I've even made a break in my work out to write this down.
Soooo... lets begin. But before - what I write here is my opinion, which I got from reading the books. I might be wrong, these are not facts and I'm not blizzards lore master.
"If anyone could explain the reasons why Heaven wants to destroy it" - Heaven is afraid of humans since they have the capacity to be stronger than them. Not because they are evil (in fact heaven and hell created Sanctuary TOGETHER, and the leaders of heaven and hell were lovers at the time).
"and why Hell wants to conquer it" - after the break up between Inarius and Lilith, old blood between heaven and hell rose up again and hell sees humans as a potential boost to their forces. Think of the cold war, and the humans as extra missiles.
"And atm, from everything I have seen in this thread, Heaven is indeed nicer than Hell." - Maybe I'm wrong about it, but they are essentially two sides of the same coin. They are the same, with very slight deviations. Tyrael excluded (or not...). Heaven has no higher moral ground, or objection to "evil", per say. They hate demons not because they are evil, or not nice, or not pretty - they just hate them. It is their nature, no one knows why. And in their hatred they had destroyed countless worlds.
"And the Burning Hells are enslaving and devouring humans for fun, Heaven is doing it for a reason, which is to destroy the Burning Hells." - Burning hells are enslaving and devouring humans for the same reason - to destroy the high heavens. They just get more of a kick out of it. You could argue which one is more evil - a sadist or a sociopat.... I think they're both bad.
"I'm atleast pretty sure that Heaven will "help" us as long as we are fighting against Hell. They gain nothing by destroying us now." - Actually, now that the world stone is shattered it is more the reason for heaven to destroy humanity, since the powers of the nefarm are once again available to the humans, and thus humanity can rise to be more powerful than the high heavens. And suuuure... they'll "help" us, if by helping we can call using us for cannon fodder.
"But unless I read, or someone tells me their intentions with the world, after they have destroyed Hell, then I have to assume that Heavens intentions for their world are better for us than the Burning Hells" - The world of Sanctuary was created by a rogue band of demons and angels together, to have a place where they can escape the fighting between the two superpowers. Then they had a big emo fight and began fighting anew. Now each group wants it for themselves to spite off the other. Other than that, they have no plans for the world.
"And I guess that Heaven has something against us for having evil (Burning Hell evil) in our hearts" - sorry to be blunt but, you're wrong. Wrong heaven.
"But instead of just saying "Read the books." Can't you just comment everything I have understood wrong, that are stated clearly in the books as facts, and correct them" - tried my best mate
"Doesn't care about." can mean alot of things. You can not care about it in the way of Hell, just wanting to take over Sanctuary and add it to their "kingdom". Or you can not cae, like, not care at all what happens to it because it is not important. But it is the Hell that is attacking us, that is a thing to remember. And that makes them very different from Heaven.
Probably because we are not purely angels, so there were a possibility that we could join Hell. And since we were more powerful, then we would be a threat that could allow the demons to take over the world. Quite the thing that Heaven wants to avoid at all costs. If destroying a race is what it takes, then why not sacricifing it?
The holy spells thing was just a little fun thing, I was not really serious about that
But we might have the possibility of angels that are afraid that we will join Hell. Pretty tricky for our heroes to step into a battlefield between Heaven and Hell when one side wants to annihilate you (Hell) and the other is afraid of you (Heaven), and therefore finds it safest to also annihilate you. It is already confirmed that the heroes are stronger in D3, so they should have the potential of more power than angels or demons. And I guess that Heaven and Hell are kindof unable to change their opinions on certain things, that is one of the things that makes them the definition of good and evil.
And my logic still says that Heaven is nice. It wants to save as much as possible, with the main priority beeing themselves, obviously. Hell just wants to kill/enslave everything and fill the world with demons. Heaven have to be smart, they have to do everything the safe way to maintain the order and peace that are their goal.
Hey.
Sorry if it sounds that I argue with you, it's not what I try to do but... I want to say that heavens main goal is not to save as much as possible.
They honestly don't care about that.
The high heavens main goal is to destroy the burning hells (for whatever reasons), no matter how many worlds are destroyed in the process. And the burning hells are the same, just want to destroy heaven.
In fact, except for Tyrael (and that is yet to be confirmed) - no angel gives a damn about no human.
They're not good. They're not out there to save men. They're demons in a prettier form and glowing wings.
I say - get the barbarian upstairs and start smashing hooded heads
But why would we fight Heaven really? They have given many humans the power of holy spells. That is to help us to defeat the demons. If we are going to fight heaven, it is going to be when Heaven is 100% sure that Hell has been/will be destroyed. And if we are going to fight Heaven, what is going to happen with the Holy spells? Would we get help from Hell then? With darkness spells?
Emil... actually... well... sort of... so far from reading the books well... the angels did not give power to the humans.
Humans are the offsprings of angels and demons (do NOT imagine the act itself) and in theory have more power than both of them combined.
When the angels and the demons saw how powerfull their children were, heaven wanted to destroy them (yes... heaven wanted to kill all the humans) and demons wanted to use them as part of their army.
As a compromise they made the world stone, which reduced the human powers to nothing.
Then came lilith (the original leader of the demons and the "mother" of all humans) and awoken those powers in one human, who in turn awoken those powers in others.
And then that human went upon a holy crusade against both heaven and hell.
So in fact the powers of light are not "given" to the humans by heaven, they are powers every human posesses but only a fraction of them uses.
With a bit of a huge delay, I have begun reading the diablo lore and ofcourse began my reading with the sin war trilogy.
Now, from what I understand now - the only difference between heaven and hell is that... the guys from heaven are shiny, and demons are not. Except for that - both of them are evil as... well... something evil, and both of them couldn't care less about humanity.
In some ways heaven is even worse since while Inarius would rather destroy sanctuary rather than see it in hands other than his own, the prime evils seem willing to fight over it (like the manly demons they are, instead of those whiny girly angels).
It's a bit fitting to me to be honest since I always thought in real life that if there is a god, he's probably worse than the devil... but... heh... that's another story.
Aaaanyhow... what I'm trying to say here is... in D2 the worldstone was shattered. That means sanctuary is no longer invisible to both the high heavens and the burning hells, and that would mean that the war between the two could spill over to this world also and ignore this little humanity thing that's going on there.
If that is the case, our heroes might not only have to fight demons, but angels too, to prevent the two from... well... steamrolling this world.
Ofcourse that would be too much of a change from previous diablo games where... you only fight one side while the other is presented in a pretty pink light but... what do you think?
Would you like to fight BOTH of the sides?
P.S.
I'm sorry if this topic had been discussed already before. If it had been then... don't be mad at me
P.S.S.
Apperantly I have spoilers in my post. Go figure...
And none of the silly diablo 2 zombies who walked alone and made silly "arrrrrgh" sounds.
Hell no - I want "Dawn of the dead a barbarian is trapped in a shopping mall and is surrounded by dead bodies" zombies.
I want tons and tons and tons of them. Everywhere. They'll come from underground, break through walls, chew on buildings (don't ask why) and try to zerg the player character as fast as a zombie can (which is not terribly fast).
Also they should be different. There should be adult zombies, old zombies, male zombies, female zombies, children zombies, politically correct zombies representing the depressed minorities... I want a lot of zombies, and I want the different!
Ooooh... and they can carry weapons too. But not as if they know how to use them, instead they'd just swing them around like the mindless walking corpses they are just to fall to my barbarians axe.
What I'm trying to say - Blizzard! Giev gooood undead plz! Thnx.
Oooh... and I want zombie kittens on whom I can stomp. Just cause I don't like kittens. They are evil.
Untrue! Barbarians were largely those tribes living in Germania who did not know Roman. The Romans referred to them as Barbarians, as well as anyone else who did not know the Roman language. In fact, it comes into English from Medieval Latin Barbarinus.
Doubt not the Xerj, young one - for he has both knowledge AND wikipedia on his side.
The great wiki one agrees with the Xerj. Read its words and tremble.
Greeks! Not Romans!
"The word "barbarian" comes into English from Medieval Latinbarbarinus, from Latinbarbaria, from Latin barbarus, from the ancient Greek word βάρβαρος (b?rbaros). The word is onomatopoeic, the bar-bar representing the impression of random hubbub produced by hearing a spoken language that one cannot understand"
"Depending on its use, the term "barbarian" either described a foreign individual or tribe whose first language was not Greek or a Greek individual or tribe speaking Greek crudely"
"The Greeks used the term as they encountered scores of different foreign cultures, including the Egyptians, Persians, Celts, Germans, Phoenicians, Etruscans, and Carthaginians. It, in fact, became a common term to refer to all foreigners. However in various occasions, the term was also used by Greeks, especially the Athenians, to deride other Greek tribes and states (such as Epirotes, Eleans and Aeolic-speakers) in a pejorative and politically motivated manner"
I would sacrifise a cute fluffy kitten to satan, shoot up a McDonalds branch and then go on by trying to set the statue of liberty on fire after I've painted a huge smilie on its face.
That or... I could just accept that this is not the game for me and move on.
One of the two.
P.S. - completely not thread related.
Anyone noticed how "Satan" and "Santa" are quite similar words? I nearly wrote I would sacrifise a kitten to Santa... which could be quite a funny turn out, and end up with me being on the naughty list
please - point me to even a one Monk in the history, that using killing force , and do PvP / PK for fun !
Please !
Actually the shaolin monks became famous in the ancient world after in a single battle they had managed to kill a lot of people using only a few monks.
Not that I think that a monk is a good class idea in diablo... BUT... the monks of old were not the meditating stage performing nice little girlscouts they are today.
I doubt anyone here would question the fighting skills of the monks, but think about the following thing - there is only place for ONE pure meelee fighting character in diablo (expansions excluded).
As for now this character is the barbarian.
Now think for a second - who would you rather play, a giant of a man clad in iron and furs, weilding weapons normal men would struggle to even lift while berserking the hell out of demons (get it? hehe) or... a five foot tall dude in a robe?
So in that aspect I would like to answer your quesion - MONK IS NOT GOOD ENOUGH NOW!
One can find a reason that something is bad to just about everything out there.
For example - the word "barbarian" was originally an insult in ancient Greece to other peoples who did not have Greek as their native language. So... if I don't speek Greek, should I ask to remove the barbarian!
Though I do believe there are things that can be inappropriate for a game such as diablo (a suicide bomber class for example, one who runs into masses of mobs, yells "Die Infidels" and blows himself up... hehe... I just thought about that) I don't know if a witch doctor qualifies as an inapropriate character
0
I've even made a break in my work out to write this down.
Soooo... lets begin. But before - what I write here is my opinion, which I got from reading the books. I might be wrong, these are not facts and I'm not blizzards lore master.
"If anyone could explain the reasons why Heaven wants to destroy it" - Heaven is afraid of humans since they have the capacity to be stronger than them. Not because they are evil (in fact heaven and hell created Sanctuary TOGETHER, and the leaders of heaven and hell were lovers at the time).
"and why Hell wants to conquer it" - after the break up between Inarius and Lilith, old blood between heaven and hell rose up again and hell sees humans as a potential boost to their forces. Think of the cold war, and the humans as extra missiles.
"And atm, from everything I have seen in this thread, Heaven is indeed nicer than Hell." - Maybe I'm wrong about it, but they are essentially two sides of the same coin. They are the same, with very slight deviations. Tyrael excluded (or not...). Heaven has no higher moral ground, or objection to "evil", per say. They hate demons not because they are evil, or not nice, or not pretty - they just hate them. It is their nature, no one knows why. And in their hatred they had destroyed countless worlds.
"And the Burning Hells are enslaving and devouring humans for fun, Heaven is doing it for a reason, which is to destroy the Burning Hells." - Burning hells are enslaving and devouring humans for the same reason - to destroy the high heavens. They just get more of a kick out of it. You could argue which one is more evil - a sadist or a sociopat.... I think they're both bad.
"I'm atleast pretty sure that Heaven will "help" us as long as we are fighting against Hell. They gain nothing by destroying us now." - Actually, now that the world stone is shattered it is more the reason for heaven to destroy humanity, since the powers of the nefarm are once again available to the humans, and thus humanity can rise to be more powerful than the high heavens. And suuuure... they'll "help" us, if by helping we can call using us for cannon fodder.
"But unless I read, or someone tells me their intentions with the world, after they have destroyed Hell, then I have to assume that Heavens intentions for their world are better for us than the Burning Hells" - The world of Sanctuary was created by a rogue band of demons and angels together, to have a place where they can escape the fighting between the two superpowers. Then they had a big emo fight and began fighting anew. Now each group wants it for themselves to spite off the other. Other than that, they have no plans for the world.
"And I guess that Heaven has something against us for having evil (Burning Hell evil) in our hearts" - sorry to be blunt but, you're wrong. Wrong heaven.
"But instead of just saying "Read the books." Can't you just comment everything I have understood wrong, that are stated clearly in the books as facts, and correct them" - tried my best mate
0
I say fight heaven AND hell.
Twice as many foes (just think of the XP)
0
Read the books.
0
Hey.
Sorry if it sounds that I argue with you, it's not what I try to do but... I want to say that heavens main goal is not to save as much as possible.
They honestly don't care about that.
The high heavens main goal is to destroy the burning hells (for whatever reasons), no matter how many worlds are destroyed in the process. And the burning hells are the same, just want to destroy heaven.
In fact, except for Tyrael (and that is yet to be confirmed) - no angel gives a damn about no human.
They're not good. They're not out there to save men. They're demons in a prettier form and glowing wings.
I say - get the barbarian upstairs and start smashing hooded heads
0
Emil... actually... well... sort of... so far from reading the books well... the angels did not give power to the humans.
Humans are the offsprings of angels and demons (do NOT imagine the act itself) and in theory have more power than both of them combined.
When the angels and the demons saw how powerfull their children were, heaven wanted to destroy them (yes... heaven wanted to kill all the humans) and demons wanted to use them as part of their army.
As a compromise they made the world stone, which reduced the human powers to nothing.
Then came lilith (the original leader of the demons and the "mother" of all humans) and awoken those powers in one human, who in turn awoken those powers in others.
And then that human went upon a holy crusade against both heaven and hell.
So in fact the powers of light are not "given" to the humans by heaven, they are powers every human posesses but only a fraction of them uses.
Also, from this story, heaven are not nice!
0
One of them look like a city guard, the other seems to be the pope
0
With a bit of a huge delay, I have begun reading the diablo lore and ofcourse began my reading with the sin war trilogy.
Now, from what I understand now - the only difference between heaven and hell is that... the guys from heaven are shiny, and demons are not. Except for that - both of them are evil as... well... something evil, and both of them couldn't care less about humanity.
In some ways heaven is even worse since while Inarius would rather destroy sanctuary rather than see it in hands other than his own, the prime evils seem willing to fight over it (like the manly demons they are, instead of those whiny girly angels).
It's a bit fitting to me to be honest since I always thought in real life that if there is a god, he's probably worse than the devil... but... heh... that's another story.
Aaaanyhow... what I'm trying to say here is... in D2 the worldstone was shattered. That means sanctuary is no longer invisible to both the high heavens and the burning hells, and that would mean that the war between the two could spill over to this world also and ignore this little humanity thing that's going on there.
If that is the case, our heroes might not only have to fight demons, but angels too, to prevent the two from... well... steamrolling this world.
Ofcourse that would be too much of a change from previous diablo games where... you only fight one side while the other is presented in a pretty pink light but... what do you think?
Would you like to fight BOTH of the sides?
P.S.
I'm sorry if this topic had been discussed already before. If it had been then... don't be mad at me
P.S.S.
Apperantly I have spoilers in my post. Go figure...
0
And none of the silly diablo 2 zombies who walked alone and made silly "arrrrrgh" sounds.
Hell no - I want "Dawn of the dead a barbarian is trapped in a shopping mall and is surrounded by dead bodies" zombies.
I want tons and tons and tons of them. Everywhere. They'll come from underground, break through walls, chew on buildings (don't ask why) and try to zerg the player character as fast as a zombie can (which is not terribly fast).
Also they should be different. There should be adult zombies, old zombies, male zombies, female zombies, children zombies, politically correct zombies representing the depressed minorities... I want a lot of zombies, and I want the different!
Ooooh... and they can carry weapons too. But not as if they know how to use them, instead they'd just swing them around like the mindless walking corpses they are just to fall to my barbarians axe.
What I'm trying to say - Blizzard! Giev gooood undead plz! Thnx.
Oooh... and I want zombie kittens on whom I can stomp. Just cause I don't like kittens. They are evil.
0
Call the FBI much?
0
Ok... from my knowledge of exorcists (purely based on the original movie), I'd say he'd have the following skills.
1) Tie little girl to bed
2) Avoid vomit
3) Prinkle holy water and pray
Heh... I'm just kidding, actually that's a nice idea. Though to be honest, I'm hoping Blizzard won't put a "holy" class into the game this time.
But I guess it's just me.
0
Doubt not the Xerj, young one - for he has both knowledge AND wikipedia on his side.
The great wiki one agrees with the Xerj. Read its words and tremble.
Greeks! Not Romans!
"The word "barbarian" comes into English from Medieval Latin barbarinus, from Latin barbaria, from Latin barbarus, from the ancient Greek word βάρβαρος (b?rbaros). The word is onomatopoeic, the bar-bar representing the impression of random hubbub produced by hearing a spoken language that one cannot understand"
"Depending on its use, the term "barbarian" either described a foreign individual or tribe whose first language was not Greek or a Greek individual or tribe speaking Greek crudely"
"The Greeks used the term as they encountered scores of different foreign cultures, including the Egyptians, Persians, Celts, Germans, Phoenicians, Etruscans, and Carthaginians. It, in fact, became a common term to refer to all foreigners. However in various occasions, the term was also used by Greeks, especially the Athenians, to deride other Greek tribes and states (such as Epirotes, Eleans and Aeolic-speakers) in a pejorative and politically motivated manner"
0
That or... I could just accept that this is not the game for me and move on.
One of the two.
P.S. - completely not thread related.
Anyone noticed how "Satan" and "Santa" are quite similar words? I nearly wrote I would sacrifise a kitten to Santa... which could be quite a funny turn out, and end up with me being on the naughty list
0
Actually the shaolin monks became famous in the ancient world after in a single battle they had managed to kill a lot of people using only a few monks.
Not that I think that a monk is a good class idea in diablo... BUT... the monks of old were not the meditating stage performing nice little girlscouts they are today.
0
As for now this character is the barbarian.
Now think for a second - who would you rather play, a giant of a man clad in iron and furs, weilding weapons normal men would struggle to even lift while berserking the hell out of demons (get it? hehe) or... a five foot tall dude in a robe?
So in that aspect I would like to answer your quesion - MONK IS NOT GOOD ENOUGH NOW!
Kudos.
0
One can find a reason that something is bad to just about everything out there.
For example - the word "barbarian" was originally an insult in ancient Greece to other peoples who did not have Greek as their native language. So... if I don't speek Greek, should I ask to remove the barbarian!
Though I do believe there are things that can be inappropriate for a game such as diablo (a suicide bomber class for example, one who runs into masses of mobs, yells "Die Infidels" and blows himself up... hehe... I just thought about that) I don't know if a witch doctor qualifies as an inapropriate character
Guess it's up to personal flavor.