lack discipline. Really bad build as it is now. Remove shit-vault and replace with companion and it's decent (still going to have major discipline problems tho). Vault is a bad spell för PvE anyway. EDIT: Should also remove custom engineering. Replace with perfectionist/vengeance/night stalker and it's going to be alright.
I don't see how vault isn't a good Pve spell, it's an awesome utility spell that enables the DH to put distance between herself and mobs (and yeah she is a ranged class that doesn't mean it won't get close up and brutal throughout the game). I can see this being very viable in nightmare and up where rares/champions and bosses have f**kton of HP and abilities. Just my opinion.
Vault is bad for several reasons: 1. It occupies a skill slot 2. It costs A LOT of discipline or has a LONG cooldown (depending on rune) 3. It's better to focus on actually preventing stuff from reaching you than allowing things to reach you and then jump backwards. 4. Using vault is always bad. Either you jump backwards, they way you came from, resulting in lost time (you'll have to rerun that distance) or you jump forward. If you are able to jump forward, then vault isn't even needed in the first place (jumping into the unkown should never be done unless the area is too easy for you - hence, vault is not needed). 4. The distance traveled by vault can be walked in ~0,3 additional second. It's nothing really. Diablo is a hack n slash farming game. Time and efficiency is everything that matters. Vaulting back to save your ass lessens your efficiency and wastes your time. Better spend that discipline on more caltrops or more damage (preventing monsters from ever getting close) such as FoK. Vault is nothing but a bad and comfortable skill.
What? Were you drunk when you wrote this? I really had trouble taking you seriously after you listed the disadvantage of a skill being that "it occupies a skill slot."You sure seem certain of yourself though...Unfortunately I'm having trouble following most of the logic in your post aside from the reasonable argument that his discipline regen is too low. Your snarky tone aside, while you can argue with OP's choices, singling out vault and as "a bad and comfortable skill" makes me really question your judgement. Unless you're spamming it, its discipline cost is reasonable, and certainly can be reduced/ made up for with other passives. Also, what exactly is "rerunning"? This is a puzzling term to me. Battles aren't linear forwards/backwards scenarios in Diablo; they're fluid. A kiting class with a variety of AoE skills (as his build has) will have to be moving constantly for optimum "farming." He would be dealing with packs of monsters in the end game that will reach him regardless of slows. Having a vault is if anything more essential at that point. Keep in mind dying is a lot less "efficient" than staying alive to farm an area continuously. Also, he won't be covering the same 35 yards that vault does in "~.3 seconds" considering that's about the speed vault travels in the first place...
3. It's better to focus on actually preventing stuff from reaching you than allowing things to reach you and then jump backwards.
4. Using vault is always bad. Either you jump backwards, they way you came from, resulting in lost time (you'll have to rerun that distance) or you jump forward. If you are able to jump forward, then vault isn't even needed in the first place (jumping into the unkown should never be done unless the area is too easy for you - hence, vault is not needed).
4. The distance traveled by vault can be walked in ~0,3 additional second. It's nothing really.
Diablo is a hack n slash farming game. Time and efficiency is everything that matters. Vaulting back to save your ass lessens your efficiency and wastes your time. Better spend that discipline on more caltrops or more damage (preventing monsters from ever getting close) such as FoK.
If Diablo 3's difficulty was like Diablo 2's difficulty, then you'd be right - any skill predicated on kiting mobs backwards would be slowing yourself down needlessly. If what all the Blizzard reps are saying about difficulty is correct, however, you will actually need to invest skills, time, and energy into defense and CCs. You say, just use Caltrops or FoK instead of Vault. Well, the problem is that Caltrops can only be dropped at your feet, and FoK has a range of 10 yards and only slows for 2 seconds (less on higher difficulties). And if mobs are that close, they're going to hit you. Could you slow them and then run away? Yes, but then you wouldn't be doing any damage to them except from your turret. Vault is a quasi-offensive skill in this build - instead of backpedaling, you're spending that time shooting grenades and cluster arrows.
I don't know if this build is viable at all, if largely because it is hard to tell how much damage those rocket abilities will be, if they have splash damage, etc. The first obvious change is to change Vault's rune to Acrobatics. You should never be Vaulting INTO groups, so I don't know why the 8 yards knockback would be useful. You can't afford to regularly use 3 discipline abilities, so better to have one on a cooldown.
I got valid points and you got an opinion. Two very different things. My opinion is based on math. Your is based on wishful thinking.
Discipline spent on caltrops is better than vault in every situation.
Those points are only valid to that marble you got rolling around upstairs.
1. It occupies a skill slot
That is not a valid argument, unless of course you know of some skill that doesn't occupy a skill slot.
2. It costs A LOT of discipline or has a LONG cooldown (depending on rune)
10 discipline is hardly a lot, especially if you take a means to restore discipline. Vault is one of the cheapest defense skills we have really.
One rune gives the ability a 15 sec cooldown & removes the disc cost completely, that is hardly an argument against vault though.
3. It's better to focus on actually preventing stuff from reaching you than allowing things to reach you and then jump backwards
Kiting is a huge part of this game, especially when you are under geared.
Its basically the only defense the DH has.
4. Using vault is always bad. Either you jump backwards, they way you came from, resulting in lost time (you'll have to rerun that distance) or you jump forward. If you are able to jump forward, then vault isn't even needed in the first place (jumping into the unknown should never be done unless the area is too easy for you - hence, vault is not needed).
Death is what wastes time/money, not skillful retreat. And really all this is saying is #3 again...."its less efficient to run away and kite".
Well that is absurd, especially as a DH, as the whole class is designed to nuke and keep its distance. They are the glass cannon of diablo 3.
5. The distance traveled by vault can be walked in ~0,3 additional second. It's nothing really.
The earth is 24.332 meters from the sun.
Making up numbers is fun.
Its more like 2-3 seconds, which if used in conjunction with some type of slow can be huge. This in turn completely contradicts #4 again.
You may have also noticed that vault has these things called runes that offer additional benefits as well.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Do you want to get scammed? Perhaps a nice keylogger?
"Just google "diablo 3 gold guide" and magical rainbow covered demons will assault your eyes."
Those points are only valid to that marble you got rolling around upstairs.
Read about stutter stepping and please attempt to run two DH's between eachother in beta, one vaulting and one running. I've done both for ~30 hours play time with DH and i can assure you:
-Stutter step with caltrops is great. (I've played through the beta with nothing but the first weapon doing this, trying to simulate inferno best as possible).
-Stutter step with vault is decent. It's effect is basicly the same as just shooting/vaulting.
-One has enough discipline to vault once every ten seconds and several vaults are required each battle in order to stay out of trouble. Caltrops on the other hand lasts for such a long duration that it often just takes one (8 discipline), but sometimes, rarely, two (16 discipline).
-Vault always puts you in a worse spot. Either you end up too far back or you end up too far forward. The straight movement, the static distance and the fact that you spend resources moving instead of killing is horrible. It's much better to move dynamicly, adjusting to the situation, and placing caltrops when needed instead of moving clunky with vault.
Have you ever played wow or diablo 2? If so, you know how unneccesarry these mobility spells are in PvE. How often do a amazon use enigma? How often do a mage blink away from mobs while grinding? When did you last see a shaman kite mobs with ghost wolf rather than frost shock? It's simply so much better to spend time on offensive abilities controlling the opponent then defensive abilities putting you outside harms reach.
Why would I need to read about it? Its not exactly a difficult or new concept....
I personally, don't like vault myself either, but I wouldn't say its crap. Sometimes, you simply need to move, like on SK who blinks in your face. Vault needs a slow component to go with it to make it ideal for use really, which we don't have in beta.
I used Blink and Ghost wolf all the time, because slows become more effective the more distance you can put yourself between the target.
I prefer caltrops, and smoke screen myself though.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Do you want to get scammed? Perhaps a nice keylogger?
"Just google "diablo 3 gold guide" and magical rainbow covered demons will assault your eyes."
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http://us.battle.net/d3/en/calculator/demon-hunter#UcYdkP!Ugh!ZbaZaZ
I don't see how vault isn't a good Pve spell, it's an awesome utility spell that enables the DH to put distance between herself and mobs (and yeah she is a ranged class that doesn't mean it won't get close up and brutal throughout the game). I can see this being very viable in nightmare and up where rares/champions and bosses have f**kton of HP and abilities.
Just my opinion.
There will be scenarios where you cant just out damage your way out of every situation, that's why utility and CC skills exsist. And in terms of lost time and efficiency, would you rather die? resulting in lost time to get back to your current position and the gold repairs will become more and more severe. The two or so seconds to regain control or attack position in a battle seems alot more plausable.
I don't agree with you so I'm not going to take it any further, we will just see on launch.
What? Were you drunk when you wrote this? I really had trouble taking you seriously after you listed the disadvantage of a skill being that "it occupies a skill slot."You sure seem certain of yourself though...Unfortunately I'm having trouble following most of the logic in your post aside from the reasonable argument that his discipline regen is too low. Your snarky tone aside, while you can argue with OP's choices, singling out vault and as "a bad and comfortable skill" makes me really question your judgement. Unless you're spamming it, its discipline cost is reasonable, and certainly can be reduced/ made up for with other passives. Also, what exactly is "rerunning"? This is a puzzling term to me. Battles aren't linear forwards/backwards scenarios in Diablo; they're fluid. A kiting class with a variety of AoE skills (as his build has) will have to be moving constantly for optimum "farming." He would be dealing with packs of monsters in the end game that will reach him regardless of slows. Having a vault is if anything more essential at that point. Keep in mind dying is a lot less "efficient" than staying alive to farm an area continuously. Also, he won't be covering the same 35 yards that vault does in "~.3 seconds" considering that's about the speed vault travels in the first place...
If Diablo 3's difficulty was like Diablo 2's difficulty, then you'd be right - any skill predicated on kiting mobs backwards would be slowing yourself down needlessly. If what all the Blizzard reps are saying about difficulty is correct, however, you will actually need to invest skills, time, and energy into defense and CCs. You say, just use Caltrops or FoK instead of Vault. Well, the problem is that Caltrops can only be dropped at your feet, and FoK has a range of 10 yards and only slows for 2 seconds (less on higher difficulties). And if mobs are that close, they're going to hit you. Could you slow them and then run away? Yes, but then you wouldn't be doing any damage to them except from your turret. Vault is a quasi-offensive skill in this build - instead of backpedaling, you're spending that time shooting grenades and cluster arrows.
I don't know if this build is viable at all, if largely because it is hard to tell how much damage those rocket abilities will be, if they have splash damage, etc. The first obvious change is to change Vault's rune to Acrobatics. You should never be Vaulting INTO groups, so I don't know why the 8 yards knockback would be useful. You can't afford to regularly use 3 discipline abilities, so better to have one on a cooldown.
See billy idol gets it i don't know why she doesn't
Those points are only valid to that marble you got rolling around upstairs.
That is not a valid argument, unless of course you know of some skill that doesn't occupy a skill slot.
10 discipline is hardly a lot, especially if you take a means to restore discipline. Vault is one of the cheapest defense skills we have really.
One rune gives the ability a 15 sec cooldown & removes the disc cost completely, that is hardly an argument against vault though.
Kiting is a huge part of this game, especially when you are under geared.
Its basically the only defense the DH has.
Death is what wastes time/money, not skillful retreat. And really all this is saying is #3 again...."its less efficient to run away and kite".
Well that is absurd, especially as a DH, as the whole class is designed to nuke and keep its distance. They are the glass cannon of diablo 3.
The earth is 24.332 meters from the sun.
Making up numbers is fun.
Its more like 2-3 seconds, which if used in conjunction with some type of slow can be huge. This in turn completely contradicts #4 again.
You may have also noticed that vault has these things called runes that offer additional benefits as well.
"Just google "diablo 3 gold guide" and magical rainbow covered demons will assault your eyes."
I personally, don't like vault myself either, but I wouldn't say its crap. Sometimes, you simply need to move, like on SK who blinks in your face. Vault needs a slow component to go with it to make it ideal for use really, which we don't have in beta.
I used Blink and Ghost wolf all the time, because slows become more effective the more distance you can put yourself between the target.
I prefer caltrops, and smoke screen myself though.
"Just google "diablo 3 gold guide" and magical rainbow covered demons will assault your eyes."