Bashiok Says: No Mana/Health Leech

Bashiok was recently interviewed at incgamers where he discussed aspects of Diablo III ranging from its new health orb system to other aspects of gameplay. One of the subjects he touched base upon was the health/mana leech system that most of us have been used to in Diablo II, to which he said:
Well, health and mana leach may not come back. There's balance issues, and they may not make it into Diablo III

What is your take on the subject?


  • #1 Jarhead89
    This will completely change the way certain characters are played, not to mention items used and builds that are used.
  • #2 TeHAJ
    no pots or life leach? ahhhhh i know blizzard makes awesome games but iam kinda starting to worry
  • #3 Sol_Invictus
    There's pots! They just work differently.
  • #4 SNowfreak
    i knew this would happen. Honestly i am far more dissapointed than anything with this news.
  • #5 biff_exploder
    they are changing alot of gameplay aspects, but then again, in D1 there wasnt much leeching either, except for the Undead crown, i dont remember any other items with leeching... still it was alot more effective on d2.

    i liked leeching in d2, but i can live without it i guess, but with potions weakened and more rare, health/mana leeching would be a good thing in D3.
  • #6 Romak
    I knew it!! I even thought to make a thread about it a few days ago. I'm not surprised; there will be no mana/health leech because it ruins the whole health/mana concept for Diablo 3. In Diablo 2, mana/health leech were some of the main health/mana sources except potions. It's because of mana leech people didn't put even 1 point in energy (except the sorc). So yeah... no mana/health leech unless the effect is REALLY small.
  • #7 Mr_Icicle
    I'm actually glad this is gone. Leech was pretty dumb the way it was implemented in Diablo II. For most classes, you needed it, but you only needed so much. It was pretty much pointless to get more than just a few % of mana and/or life leech.

    In almost every RPG or game with a stat system, you have stats or attributes that you need, but you don't stop once you get to a certain point, you get as much of the desired stats as you can. You may min/max a bit, but you that doesn't mean you stop at some ridiculously low number. Yeah, it wasn't hard to get mana and life leech, but it was the fact that it was something you needed, but getting more was pointless. It scaled pretty badly.

    If mana/life leech returns, it needs to scale much better.
  • #8 Septar
    Quote from "SNowfreak" »
    i knew this would happen. Honestly i am far more dissapointed than anything with this news.

  • #9 permaximum

    This is my thought about the topic in another thread.
  • #10 Dimebog
    Quote from "permaximum" »

    This is my thought about the topic in another thread.

    Didn't you already agree with me that most of the stuff you said in that post are pure BS.... :D
  • #11 permaximum
    Quote from "Dimebog" »
    Didn't you already agree with me that most of the stuff you said in that post are pure BS.... :D

    Didn't disagree with you about gameplay stuff but not agreed either.Just waiting for another gameplay video :P
  • #12 silver_wings
    I think the key word is may.

    Jay Wilson said in another interview the barbarian skill bloodthirst gives some kind of recovery everytime you kill a monster, but they weren't sure if they would keep it for balance issues.

    Stay awhile and wait patiently for BlizzCon :P
  • #13 Bisso
    Yeah, for the first time I am wondering what is Blizzard thinking. I know its possible, even in D2 to live without any leech. But I tihnk it was a great aspect. Choosing to wear leeching item instead of boosting your stam and energy. Put your offensive skills on top to keep you alive. It was great.

    But since they said it was about balance issues. I don't really care, I prefer seeing thing not coming back then coming back with the wrong approach.
  • #14 Tumnayar
    This was one of the most FUN aspects of Diablo 2, so that's just shit to remove it for Diablo 3.
  • #15 Mr.Yoshida
    Quote from "Tumnayar" »
    This was one of the most FUN aspects of Diablo 2, so that's just shit to remove it for Diablo 3.

    Fun for Diablo2 /= fun for Diablo3. Just because you liked something in Diablo2 does not mean it would work well in Diablo3, people seem to forget that this is not Diablo2 or Diablo2.5 but a completely redesigned Diablo game.
  • #16 Snowee
    Good. If they put in leech everyone will just swarm to get it since there are no pots.
  • #17 Veltras
    I think it's possible that mana/health leech comes back but maybe through a skill and it will also be severly nerfed (so you won't get all your life back in one hit).
  • #18 Dimebog
    Quote from "Veltras" »
    I think it's possible that mana/health leech comes back but maybe through a skill and it will also be severly nerfed (so you won't get all your life back in one hit).

    And they already talked about one such spell. It's not DEFINITE that there will be no leech. Blizzard has become the gods of balance - if they find a way to implement leeching and keep the balance, I am only 100% sure it will be in there in one way or another.
  • #19 DarkMagicc
    Before I comment, I would just like to say I don't post that much...I ONLY post when there is something that interests me, or just really pisses me off...This one pissess me off !

    I read this and said to myself, are you f***ing serious. I have played every Diablo game and pretty much most of Blizzards game..I have played D1 a few years, and D2 as long as I can remember, about 7 years on & off..I am not a hardcore fan that goes to blizzcon and stuff like that..but the kind that plays the games for hours.

    I think its really pathetic how every change they announce people complain about what they do, i guess it might be a minority (or just the people that hate it, post comments. The ones that like it keep shut. thats not a problem though.)

    Back to the subject...One thing people have a problem understanding is that Diablo 3 is a different game, repeat a different game! for those who are slow. People see that they remove potions and think about how Diablo 2 would be without potions, and say HOW CAN WE PLAY THEN? its sooo....hmmmm, different, original, this is not mmorpg, rpg!!!!! call it whatever you want.

    To explain about Diablo 2..I've played it for many years, I've never really cared that much for the fact it was a broken game. when I heard the announcement I re-installed the game and played it...but it felt really boring for some reason, I thought after so many times...what makes now different. I realized it was all those forums about how Diablo 2 was a broken game!!, how people want it to be balanced after all those I sat down and really examined Diablo 2...The Item system on multiplayer F**KED (bots, I know...but not completely true, bots raised the standards but have you ever really tried running hell without those godly items.,you cant..) The currency F**ked, skill builds are unbalanced and many useless skills...

    no strategy just breaking your mouse (hyperbole). Has anyone ever thought that the system they began with was sooo....exagerated, that they needed to exagerate more to "balance it out"...nothing was balanced...the monsters did massive can we prevent the player from dieing?? , give him an exagerated skill/ ability to balance it out (it didn't). I may be pushing it, but its like a lie once, you need to lie again and again etc.... If you look at Diablo 3 its more subtle...more subtle damage, stronger attacks, but they balanced this with numbers of monsters, more strategy (i sound like I am reading the back of the box...but its true, the whole strategy thing prob wont work like they thought but I like the archer, and skele shield thing...brilliant.)

    When you look at Diablo 3 do us all a favor, STOP COMPARING EVERY FRICKEN FEATURE TO DIABLO 2...change, another thread said,.....colorr, gooooooodddd....people are so fricken afraid of change in Diablo, DIABLO IS WHAT THEY MAKE IT!!!!!...if they release another diablo with different style, people will compare it to Diablo 3...

    As for the PVP thing...ok yes, it is fun to have excitement of it...but seriously slow down and think for a second...when a level 81 comes to attack a 25 or 40, that is not thrill that is f***ing stupidity..wheres the excitement in being attacked by a character that can kill you with one shot, and you have no chance against...Truth is, this almost never happened to me but It has...I'm all for the idea of being able to flag yourself PVP'auto enable at a whim...for the arena, for in field...etc but no random PK for any unlucky guy.../girl...

    Teleport is also an with massive cooldown and cant go through walls then sure!!! but only if each class can have a mobility spell...with cool downs and make sure they cant be abused

    My own personal Idea (not very original, just i'd like to see in d3) start with like 5 spells, you dont add to it (or maybe yes) ... but have them usefull and, cool...most starting skills are weak and useless...use this in your strategy Blizzard..

    I'm also portal as a skill..but can only use it when you get a scroll..when you cast the portal you open the scroll and start whispering the spell...after few seconds it opens...if you are hit it cancels....this ends the abuse..

    The truth is the game is amazing, color is fine, I admit some models could have better detail..I have no dought in my mind this game will be successfull...AND ABSOLUTELY NO DOUGHT THAT YOU WILL BUY IT!!, NO DOUGHT THAT ANYONE THAT GOES TO THIS SITE WILL NOT BUY IT....

    I was ganna quote people and comment on that but I have already covered many topics...

    PS: If you read the whole thing give yourself a *pat on the back*..people these days don't have the attention span to read 3 sentences without day dreaming....

  • #20 Shadout
    Leeching was way too strong in Diablo 2. Im not surprised they want to do something about it.
    At the same time howver, leeching had one great thing about it: Action-based healing. To leech health/mana, you had to attack.
    That seems to be pretty much what they aim to achieve with the health orb system too. You cant just run away and regen. For that reason alone, leeching is much less important in Diablo 3. And orb dropping will be easier to balance.

    Imo the best way to go would be having limited leeching. For example, using arbitrary numbers, you could have max 2% leeching, spread between health and mana regen. Getting those 2% should be harder than it was in Diablo 2. By setting the limit for the two leech effects combined rather than individual, you add some choice to it. Some would prefer 2% health leech, others a more balanced 1% health, 1% mana, etc.
    Leeching has to provde a quite small benefit to work in D3 though, as Romak said, having points in energy was pretty pointless due to mana leeching, it can only be a good thing to fix it.
    Leeching, if in the game, should be small enough to be balanced (which it wasnt in D2), but also high enough to add some incentive to dmging enemies (beside getting health orbs from the mobs).
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