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Quote from CardinalMDM

Quote from Gheed2010

Quote from CardinalMDM

Lately, so many more people are showing support for the game, instead of just posting the same dumb crap all the time about D2 and POE.

That's because the millions who were dissapointed with the last couple of years finally got sick of whining and waiting and just left.
The extremely large "community" that loved (and loves) D2 is basically gone, and the minority that doesn't see D3 as a flaming train wreck remains. Which is probably a win-win for both groups.

The weak console sales and relatively very slow forums, like this one, reflect this. I don't think we'll be seeing any confetti parade "fastest sale ever" news blurbs about the expansion, for that matter, unless they find a way to tie it into WoW subs.

In the bigger picture, the genre itself has been pretty well driven into the ground. No one is particularly excited about anything in the ARPG space at the moment, and this most recent generation didn't have a single title that really filled the gap left by D2, or even came close.

Gheed...

You're not wrong that the ARPG genre has been extremely lacking. I can't disagree with that. In fact, in defending D3 on console, I say it all the time...4-player local co-op ARPGs have been severely lacking. However, that's partially because of the genre itself not being seen as attractive as it once was.

Games on the whole have been getting way more advanced, the depth and storytelling ECLIPSES most big budget motion picture crapfests that Hollywood puts out, the features are getting fleshed out every generation...all in all, you're right, ARPGs are likely going, in some fashion, the way of old classic "beat-em-ups" like Streets of Rage, Final Fight, and others. Companies have tried to bring back the beat-em-up, even adding depth like quest-givers, XP, levels, skill trees, but many of them still failed because they tried to capture an old style that wasn't as attractive by turning them into GTA/RPG clones that didn't match up to the inspiration.

However, try to keep in mind...D3 was a huge seller on launch day, and as you mentioned, people left in droves because they were disappointed, they were tired of whining and complaining, and stopped playing. But many of the reasons players were leaving was because of very key points that are pretty much ALL getting addressed.

1) The Auction House...BOTH Auction Houses. Huge point of contention for thousands who feel that both paying real money, or in-game gold, completely undermines the organic gear upgrading a player can feel, and instead turns 100% of the game into an exploitive race for more wealth. Thousands of those, in fact, didn't want to use the AH, but uesd it anyway because it was better than dealing with disappointing item drops and poor itemization.

Come next March, that point of contention will be gone.

2) Itemization. Another huge point of contention. Farming, for a lot of people, was a pointless endeavor that yielded page after page of what they felt was useless garbage that they didn't want to sift through to "see the real potential." Which would often lead them to swallowing their pride and camping in the AH.

Loot 2.0 will be overhauling not only the amount of high end items, it'll be considerably raising the bar on their potency, as well as inspiring people to change and modify builds not based on popularity, but because an item they find dictates it.

3) Character progression. Another huge problem. Players all over hated how D3 got rid of skill points (even though a VAAAAAAAAAAAST majority of D2 players pretty much stuck to standard builds, that were further homogenized by patched in "synergy bonuses") and stat point allocation (even though that same VAST majority of D2 players followed the same moronic formula....enough Strength for gear, Dex or Energy depending on if you were doing a ranged or magic class....rest into Vitality).

Paragon 2.0 not only blows the lid off that ridiculous system by removing the level cap all together, but it actually benefits players the most by having more than just one character. Any time a player gains a Paragon level, all their characters gain a point to spend. I could level my Monk and make my Wizard stronger. That's pretty unreal by D2's ancient standard. Furthermore, I can actually put points into specific places I want to, instead of only 4 vague umbrella stats. Come Paragon 2.0, if I want my Barb to get most of his Strength from gear, but I want to boost his speed by boost his Dodge Chance, Paragon 2.0 lets me do that directly. If I want to raise the Armor or Resistances of my Witch Doctor or Demon Hunter, I can do that directly.

4) Personal customization. People have also hated how, when equipping the common high end gear sets, that everyone's characters look pretty much identical.

The Mystic being returned to the game, after getting removed before launch, not only fixes this, but helps with getting better gear.

EDIT: Almost forgot...5) Competitive/Social aspects...people loved the Ladders in D2, and hated not seeing them in D3. They're pretty much confirmed to be coming at some point, along with other popular multiplayer aspects, like Clans and Guilds...more than likely, better trading methods...and of course, down the road...PvP. You want to say D3 should've had PvP at launch, like it was promised, fine, I can't argue that. But the devs want to ensure players have the best PvP possible, and just looking at the changes being proposed so far...I'm sure it'll all be more than adequate.

Not to mention, "Gheed"...but I read in the datamined changes that your namesake might even be making a return.

You call D3 a "flaming train wreck"...personally...I acknowledge every one the flaws its had since launch, and in its development. I understand many of the intentions, but I acknowledge how those intentions went seriously awry. I also acknowledge, though, that the game has the undeniable potential to take many of the basic ideas and aspects people like about D2, and make them insanely better in D3.

You don't feel like warming your hands on the flames of what D3 used to look like, you're free to move on like all the other pessimists. Diablo 3 is going to turn a major corner Soon™. Count on it.

Quote from Babel

In the end, its all gonna come down to farming efficiency. Even classes that can do sustain dps against 50 million hp might not want to waste time fighting mobs for minutes instead of seconds, and want to lower the monster level. I suspect builds from now on will be rated on which level they can take on.

There might also be builds that specialize in clearing easier contents quickly, thus improving farming efficiency.

Of course, this is all speculation. I do hope class remains reasonably balance at the higher level.