Nowhere did I say to switch runes. Are you going to be using hungering arrow on a boss? Grab a single target skill for a boss and if there are less than 3 mobs left alive, use a smaller aoe or the single target. That's what I was getting at. I don't plan on swapping runes all that often.
Aha, sorry for misinterpreting.
Anyway, shooting hungering arrow with shatter on 4 mobs is no guarantee that the shots will hit. Mobs might:
- flee
- burry
- fly
- go invis
- die from merc
- die from teamate
- die from companion
- die from trap
- die from dot
Of course all of this can happen with other runes as well, but as they only require 1 target (instead of 4) to maximize their efficiency they will be less likely to be affected.
This is no biggy. The rune will probably still be good. I'm just saying: It's not as good as it's on paper.
That's why I say you should have a skill for every situation :P. My build probably won't even include HA, so :3.
When making assumptions about Scatter, please consider that there are not always 4 mobs (1 mob and 3 nearby mobs to receive the split arrows). In many cases you might find your arrow split into 3 arrows with nothing to hit.
The chances of the other runes piercing and hitting an additional target is higher because:
1. they just need 1 additional target
2. they can hit the same target they pierced (which scatter PROBABLY can't. Would be really OP if it could)
Scatter will therefore blow more damage into thin air, instead of mobs, more on average than the other runes.
Sure - but you don't have to use said rune in any situation where there is less than three mobs.
Switching runes will cause delay and the loss of valor buff.
My original point was anyway, that in all those calculations on the rune you assume that the arrows will hit, which they won't a lot of the time.
I'm pretty sure that the shattered arrows btw won't be able to hit the same target they originated from. Why would anyone prefer any of the other runes?
Devouring arrow: 70% bonus dmg if the arrow pierces.
Shatter shot: 230% bonus dmg if the arrow pierces.
hmm..
Nowhere did I say to switch runes. Are you going to be using hungering arrow on a boss? Grab a single target skill for a boss and if there are less than 3 mobs left alive, use a smaller aoe or the single target. That's what I was getting at. I don't plan on swapping runes all that often.
When making assumptions about Scatter, please consider that there are not always 4 mobs (1 mob and 3 nearby mobs to receive the split arrows). In many cases you might find your arrow split into 3 arrows with nothing to hit.
The chances of the other runes piercing and hitting an additional target is higher because:
1. they just need 1 additional target
2. they can hit the same target they pierced (which scatter PROBABLY can't. Would be really OP if it could)
Scatter will therefore blow more damage into thin air, instead of mobs, more on average than the other runes.
Sure - but you don't have to use said rune in any situation where there is less than three mobs.
It's 176% damage because they are factoring in the chance for multiple hits/piercings. It's the average damage.
Also, it seems to be the consensus for now that the arrows most likely don't pierce after they split into 3 with Shatter Shot. The reasoning has been explained on the first page.
But yeah...I don't think they're allowed to pierce...but it could be an oversight. You never know =/
Unless I'm mistaken...Wouldn't you have a 72.5% chance of one of the three arrows piercing on scatter?
(1.0-0.35)*(1.0-0.35)*(1.0-0.35)
I'm not saying one roll with a 72.5/100 chance...Just statistically, that you have a 72.5% chance for one of those three to pierce?
Its much easier to just look at the dmg of each individual arrow in that situation.
Each arrow is merely the unruned version of the hungering arrow at 176% wpn dmg.
There is a 35% chance to spam the 3 arrows, so 115+0.35*3*176
Why are they at 176% wpn dmg? They don't add any damage - they're at 115%..
And logically, those arrows have a 35% chance to split - but the first pierce is the one that creates said arrows. I'm not so sure that equation factors in everything...
You only have a 35% chance to crit at least once with your first arrow....
Knowing that you have to calculate that every shot is guaranteed 115% wpn dmg. Due to chance it's an extremely bursty skill - it's not really an easily calculated skill without a calculator / parser.
Let me add that the damage range is EXTREMELY LARGE.
IT DOESNT MEAN YOU WILL do 353% EVERY SHOT.
That means IT WILL AVERAGE out to that IF the scatter shots can pierce.
If not - you can disregard this post.
IE:
Let's assume we fire the shot 100 times.
11500% Weapon Damage just from the shot
4025% Weapon Damage from the first shot piercing once
1380% Weapon Damage from the first shot piercing twice
460% Weapon Damage from the first shot piercing three times (not going any further due to such a low chance)
17426.9% Weapon Damage over the course of 100 shots.
Adding in the scatter rune:
12075% Weapon Damage (11500*0.35)*(3)
1380% Weapon Damage if first arrow pierces once
460% Weapon Damage if first arrow pierces twice
115% Weapon Damage if first arrow pierces thrice
1380% Weapon Damage if second arrow pierces once
460% Weapon Damage if second arrow pierces twice
115% Weapon Damage if second arrow pierces thrice
1380% Weapon Damage if third arrow pierces once
460% Weapon Damage if third arrow pierces twice
115% Weapon Damage if third arrow pierces thrice
Using a sample of 100 shots with the math provided:
We get 100 shots.
100/100 Normal Damage
11500% Weapon Damage
35/100 Pierce Once
4025% Weapon Damage
12/100 Pierce Twice
1380% Weapon Damage
4/100 Pierce Thrice
460% Weapon Damage
35/100 Scatter Shot
12075% Weapon Damage
12/35 First Arrow Pierces Once
1380% Weapon Damage
4/35 First Arrow Pierces Twice
460% Weapon Damage
1.5/35 First Arrow Pierces Thrice
115% Weapon Damage
12/35 Second Arrow Pierces Once
1380% Weapon Damage
4/35 Second Arrow Pierces Twice
460% Weapon Damage
1.5/35 Second Arrow Pierces Thrice
115% Weapon Damage
12/35 Third Arrow Pierces once
1380% Weapon Damage
4/35 Third Arrow Pierces Twice
460% Weapon Damage
1.5/35 Third Arrow Pierces Thrice
115% Weapon Damage
That's why I say you should have a skill for every situation :P. My build probably won't even include HA, so :3.
Nowhere did I say to switch runes. Are you going to be using hungering arrow on a boss? Grab a single target skill for a boss and if there are less than 3 mobs left alive, use a smaller aoe or the single target. That's what I was getting at. I don't plan on swapping runes all that often.
Sure - but you don't have to use said rune in any situation where there is less than three mobs.
But yeah...I don't think they're allowed to pierce...but it could be an oversight. You never know =/
Why are they at 176% wpn dmg? They don't add any damage - they're at 115%..
And logically, those arrows have a 35% chance to split - but the first pierce is the one that creates said arrows. I'm not so sure that equation factors in everything...
You only have a 35% chance to crit at least once with your first arrow....
Knowing that you have to calculate that every shot is guaranteed 115% wpn dmg. Due to chance it's an extremely bursty skill - it's not really an easily calculated skill without a calculator / parser.
Let me add that the damage range is EXTREMELY LARGE.
IT DOESNT MEAN YOU WILL do 353% EVERY SHOT.
That means IT WILL AVERAGE out to that IF the scatter shots can pierce.
If not - you can disregard this post.
IE:
Let's assume we fire the shot 100 times.
11500% Weapon Damage just from the shot
4025% Weapon Damage from the first shot piercing once
1380% Weapon Damage from the first shot piercing twice
460% Weapon Damage from the first shot piercing three times (not going any further due to such a low chance)
17426.9% Weapon Damage over the course of 100 shots.
Adding in the scatter rune:
12075% Weapon Damage (11500*0.35)*(3)
1380% Weapon Damage if first arrow pierces once
460% Weapon Damage if first arrow pierces twice
115% Weapon Damage if first arrow pierces thrice
1380% Weapon Damage if second arrow pierces once
460% Weapon Damage if second arrow pierces twice
115% Weapon Damage if second arrow pierces thrice
1380% Weapon Damage if third arrow pierces once
460% Weapon Damage if third arrow pierces twice
115% Weapon Damage if third arrow pierces thrice
Using a sample of 100 shots with the math provided:
We get 100 shots.
100/100 Normal Damage
11500% Weapon Damage
35/100 Pierce Once
4025% Weapon Damage
12/100 Pierce Twice
1380% Weapon Damage
4/100 Pierce Thrice
460% Weapon Damage
35/100 Scatter Shot
12075% Weapon Damage
12/35 First Arrow Pierces Once
1380% Weapon Damage
4/35 First Arrow Pierces Twice
460% Weapon Damage
1.5/35 First Arrow Pierces Thrice
115% Weapon Damage
12/35 Second Arrow Pierces Once
1380% Weapon Damage
4/35 Second Arrow Pierces Twice
460% Weapon Damage
1.5/35 Second Arrow Pierces Thrice
115% Weapon Damage
12/35 Third Arrow Pierces once
1380% Weapon Damage
4/35 Third Arrow Pierces Twice
460% Weapon Damage
1.5/35 Third Arrow Pierces Thrice
115% Weapon Damage
Knowing that:
2 Arrows Piercing Once: 11.76% Chance
3 Arrows Piercing Once: 4% Chance
2 Arrows Piercing Twice: 1.3% Chance
I don't really need to go any further..
Let's adds everything together...
35305% Weapon Damage every 100 shots (this is an average)
353% Weapon Damage every shot
Correct me if that's wrong.
Edit: I'm not claiming to be a genius or mathematician...I'm just dropping in to give what I observed...
(1.0-0.35)*(1.0-0.35)*(1.0-0.35)
I'm not saying one roll with a 72.5/100 chance...Just statistically, that you have a 72.5% chance for one of those three to pierce?