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    posted a message on MMO (Diablo III?)
    As I understand, team 3 is already big, and is working on something "awesome" according to Blizzard. Team 3 must be different because all the job postings are for senior or lead positions. If team 3 is already big, they have their own lead/senior. Team top secret is starting from scratch.
    Posted in: Diablo III General Discussion
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    posted a message on MMO (Diablo III?)
    When I went to GDC last year, a lot of people from Red 5, and other companies worked for Blizzard on WoW. They quit after it launched. Probably this is why they are looking for people for the WoW section. Or it is a trick, and they are looking for Warcraft 4 folks.

    Either way, I know that many who applied to work on Warcraft 3, ended up working on WoW instead. Blizzard likes to trick people.
    Posted in: Diablo III General Discussion
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    posted a message on MMO (Diablo III?)
    You guys are not thinking logically. The job listings are all for senior or lead positions which means that they havn't started the development. They are still designing the game.

    "Team 3" is working on something, and it is a seperate entity from this "top secret" project. Companies do not hire new people to do expansions, they keep the same team from the stand alone game.

    LINEUP(as it is now)
    WoW Team: Current WoW crap, plus any new expansions
    Starcraft 2 Team: Starcraft 2, and expansion
    Team 3: ?
    Top Secret Team: ?

    It can't be Warcraft 4, because the Starcraft 2 team will switch over to it.

    LINEUP(Sabacca50's Prophecy)
    Team 3: Diablo III
    Top Secret Team: Starcraft MMORPG
    Posted in: Diablo III General Discussion
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    posted a message on D3 Designers like WoW... Good? OR Bad?
    Carl??????
    Posted in: Diablo III General Discussion
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    posted a message on D3 Designers like WoW... Good? OR Bad?
    The Chargers will play in SD. Good times for us in SD.

    I am glad Khaan, that you have seen Kahn... But let us continue here. Bandwith Lag potential being the reason for auto attack is not a reason at all, it is an excuse. Also, there are Asian, European, Oceanic, and Continental WoW servers.

    You must agree Kahn, that Lag is not the reason for auto attack in WoW. It was a design decision.

    As for the hitting 1,2,3,4... in WoW, it IS worse than Diablo. You are right to state that in Diablo, we do have our skill/spell hotkeys, and players usually stick to 1 main attack type. However, since the game is not auto attack, it is better because the combat is quick and involving. Moving your character matters in terms of dodging thier melee attacks and ranged projectiles. Clicking when you want to strike/cast, and using shift to hold your ground. Using potions as needed (although that is in WoW as well) and always checking the drops with Alt. Combat in Diablo always requires 2 hands

    As for WoW, it is all about aggro. Once you get that aggro, you start that 1,2,3,4... key combination, and you dont need to look at the screen, or use 2 hands. Therefore, Diablo is more invovling, even though we have only a handful of skills to use compared to WoW. You must agree with that Kahn, or atleast see the involvment difference.

    Kahn, Auto attack is designed for 1vs1 or 2vs1 battles. It has nothing to do with balance. Being able to take only 1 to 2 enemies at a time is part of its design. The enemies take longer to kill and are scaled for more HP because auto attack combat calls for no movement of the player. It is all about slowly attacking eachother, and using the 1,2,3,4 abilities, trying for a sucessful attack. That is supposed to be the interesting part of combat. The thing that happens though, is what I talked about in the above paragraph, not even looking at the screen, 1 handed, only memorizing the combo timing. That is not an engrossing or involving experience. That isnt even playing anymore.

    Respones for Items
    As for your suggestions, I really liked the items system in Diablo 2. The only issue I have with adding more types of items is having some purpose in it. Diablo 2 had this purpose. Normal was regular. Magical had 1 or 2 special properties. Rare had 3 or 4 special properties. Unique was a set number of properties, Set items were like unique, but gained more power if more of the set was collected. And ofcourse, socketed was making your own magic items, controlling which properties they have. It seems like in WoW there are too many to understand and they were not simple differences like D2.

    Respones for Gold
    As I have said before, I'm the only one who likes Items for Items. Items for gold isn't exciting. Bartering crappy items that you collect, and trying to strike a deal with a dude whos got 1 good item, is very fun.

    Response for Quests
    I would say that any side quests would be good for D3. However, Fed Ex make me feel like a bitch quests would be no good.

    Response for Pets
    We will see what blizzard does about minion control.

    Response for Transfer Items
    I think GW way would be a better idea.

    I know some folks (like Kahn) are telling us that this discussion is more Diablo vs MMO type gaming, but let me remind you that in the original list, I stated that these are things that I thought were a problem in WoW, and should not transfer over to any Diablo game.

    For people like Boklaminos, sure it is your opinion, but why don't you contribute and say what you think can be taken from WoW into D3.

    Carl, where is your list?!
    Posted in: Diablo III General Discussion
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    posted a message on D3 Designers like WoW... Good? OR Bad?
    Take your time with the list. I look forward to it.
    Posted in: Diablo III General Discussion
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    posted a message on D3 Designers like WoW... Good? OR Bad?
    Carl, besides some jokes about samurai pizza cats, I really don't see anything offensive in that post. The conclusion especially is very upfront and just states that the features that I listed would hinder the Diablo experience if they were implemented in D3.

    Its cool Carl. I think you were already angry at Blades111 (I cite the page 2 "Shoot yourself...", and tried to take it out on me. I have been a member long enough here to know about the crazy folks you mention.

    You must agree though Carl, that many features that I listed would hurt the Diablo experience if implemented in D3.

    -

    Now for you Mr. Khaan. I must ask this, have you seen Wrath of Khan? You should check it out...

    Auto Attack is bad. It stagnates combat, making it boring. It also is designed for 1vs1 combat, which slows the game down as well. Sure Khan, there are a few instances where you can be successful in 2 or 3vs1 battles, but the game is not designed for it.

    What is Auto Attack Khan??? I will tell you. You and a monster are fighting. You are not moving, and they are not moving. You are standing still, hitting eachother slowly. There is no way to dodge each other by moving, and even if you slice your sword through the enemy, it doesn't mean you are hitting them. I don't know about you, but I'm already bored. Also, since auto attack uses a radius for enemies, you can be running away from them, and have 20 ft of ingame space between you, yet the monster still hits you! Awesome!

    Wait, there is more... I continue to press 1,2,3,4 in the appropriate order to keep casting my spells right when their cooldown expires. Yes, the only keys I am hitting are 1,2,3 and 4. Hell, since I auto attacked so many monsters trying to get to the next level (1 monster at a time mind you), I have memorized the cool down times. I dont even need to look at the screen when I'm attacking. I can watch TV, or a movie. Hell, I dont even need 2 hands to play. Just 1,2,3, and 4 until the monster dies.

    Auto Attack does ruin the game, because like I have mentioned above, you are not even playing the game anymore. The game loses its immersion factor by 100%. You don't even need 2 hands to play.

    I'm not done yet...

    Since the game is auto attack and designed for 1vs1 combat, it is all about pulling 1 monster at a time. This is the game, as I have mentioned. If you are shitty at pulling 1 monster while he chills with his buddies, you will pull more than you can handle, and keep dying, effectively stopping your progress through the game. If you are good at pulling 1 monster at a time, you will suceed in the game. Therefore, as I have shown, the game of WoW is all about pulling safely.

    About the expansions. Yes. Diablo 2 has an Expansion. But you can beat the expansion because there is a boss to it. And since there is no more expansions to Diablo 2, you can beat the game. In WoW, there is no boss figure. Also, there will be endless expansion that continue to not have boss figures. Therefore, you cannot beat the game. Sure, Kahn, there are raid bosses, but they are not the bosses of the entire expansion.

    -

    That list was what I saw to be problems in WoW, and things that do not belong in a Diablo title.

    Like I said in my original list. They will keep the skeletal game the same because they have to. I am worried though, that if a WoWer is in charge of the design team, they might do things that will ruin the diablo experience. Stuff like expand the inventory to 20 equippable slots, change the spell system so that you learn all the spells and invest in the ones you like, etc...

    I have a challange for all you WoWers out there like Carl and Khan. I listed things that are in WoW that I think would hurt Diablo 3. Why don't you guys get together and lists things from WoW that you think would work well in D3.
    Posted in: Diablo III General Discussion
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    posted a message on D3 Designers like WoW... Good? OR Bad?
    Carl, I mean seriously... Calling me a retard, thanks. And then you go and call me an idiot! I'm Mcloving it!

    Carl, the list I compiled are things that exist in the World of Warcraft. This is fact. These features are examples of design decisions that would effect Diablo III in a negative way. I will elaborate in a moment.

    I applaud Sandman53. He is a WoW fan like you Carl, yet he is trying to explain himself in a professional manner. And Carl, you should realize that WoW's biggest influence is not Diablo. No, it isn't even Warcraft. It's biggest influence is Everquest. Both WoW and EQ, at their core, are the same.

    Ok I will elaborate now.

    Inventory
    -WoW has many item slots, which makes each individual item worth less.


    I am talking about equippable item slots here, not your 4x10 inventory. World of Warcraft has 20 equippable item slots, while Diablo 2 has 10. The reason I like less equippable item slots, is because every item is worth a lot more to the character. You need 10 good items, and if you only 8 good items, you are feeling it. In WoW, if you have 18 good items, and 2 crappy ones, it doesn't affect the character as much as the Diablo 2 situation would.

    Also, I like how Polearms took more inventory space than a ring. This is not the case in WoW.

    So you can see my concern Carl. If Diablo 3 had a WoW inventory, it would lower the value of each item. Why? because there are so many slots, that you can get your bonuses elsewhere.

    Spells
    -Every member of a class can learn the same spells as one another. The only exceptions are talents, but this is not as efficent as just having skill trees. Infact, it is horrible.


    I am not a fan of "everyone in this class gets all their spells". In Diablo 2, the skill trees made it very interesting because you could powerup certain spells, without learning every spell. In WoW, you can power up certain spells with talents, but you still can cast fire spells, even if you went ice. This hurts character uniqueness.

    Stats
    -You can't distrubute your stats in WoW. That design decision was a dumb one.
    -You can respec yourself mutliple times. So much for a dedicated style char.


    You can't distribute your stats in WoW. You must agree with me here Carl, and Sandman, that this is a design flaw. I know that if I asked both of you, if you could distribute your stats in WoW would you? Both of you would say yes. You cite balance Sandman, and that may be true, but I think it is more for newbie protection, so they don't screw up their stats and have to restart. Why didn't they just let you respec your stats???

    I only have 1 problem with respecing. It is that if you can do it multiple times, than your character can just keep changing with no identity of its own. For example, I am a mage, I go fire, then in the next raid, I go Ice, then in the next raid, I go arcane. Characters lose their uniqueness, and have no identity.

    Attacking/Casting
    -WoW has auto attack. Horrible...

    Auto Attack is horrible. It makes the game slow, boring, and less immersive. This is where WoW fails. Just because it is an MMORPG doesnt mean it should have auto attack. I elaborate more about this in the Gameplay section.

    Graphics
    -Cartoony. I don't want Diablo to look like Samurai Pizza Cats
    I like WoWs graphics. Yes, I did just compliment the game Carl. However, I do not want WoW's graphical style in a Diablo game.

    Gameplay

    -I can kill a tiger, while another tiger walks through my body. And that 2nd tiger doesnt give a shit about his buddy. The immersion factor is at 0!

    Do I even need to comment... This is because of Auto Attack. Games designed with auto attack are about 1vs1 battles, and the characters can't usually handle 2vs1. That is the reason why all the monsters and animals don't care about eachother.

    -The game is all about pulling 1 monster while hes chilling with his monster buddies. Sometimes accidents happen and you pull 2... you know the rest...

    Again. Auto Attack. You have to realize that Auto Attack isn't just a feature in WoW. It is the game. Everyone who has ever played an MMO knows of this situation, trying to pull/aggro 1 monster when there are 3 or 4 around. Let me repeat. This is the game. This is what you do for 70 levels. It is not fun, it is frustrating, it is annoying and it is boring.

    Why is it all about pulling 1 monster while he is chilling with his pals? Why is it I can kill a tiger infront of his buddies, and the other tigers dont give a crap? Why is it that when I swing my sword, and it goes through the monster, I still miss? Why is it that when I am running away from a monster, he can still hit me, even when I am 20 ft away???

    ANSWER: Auto Attack.

    -Fed Ex quests..

    You know what World of Warcraft makes you feel like? A bitch. Go fucking deliver this mail to my mom. Go kill a rat and drain its blood. Yea.. I feel like I'm apart of an epic storyline...

    In Diablo, there were never unnessecessary quests, or quests that made you feel like a bitch. I don't want this in D3. Do you?

    -I don't want to kill oversized rats anymore...

    Have you played EQ?

    -No end to the game
    -No boss of the game
    I can say that I have beaten Diablo II. You cannot say that you beaten World of Warcraft. I really want to say that I have beaten D3. I hope this is achievable.

    -No hardcore mode, or single player

    I want Diablo 3 to have a hardcore mode, and a single player mode. Do you?

    -Undead characters are not considered undead in the game
    -Undead can be priests...

    Lets say, In Diablo 3, you can be a vampire as a character class. If Im a paladin, and I go hostile on you, I want my Holy Bolt to do some damage. Don't you?

    So I holy bolt him, and they he casts holy light. What!?

    -Money runs the economy. This is too much like real life to me. I liked the Diablo "Items for Items" economy. I am probably the only one who thinks this though.

    If you have money in WoW, you can buy whatever you like. I think thats too easy. All you got to do is farm gold. In Diablo, you have to find your own stuff, or find other stuff and trade it for stuff you want. This is much more fun because you have to make deals with players. I want to strike deals in Diablo 3!

    Business Model
    -Monthly Fee
    -Endless Expansions


    For the Monthly Fees, please refer to threads "There gonna screw up D3", and "Poll: Would you pay to play Diablo III?". I explain in mutliple places why monthly fees are not needed.

    As for Endless Expansions. Like I have said before, I want to be able to beat the game.

    ---------------------------------------------------------

    So Carl, do I sound like a retard? An idiot? Do I?
    Posted in: Diablo III General Discussion
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    posted a message on D3 Designers like WoW... Good? OR Bad?
    Quote from "Sofawall" »

    Anyway, would someone mind telling me just what Diablo would lose if WoW was considered for source material?

    I'm gonna list a few things here... Please read the conclusion at the bottom before you respond...

    Inventory
    -WoW has many item slots, which makes each individual item worth less.

    Spells
    -Every member of a class can learn the same spells as one another. The only exceptions are talents, but this is not as efficent as just having skill trees. Infact, it is horrible.

    Stats
    -You can't distrubute your stats in WoW. That design decision was a dumb one.
    -You can respec yourself mutliple times. So much for a dedicated style char.

    Attacking/Casting
    -WoW has auto attack. Horrible...

    Graphics
    -Cartoony. I don't want Diablo to look like Samurai Pizza Cats

    Gameplay

    -I can kill a tiger, while another tiger walks through my body. And that 2nd tiger doesnt give a shit about his buddy. The immersion factor is at 0!
    -The game is all about pulling 1 monster while hes chilling with his monster buddies. Sometimes accidents happen and you pull 2... you know the rest...
    -Fed Ex quests..
    -I don't want to kill oversized rats anymore...
    -No end to the game
    -No boss of the game
    -No hardcore mode, or single player
    -Undead characters are not considered undead in the game
    -Undead can be priests...
    -Money runs the economy. This is too much like real life to me. I liked the Diablo "Items for Items" economy. I am probably the only one who thinks this though.

    Business Model
    -Monthly Fee
    -Endless Expansions

    Conclusion
    Now this list has some big issues, as well as many little issues. The little things do matter; Infact they are critical! So this is why I am afraid of WoW players designing Diablo III. They will be forced by Blizzard(Morhaime) to keep Diablo III, like Diablo II and I, in the skeletal sense (same Camera Angle, same Hack N Slash). However, with their WoW influences, I think they will screw up many small features that will end up hurting the Diablo experience. They will try to force features from WoW into the Diablo universe.

    I mean, imagine if you couldn't distribute your stat points! That 1 small change would make D3 worthless!
    Posted in: Diablo III General Discussion
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    posted a message on D3 Designers like WoW... Good? OR Bad?
    Lets keep it clean in here folks...
    Posted in: Diablo III General Discussion
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    posted a message on Diablo 3 on Xbox 360?
    I think you are talking about Diablo (the first one) on Xbox Live Arcade. Blizzard stated that they did not want to use Microsofts Xbox Live service in the past. Citing that they want users to connect to battle.net, not Xbox Live (this was for Ghost).

    As for Diablo 3 on Xbox 360. Blizzard has stated that they are strictly sticking to PC games for right now.
    Posted in: Diablo III General Discussion
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    posted a message on Ghostbusters 3 Vs Diablo 3!!!
    Ghostbusters III is already in the works. It is in CG though, but all the characters will be there and the voices will be the original guys.

    Ghostbusters 3 will come out first.
    Posted in: Diablo III General Discussion
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    posted a message on Ghostbusters 3 Vs Diablo 3!!!
    Which will come out first. Ghostbusters 3 or Diablo 3???

    ANSWER!
    Posted in: Diablo III General Discussion
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    posted a message on D3 Designers like WoW... Good? OR Bad?
    Like most of us on these forums , I am not a fan of World of Warcraft. However many people are. Infact, I guarantee you that the entire Design team on "Team 3" are big time WoW players.

    So heres the crucial question. What if the Lead Designer on D3 is a WoW lover? Will it effect the game in a negative or positive way?

    ANSWER!
    Posted in: Diablo III General Discussion
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    posted a message on Diablo 3 countdown!
    It wouldn't change anything. They are already making the game.
    Posted in: General Discussion (non-Diablo)
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