My name is Zaramos (Barbarian Classleader of <Zero Empathy>) and i want to show you some details on how big the current Paragonsystem influences Leaderboards after reaching Paragon 800 is. I will not only throw numbers on you but also a practical example and how easy it is to scale it up accordingly to the Paragonlvl. Keep in mind that this is not intended to be a whine threat but wants to solve the problem.
Practical Example:
I knew that i wouldnt have enough time to compete on either Season/Era this time so i played the game for fun the past 3 month. With "FUN" i mean doing Solo Grifts for pushing and training and theoriecrafting, and for me it is a lot of fun and the endgame of D3.
I started with Paragon 1114 this Era and ended up being Paragon 1180 without doing a sgl XP run. In total i did around 500-600 pushing Solo Grifts.
I was able to finish T71 in a okayish Rift (Enchantress Map,Thralls/Grotesque,Mothers,Punishers, 12% progress Conduit, 6min30 fight against EMBER).
So I knew on a dream rift with better Conduit + Boss i am able to do T72, and i got a Top 3 Dream Rift (best one i got within all my keys):Unburried/Goats,Big Arreat Crater lvl1,25% Conduit,but Orlash. This was the result:
After that rift i stopped playing for rankings cause i knew it is possible for me within another 1000 keys or lvling my gems to lvl 90 to ease it a bit. At that point some people on NS started reaching Paragon 2600 even in our Clan so i did the math, which is kinda simple:
I have exacly 12000 Main Stat at Paragon 1180. A Paragon 2620 guy has 19200 Main Stat if he has the exact same gear.
19200/12000=1.6 => 60% flat dmg increase, also 7200 Armor more which decreases the DMG taken by around 23%.
Mob Healt increases by 1.17 per Tier and Dmg done by 1.07 => 1.17^3 = 1.60 (Mobs have 60% more HP); 1.07^3 = 1.225 (Deal 22.5% more DMG).
Its easy to see that a Paragon 2600+ guy can do 3 Tiers higher with the same gear on the same map with the same mobs
For a Paragon 800 Char it is 4 Tiers difference. 19200/10000 = 1.92 => 92% Dmg increase. 1.17^4 = 1.87.
This is just to show the numbers and i dont want to blame people who put a hell lot of time in this game to get those high Paragons if they did it without botting. I would like you to also take a look on how much more someone has to play to get to 2.6k and if the advantage is fair:
Paragon 800: 3.196.623.480.000 (3.2T XP needed)
Paragon 1180: 20.830.856.760.000 (20.8T XP needed)
Paragon 2600: 250.511.368.710.000 (250.5T XP needed)
A Paragon 2600 guy has played 80 times more than a p800 char and 12.5 times more than i did.
In my opinion it is somehow fair that people that spend way more time into the game should be rewarded maybe even like it is right now, but it drains the fun from 99.9999% of the other D3 players, may it be competitive players or casual players.
I knew i wouldnt be able to get Rank 1 this Era so i played in my own "League" and compered my achievments with Paragon 1100-1400 chars.
You can do it as well but it does not get reflected on the leaderboard so my "Paragon League" idea was born:
The Paragon Leagues: (TL;DR)
Keep in mind that this is just an example and i really want your opinion and maybe tweaks to this idea.
A new League:
What about a 4th anchor on the leaderboard which sorts the board depending on the Paragonlvl the Ranking was done?
For example: 0-300,301-600, 601-900 etc. within those 300 Paragons the difference in DMG/EHP is not more than 1 Tier (with the same Gear)
As i was thinking about this a bit more there were more things that this "Leagues" will do for the game and for the players.
Bringing back the FUN!
Currently everyone is grinding gear and paragon for month till the 2 weeks warning and then they start with the "Fun". (95% grinding 5% fun). The "League-System" would enhance the funfactor by a lot for most players as they can compete even mid season/era on their respective boards. The most competitive players will skip all of that early grifitng till they are 2k+ but they dont influence you anymore if you dont have the time or passion.
New Builds for low Paragonlvl!
Below Paragon 800 there might be different builds as you dont have all Stats from the Paragonsystem and you might not have the perfect Set yet . Your gear is not yet full ancients, you dont have the mats or the right items to cube etc.
Bots?
If you think deeper into this you might see that it somehow fixes the influence of botts at least for not top end players as it makes not much sense to bot within a 300 paragons reach as you will have limited time to compete in that league anyways so better play wisely and efficient
Groupplay?
For groupplay the average lvl of the group can be used.
What happens to my Rankings if i reach higher Paragon?
They will stay as long as you are within top 1000 at the end of Season/Era. So there will be players trying to compete on all leagues!
Futher additions from the Playerbase:
A suggestion over from reddit by akagamisteve: The League can also be determined by the Paragon Points you have spend doing the run.
Good thing about it: You can participate in every League you want by spending less points.
Downside for the more casual playerbase: Gear will matter a lot more so does botting/playtime
So now i want to hear your opinion! Feel free to comment, criticism appreciated!
So it really matters at which ApS you Snapshot your Ancients.
Tasker and Theos will just multiply the normal or Snapshotet ApS: *1.4-*1.5 (Only if you wear T n T after Snapshoting)
Additonal info: Only you Main Hand attackspeed counts, so if you want to get to the 3.0 Breakpoint use legacy Echoing Fury in Off Hand.
You cant snapshot anything but IAS for Ancients
I did a lot of testing i hope the numbers are accurate
Zaramos
0
I am also fine with a 1:1 ratio, but we will see
0
If you want to read and join the discussion over at reddit (over 60 comments) use this link:
https://www.reddit.com/r/Diablo/comments/3tt8us/the_state_of_paragon_in_d3_and_an_example_how_to/
0
Added a suggestion over from reddit (might be debatable but that´s what this threat is about)
0
I am not able to post this on the official D3 forums as i am banned there somehow -.-
13
Hey guys,
My name is Zaramos (Barbarian Classleader of <Zero Empathy>) and i want to show you some details on how big the current Paragonsystem influences Leaderboards after reaching Paragon 800 is. I will not only throw numbers on you but also a practical example and how easy it is to scale it up accordingly to the Paragonlvl. Keep in mind that this is not intended to be a whine threat but wants to solve the problem.
Practical Example:
I knew that i wouldnt have enough time to compete on either Season/Era this time so i played the game for fun the past 3 month. With "FUN" i mean doing Solo Grifts for pushing and training and theoriecrafting, and for me it is a lot of fun and the endgame of D3.
I started with Paragon 1114 this Era and ended up being Paragon 1180 without doing a sgl XP run. In total i did around 500-600 pushing Solo Grifts.
I was able to finish T71 in a okayish Rift (Enchantress Map,Thralls/Grotesque,Mothers,Punishers, 12% progress Conduit, 6min30 fight against EMBER).
So I knew on a dream rift with better Conduit + Boss i am able to do T72, and i got a Top 3 Dream Rift (best one i got within all my keys):Unburried/Goats,Big Arreat Crater lvl1,25% Conduit,but Orlash. This was the result:
http://imgur.com/a/fihG4
My Profile and Gear I used:
http://eu.battle.net/d3/de/profile/zaramos-2604/hero/59558231 (GEMS:lvl76 BoT/Taeguk and lvl 70 PE)
After that rift i stopped playing for rankings cause i knew it is possible for me within another 1000 keys or lvling my gems to lvl 90 to ease it a bit. At that point some people on NS started reaching Paragon 2600 even in our Clan so i did the math, which is kinda simple:
I have exacly 12000 Main Stat at Paragon 1180. A Paragon 2620 guy has 19200 Main Stat if he has the exact same gear.
19200/12000=1.6 => 60% flat dmg increase, also 7200 Armor more which decreases the DMG taken by around 23%.
Mob Healt increases by 1.17 per Tier and Dmg done by 1.07 => 1.17^3 = 1.60 (Mobs have 60% more HP); 1.07^3 = 1.225 (Deal 22.5% more DMG).
Its easy to see that a Paragon 2600+ guy can do 3 Tiers higher with the same gear on the same map with the same mobs
For a Paragon 800 Char it is 4 Tiers difference. 19200/10000 = 1.92 => 92% Dmg increase. 1.17^4 = 1.87.
This is just to show the numbers and i dont want to blame people who put a hell lot of time in this game to get those high Paragons if they did it without botting. I would like you to also take a look on how much more someone has to play to get to 2.6k and if the advantage is fair:
Paragon 800: 3.196.623.480.000 (3.2T XP needed)
Paragon 1180: 20.830.856.760.000 (20.8T XP needed)
Paragon 2600: 250.511.368.710.000 (250.5T XP needed)
A Paragon 2600 guy has played 80 times more than a p800 char and 12.5 times more than i did.
In my opinion it is somehow fair that people that spend way more time into the game should be rewarded maybe even like it is right now, but it drains the fun from 99.9999% of the other D3 players, may it be competitive players or casual players.
I knew i wouldnt be able to get Rank 1 this Era so i played in my own "League" and compered my achievments with Paragon 1100-1400 chars.
You can do it as well but it does not get reflected on the leaderboard so my "Paragon League" idea was born:
The Paragon Leagues: (TL;DR)
Keep in mind that this is just an example and i really want your opinion and maybe tweaks to this idea.
A new League:
What about a 4th anchor on the leaderboard which sorts the board depending on the Paragonlvl the Ranking was done?
For example: 0-300,301-600, 601-900 etc. within those 300 Paragons the difference in DMG/EHP is not more than 1 Tier (with the same Gear)
As i was thinking about this a bit more there were more things that this "Leagues" will do for the game and for the players.
Bringing back the FUN!
Currently everyone is grinding gear and paragon for month till the 2 weeks warning and then they start with the "Fun". (95% grinding 5% fun). The "League-System" would enhance the funfactor by a lot for most players as they can compete even mid season/era on their respective boards. The most competitive players will skip all of that early grifitng till they are 2k+ but they dont influence you anymore if you dont have the time or passion.
New Builds for low Paragonlvl!
Below Paragon 800 there might be different builds as you dont have all Stats from the Paragonsystem and you might not have the perfect Set yet . Your gear is not yet full ancients, you dont have the mats or the right items to cube etc.
Bots?
If you think deeper into this you might see that it somehow fixes the influence of botts at least for not top end players as it makes not much sense to bot within a 300 paragons reach as you will have limited time to compete in that league anyways so better play wisely and efficient
Groupplay?
For groupplay the average lvl of the group can be used.
What happens to my Rankings if i reach higher Paragon?
They will stay as long as you are within top 1000 at the end of Season/Era. So there will be players trying to compete on all leagues!
Futher additions from the Playerbase:
A suggestion over from reddit by akagamisteve:
The League can also be determined by the Paragon Points you have spend doing the run.
Good thing about it: You can participate in every League you want by spending less points.
Downside for the more casual playerbase: Gear will matter a lot more so does botting/playtime
So now i want to hear your opinion! Feel free to comment, criticism appreciated!
Zaramos
1
0
Not only clear the hellrift, just do every bountie there.
0
0
0
CotA Attackspeed Breakpoints:
It seems like Ancients normaly have 1.0 attacks/sec if you have 1.0 attacks/sec, but they dont have 3.0 attacks/sec when you have 3.0 attacks/sec.
It works like this:
Your ApS / Ancients ApS:
1.00 / 1.00
1.99 / 1.17
2.00 / 1.50
2.99 / 1.66
3.00 / 2.00
So it really matters at which ApS you Snapshot your Ancients.
Tasker and Theos will just multiply the normal or Snapshotet ApS: *1.4-*1.5 (Only if you wear T n T after Snapshoting)
Additonal info: Only you Main Hand attackspeed counts, so if you want to get to the 3.0 Breakpoint use legacy Echoing Fury in Off Hand.
You cant snapshot anything but IAS for Ancients
I did a lot of testing i hope the numbers are accurate
Zaramos
0
0
Hey guys, anybody knows if it is possible to wear the "legacy" Hellfirering + the new lvl 70 ring together? Thanks in advance!
0
What you mean by that?
Zara
0
My WD is still for sale:
Firebats(COB) Witchdoctor: 2.0 Billion Gold**
http://www.diabloprogress.com/hero/zaramos-2604/Rakanishu/22427937
- DPS*: 200k (d3p), 250k (ub), 664k (selfbuffed)
- 48% CC,555% CD,4.7% LS,54k HP,1020 AR,5.1k Armor
- Really high EHP WD: Able to do Ubers MP10 Solo
* All stats on a Paragon lvl. 100 Character.
** All items as a package! (Singel Items on top offer), Prices can be discussed.
Zara
0
EHP Barb Set + DPS Barb Set sold already!
Still for sale my WD Gear: 2.0 Billion
Zara