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    posted a message on Φ Ask Lore Questions Here (No Theories)
    Quote from mooclwon

    Did we fight Lilith in the pandemonium event or was that purely a game event and didn't really happen lore wise?
    Gibson is correct, but it has little to do with the Book of Cain. The DiabloWiki.com - Pandemonium Event Pandemonium Event, or DiabloWiki.com - Uber Diablo Uber Diablo for that matter, were never canonical events. Even during the days of D2, before the Sin War books etc., it made absolutely no logical, metaphysical or narrative sense within the Diablo Universe. They were two fun events designed to deal with design flaws within D2, nothing more.
    Posted in: Lore & Storyline
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    posted a message on Who do you miss?
    Quote from FreddyBenson

    ive no idea myself now lol
    LinkX was just taking a jab at all the countless people over the years (myself included once) who've made farewell threads as soon as they leave the forums. Sometimes it's been warranted, sometimes not so much. Though it is much more common for people to announce their return...
    Posted in: General Discussion (non-Diablo)
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    posted a message on Who do you miss?
    Quote from LinkX

    I joined in '07, so I don't get the illustrious '06 gloating rights. :( Link has a sad.
    Well taht is true, but I think it's time we move past the "you're only an oldtimer if you were here in '06"-mentality. It's like distinguishing between the Jurassic and Cretaceous; we're all dinosaur anyway :P

    Quote from Umpa

    HEY! If you ever have the need to say goodbye here, actually say goodbye. Let us all know where you are going and that you're not dead. :)
    Yes. I mean you don't have to make a public thread or anything, but do tell someone at least.
    Posted in: General Discussion (non-Diablo)
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    posted a message on Plot fluidity
    Quote from Damerflinn

    I had never thought of the crown, and why it would be needed to kill him. It's certainly an interesting question. And I can see us getting more detail. But it still makes sense. Traditionally ghosts are things that are holding onto this world, and items of personal value often can be a center for their energies. When you encoutner him before, he's in a more corpreal state, but when you put the crown on his head, he takes a physical form, instead of summoning other demons to do his bidding, I mean he could have struck down Cain all by himself but he chooses to use summons instead. So I think the crown is what was needed to defeat not only his body, but the part of his soul that was tethered to the world. But that's just logic attached to speculation, and I'm hoping that it's revealed more in the full game.
    I'm not so certain we'll get an explanation about it, but something along those lines seems to be the most reasonable explanation at least.

    Quote from Damerflinn

    I found it very odd that the first real mini boss would say something like "You shall never defeat me." It seemed really cheesy, and not placed well. I mean think about it, we're obviously going to defeat him, he's the first damn boss.
    That to me doesn't seem all that unreasonable. I mean, if this had not been a story and he's revived again, really pissed off, and faces off some (as far as he can tell) random adventurer, I'd be pretty cocky too.

    Something I find much more strange is the first time you encounter him, when he says "The power of the fallen star awakened me". How does he know it was a fallen star? Or a more prudent question, why does he assume like all the townsfolk, who actually was something fall, that it's a star? He was dead and gone, buried underground, and he only just woke up after the thing crashed. He's talked to no one, and all he knows is that there's a big blue hole in the ground. And even if he suspected that, why say "the power of the fallen star?" As far as we know it's definitely not a star, and if anyone else knows this it ought to be Leoric. It seems like he's only saying it so the player gets a quick explanation for why he's not dead anymore.

    Btw, kickass name Damerflinn. I always liked Flinn best of the Asha'man :)
    Posted in: Lore & Storyline
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    posted a message on Plot fluidity
    Quote from NaginnahNibor

    Second, it is true that there really isn't much to go on because of how much Blizz is trying to keep hidden. I am also trying to keep as much hidden as possible so I have not really sought out too much of the datamined spoilers. I also have not read the books but it is on my to do list. That being said, I am up to date on the lore from the wiki site and from ForceStrategy Gaming Diablo Cast episodes where you speak about the lore in the books.
    Well then how can you know there won't be any "Xel'Naga" mentioned in D3? :P
    Posted in: Lore & Storyline
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    posted a message on Plot fluidity
    Quote from NaginnahNibor

    Wow, I can't believe I attracted the attention of two moderators. I'm flattered.
    Ok first of all he's just a greenskin, so pay no attention to him :P

    Quote from NaginnahNibor

    I had a couple other thoughts on this recently. Having only played D2 (but seen D1 on multiple occasions), I became familiar with the layout for tristram. Is it me or does D3's Tristram not really resemble prior layouts? I know there are similar locations like the blacksmith and Adria's house but I'm not sure if they're even in the same spots they used to be in. Also, what would really help me get a better feel for it would to actually get my hands on the beta. That way I would know for sure.
    You're right, they're not the same at all. To be honest I think it's at least partly an aesthetic decision: the original layout from D1 is very spacious and would probably look rather weird if it was out into the new D3 Sanctuary alongside all the other towns.

    Quote from NaginnahNibor

    For intance, SC1 spoke about the Xel'Naga like we all knew what they were talking about and D2 talked about the lesser and greater Evil's the same way. Normally, I would think I would have a problem with this because I can't relate to what the character's are refering to. However, it seemed this element made the SC1 and D2 universe much more immersive: It gave impression there was a dynamic world to discover. Phrozen, I've heard you on podcasts and I know you're a lore expert so I'm wondering what your thoughts are on this and also why/if this element does not seem to be in D3?
    I don't think one should mistake ignorance on the player's behalf with immersion. D2 contains just as much, or rather just as little, as it did when it was released. D3 by comparison is by almost any metric a much more developed and fully-fledged world.

    What I think you really mean is that SC1 and D2 introduced new story concepts which you were unfamiliar with, while D3 seems to just expand on exactly what you learned in D2. And that is certainly true so far, but any new developments that stray from what we know from D2 would be considered spoilers and would be information that Blizzard would not give out to us.

    Let me ask you, how many of the books/datamined spoilers have you looked over?
    Posted in: Lore & Storyline
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    posted a message on Who do you miss?
    Quote from DarkJayII

    Did you all ever see a ghost? Now its not the normal Darkjay as i cant remember the password but it is close. I think
    I was like "wait a minute, I don't remember no DarkJayII ever posting... oh it's from today." :P

    Welcome back!

    Quote from DarkJayII

    Sure does look the same to me. So who all is still active? I will at least be on occasionally I miss everyone. Any chance i can get my old acct back?
    If you're looking for old-timers they're few and far in between. The only '06 members I can think of who are still active would be me, Siyanoq and Fingolfin_GR. Though I do see a lot of others lurking from time to time.

    Quote from DarkJayII

    Yea forgot password i usually keep the same one but for somereason it has not worked, I even tried the other variations i do. So its been nearly 4 years and im still #12 in the post count lol
    Message Daemaro, he should be able to fix it for you.

    Quote from Siaynoq

    I've kind of become like an old man that everyone ignores. I'll write these long wall of texts sometimes in a thread and most the time people just ignore it. LOL
    Oh come on Siya, you've been pulling that excuse for years. Although I guess the wall of text part is still as true as ever :P
    Posted in: General Discussion (non-Diablo)
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    posted a message on Suggestion for Twitter/Facebook quiz
    EDIT: I retract what I just said. After becoming uncertain, I checked the Diablo II Manual and did find one place where they're called the Northern Steppes. Though it hasn't been used anywhere I guess you would still be technically correct.

    That being said, Mount Arreat is such a defining factor of the region, and a much more well-known descriptor that I'm not sure this would invalidate answering Mount Arreat.
    Posted in: Site Feedback
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    posted a message on Plot fluidity
    I definitely agree with your point on the Haedrig thing, it is rather unbelievable that in two seconds he doesa 180 and goes in and murders everyone. Obviously this is a gameplay thing, since the focus is on people not having to stand around and listed to quest dialogues all that muchin D3, but I agree that it could have been handled better. Your suggestion is a good one.

    Quote from Zaxlor

    Almost like the Skeleton King dilema. Cain telling you "This is the only route Hero, we can only go deeper into the crypts from here. There is no turning back!" would help, but you've already got a quest telling you to slay him anyways. Hopefully, there isn't alot of this in game.
    But the point isn't so much to inform us, it's to weave us into the world and prevent us from remembering that there's a UI overlay telling us with divine power what our purpose is.

    Though to be honest I hadn't really reflected on the crown thing until I read it here. I guess that goes to show you how ingrained the "fetch arbitrary item to proceed further"-mentality is in a gamer's head :P
    Posted in: Lore & Storyline
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    posted a message on Why don't the demons use any weapons?
    Quote from Ralnon7

    Well, it's kind of ironic, because Hell actually has its own Forge, and Heaven doesn't, as far as we know.
    Book of Cain doesn't meantion an angelic forge =/= Heaven doesn't have any forges. Heaven certainly has a means to produce weapons and armor, not to mention the DiabloWiki.com - Pandemonium Fortress Pandemonium Fortress, which was alsu built by Heaven.

    Quote from Ralnon7

    The Angiris Council are really interesting characters, but it just seems strange that for all their power and items of power (the Sword, Cord, Spear, Scroll and Chalice), they've never been able to kill even one of the seven Great Evils over thousands of years (while a few humans with untapped potential were able to slaughter five in maybe a week), and the Angels, for all their weapons, still haven't won a war against disorganized hordes of unarmed creatures...
    Not if:
    1) There are way more demons than angels
    2) Demons are, on average, stronger than angels or,
    3) Demons aren't as disorganized as one might think

    It could be any number of other reasons. Perhaps demons are more like cannon-fodder. Equipping these with gear equal to what angels wear would in that case be impossible if they die 3 times faster, even in a fantasy setting that'd be economically impossible.

    Quote from Milknut

    Well plenty of the lesser demons use weapons.
    Agreed. DiabloWiki.com - Fallen Fallen, DiabloWiki.com - Megademons Megademons, DiabloWiki.com - Overseers Overseers etc. Like I said above, it could be any number of reasons. Some use weapons, some don't.
    Posted in: Lore & Storyline
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    posted a message on Future Major Players
    Siggard's story will likely not be implemented, the events in Demonsbane make absolutely no chronological sense with the rest of the lore these days. If he came back in the story somehow it would be heavily retconned, though I guess that's a possibility. The basic premise of him being a human who awakens in nephalem powers is certainly there, so perhaps.

    Other than that, I guess I'd really like to see more of the DiabloWiki.com - nephalem nephalem in general. Who they were and what happened between them after DiabloWiki.com - Lilith Lilith murdered their parents.

    Posted in: Lore & Storyline
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    posted a message on Φ Diablo Books Chronological Order
    Quote from Exostra

    Hey guys.I've never read any diablo books and now I am thinking to read them before the game come out.What do you think should I buy all books or just the book of cain for a nice recap of the story?
    If you just want a recap and get up to date on the current state of the lore, then the DiabloWiki.com - Book of Cain Book of Cain is definitely the one you want to get.

    If you want some additional lore and an in-depth look at what happened during the DiabloWiki.com - Sin War Sin War, try the Sin War novels, starting with DiabloWiki.com - Birthright Birthright.

    The other books you could check out if you want to, but they're not considered canon.
    Posted in: Lore & Storyline
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    posted a message on Map of Sanctuary (Complete)
    There we go, the megaupload links have been removed. You can now get the map in full size again :)
    Posted in: Lore & Storyline
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    posted a message on Map of Sanctuary (Complete)
    I've been trying to get Atrumentis to upload it again somewhere, we'll see if we can't get that fixed :)
    Posted in: Lore & Storyline
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    posted a message on Diablo 2 story questions
    Quote from Zaxlor

    Ah, awesome, thanks alot for that! It's a shame that more of this wasn't in game, thought i suppose the way that Diablo 3 is handling lore will make things in the new game abit more easier to understand. I'm guessing there's some kind of Codex, or Lore book in D3 that you can re-read though?
    Well most of it probably wasn't really though of by the time the game was made ;)

    As for where this information comes from, it's mainly the DiabloWiki.com - Book of Cain Book of Cain. You can also check out the Sin War lore reference, though that's probably going to be dull without having read the books. I would have advised you to read the DiabloWiki.com - Lore Summary Lore Summary as well, but as of this moment it's quite out of date and will need to be reworked to be fully accurate.
    Posted in: Lore & Storyline
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