DiabloFans

Looking at the poll results, I'm glad people understand the need for the nerf on the ring. I think it might have been slightly too much, but I think that nerfing it at least 95% was completely justified. It was doing waaaay too much damage, and while Blizzard wants the Infernal Machine to be part of the endgame for everybody, I don't think they want the ring to be absolutely necessary for everybody to use during endgame.

Is there any change in the drop or items in Normal, NM and Hell using MP?

I know that with MP1+ in Inferno all items will have ilvl63 affixes, but is there any change like this for items from Normal, NM and Hell??

Thanks

HP increase from base is deceiving. Show the HP increase from MP1 would give a much better picture on how the bosses scale, since anyone who is good enough to ever touch mosnter power in inferno doesn't care about how strong stuff are relative to act 1/2 MP0 monster strengths.

I think the "jump" to 63 is inferno-only, everywhere else is just the "normal" scaling like what you see in Act 3 inferno, so even if you beat hell at MP10 it still doesn't mean you're strong enough for act 1 inferno MP1 or even MP0.

wow the info video was so good. No annoying music, good quality thorough explaination.
+1

Poll is vague. *A* nerf was justified, yes. But not to the massive degree Blizzard took it. They swing the hammer way too far sometimes.

Quote from UberMey

Is there any change in the drop or items in Normal, NM and Hell using MP?

I know that with MP1+ in Inferno all items will have ilvl63 affixes, but is there any change like this for items from Normal, NM and Hell??

Thanks

I can't say I noticed any real difference between what drops in lower difficulties when Monster Power is active. It didn't look all that different. The only noticable thing that did happen was Diablo in MP10 Hell mode dropped a iLvL 62 1h Crossbow for me and I could have sworn that Hell only dropped iLvL 61 at most. I could just be remembering incorrectly on that one.

Quote from GalZohar

HP increase from base is deceiving. Show the HP increase from MP1 would give a much better picture on how the bosses scale, since anyone who is good enough to ever touch mosnter power in inferno doesn't care about how strong stuff are relative to act 1/2 MP0 monster strengths.

I think the "jump" to 63 is inferno-only, everywhere else is just the "normal" scaling like what you see in Act 3 inferno, so even if you beat hell at MP10 it still doesn't mean you're strong enough for act 1 inferno MP1 or even MP0.

I have complied to your request, sir. The main thread has been updated with a line and bar graph for comparison. Here's the breakdown:

Quote from t0luene

wow the info video was so good. No annoying music, good quality thorough explaination.
+1

Thank you.

The Poll is stupid :-)

Was the Nerf to the Hellfire Ring Justified?

YES !!!

By 99.5% ?

HELL NO !!!

Quote from KageKaze

Is there any change in the drop or items in Normal, NM and Hell using MP?

I know that with MP1+ in Inferno all items will have ilvl63 affixes, but is there any change like this for items from Normal, NM and Hell??

Thanks

Well, then its only about exp and a little piece of mf then, well not bad anyways ... was expecting to farm good gear in HC on lower difficulties ... atm Im playing with some gears from lvl 30 and Im lvl50 still didnt find better kinda sux to farm ...

The other video demonstrates his almost 7 minute fight with the Skeleton King.

All this video does is show it to be a complete waste of time for MP10 in normal. He took 7 minutes for 1 yellow and a blue? You can do that in any mode.

Wow, this is shocking.

How are people agreeing with a nerf more than not???

I think Blizzard finally succeeded in brainwashing people.

Quote from lorien1973

The other video demonstrates his almost 7 minute fight with the Skeleton King.

All this video does is show it to be a complete waste of time for MP10 in normal. He took 7 minutes for 1 yellow and a blue? You can do that in any mode.

The point of playing in MP10 normal (or any other lower difficulty) is not for efficency, it's for challenge. You will get more efficient leveling using a fairly low MP as you can still kill quickly and get 20% XP gain per MP level. I imagine MP 2 or 3 might be the most efficent for someone just running through with no twink gear. This could be increased if you have some gear on reserve for that character.

As for item finding, unless you're in act 3/4 in Hell or in Inferno, I don't see many people careing or using MP for item hunting. Not unless you want to take a lvl 60 into MP10 and farm for low level legendaries for an alt or something.

Quote from Grimraven

Wow, this is shocking.

How are people agreeing with a nerf more than not???

I think Blizzard finally succeeded in brainwashing people.

EDIT: Clearing up for clairty and after re-reading the original.

I think it's about being reasonable. You can't just buff everything, if you do, there'd be nothing left and everything would be trivial. I think people are finally starting to realize you sometimes have to bring things down in order to maintain balance. Otherwise they'd then have to buff the monsters all over again and we'd start seeing ridiculous numbers and values all becuase no one wanted to see the word "nerf".

Quote from Cor7ez88

MP10 in normal is to level faster, imo very usefull if you want to start a new char.

Not entirely true. MP10 appears to be for challenge more than anything else. There's even a thread here in Diablofans that shows it's not efficient even though you have higher levels for the content that you're at. If you were to twink out a character, then maybe it could be efficient.

Quote from KageKaze

Not entirely true. MP10 appears to be for challenge more than anything else. There's even a thread here in Diablofans that shows it's not efficient even though you have higher levels for the content that you're at. If you were to twink out a character, then maybe it could be efficient.

It's definitely efficient to level a character with MP10 when you have a 60 running you. Your levels fly up faster than you can progress through content. I like this because as a HC inferno player, it's nice to have a decently quick way back to 60.

maaaan...are you serious with this?
MP10 in normal is to level faster, imo very usefull if you want to start a new char.

The extra time spent killing the skeleton king would let you move all the way thru the fields of misery. Now, tell me again, what is more efficient? Sure you'll out level content and make the experience easier, but you'll also level to 60 slower.

Not entirely true. MP10 appears to be for challenge more than anything else. There's even a thread here in Diablofans that shows it's not efficient even though you have higher levels for the content that you're at. If you were to twink out a character, then maybe it could be efficient.

What might be interesting is this. Extrapolate what your level would be at MP 10 at the end of normal/nightmare/hell. At what point do you reach level 60 - thus giving you access to the best gear. Let's say you hit 60 end of nightmare. And if you can MP10, say all of hell at level 60 - is that net experience better than doing inferno runs?

I'm going to put my vote in the same as the others who pointed out the flaw in the poll, the game didn't need a ring that procs for 3M or 5M or whatever, but neither does it need a multi hour grind for a rare ring you can pick the primary stat on (Nice, but less important than the other stats you'd go after for a good ring at mid-upper gear levels) that happens to have experience (nice for the people who would equip a leorics signet, I suppose) and a fireball that doesn't really do comparable damage to anything the characters put out except for fresh level 60s.

Really all it looks like is an upgraded leoric's signet, not an item used for smashing faces unless you get that 1/1000 roll.

I know charms in D2 had it easier, but I never saw someone say "That's a crappy charm that isn't worth the space it would take to benefit from it." Even the low rolled ones were decent and warranted the space for the effect. Anything but the best hellfire rings will not benefit killing power or survivability over a 2/3 trifecta rare. I guess one could argue that the randomness will add longevity to the game for people incapable of becoming bored, but the majority will get a few crappy ones and deem the effort too much for the reward.

I'd say let it scale and let it become pretty powerful, but nowhere near "let the enchantress 5 shot MP 10 Azmodan" powerful.

Edit above: The charm was in reference to the hellfire torch received in a similar manner, the stats of which are listed here: http://classic.battle.net/diablo2exp/items/normal/ucharms.shtml

5% Chance To Cast level 10 Firestorm* On Striking
+3 to Random Character Class Skills (varies)
+10-20 To All Attributes (varies)
All Resistances +10-20 (varies)
+8 To Light Radius
Level 30 Hydra (10 charges)

I'll try to be fair in the comparison.

The proc was a bonus, I can't recall the proc being amazingly powerful, but it was strong. However, due to the nature of the game a good portion of the enemies were immune to it.

The skills were very nice, you had a 1/21 chance to get it for the skill tree you wanted, which added some replayability and desire to farm multiples. However, normally at least two of those 21 rolls would be useful based on your build.

The 10-20 to all attributes was pretty strong. All attributes were beneficial to all characters (perhaps energy less than the others) but at best, you could alter your build around this and get 6-12 levels more worth of vitality for your character or at worst a small damage boost and some more health. All depending on your level of min-maxing.

The 10-20 resists is pretty easy to comprehend, light radius was in fact pretty much useless to most people, and the charge was expensive and some people used it, I didn't.

I guess the point of this post is that even if you got a bad one, you got the same item. I guess you weren't guaranteed that it'd be useful to your build every time, but the chances were much stronger than what our ring is after the nerf. The stats on the charm (even without the skills) were pretty powerful for an item of that slot.

Now, the difference between a good rolled hellfire ring and a badly rolled hellfire ring are huge, like from being a few hundred dps upgrade from a level 13 legendary to being an endgame item like I (and it seems quite a few others) believe it should be.

A reasonably powerful proc can carry the ring a long way, so that it could still be good enough when the rolls don't line up, and giving reason to keep trying for a stronger version with some of the trifecta stats. Again though, it doesn't need to proc for 3M damage for it to be there, but it also can't be 25k.

As long as you aren't killing stuff in 1 shot and/or spending well over 80-90% of your time running around rather than killing stuff, you should lower the MP if you want to be efficient for both MF and exp. Of course the exact % of time running around needed to up the MP even if you aren't 1-shooting stuff can vary based on your existing MF and XP and the exact scaling, but most likely most people will spend too low of a % of their time running around if they aren't 1-shooting everything, as even 1-shooting everything you probably still spend more than 10% of your time actually attacking.

In the end, monster power mostly adds time it takes to kill stuff with a slight challenge of increased damage and increased chance of dying because stuff take longer to kill. In terms of rewards, monster power is a joke, as the only case you'll increase it for efficiency is if the game is already extremely boring and then you'll increase it to a level where the game is still extremely boring.

They really need to lower HP, up the damage and up the MF and XP bonuses if they want MP to be used other than just for messing around.

STOP STOP STOP STOP STOP STOP Calling this a nerf. You are INTENTIONALLY stirring up unrest within the community when the first line of the Blue Post report on THIS SITE says "It was actually a bug fix."

You did this with the flaming shoes legendary (the name escapes me right now) and it's just a gross misuse of Admin/posting privaledges. Do you want this to be a legitimate news site or a controversy creator?

Quote from Eccodomi

STOP STOP STOP STOP STOP STOP Calling this a nerf. You are INTENTIONALLY stirring up unrest within the community when the first line of the Blue Post report on THIS SITE says "It was actually a bug fix."

You did this with the flaming shoes legendary (the name escapes me right now) and it's just a gross misuse of Admin/posting privaledges. Do you want this to be a legitimate news site or a controversy creator?

Blizzard claims a lot of nerfs are bugs but we don't get to confirm that. It's a way to save face.