Optimistic idea for a Paragon update
For a long time now players have recognised that the current paragon system not only has a few problems (the unlimited paragon grind incentivizes botting, for example), but is also pretty uninspiring (you fairly quickly reach the point where you simply max everything, and past 800 you simply add to mainstat). There have been many great ideas put forth by the community to address one or both of these issues, and here I’ve tried to collect a lot of those ideas and combine them together and present them in the form of some colourful pictures (everyone likes pictures).
(A sort of TL; DR)
This idea for a new paragon system has two main objectives:
- Address the infinite paragon grind which incentivizes botting. This is done by having a ‘soft cap’ on paragon (only for those wanting to compete on leaderboards)
- Address the tedium of the current system. This is done by providing players with actual choices and different ways to customize their builds
Don’t worry too much about the particular values suggested for each of the stats – I won’t claim that they’re perfectly balanced, although I did spend a decent amount of time math’ing through them to attempt to balance them, but I could obviously be way off the mark on many of them. If you think any of the numbers are particularly off, throw your feedback this way.
Paragon is divided between ‘Core’ and ‘Bonus’. This simply divides your first 800 paragon levels (Core paragon) from anything above 800 (Bonus paragon).
There are 5 Categories (Offense, Defense, Resource, Utility, Adventure).
There are 10 Stats per category.
Almost all Stats max out at 50 points per Stat (like the current system), with a few exceptions.
While below paragon 800.
Points can be spent on any stat in any category at any time (unlike the current system), up to 200 points per category (like the current system). This equates to being able to max out 16 stats across the 5 categories, and 4 out of 10 stats within a category. So, if using the maximum 200 points per category, only 4 out of 5 categories can be accessed (or, alternatively, one could spread the points across all 5 categories).
Beyond 800 paragon.
The restrictions of 200 points per Category disappear. Perhaps there could be brackets: Paragon 800 – 1600, the cap is increased to 400 points per category; Paragon 1600 – 2400 the cap is increased to 600, etc.
Why the paragon 800 threshold?
This deserves its own separate discussion, but as a basic summary: I feel the general consensus of the community is that there needs to be some ‘restrictions’ in place to curb the incentives for botting i.e. the infinite progression systems that are present in almost every aspect of this game only serve to enhance the benefit botting gives – and botting will never be got rid of (it exists in every game and always will), so one ‘solution’ (the only realistic solution) is to minimise the impact botting has, and minimise the incentives for botting.
So, there’s nothing special about 800 in particular, and the threshold could be set anywhere, but Paragon 800 should be an ‘achievable’ paragon level to reach for most people interested in the leaderboards. Now, what we can do is have some kind of ‘Competitive’ Rift system (which would be the only Rift system tied to leaderboards – there would be no more need to tie Leaderboards to GRifts, which is really getting more and more ridiculous as can be seen by having well-documented botters holding top places on the leaderboards). In this Competitive Rift system your paragon would be capped at this 800 threshold. Outside of this Competitive Rift system (i.e. everywhere we currently play: Adventure Mode, Rifts, Grifts, etc.) players could use their uncapped paragon points. Ideally (and now I’m really digressing here) these Competitive Rifts would not be exactly like current Greater Rifts, with their heavy dependence on RNG – however, that’s definitely a topic for another thread, and I’d settle for the Competitive Rifts being effectively identical to Greater Rifts, and see it as a move in the right direction.
(Another alternative could be simply to have Seasonal paragon cap at 800, while non-season has uncapped paragon.)
In the following images, this player has a Paragon level of 1123, and has currently applied only 200 points of their 800 Core points into the Offense tab, maxing that tab out.They have not placed any more points in any other tabs, leaving 600 Core points to distribute. The 323 (1123 - 323 = 800) Bonus points would not be able to be used while inside a Competitive Rift.
Attack Speed (10% @ 50 points)
Critical Hit Chance (5% @ 50 points)
Critical Hit Damage (50% @ 50 points)
Elemental Damage [10% @ 50 points]
Elite Damage [10% @ 50 points]
Area Damage [10% @ 50 points]
Primary Skill [15% @ 50 points]
Increase all damage of Primary skills, as Depth Diggers and such do. There is a problem deciding on appropriate values due to additive dilution, but oh well.
Secondary Skill [15% @ 50 points]
Increase all damage of your Secondary skills. Same issue with Primary skills: additive dilution with new items in 2.4 increasing Secondary skills damage by up to ~100%.
Pet Damage [10% @ 50 points]
Increase the damage of your Pets. Currently Pet Damage is additive with Elemental damage, which once again makes finding appropriate values difficult.
Cooldown Reduction [10% @ 50 points]
Armor [20% @ 50 points]
Single Resists [250 @ 10 points]
The only stat that maxes out at 10 points instead of 50 points. The idea is that spreading out your points into all the single resists should give you roughly equivalent mitigation as the same number of points put into Armor, while also being able to specialise in particular resistances if one wishes to.
Elite damage reduction [20% @ 40 points]
Maxes out at 40 points. Greater damage reduction than either Armor or All Resists, but specifically for Elite damage.
Ranged/Melee damage reduction [20% @ 50 points] Similar to Elite damage reduction in that each category provides more mitigation than straight Armor, but is specific to a damage type.
Life% [25% @ 50 points]
Vitality [2000 @ 50 points]
Health Globe Bonus [40,000 @ 50 points]
Life per Second [15,000 @ 50 points]
Life per Hit [10,000 @ 50 points]
Life per Kill [10,000 @ 50 points]
Life per Resource Spent [800 @ 50 points]
This one is a bit tricky. Only Barbs, Monks and Crusaders have LpRS, and in different quantities, so the particular value would be adjusted per these classes. For the other 3 classes, either this stat could remain (which might be an interesting option in itself), or could be replaced by Arcane per Crit, Max Discipline, and flat increase in Mana regen for Wiz, DH, and WD respectively.
Resource Cost Reduction [20% @ 50 points]
Primary Resource Generation [25% @ 50 points]
Increases all sources of resource generation/regeneration by 25%.
Max Primary Resource [50 @ 50 points]
Amount varies from class to class, just as in the current system.
Some of these stats are technically ‘Defensive’ or ‘Offensive’, but in the interest of keep 10 stats per category they are placed here.
Dodge [10% @ 50 points]
Thorns [10,000 @ 50 points]
CC Reduction [40% @ 50 points]
Block Chance [10% @ 50 points]
Chance to Bleed for 5 seconds [40% @ 50 points]
Bleed could do 350% weapon damage (the same as the weapon roll), but it would not primarily be for damage, but instead be for use with Pain Enhancer for builds that might not crit.
Chance to Stun [10% @ 50 points]
Chance to Freeze [10% @ 50 points]
Chance to Charm [10% @ 50 points]
Chance to Blind [10% @ 50 points]
Chance to Knockup [10% @ 50 points]
Movement Speed [25% @ 50 points]
Material Multiplier [100% @ 50 points]
Doubles all white, blue, yellow and forgotten soul mats that drop.
Gold Find [50% @ 50 points]
Gem Enhance [15% @ 50 points]
15% increase in the power of all your non-legendary gems, similar to how Leoric’s Crown works, but for all of your sockets. Ideally this would accompany an overhaul of the current non-legendary gems to make all of them more interesting/useful.
Pickup Radius [7 @ 50 points]
Health Globe Chance [100% @ 50 points]
100% increase in base chance to drop HGs (e.g. double health globe amount) – probably shouldn’t interact with Solanium.
Nephalem Globe Chance [100% @ 50 points]
Doubles number of NGs produced. Ideally this would coincide with a rework of NGs, to make them actually good.
Shrine Duration [100% @ 50 points]
Double the duration of shrines (they currently last 2 minutes) – could multiply with Gloves of Worship as well.
Teleport Duration [100% @ 50 points]
Reduction in TP channeling time. Currently channeling lasts 5 seconds. 50% would reduce to 2.5 seconds, 100% would make it instant, like you were using a waypoint.
Follower Damage [100% @ 50 points]
Multiplicative increase in your Follower damage – ideally this would accompany a full rework of Followers that made them actually do non-negligible damage.