Quick question, does anyone know if the stacking buff from the Gorget of Swiftness gem works with sentries? Do they snapshot it, use it dynamically, or just ignore it completely? The reason I ask is that the max level breakpoint is a huge upgrade over the previous, but requires build breaking amounts of IAS to get there, but if the sentries use this gem(especially if they snapshot the buff) I could see it being a very viable greater rift build.
I don't think you will have major issues with sentry dmg output. If it is snapshotted, you can buff to max stacks and drop sentry, then use intermittent fire to keep stack up for next sentry drop (vault - action shot could be useful for this. I cannot confirm that this skill procs gorgok, it's just a thought). If sentry atk spd is affected dynamically, then the same actions will net the same results. Ultimately, you would not want to have to restack buff prior to every sentry drop anyhow, so keeping stacks at max between casts would be essential for this item to be effective.
As for the question itself, I am not sure... In the past, sentries seemed to calculate atk spd dynamically (atk spd would not kick in until 2nd rotation, this would seem like odd behaviour if fixed values were being used). From what I understand, sentries are now "fixed" in that they use the correct atk spd from the first shot (this would seem like either, more efficient coding to handle dynamically updated values, or may result from using fixed values,which are taken from a "snapshot"). So basically, it seemed to be dynamic, but now it could be either. You could test this by wearing a T&T, casting sentry, and then unequipping T&T (monitoring atk spd changes throughout). If the ROF remains constant, the sentry is likely using a snapshot.
@ erav2000
Only viable T6/GRift build? how about no. Ever played a WD?
Perhaps you mean, "giving the Demon Hunter only 1 viable T6/GRift build". This would be more correct, but not necessarily the case under all circumstances (I highly doubt you have tested every single skill combination with every single gear combination, where gear rolls are of optimal quality). Theorycrafting does not count, as this can only tell us how effective a build should be, and not necessarily, how effective it truly is. Also, just because 1 player may find a build clunky, will not discount it for all other players, and so no 1 person can deem every build either viable or not viable. As an example, many players discount strafe as an end-game skill, however I have personally witnessed a strafe/vault + danetta's build clear T6 rifts without taking damage (high mobility). I am not about to suggest that this build is on par with mara 6's raw power, though it does serve to suggest that other viable T6 builds exist, with the drawback that their clear times will be slower than mara 6.
In what way does a DH not benefit from LoH? (sentries attacking for you does not mean you cannot drop skills yourself).
You don't benefit from gems? odd, I seem to be getting plenty of build synergy, bane of the powerful + bane of the trapped (+cull of the weak) + efficacious toxin (10% debuff for a total of 30-70% dmg boost - depending on offhand, and assuming helltrapper/rucksack + custom engineering). Or if you prefer a strafe + vault build... wreath of lightning works great due to high number of hits (having huge mobility allows this to be used to maximum effect).
End result is that 2.1 most definitely buffs DH. It is too early in PTR to say who will come out "weakest" or "strongest" as changes are on-going.
You are reading selectively, which tends to happen on forums, so fair enough. Still, just to point it out...
The wording you used in your earlier post did in fact state that Demon Hunter mara 6 was the only viable T6/High GRift build, as quoted here. "giving the Demon Hunter class the only viable T6/high Grift build".
Nobody except you has mentioned entangling shot at any point.
At no point did I state that wreath of lightning should be proced by sentry, as sentry has a 0% proc co-effecient, what I had suggested was to use strafe to proc this quickly while maintaining mobility. Vault was another option, which as I have said, I have not tested.
Note: Ideally these might even just compliment a mara 6, but the main point was that it can allow for more build diversity. Strafe is known to be effective for kiting while dishing constant dmg, with a low dmg output. Wreath would significantly improve the dmg output, possibly to an extent which deems it viable. At the same time, wreath also synergizes with strafe due to providing back the lost move speed, and should be reliably procced due to high number of hits per second.
You questioned the point of my statements in my earlier post, here is my response. While mara 6 may be the only option at 2.0.6 for fast clears, 2.1 changes, particularly cold runes and leg gems will create more competitive builds, which is always a good thing, because frankly 2.0.6 non-mara 6 is not fantastic, but can still do the job at a much slower pace.
Also a note on LoH again, where you desperately need hp, you could simply smoke screen and gain hp from pet passive (mara 4 bonus, always assuming a pet is equipped). Worth noting is that the switch to cold as preferred element has provided a measure of healing through cold CA rockets, and sufficient RCR stat can use this to great effect. Simply smoke, kite, CA, rinse and repeat (up sentries as they CD). I would advise you to kite to safer ground, rather than into the next mob pack.
I will admit that current strafe builds (2.0.6) will not perform well in GRift due to time constraints, hence why I have suggested to explore dps options (particularly wreath).
@ mikello
Devs have considered the effects of altered LoH mechanic, the LoH values have been increased to partially counteract this. They will probably tweak this again after some PTR testing, The LoH change is possibly also being used to promote primary skills which tend to provide better healing (more attacks/skills per second should generate more LoH). If this is true, it seems like a good way to promote primaries, although the dps loss for most classes will probably result in continued under-use. Keep in mind this is just my own theory, so it's not necessarily correct.
As with the 2H buff, LoH was probably just buffed to a safe level, if it is clear that overall healing has been nerfed, the LoH value will probably change again (also keep in mind that hp regen got buffed too). Initially devs had stated that healing in GRifts had become an issue, and so it is clearly in the spotlight, I would expect it will be in a reasonable state by the time 2.1 goes live.
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I don't think you will have major issues with sentry dmg output. If it is snapshotted, you can buff to max stacks and drop sentry, then use intermittent fire to keep stack up for next sentry drop (vault - action shot could be useful for this. I cannot confirm that this skill procs gorgok, it's just a thought). If sentry atk spd is affected dynamically, then the same actions will net the same results. Ultimately, you would not want to have to restack buff prior to every sentry drop anyhow, so keeping stacks at max between casts would be essential for this item to be effective.
As for the question itself, I am not sure... In the past, sentries seemed to calculate atk spd dynamically (atk spd would not kick in until 2nd rotation, this would seem like odd behaviour if fixed values were being used). From what I understand, sentries are now "fixed" in that they use the correct atk spd from the first shot (this would seem like either, more efficient coding to handle dynamically updated values, or may result from using fixed values,which are taken from a "snapshot"). So basically, it seemed to be dynamic, but now it could be either. You could test this by wearing a T&T, casting sentry, and then unequipping T&T (monitoring atk spd changes throughout). If the ROF remains constant, the sentry is likely using a snapshot.
@ erav2000
Only viable T6/GRift build? how about no. Ever played a WD?
Perhaps you mean, "giving the Demon Hunter only 1 viable T6/GRift build". This would be more correct, but not necessarily the case under all circumstances (I highly doubt you have tested every single skill combination with every single gear combination, where gear rolls are of optimal quality). Theorycrafting does not count, as this can only tell us how effective a build should be, and not necessarily, how effective it truly is. Also, just because 1 player may find a build clunky, will not discount it for all other players, and so no 1 person can deem every build either viable or not viable. As an example, many players discount strafe as an end-game skill, however I have personally witnessed a strafe/vault + danetta's build clear T6 rifts without taking damage (high mobility). I am not about to suggest that this build is on par with mara 6's raw power, though it does serve to suggest that other viable T6 builds exist, with the drawback that their clear times will be slower than mara 6.
In what way does a DH not benefit from LoH? (sentries attacking for you does not mean you cannot drop skills yourself).
You don't benefit from gems? odd, I seem to be getting plenty of build synergy, bane of the powerful + bane of the trapped (+cull of the weak) + efficacious toxin (10% debuff for a total of 30-70% dmg boost - depending on offhand, and assuming helltrapper/rucksack + custom engineering). Or if you prefer a strafe + vault build... wreath of lightning works great due to high number of hits (having huge mobility allows this to be used to maximum effect).
End result is that 2.1 most definitely buffs DH. It is too early in PTR to say who will come out "weakest" or "strongest" as changes are on-going.
You are reading selectively, which tends to happen on forums, so fair enough. Still, just to point it out...
The wording you used in your earlier post did in fact state that Demon Hunter mara 6 was the only viable T6/High GRift build, as quoted here. "giving the Demon Hunter class the only viable T6/high Grift build".
Nobody except you has mentioned entangling shot at any point.
At no point did I state that wreath of lightning should be proced by sentry, as sentry has a 0% proc co-effecient, what I had suggested was to use strafe to proc this quickly while maintaining mobility. Vault was another option, which as I have said, I have not tested.
Note: Ideally these might even just compliment a mara 6, but the main point was that it can allow for more build diversity. Strafe is known to be effective for kiting while dishing constant dmg, with a low dmg output. Wreath would significantly improve the dmg output, possibly to an extent which deems it viable. At the same time, wreath also synergizes with strafe due to providing back the lost move speed, and should be reliably procced due to high number of hits per second.
You questioned the point of my statements in my earlier post, here is my response. While mara 6 may be the only option at 2.0.6 for fast clears, 2.1 changes, particularly cold runes and leg gems will create more competitive builds, which is always a good thing, because frankly 2.0.6 non-mara 6 is not fantastic, but can still do the job at a much slower pace.
Also a note on LoH again, where you desperately need hp, you could simply smoke screen and gain hp from pet passive (mara 4 bonus, always assuming a pet is equipped). Worth noting is that the switch to cold as preferred element has provided a measure of healing through cold CA rockets, and sufficient RCR stat can use this to great effect. Simply smoke, kite, CA, rinse and repeat (up sentries as they CD). I would advise you to kite to safer ground, rather than into the next mob pack.
I will admit that current strafe builds (2.0.6) will not perform well in GRift due to time constraints, hence why I have suggested to explore dps options (particularly wreath).
@ mikello
Devs have considered the effects of altered LoH mechanic, the LoH values have been increased to partially counteract this. They will probably tweak this again after some PTR testing, The LoH change is possibly also being used to promote primary skills which tend to provide better healing (more attacks/skills per second should generate more LoH). If this is true, it seems like a good way to promote primaries, although the dps loss for most classes will probably result in continued under-use. Keep in mind this is just my own theory, so it's not necessarily correct.
As with the 2H buff, LoH was probably just buffed to a safe level, if it is clear that overall healing has been nerfed, the LoH value will probably change again (also keep in mind that hp regen got buffed too). Initially devs had stated that healing in GRifts had become an issue, and so it is clearly in the spotlight, I would expect it will be in a reasonable state by the time 2.1 goes live.