The way LoD ended, is an oxymoron I'd like to refer to as a conclusive cliffhanger. It was conclusive because of what I talked about in my last couple of posts there, it's still a cliffhanger because we don't know for sure exactly what it all meant at the end. Because you can interpret the Worldstone's destruction in so many ways, there's no telling what the next Diablo game may be like. Even if it was originally intended to mean a certain thing, the writers can just as easily come up with new reasons why all our theories are incorrect. It's kind of frustrating, really.
Another key point I noticed is that Diablo and Baal overpowered Tyrael in Act two, why didn't they kill him as well? It is more than obvious that they could have.
Not necessarily. Remember when you finally reach Tyrael he says he did expect you earlier and that the energies tying him to this world are broken. This implies that he was guarding Baal for when you reached him first. Unfortunately, it did not work out that way. Diablo had held back our hero for too long and Tyrael's investment did not pay off.
When you see Tyrael kind of throwing the Wanderer around in that cutscene, it's obvious an Archangel of his power would be able to deal with him then and there. But Tyrael has no anchor such as a Soulstone or any other device that allows him to remain indefinitely in Sanctuary. He seemed to do it on his own power, but the power needed to remain there was vast and his energies were dissipating quickly.
When you see Tyrael after Act II, it is no longer in the mortal plane. It is in the Pandemonium Fortress which is a bastion of Heaven and therefore probably doesn't require any special power to physically exist there. You also see him in the Worldstone chamber where he appears in flux.
I think that when Diablo managed to free his brother with the help of Marius, they probably considered themselves lucky to have pulled even that off. Diablo knew it would be no cakewalk, so why take the chances of doing further battle with Tyrael? Diablo got what he had come for.
Out of all the members of Tristram, isn't it a bit odd that Cain was left alive when everyone else was slaughtered?
It is mildly odd, yes. Especially since there's no telling how long he was in his gibbet. However, there's no comprehending the mind of a demon. They might have just wanted to save him for torture. And part of that torture might have just been to starve him for awhile. It is also possible that they sensed power about him. And it seems that when demons perceive a power that they can exploit or harness in some way, they'll tinker with it for awhile first to see how to gain that power (Remember Ogden's sign? The demons then showed to be totally misguided and foolish).
Quote from "Eldius" »
(Marius survived, followed Diablo and played a part in the release of Baal) Cain practically lead you to the destruction of the Worldstone.
Even if this is true, the consequences of letting Baal fully have his way with it would have been far worse. While we do not understand the full ramifications of the Worldstone's destruction, it makes sense regardless that Cain would want you to stop Baal from doing what he wanted to do with it, albeit, we arrive too late anyway. But I believe destroying it was detrimental, but that it was really a matter of cutting or losses and salvaging what we could.
Quote from "Eldius" »
(Note: If a soul stone is destroyed, the spirit contained within returns to Hell,
More like the Great Abyss. There's no telling what happens after that or even it there is an after that. I personally believe that Mephisto, Diablo, and Baal (assuming his Soulstone was destroyed) are indeed sentenced to drift for all eternity through the Great Abyss. But people don't like this theory cause that implies they can never fight the Prime Evils again. However, this is one reason that I believe the next Diablo game will be a prequel.
Quote from "Eldius" »
and with the Worldstone destroyed, the barrier between realms would be shattered thus allowing the Prime Evils to return to Sanctuary.)
This is where I disagree with most people. Tyrael destroyed the Worldstone just to keep this from happening. Destroying it would keep any angelic force from ever entering Sanctuary again, but more importantly, it would keep the demonic forces from entering Sanctuary as well. When Tyrael speaks of the consequences that even he cannot foresee from its destruction, I believe he is referring to how he does not know how mortals will get along without the influence or guidance of higher powers. And this disturbs him somehow.
Quote from "Eldius" »
It could be that both Tyrael and Cain were pulling the strings. Perhaps they are truly Belail and Azmodan (Both of whom were mentioned in the guide book texts & novels and yet never made an appearance).
Your theory that Tyrael and Cain were puling the strings from the beginning to result in the Worldstone's destruction is an interesting one. But I certainly do not believe they were Belial and Azmodan assuming their forms. You'd have to suggest more to support that.
Wich act are this peoples from : Hadriel and Inarius??
I can't remember them from Diablo2
Hadriel is in Act IV. And unfortunately, we've never seen Inarius in any of the games. But if the next Diablo game is a prequel, like I suspect it will be, he may make an appearance. Yet, he could make one in a game that does take place after the Worldstone's destruction. Since we're not positive what has become of him or if he's still existing in his prison.
Jarhead, as for your question about the Worldstone, here is my own personal theory, and I know quite a few disagree with me on this. But I believe that the Worldstone was the link between the mortal and spiritual realm, in a sense. Yes, demons could enter Sanctuary, but so could angels so it was all fair game. However, I believe what Baal's corruption did to the Worldstone was basically tune it to the demon's only, forever preventing any angelic intereference within Sanctuary. It's like if there were two doors, one each for the Burning Hells and High Heavens, he was basically using his powers to forever shut the doors of the High Heavens.
Since Tyrael could obviously not allow this to happen (I'm assuming he couldn't allow it to happen because I don't believe he's evil like some others do), he opted to destroy the doors for both Heaven and Hell. When he speaks of the consequences that even he cannot foresee, I think that's partly referring to what Sanctuary would be like without the direct or at least indirect influences of higher powers. There would still be magic in Sanctuary, but none of the angelic or demonic kind. But while there would still be magic, I believe there would also be less of it. It would be more difficult to come by or at least more difficult to hold on to once you have it. So perhaps certain schools of magic would become more rare. This would perhaps force people to innovate in order to feel safe and remain competitive with other factions. Such innovation could pave the way to an industrialized Sanctuary. Yes, I know people hate to imagine rifles in Diablo, I among them; but, the Warcraft universe has always seemed more riddled with magical essence than Diablo's yet they managed to justify rifles, mortars, and rickety tanks.
The other consequences that Tyrael could not foresee could also very well come from his own misconceptions about the Worldstone. The beauty of the Worlddstone is that no one knows for sure what it is or how it works so the possibilites for the next Diablo game are totally endless.
I just think a prequel would be more interesting and less contrived at this time since so much of the lore is already in place, where making a sequel for the game would indeed require some labored plot twists that I wouldn't find as convincing as the already enriched lore of the eras before what we play in the first two Diablo games. But ultimately, like I said, the plot twists avoid necessarily being labored due to the ambiguous nature of the Worldstone and its destruction.
I mean, it's so final, yet so open-ended isn't it? The very last image you see is of the entire thing blowing to pieces. There's no epilogue of any kind or anything afterwards to give you hints. Just the thing blowing up, then fading to darkness.
Meh, I just don't buy all the Tyrael conspiracy theories. Cause if he wanted to screw everyone over, he could've easily done it several different times. And I don't think that the Worldstone's destruction will affect Tyrael in any way except that he will no longer be able to have a physical presence in Sanctuary.
I'm sure I've said this before, but I would be interested in seeing Kabraxis as a driving force behind the story. What I found interesting about his character was in most senses, he seemed as powerful as the Prime Evils, but wasn't directly aligned with them. Not even in the on and off way of the Lesser Evils. The notions of strife among the Lesser and Prime evils makes for really interesting plots, I think. But I think it would be especially interesting if the Prime Evils themselves were no longer aligned and working against each other.
But then you'd have to make some changes to the rules of their power I guess since it was made clear that with their powers combined, they are seemingly unstoppable.
I still think Cain is hardly as powerful as people want to think. And if they did make him all evil, I just think that would be cheap and inconsistent. I sense that like Khalim, Cain was incorruptible. One reason I think this is because as a member of the Horadrim, it seems Cain could've chose to become much more powerful, but power didn't really interest him. Instead he craved knowledge for the sake of knowledge alone; not to learn types of magics or control demons or anything like that. He was just a simple man who took pleasure in more simple things.
But does anyone really picture him being this evil villain in the next game? I would be unconvinced no matter how much they contrived it. And it's not like Diablo is so short on characters that they would need to resort to using Cain in that way.
indeed, a civil war ciknematic between the 2 would rock
I agree. It's interesting though how when you read the first Diablo manual, it describes kind of how each minion of each Prime Evil does its thing. Like how Diablo's minions use fear and illusion while Baal's minions use brute force and sheer might, etc.
So I wonder if that had any bearing on Belial's and Azmodan's minions, how lies and sin would affect their respective methods.
Siaynoq's Playthroughs
When you see Tyrael kind of throwing the Wanderer around in that cutscene, it's obvious an Archangel of his power would be able to deal with him then and there. But Tyrael has no anchor such as a Soulstone or any other device that allows him to remain indefinitely in Sanctuary. He seemed to do it on his own power, but the power needed to remain there was vast and his energies were dissipating quickly.
When you see Tyrael after Act II, it is no longer in the mortal plane. It is in the Pandemonium Fortress which is a bastion of Heaven and therefore probably doesn't require any special power to physically exist there. You also see him in the Worldstone chamber where he appears in flux.
I think that when Diablo managed to free his brother with the help of Marius, they probably considered themselves lucky to have pulled even that off. Diablo knew it would be no cakewalk, so why take the chances of doing further battle with Tyrael? Diablo got what he had come for.
Siaynoq's Playthroughs
It is mildly odd, yes. Especially since there's no telling how long he was in his gibbet. However, there's no comprehending the mind of a demon. They might have just wanted to save him for torture. And part of that torture might have just been to starve him for awhile. It is also possible that they sensed power about him. And it seems that when demons perceive a power that they can exploit or harness in some way, they'll tinker with it for awhile first to see how to gain that power (Remember Ogden's sign? The demons then showed to be totally misguided and foolish).
Even if this is true, the consequences of letting Baal fully have his way with it would have been far worse. While we do not understand the full ramifications of the Worldstone's destruction, it makes sense regardless that Cain would want you to stop Baal from doing what he wanted to do with it, albeit, we arrive too late anyway. But I believe destroying it was detrimental, but that it was really a matter of cutting or losses and salvaging what we could.
More like the Great Abyss. There's no telling what happens after that or even it there is an after that. I personally believe that Mephisto, Diablo, and Baal (assuming his Soulstone was destroyed) are indeed sentenced to drift for all eternity through the Great Abyss. But people don't like this theory cause that implies they can never fight the Prime Evils again. However, this is one reason that I believe the next Diablo game will be a prequel.
This is where I disagree with most people. Tyrael destroyed the Worldstone just to keep this from happening. Destroying it would keep any angelic force from ever entering Sanctuary again, but more importantly, it would keep the demonic forces from entering Sanctuary as well. When Tyrael speaks of the consequences that even he cannot foresee from its destruction, I believe he is referring to how he does not know how mortals will get along without the influence or guidance of higher powers. And this disturbs him somehow.
Your theory that Tyrael and Cain were puling the strings from the beginning to result in the Worldstone's destruction is an interesting one. But I certainly do not believe they were Belial and Azmodan assuming their forms. You'd have to suggest more to support that.
Siaynoq's Playthroughs
Siaynoq's Playthroughs
Siaynoq's Playthroughs
Jarhead, as for your question about the Worldstone, here is my own personal theory, and I know quite a few disagree with me on this. But I believe that the Worldstone was the link between the mortal and spiritual realm, in a sense. Yes, demons could enter Sanctuary, but so could angels so it was all fair game. However, I believe what Baal's corruption did to the Worldstone was basically tune it to the demon's only, forever preventing any angelic intereference within Sanctuary. It's like if there were two doors, one each for the Burning Hells and High Heavens, he was basically using his powers to forever shut the doors of the High Heavens.
Since Tyrael could obviously not allow this to happen (I'm assuming he couldn't allow it to happen because I don't believe he's evil like some others do), he opted to destroy the doors for both Heaven and Hell. When he speaks of the consequences that even he cannot foresee, I think that's partly referring to what Sanctuary would be like without the direct or at least indirect influences of higher powers. There would still be magic in Sanctuary, but none of the angelic or demonic kind. But while there would still be magic, I believe there would also be less of it. It would be more difficult to come by or at least more difficult to hold on to once you have it. So perhaps certain schools of magic would become more rare. This would perhaps force people to innovate in order to feel safe and remain competitive with other factions. Such innovation could pave the way to an industrialized Sanctuary. Yes, I know people hate to imagine rifles in Diablo, I among them; but, the Warcraft universe has always seemed more riddled with magical essence than Diablo's yet they managed to justify rifles, mortars, and rickety tanks.
The other consequences that Tyrael could not foresee could also very well come from his own misconceptions about the Worldstone. The beauty of the Worlddstone is that no one knows for sure what it is or how it works so the possibilites for the next Diablo game are totally endless.
I just think a prequel would be more interesting and less contrived at this time since so much of the lore is already in place, where making a sequel for the game would indeed require some labored plot twists that I wouldn't find as convincing as the already enriched lore of the eras before what we play in the first two Diablo games. But ultimately, like I said, the plot twists avoid necessarily being labored due to the ambiguous nature of the Worldstone and its destruction.
I mean, it's so final, yet so open-ended isn't it? The very last image you see is of the entire thing blowing to pieces. There's no epilogue of any kind or anything afterwards to give you hints. Just the thing blowing up, then fading to darkness.
Siaynoq's Playthroughs
Siaynoq's Playthroughs
Siaynoq's Playthroughs
Siaynoq's Playthroughs
But then you'd have to make some changes to the rules of their power I guess since it was made clear that with their powers combined, they are seemingly unstoppable.
Siaynoq's Playthroughs
Siaynoq's Playthroughs
But does anyone really picture him being this evil villain in the next game? I would be unconvinced no matter how much they contrived it. And it's not like Diablo is so short on characters that they would need to resort to using Cain in that way.
Siaynoq's Playthroughs
Siaynoq's Playthroughs
I agree. It's interesting though how when you read the first Diablo manual, it describes kind of how each minion of each Prime Evil does its thing. Like how Diablo's minions use fear and illusion while Baal's minions use brute force and sheer might, etc.
So I wonder if that had any bearing on Belial's and Azmodan's minions, how lies and sin would affect their respective methods.
Siaynoq's Playthroughs
Siaynoq's Playthroughs