Personally, I think any nerf like that that limits group diversity is bad for diablo. One of the original draws in D2 was that you could make different builds to do almost anything. Without perma CC, builds like lightning wiz drop out yet again... mainly because wizards don't get that 30% baseline defense. For wizards, perma CC helps make up for defenses their class lacks. Yay buff to defensive stats, but I still think the better move is to just make all exp bonuses be distributed evenly by the team. This way, in team play support structure still has a role.
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- blackmorgrim
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Member for 12 years, 8 months, and 10 days
Last active Thu, Nov, 30 2017 04:24:59
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You're much better off with starfire with a camaral+mykens build. Those chains tend to travel! This is the build I'm running at the moment. I swap between IAS, Stun, and Damage with slow time, and swap between gogok and stricken for gems. https://us.battle.net/d3/en/profile/Blackmorgrim-1728/hero/42023928
Hydras just melt single targets, while chain deals well with packs, the slow time helps bunch up large packs enemies.
My largest Manald crits tend to reach 200,000M+ (200 Trillion?) and I can reliably complete GR 70-71.
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From my experiences, I'm pretty sure the manald heal proc can proc area damage. It makes chain lightning pretty darn effective, especially on large packs of enemies off screen. Even on GR70 I'm sometimes seeing full champ packs exploding as they come on screen just from chains reaching them.
But then I was under the assumption area damage can proc off of any damage, but area damage doesn't actually proc anything.
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well with the new manald heal coming around it might finally come around. The effect on the new manald heal makes every proc of paralysis do 2700% damage.
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For something like Shard of Hate, could the combo of the 50% attack speed belt and the wand that increases the attack speed of Spectral blade... combined that with the pants that increase generator damage (the belt turns primaries into generators)
spectral blade seems like it could really become a powerhouse with that much attack speed.
I was playing around with a non spender build (basically spectral blade for single target, and chain lightning for large groups) and it seemed to work really well in a legacy of nightmares build, especially since you never spend arcane power and always have the armor damage reduction up. Was also thinking a non spender build could allow for spammable teleport with the cube wep enchant, allowing for fast travel when density is low, and near infinite battle stamina when density is high.
Even with it's low proc rate... I'm curious if there's a point something like Mirinae might outdo something like Toxin or even Pain enchancer.
I'm not really sure how something like bane of the stricken might work with a combo of chain lightning, shocking aspect, and electrify. Then again, I'm still kind of unclear on how shocking aspect actually works except an old video showing vortexes procing it like crazy. Shocking aspect has a proc coef of .1 but I'm not sure if that applies to only the bolt or the crit effect too. I know when I used to run a stun build, electrify weapon made a noticable difference in how well I could stun things, but I'm unsure of whether that's shocking aspect procing from electrify or stuns procing or electrifies effect.
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This would probably be key to making a legacy of nightmares/chain lightning build work
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This was about as far as I could get with a chain lightning/AT build. I think I could get further with a decent pure AT build, but I just haven't gotten the gear to support it. The main problem was being incredibly squishy (but then, I guess almost anything is at high GRs) The main problem with this build was mainly dealing with Rift guardians solo... otherwise, clearing high density rifts were cake, and I was easily able to lock down groups of 15 or more... champ packs were a breeze provided they didn't have lightning storm or binding.
Personally, I feel electrify wep really isn't about damage, but proc'ing more stuns. And in general, I'd never consider using more than 2pc tals in a single element build... I'd be more likely to do 2pc tals/4pc Opus.
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I'd think with a chain lightning build (High IAS, Mykens+Velvet Camarel, new Wyrdward) add in Storm armor with Shocking aspect, electrify wep, Teleport, chain lightning, lightning orb, then Slow time-time warp. Especially since the damage of the Magnum Opus set is based on your + elemental damage, it means it can proc the stuns (maybe shocking aspect/electrify wep too) Then you could always forget the chain lightning allowing you to use crown of the primus, triumverate, and piercing orb.
Add in a wep like shard, odyn son, or even the new skycutter or gesture of orpheus... single handed build with mass chain might lay waste. Maybe 2 arctstones for your minion and you if you can handle wearing 1 more set piece.
Otherwise... swap the velvet camarel and the orb/one hander for the new Scaefer's. Drop the chain lightning for Arcane Torrent perhaps.
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Still waiting for the lightning themed set. Preferably one that does not include and orb/helm in the set itself... allowing mass electrocute (Camarel+Myken's) and some other spell to be used. Personally, I love my current setup then main thing it lacks is the survivability and single target damage of fire. However, in clearing/controlling packs mass electrocute+pain enhancer, poison, and conduit gems is hard to top. (keep in mind electrocute gets double the benefit from pain enhancer's AS bonus)
Heck, I'd just be happy for an item that gives some defensive worth to storm armor.
But more in line with the topic... has anyone seen what kind of damage the 4pc does? Does it default to arcane, or is it another damage type that matches your highest +elemental damage?
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If Chain bounces 19 times... that's 66% WD X 19... That's 1254% WD (or 1320% if it hits 20 times) per cast. Plus electrocute is using double the APS that AT uses. (my current build has 2.05+ APS, so I'm casting electrocute more than 4 times a second.
Unless it has a cap I don't know about) That's also 76-80 chances a second to proc electrify weapon/shocking aspect. ( I sooo wish wizardspike's orb took on the element of the arcane orb rune you had...)
I've thought about Zei's too (mine's still like rank 8 atm), but damage wise, I'd think overall its a loss over some other gems. I believe AT's range can't even take full advantage of the gem unless you're on a vantage point. However, I'd agree if you want maximum control, its probably the way to go.
The fire AT build I tried out yesterday looks something like this:
Skills:
Black Hole- Blazar
AT- Flame Ward
Magic Weapon- Deflection
Familiar- Sparkflint
Energy Armor- Pinpoint Barrier
Teleport- Safe Passage
Helm- Firebird
Shoulders- Firebird
Gloves- Firebird
Legs- Firebird
Feet- Firebird
Chest- Cindercoat
Belt- Tal's, witching hour, string of ears
Neck- Tals or Hellfire
Ring1- RoRG
Ring2- SoJ or Unity
Bracers- Stongarm or good Steady Strikers... anything with 20% Fire Damage, 6% crit, and intellect
2H Weapon- Furnace, Maximus, or Cinder Switch (This fireball really hits pretty hard)
Orb: Tal's orb if you have a good hellfire, Triumverate, Cosmic Strand
1H Wep- Sunkeeper, Devastator, Burning Axe,
Passives:
Blur, Unwavering Will, Illusionist, Conflag, Astral Presence (not needed if you have Tal's set)
With 30% Cindercoat and 10% cost reduction from Paragon... I had infinite arcane power to run AT.
(Tbh... really want a cindercoat for all elements! Its pretty much the item that makes fire so good)
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I like discussion, I've been a major theorycrafter for Howtopriest.com and shadowpriest.com before that. Tbh, its nice to theorycraft about something other than Warlord of Draenor for once! Diablo 3 is a particular challenge merely because you don't have all the parsing tools like WoW does.
I will say, that more experimentation with your build has me tempted by the sheer raw power that AT has on its own. Though I think for a pure AT build (only targeted damage skills I'd use would be AT and BH) I'd probably be tempted to use poison, smite, and either bane of the trapped or bane of the powerful. Then I'd probably look for a really good 2 hander like Furnace, Shaeffer's Hammer, or maybe even try to craft a good cinder switch to give me all 4 elements with arcanot.
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The main thing I've started to think about is if you try to consider shocking aspect in the place of CHD. If shocking aspect procs on all crits, it could effectively act like CHD, meaning you stack crit to proc it more. However, tbh, I really don't know what the proc rate of shocking weapon/shocking aspect is... and as I try to research it, I seem to get conflicting/vague answers. All I really have been going by is the rate at which things seem to stay paralyzed.
Elemental Exposure was something I tried out and seem to like since when doing wizard LS, most fire wizards don't run it, so between my lightning damage, and the cold damage on my TF, its pretty much 10% increased damage for everyone, plus the further 10% from the poison gem. Dropping audacity is something I've considered however, especially for an ability that might up my survivability. At the same, time audacity is a pretty big damage increase for when enemies have reached the point the can't be stunned, meaning things within that 15 yard radius melt.
I will say two elements of your build I did try out... first was conduit, which I did like for AT (it was pretty much infinite AP on packs) However, as I said, the loss of electrify weapon was very noticeable in my ability to keep packs locked down. However, I loved safe passage over fracture. (particularly good when lightning would chain to a damage reflect pack) Its the one ability really making me want to swap out audacity for illusionist.
One thing the camarel-enchanced chain is good at is aggro'ing mobs and damaging them in a wide area. Especially since the chains will travel along pots, doors, and other breakables... you can sometimes aggro mobs and packs from as far as 2-3 screens away. The chain lightning, along with electrify wep, shocking aspect, and TF... seems to do a very good job of spreading around bleeds and poison, while crits from the smite gem will take out lesser/weakened mobs in 1 hit. Once the mobs are aggroed, they can be corralled for more effectient killing with AT. Also, since fire wizards have a tendency to burn things and run, often failing to actually reach the dot cap for firebirds... in groups chain lightning does very well for cleanup of these large packs of armageddon victims. Again, its a large, wide area mob... which chain lightning is very good at bouncing around to deliver bleeds and poison to in order to actually kill them.
Side note: 1 special case that is really good for camarel and mykens is in the Kulle-type dungeons where there are 'breakable crystals' that can be 'broken' over and over. With these, you can drag over large single targets like a rift guardian, and use these crystals like a 2nd target.
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Another swap out I have is a 20 lightning, 6% crit, 30% damage strongarm, which is really nice for groups when I don't need the survival of the defender wrists.
Many people seem to think the smite gem is horrible, but for me, the main reason I take it is for single target with arcane torrent. When I get to focus on a target like a rift guardian, that gem is easily proccing at least once a second. I know for my build, I'm easily completing solo rifts around rank 26, though I begin to struggle in 27 or 28 whenever a get rift levels lacking high density. In general, I tend to find a do better the more dense rifts are packed. One of the tricks to keeping your damage output high and retaining your momentum is whenever you see 2-3 mobs, cast a single chain lighting at them and move on, as the bouncing will take care of them.
Otherwise, between the mass stuns, poison gem, and 10% elemental exposure, it seems to work very well when supporting fire wizards. (as I tend to run all wiz LS runs).
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